Rennteam 2.0 - EN - Forum - Oh. - Page1

May 24, 2003 10:57:37 PM

RC: Rennteam Administrator; Loc: Rennteam HQ , Germany; Posts: 59582, Gallery; Registered on: Mar 26, 2002

BMW new 5-series sighting today...

I saw a new BMW 5-series model today on my way to Herrsching/Ammersee in South Germany.
What can I say? The car looks even more ugly than on pictures. I'm not kidding.

It looks even worse than the 7-series, like somebody tried very hard to make a modern art sculpture out of the 5-series and didn't fully succeed. Strange looks and I don't think I can get used to it.
So no matter how much HP the new M5 will have, it looks horrible.

The M3 looks nice, the new Z4 already looks a little bit strange and I can even live with the 7-series but the new 5-series is a huge shock for me. I already saw pictures in different car magazines but what I saw today was really butt ugly. My wife couldn't believe her eyes either, she thought that was a new Hyundai. No kidding again.

The 5-series is a very important product for BMW and it sells very very well over here in Germany among the ages 40-50, a very popular limousine. I doubt BMW will have the same success with the new 5-series, it looks way too weird.

Next
Threads

May 26, 2003 6:47:37 AM

william: Senior; Loc: New York/Hong Kong , Hong Kong; Posts: 670, Gallery; Registered on: Apr 9, 2002; Reply to: RC

I never seem to understand..

What was Chris Bangle's design revelation? What is he trying to do or prove??

With all the negative comments toward his work, he still stand strong and stubborn. Seem like he is trying to commit a profession sucide. BMW really need a very impressive performance and everything else to save their product line.

It is very difficult to understand, Cayenne may have an excuse for the poor styling.. But a 5 series?? During this kind of economy situation, BMW can't afford to take such a risk.

Next
Threads

May 26, 2003 7:15:58 AM

RC: Rennteam Administrator; Loc: Rennteam HQ , Germany; Posts: 59582, Gallery; Registered on: Mar 26, 2002; Reply to: william

Re: I never seem to understand..

Quote:
What was Chris Bangle's design revelation? What is he trying to do or prove??

With all the negative comments toward his work, he still stand strong and stubborn. Seem like he is trying to commit a profession sucide. BMW really need a very impressive performance and everything else to save their product line.

It is very difficult to understand, Cayenne may have an excuse for the poor styling.. But a 5 series?? During this kind of economy situation, BMW can't afford to take such a risk.

I think BMW wanted to get away from the "Mercedes-illness"..."reliable, perfect but boring".

Unfortunately people who are buying the 5-series want a reliable and perfect car.
And every car you see at almost every corner over here in Germany (like the 5-series or the Mercedes E-class) becomes "optically" boring, there is nothing they can do about it. So this could brake BMW's "neck", the future will tell.
The 5-series model I saw was black.

Next
Threads

May 26, 2003 7:57:05 AM

rsv: Co-Pilot; Loc:; Posts: 180, Gallery; Registered on: Jun 7, 2002; Reply to: RC

Re: I never seem to understand..

Hi Christian,

the Z4 and 7-series look more than weird, they are ugly, but the 5-series are ok.

But I can't follow you in what you say about the design of the 5 series.
I saw several 5 on road (even the M5 one time) and i like the design.
The car looks stylish and dynamic - not as nice as the E-class, but more dynamic.

The M5 looks nice too, it has a very aggressive front.

Do you remember what you said about the Cayenne some months ago?
I think you will get used to the 5-series design too.

Best
Wolfgang

Next
Threads

May 26, 2003 8:03:11 AM

william: Senior; Loc: New York/Hong Kong , Hong Kong; Posts: 670, Gallery; Registered on: Apr 9, 2002; Reply to: RC

I see.

Now I am starting to understand alittle bit more, but not 100%

When I was in Germany, the 5 series and E class is in fact very 'boring'. I have a totally different perspective toward those cars in Germany than other places in the world.

In United State is a very different case indeed, a 5 series is a luxury product. People want it to look 'boring' like the Mercedes, as the people in Germany may think so. Another word, I don't think America is ready for such unique styling when they haven't think it is boring yet. It is too much for them to swallow at this point.

