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Re: Ford GT versus F430 test
Quote:
JimFlat6 said:
The Ferrari is slower out of the corners.
http://motortrend.com/roadtests/coupe/112_0506_fordvferrari/
The last paragraph of the first page describes the use of the F1 very well. It truly is a marvel to use, if done correctly.
Re: Ford GT versus F430 test
From the article:
Yet there are several endearing qualities the GT has to offset the Ferrari's enthralling driving experience: The ease with which the GT breathes over less-than-perfect road surfaces, the relative calm of its supercharger's whine to the Ferrari's enchanting wail. The gratification a driver earns when he (not a computerized gizmo) perfectly executes a downshift and sets the car for a corner-and catches the Ferrari with its nuclear-powered exits.
Yet there are several endearing qualities the GT has to offset the Ferrari's enthralling driving experience: The ease with which the GT breathes over less-than-perfect road surfaces, the relative calm of its supercharger's whine to the Ferrari's enchanting wail. The gratification a driver earns when he (not a computerized gizmo) perfectly executes a downshift and sets the car for a corner-and catches the Ferrari with its nuclear-powered exits.
Re: Ford GT versus F430 test
Quote:
Raz (NC) said:
From the article:
Yet there are several endearing qualities the GT has to offset the Ferrari's enthralling driving experience: The ease with which the GT breathes over less-than-perfect road surfaces, the relative calm of its supercharger's whine to the Ferrari's enchanting wail. The gratification a driver earns when he (not a computerized gizmo) perfectly executes a downshift and sets the car for a corner-and catches the Ferrari with its nuclear-powered exits.
There is no doubt that Ferrari's Manetino and E Diff are
incredible devices that add to the vehicles capabilities.
But what about two years after purchase when the warranty is up? What price "gizmo" glory then????
As long as Ferrari plays the Ferrari commodities game with US speculators I guess it doesnt matter. Some elements of the US Ferrari market seem in love with getting what the next guy can't, more than liking the cars enough to actually drive them much.
As for the Ford, Its really sad that Fords only car success comes from bring back forty year old models, but they are cheap to fix! A new in the crate Ford "Cammer" engine is only 10K USD, wich is less than some people pay to have their F360's tuned and fixed.
May 12, 2005 11:37:33 PM
- Ryan in SD
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- Reply to: nberry
Re: Ford GT versus F430 test
Quote:
nberry said:Quote:
JimFlat6 said:
The Ferrari is slower out of the corners.
http://motortrend.com/roadtests/coupe/112_0506_fordvferrari/
The last paragraph of the first page describes the use of the F1 very well. It truly is a marvel to use, if done correctly.
How exactly do you do it incorrectly? Dont you just have to pull them?...I dont get it.
Re: Ford GT versus F430 test
Quote:
nberry said:
The last paragraph of the first page describes the use of the F1 very well. It truly is a marvel to use, if done correctly.
How can one NOT do it correctly? Pull the right paddle. Pull the left paddle. Repeat.
I thought the point of F1 WAS to not worry about 'doing it correctly' and letting the computer do it for you?
Re: Ford GT versus F430 test
Quote:
brunner said:Quote:
nberry said:
The last paragraph of the first page describes the use of the F1 very well. It truly is a marvel to use, if done correctly.
How can one NOT do it correctly? Pull the right paddle. Pull the left paddle. Repeat.
I thought the point of F1 WAS to not worry about 'doing it correctly' and letting the computer do it for you?
Using the paddles in coordination with the RPM's to maximize power. It applies both ways up and down. When done right, often on up shifts I had the car almost hopping leaping forward losing very little rpm's. You need to experience the F1 to understand. To assume it is nothing more than a pulling on the paddles is a huge misconception.
Raz I agree some people would get great satisfaction by hitting the down shift perfectly with a manual. It does not happen that often, so when it does the driver lights up.
May 13, 2005 12:24:22 AM
- Ryan in SD
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- Loc: San Diego
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- Reply to: nberry
Re: Ford GT versus F430 test
Since I dont have a way of driving a paddle shifting car, my only testing is with racing simulators. I use the shoulder buttons as paddle shifters just like you would in real life. Its really easy to do in the games and I dont see how it would be different in real life.
I would like to assume that manual is much more difficult and if I can drive manual easily then paddle shifting would seem elementry...yes?
BTW, Im not bashing paddles. If I had a ferrari then I would probably go with paddles unless it was my only car.
I would like to assume that manual is much more difficult and if I can drive manual easily then paddle shifting would seem elementry...yes?
BTW, Im not bashing paddles. If I had a ferrari then I would probably go with paddles unless it was my only car.
