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    Recent Terror Attack in London - Feelings and Opinions

    These people are WEAK and pathetic. We should PULL OUT of Iraq and let the region go into civil war. Let the people in the area sort it out. We meaning the civilized world are wasting our time there.... The area has been full of people killing each other for THOUSANDS of years.... we'll NEVER stop it.

    Re: SCREW Al Qaeda - Hope everyone in London is ok.....

    do not necessarily with your opinion, but would also like to express my solidarity to our london rennteamers. hope yourself, the families and friends are fine!

    cheers

    Re: SCREW Al Qaeda - Hope everyone in London is ok.....

    kill all of them?

    Re: SCREW Al Qaeda - Hope everyone in London is ok.....

    What a tragic and meaningless loss of life...My heart goes out to all in London. Godspeed.

    Re: SCREW Al Qaeda - Hope everyone in London is ok.....

    Quote:
    John SF 2005 997 S said:
    These people are WEAK and pathetic. We should PULL OUT of Iraq and let the region go into civil war. Let the people in the area sort it out. We meaning the civilized world are wasting our time there.... The area has been full of people killing each other for THOUSANDS of years.... we'll NEVER stop it.



    Reading your comments above I take it that you are generalising Middle Eastern people. So I will responde to each of your accusations as follow.

    "The area has been full of people killing each other for THOUSANDS of years". That's rich coming from someone who's country was build on extermination, slavery and deception.

    "We should PULL OUT of Iraq and let the region go into civil war". Iraq was, internaly, a very stable country until the US administration greed for oil decided otherwise. The US Administarion messed up everything, the US Administration should clean up their mess.

    In response to your comment regarding "we civilised world" I would like to remind you that civiliasation was BORN in the Middle East. My ancesters where living in cities while yours where living in caves!

    Finaly, I work for a British firm and I have a lot of very close British friends, I am sorry to hear about what happened today in London and my deepest simpathy goes to the British People. I am fully against what happened today in London.

    Re: SCREW Al Qaeda - Hope everyone in London is ok.....

    Quote:
    John SF 2005 997 S said:
    These people are WEAK and pathetic. We should PULL OUT of Iraq and let the region go into civil war. Let the people in the area sort it out. We meaning the civilized world are wasting our time there.... The area has been full of people killing each other for THOUSANDS of years.... we'll NEVER stop it.



    I understand your anger but I don't agree.
    The US has to finish what it started, otherwise a whole region will submerge into full chaos, not even close to the things which are happening there now.
    And guess what happens next or do you really think that fanatics will stay in that region and do nothing?!

    Experts were expecting terror attacks in Europe, especially in London. It was just a matter of time.
    And I don't think it will be the last terror attack we've seen in Europe, think about Spain for example.

    The biggest mistake we Europeans (I mean the population, the governments are fully aware of the situation, even if they don't tell people because for example the german chancellor and the french president profited a lot from their anti-Bush/anti-US position regarding their political career) make is to think that all those terror attacks started because of the Iraq war. People also forget that even Bill Clinton's government was after Bin Laden and that the 9/11 terror attack planning of Al Qaeda actually started before Bush was president.

    But anyway: the US owes it to the many soldiers from all over the world (not only US soldiers died in Iraq but also IRAQI soldiers/security forces who fought side by side with US troops to help their country get back on the feet, IRAQI civilians who work for the coalition forces to make a change, Italians, British, Spanish, soldiers from the Netherlands, Denmark and many other countries died in Iraq, including security people from various arab countries and arab business men. Retrieving the US troops from Iraq NOW would be the biggest mistake in American history.
    And not to forget the german soldiers who died helping the US troops in Afghanistan, not to speak about a pretty high number of german special forces who are fighting back to back with US troops in the region. Something the german public doesn't read in the newspapers because the media is usually completely anti-Bush and anti-Iraq war.

    Anway: I hope all our Rennteam members from London are OK, maybe some of you guys could give us a little status report if you think you want to talk about it.

    The most cowardly act is to blow up a subway or a bus, the same as raping a child. In my opinion, there is no way how to negotiate with such people, they just want to destroy or to move up to paradise (speaking in a religious kind of manner). The only way to fight them is to stay firm, to be patient, to have large tear ducts and to make the public understand that these people are not freedom fighters or rebels but terrorists. And even worse: they're using religion and god for their vicious actions, throwing a very bad light upon those peaceful religious people, no matter if they're christians, muslims or whatever.

    My prayers go to the families of the victims, I hope that those bastards who did that are dead too. And no, they won't be in paradise, they will be in hell.

    yarub1 - you have very good points....

    We should never have been involved in the area to start... and NOW whatever strategy is suggested is just useless... we got involved in a screwed up mess with no good way out.

    I especially like your comment about caves....That was actually vey funny and true of course...

    I know the area was the craddle of civilization, but in the last 200 years all parties have been engaged in civil and social war. We should have no part in it.

    I'm selling my Porsche and buying a Prius so I'm not contributing to our oil dependence and imperialism !!!

    FYI - I am a LIBERTARIAN - I think our govt. should build roads and defend the country - that's it.

    Re: yarub1 - you have very good points....

    Quote:
    John SF 2005 997 S said:
    We should never have been involved in the area to start...




    For who did you vote at the 2 last presidential elections?

    Re: yarub1 - you have very good points....

    no mercy for terrorists,
    only death penalty for those dreg(trash,scum)

    I voted for the Libertarian candidate

    I don't even remember his name - It was a protest vote.....

    Re: yarub1 - you have very good points....

    The reason the US went into Iraq was not because of oil, we don't even get the majority of oil we use from the middle east, its to show that anyone who messes with the US, like in 9/11, we'll go and invade their country in less than a month. Probably to send a message to North Korea as well. The US isn't a country of cowards, like Spain. We take care of business, and not only for the US, but for the rest of the world.

    Re: yarub1 - you have very good points....

    John,

    Thanks for your understanding.

    "... but in the last 200 years all parties have been engaged in civil and social war. We should have no part in it."
    The whole world was engaged in civil and social war. The West started to stablelise only at the end of WW2. And yes you are totaly correct, no country (No matter how big) should interfere in the internal affairs of other countries, unless for honest and urgent humanitarian reasons. Combodia in the 70's is a good example.

    "I'm selling my Porsche and buying a Prius so I'm not contributing to our oil dependence and imperialism !!!"
    Good for you and good luck. You will miss your Porsche but I am sure that your satisfsction out of doing something right will more than compensate for it.

    "FYI - I am a LIBERTARIAN - I think our govt. should build roads and defend the country - that's it."
    I wish that all countries are like Switserland, totaly neutral. Nothing but stability and prosperaty for the last 700 years.

    Re: yarub1 - you have very good points....

    All ok here. It's all happened right around me, but i dont think it has directly affected that many people - other than how they are going to get home tonight!

    This is tragic for the people hurt, but thankfully the numbers are low.

    Umm - I was kidding about selling !!

    Al Qaeda can pry the keys of my 911 from my cold dead hands!!!

    Re: yarub1 - you have very good points....

    Texas911,

    "The reason the US went into Iraq was not because of oil"
    The main source of energy is the oil, if you control it you control the world. which, by the way, explains why the US Forces whent for the oil fields before anything else.

    "its to show that anyone who messes with the US, like in 9/11, we'll go and invade their country in less than a month"
    Afganistan I can understand but Iraq had no part what so ever on the 9/11 attacks, so why did the US Administartion attack them? By the way, I have news for you the US is NOT in control of Iraq and by looking at the news lately the US is not even in control of Afganistan.

    "Probably to send a message to North Korea as well."
    The US wont go after NK because there is no oil their.

    "The US isn't a country of cowards, like Spain"
    The Spaniards are not cowards, they are just wiser. They value the life of their soldiers and decided that it was not worth for them to die for oil and make the rich even richer.