May 13, 2005 12:54:22 AM
- ben, lj
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May 13, 2005 1:03:48 AM
- Ryan in SD
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May 13, 2005 2:17:54 AM
- Jeff (in SF)
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May 13, 2005 2:37:43 AM
- Jeff (in SF)
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- Reply to: dsts6
From the Nick archives
nberry: This is what I know. Time your downshift so that you have completed it, with your left foot off the clutch and over into the dead pedal area, BEFORE you ever start to turn the steering wheel into a corner.
During H&T you are constantly applying brake pressure throught the manuever.Braking occurs BEFORE downshifting. And you cannot watch the tachometer-- your eyes must be looking ahead. Input from your eyes and the forces on your body will tell you if your doing right.
Carlos, I agree H&T can make driving more fun. However, if you don't blip enough, the driving wheels will lockup when the clutch is re-engaged. That'll cause big problems! If you blip too much, the car will attempt to accelerate... and you are supposed to be slowing down. Thus unless you have mastered it your better over practicing with the engine turn off to get a better feel for the technique.
Once you feel your proficient, you can start the engine and practice blipping while the car is stationary. Once you mastered the blipping you can head for the road. "
You're right, I haven't experienced the real thing but I play a mean game of Sega's Formula 1 at the arcade. If flicking a paddle requires so much time in a stationary car for you to master, how do you walk and chew gum at the same time?
During H&T you are constantly applying brake pressure throught the manuever.Braking occurs BEFORE downshifting. And you cannot watch the tachometer-- your eyes must be looking ahead. Input from your eyes and the forces on your body will tell you if your doing right.
Carlos, I agree H&T can make driving more fun. However, if you don't blip enough, the driving wheels will lockup when the clutch is re-engaged. That'll cause big problems! If you blip too much, the car will attempt to accelerate... and you are supposed to be slowing down. Thus unless you have mastered it your better over practicing with the engine turn off to get a better feel for the technique.
Once you feel your proficient, you can start the engine and practice blipping while the car is stationary. Once you mastered the blipping you can head for the road. "
You're right, I haven't experienced the real thing but I play a mean game of Sega's Formula 1 at the arcade. If flicking a paddle requires so much time in a stationary car for you to master, how do you walk and chew gum at the same time?
May 13, 2005 2:54:53 AM
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nberry
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Re: From the Nick archives
Quote:
Jeff (in SF) said:
nberry: This is what I know. Time your downshift so that you have completed it, with your left foot off the clutch and over into the dead pedal area, BEFORE you ever start to turn the steering wheel into a corner.
During H&T you are constantly applying brake pressure throught the manuever.Braking occurs BEFORE downshifting. And you cannot watch the tachometer-- your eyes must be looking ahead. Input from your EARS and the forces on your body will tell you if your doing right.
Carlos, I agree H&T can make driving more fun. However, if you don't blip enough, the driving wheels will lockup when the clutch is re-engaged. That'll cause big problems! If you blip too much, the car will attempt to accelerate... and you are supposed to be slowing down. Thus unless you have mastered it your better over practicing with the engine turn off to get a better feel for the technique.
Once you feel your proficient, you can start the engine and practice blipping while the car is stationary. Once you mastered the blipping you can head for the road. "
You're right, I haven't experienced the real thing but I play a mean game of Sega's Formula 1 at the arcade. If flicking a paddle requires so much time in a stationary car for you to master, how do you walk and chew gum at the same time?
The tachometer can be and should monitored with your ears. Obviously you do not have experience in performance driving or you would have recognized the typo which I corrected above. Thanks for the heads up.
May 13, 2005 3:01:48 AM
- Justin
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May 13, 2005 4:12:28 AM
- ben, lj
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Re: Ford GT versus F430 test
Quote:
Ryan in SD said:Quote:
ben, lj said:Quote:
Ryan in SD said: Its really easy to do in the games and I dont see how it would be different in real life.
it isn't any different than a video game.
Is that sarcasm or are you poking fun at paddles?
nope, just the truth. any moron can drive with the paddles. it's not any different than "shifting" an automatic tranny manually.
Re: Ford GT versus F430 test
Quote:
nberry said:
Using the paddles in coordination with the RPM's to maximize power. It applies both ways up and down. When done right, often on up shifts I had the car almost hopping leaping forward losing very little rpm's. You need to experience the F1 to understand. To assume it is nothing more than a pulling on the paddles is a huge misconception.
Raz I agree some people would get great satisfaction by hitting the down shift perfectly with a manual. It does not happen that often, so when it does the driver lights up.
Don't make it sound more difficult than it is Nick
Pulling off perfect upshifts/downshifts takes no more than a couple hours at most with the F1 system in the 360. Once you've got that down, it's all hands on the wheel and all eyes on the road. As I've said before, this helps a lot at higher speeds where the F1 system can be quite fun, but at lower speeds I'm not so sure.