    "We take care of business, and not only for the US, but for the rest of the world."
    Please keep you business within your borders and I am sure that you will end up like Switzerland with nothing but prosperaty and no wars.

    Re: Umm - I was kidding about selling !!

    Quote:
    John SF 2005 997 S said:
    Al Qaeda can pry the keys of my 911 from my cold dead hands!!!



    Ooohh, I can breath now. I was feeling sorry for you because I know what you will be going through. I sold my Boxster two months ago and I am currently driving a Toyota Echo (With its massive 1.3L engine and glorious 14" steel wheels) until I receive my 997S Convertable late Novemebr.

    Re: yarub1 - you have very good points....

    Quote:
    amazon23 said:
    For who did you vote at the 2 last presidential elections?


    Amazon - remember that only half the voters chose Bush (less than half the first election)

    Re: yarub1 - you have very good points....

    Quote:
    yarub1 said:

    "We take care of business, and not only for the US, but for the rest of the world."
    Please keep you business within your borders and I am sure that you will end up like Switzerland with nothing but prosperaty and no wars.



    That will not be possible I'm afraid, US does not have enough oil to sustain they standard of living if they do not import from outter borders.

    This is the 21st century, and we cannot all stay within our borders, globalisation is a fact, whether we like it or not.
    Keeping our businesses within our borders is not going to solve anything I am afraid, I mean, think about all the american products we use on a daily basis, and same for other countries, I drive a german car!

    Arabic civilisations are going though a crisis nowadays just like christian civilisations went through a crisis during the Inquisition, the answer I hope and believe will come from whithin.
    We are horrified that some middle eastern civilisations kill their women by throwing stones at them where they are unfaithful but let's not forget that in Europe, we used to burn people alive because they claimed the earth was round.

    Maybe each religion goes through a period of crisis I don't know, Islam is much younger than Christianism so it could be a theory. I believe Mahomet founded Islam around the 7th century right?

    Anyway, tragic events, let's be strong and carry on with our lives.
    Take care all.

    Re: yarub1 - you have very good points....

    Quote:
    yarub1 said:
    Please keep you business within your borders and I am sure that you will end up like Switzerland with nothing but prosperaty and no wars.



    Maybe we should have kept business within our own borders in 1991 too.

    Re: yarub1 - you have very good points....

    Fanch,

    Thanks for your input. What I meant was Political business "dont stick your nose in other people business", this does not involve trade. There is nothing wrong with trades among nations, if you dont have it buy it from another nation. As a matter of fact, fair trading is the best way to bring the world closer.

    Re: SCREW Al Qaeda - Hope everyone in London is ok.....

    Im sure there are going to be plenty of strong views expressed here..but my deepest sympathies go out to everyone in the UK and especially to anyone directly affected by the cowards who crawled out from under their rock this morning. I would personally like to stand on that rock and crush these scum.

    Having lived in London for years through the terrorist acts carried out by a small number of Irish people, I can fully understand what it must be like there all over again. As a result of these times in the past, London has an extensive network of surveillance cameras especially in public and high risk places so hopefully we will see a swift move to apprehend those responsible.



    Re: yarub1 - you have very good points....

    Quote:
    SoCal Alan said:
    Quote:
    yarub1 said:
    Please keep you business within your borders and I am sure that you will end up like Switzerland with nothing but prosperaty and no wars.



    Maybe we should have kept business within our own borders in 1991 too.



    For what it's worth I am grateful that the Americans and the British took matters in hand in 1944.
    No offense intented to anyone of course but I am sure everyone will understand.
    Granted, it's a completely different situation today, but that's not a reason to forget the past.

    Gents,
    I understand everyone's frustration but most of the information we get is from the media, and no offense to media companies, but I do not trust them at all.
    I have not been to Irak lately, maybe one day, but all I've seen is what the media want me to see.
    I am hopeful that a solution will be found, it will not be easy, there are so many interests to satisfy, but peace will find a way in the name of common interests.
    This is a business driven problem, I don't think religion is the prime problem here (like it is the case in the Palestinian israelian conflict).