Re: Ford GT versus F430 test
Quote:
g-force said:
it may be a 3 year warranty. BUT will Ferrari fix
your broken car under warranty after a` hard day
at the track? NOPE! Ford will!!!!!!!!!!!!!
actually there are some people suing ferrari right now for not even covering their emissions warranty when their cats fail.
Re: Ford GT versus F430 test
Quote:
g-force said:
it may be a 3 year warranty. BUT will Ferrari fix
your broken car under warranty after a` hard day
at the track? NOPE! Ford will!!!!!!!!!!!!!
I would have MUCH more confidence in Ferrari standing behind their product after a track day than Ford, absolutely no question about it. Ferrari of San Francisco sponsors 2 track days a year, and I have never heard a single story of anyone not being covered because of track activity.
Gary
Re: Ford GT versus F430 test
Quote:
tdf360 said:Quote:
g-force said:
it may be a 3 year warranty. BUT will Ferrari fix
your broken car under warranty after a` hard day
at the track? NOPE! Ford will!!!!!!!!!!!!!
I would have MUCH more confidence in Ferrari standing behind their product after a track day than Ford, absolutely no question about it. Ferrari of San Francisco sponsors 2 track days a year, and I have never heard a single story of anyone not being covered because of track activity.
Gary
yep, would be hard to believe that if ferrari of SF (a ferrari owned dealer) tells customers (and they do) the best way to break their cars in is on the track, they void warranties because of track use. now if ferrari would just stand behind their emissions warranty off the track, their customers wouldn't have to sue them.
Re: Ford GT versus F430 test
Quote:
tdf360 said:Quote:
ben, lj said:
now if ferrari would just stand behind their emissions warranty off the track, their customers wouldn't have to sue them.
Are you privy to all the details of the suit?
Gary
you mean suit(s) by multiple customers with the same problem? no, but it's quite a coincidence wouldn't ya say?
Re: Ford GT versus F430 test
Quote:
ben, lj said:Quote:
tdf360 said:Quote:
ben, lj said:
now if ferrari would just stand behind their emissions warranty off the track, their customers wouldn't have to sue them.
Are you privy to all the details of the suit?
Gary
you mean suit(s) by multiple customers with the same problem? no, but it's quite a coincidence wouldn't ya say?
Hm...I was only aware of one. How many are we talking about?
Gary
Re: Ford GT versus F430 test
Quote:
tdf360 said:Quote:
ben, lj said:Quote:
tdf360 said:Quote:
ben, lj said:
now if ferrari would just stand behind their emissions warranty off the track, their customers wouldn't have to sue them.
Are you privy to all the details of the suit?
Gary
you mean suit(s) by multiple customers with the same problem? no, but it's quite a coincidence wouldn't ya say?
Hm...I was only aware of one. How many are we talking about?
Gary
two or three i'm aware of. then of course there is the poor bastard with the 360 who had cat problems which led to more extra damage - (you can read about that one in the Exotic Warranty Company thread on fchat). ferrari denied his cat claim too!
Re: Ford GT versus F430 test
Quote:
ben, lj said:Quote:
tdf360 said:Quote:
ben, lj said:Quote:
tdf360 said:Quote:
ben, lj said:
now if ferrari would just stand behind their emissions warranty off the track, their customers wouldn't have to sue them.
Are you privy to all the details of the suit?
Gary
you mean suit(s) by multiple customers with the same problem? no, but it's quite a coincidence wouldn't ya say?
Hm...I was only aware of one. How many are we talking about?
Gary
two or three i'm aware of. then of course there is the poor bastard with the 360 who had cat problems which led to more extra damage - (you can read about that one in the Exotic Warranty Company thread on fchat). ferrari denied his cat claim too!
Ferrari of San Francisco(wich is actually in Mill Valley) is a factory owned Ferrari dealership, so the news that they deny customer warranty claims is especially pathetic.
Re: Ford GT versus F430 test
Quote:
JimFlat6 said:Quote:
ben, lj said:Quote:
tdf360 said:Quote:
ben, lj said:Quote:
tdf360 said:Quote:
ben, lj said:
now if ferrari would just stand behind their emissions warranty off the track, their customers wouldn't have to sue them.
Are you privy to all the details of the suit?
Gary
you mean suit(s) by multiple customers with the same problem? no, but it's quite a coincidence wouldn't ya say?
Hm...I was only aware of one. How many are we talking about?
Gary
two or three i'm aware of. then of course there is the poor bastard with the 360 who had cat problems which led to more extra damage - (you can read about that one in the Exotic Warranty Company thread on fchat). ferrari denied his cat claim too!
Ferrari of San Francisco(wich is actually in Mill Valley) is a factory owned Ferrari dealership, so the news that they deny customer warranty claims is especially pathetic.
ferrari of SF is the dealership that tells customers to break there cars in on the track but no one has said anything about them denying (any) warranty claims.
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