    Re: yarub1 - you have very good points....

    Quote:
    SoCal Alan said:
    Quote:
    yarub1 said:
    Please keep you business within your borders and I am sure that you will end up like Switzerland with nothing but prosperaty and no wars.



    Maybe we should have kept business within our own borders in 1991 too.



    Yes! and in 1980 when the US supported Saddam attack against Iran with no limits and turned him into the monster we all know.

    Re: SCREW Al Qaeda - Hope everyone in London is ok.....

    Yarub, the US gets most of its imported oil from South America, and we have reserves that are just to expensive to drill at even $60/barrel. Its cheaper to get them from third world countries where production costs are a lot lower. So this whole thing about the US only wanting oil is ridiculous. If you instead stated that the US is concerned that oil keeps flowing for other countries like Japan, China, Europe, then that would be correct, because if those countries economies go down, they'll take the US with them. So indirectly its about oil, but not for our use. The US is the lone remaining super power and has taken on the responsiblilty of policing the whole world.

    The rest of the world better thank God that Russia didn't win the cold war.

    Re: SCREW Al Qaeda - Hope everyone in London is ok.....

    Quote:
    Texas911 said:
    Yarub, the US gets most of its imported oil from South America, and we have reserves that are just to expensive to drill at even $60/barrel. Its cheaper to get them from third world countries where production costs are a lot lower. So this whole thing about the US only wanting oil is ridiculous. If you instead stated that the US is concerned that oil keeps flowing for other countries like Japan, China, Europe, then that would be correct, because if those countries economies go down, they'll take the US with them. So indirectly its about oil, but not for our use. The US is the lone remaining super power and has taken on the responsiblilty of policing the whole world.

    The rest of the world better thank God that Russia didn't win the cold war.



    I know this is OT but I must rectify you here as you are incorrect, most of the hydrocarbon imported into the US comes from Qatar now as LNG, produced by Qatargas, a consortium operated by ExxonMobil.
    As for South America, Mexican fields are only operated by Pemex and Hugo Chavez limits oil exports from Venezuela to the US.
    The US is more than ever dependant on the Middle east oil, nothing new though.
    Yes North Texans low perm fields and Canadian sand tar fields do hold billions of OOIP, but you are correct, current technologies is not good enough to exploit them at profit (fracking, steam injection, etc.)

    Re: SCREW Al Qaeda - Hope everyone in London is ok.....

    thats enough!

    go out and drive your porsche! and enjoy!

    Re: SCREW Al Qaeda - Hope everyone in London is ok.....

    It is really sickening to hear stuff like this happening to good innocent people! I hope everybody is ok, as others have stated, we will just have to wait till tomorrow and see what the outcome is.

    Re: SCREW Al Qaeda - Hope everyone in London is ok.....

    We get oil from the United Kingdom? We better invade them quick!

    Re: SCREW Al Qaeda - Hope everyone in London is ok.....

    I'm in London and myself and my friends here are fine - I hope other Rennteamers are too! The bombs went off in central London and it was quite scary at first, but people right now (who weren't affected) are more concerned about how they are going to get home from work as the transport services are mostly suspended. I think it was only a matter of time before the UK was targeted.

    I'd also like to say that as a practising Muslim of Arab origin I can confidently say that the killing of innocent people has no place in my religion or culture - so whether or not this attack is related to "Al-Qaeda", I am sure that no-one who values life or has any morals will find it acceptable!

    Re: SCREW Al Qaeda - Hope everyone in London is ok.....

    Gentlmen,

    Unfortunatly I need to quit this discussionue for the simple reason that I have part of my MSc research due on Friday July 15 and I am already behind. I would love to continue this dicussion on Friday. But please, please, please, lets keep it civilised and among grown up people.

    Once again, my deepest simpathy for the British people.

     
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