Even so, I still think it is a great risk to test this theory in such sensitive time.

Next
Threads

May 26, 2003 8:21:40 AM

zzboba: Rennteam Administrator; Loc: Germany; Posts: 3115, Gallery; Registered on: Apr 8, 2002; Reply to: william

Re: I see.

i think the misunderstanding at BWM -- let alone that bangle's origami style does not work for cars -- is that they thought that in their core markets asia and USA the buyers demand BIG and REPRESENTATIVE cars. an BMW official once stated in a german car mag that they "had beautiful designs for the 7 series, slick and sporty -- but they canned them because they might have been the right design for germany and the rest of europe, but not for asia and the US". IMO they are WRONG. why is it that beemer has become such a strong brand in the US? because of his sporty image, because of beeing different from fat merc and lexus vehicles. well, it's just sad. and once more: what i really miss is the wrap-around cockpit layout. i always would have preferred any BMW over a merc, but not any more.

RC: you are right, the 5 series is even more ugly in real life than the 7 series. the 7 doesn't work on pictures, the 5 doesn't work in reality.

Next
Threads

May 26, 2003 8:24:32 AM

zzboba: Rennteam Administrator; Loc: Germany; Posts: 3115, Gallery; Registered on: Apr 8, 2002; Reply to: zzboba

Re: PS

PS. there are rumours on autospies that the 7 series is getting an early facelift -- trunk softened, easier iDrive, headlamp workover. i wonder what BMW does to make the early adaptors happy again? depreciation is EXTREME in germany for the 7 already. you can get 1 year old cars for nearly 50% of the original price tag. having in mind that most cars (i suppose) are leased... :-(

Next
Threads

May 26, 2003 9:03:23 AM

william: Senior; Loc: New York/Hong Kong , Hong Kong; Posts: 670, Gallery; Registered on: Apr 9, 2002; Reply to: zzboba

Oh.

Even zzboba, RC and the german car magazine don't think so...

which mean Bangle's concept didn't work for US and Asia, but also in Germany. This is obviously a sign they should rearrange the 'high position' people in BMW with such poor decision making. I don't think Bangle should be the only one responsible, but the executive who actually allow this concept to go on.

Wait til you see the new 3 series... I can't even imagine.... with such low expectation, I think if it turn out to be normal.. everyone will be so happy already.

Next
Threads

May 26, 2003 9:28:03 AM

zzboba: Rennteam Administrator; Loc: Germany; Posts: 3115, Gallery; Registered on: Apr 8, 2002; Reply to: william

Re: Oh.

actually the guy who did design the new 5 series died two years ago of cancer (a tragic story i heard from a guy i know at BMW) -- but bangle is head of design and responsible for the origami era. he's very charismatic of what i've heard and so he can always convince the board of directors -- who IMO have no style at all. i do not want to get too personal, but look at burkhard goeschl, the head of R&D at BMW... just look at him... he's got no good personal style, so how should he decide what style is good for cars?

but market research should have worked...

Next
Threads

May 26, 2003 1:56:02 PM

RC: Rennteam Administrator; Loc: Rennteam HQ , Germany; Posts: 59582, Gallery; Registered on: Mar 26, 2002; Reply to: rsv

Re: I never seem to understand..

The worst thing, Wolfgang, is: I didn't get used to the Cayenne...(yet?).

Dynamic? Hmm. I don't know. Maybe I just have to see the new 5-series much more often on the street to come to a final conclusion. But what I saw shocked me. I didn't like it at all and this happens very very seldom with a car. Best example: I saw the new Honda Accord on the street and I liked it immediately. It is no beauty but a nice looking car. Compared to the new 5-series, it looks even classy.

I don't know, maybe BMW drivers will love this car but I wouldn't bet on it. Today I saw a 7-series again and I have to say that the 7-series is much nicer than the 5-series. But maybe this really lies in the eye of the beholder.

I wish BMW all the best luck but we have tough times now and if people have to choose, I'm not sure they'll go with the new 5-series.

Top
Threads

Board	Subject	Last post	Views	Replies
Porsche	SUN'S LAST RUN TO WILSON, WY - 991 C2S CAB LIFE, END OF AN ERA (Part II)	4/17/24 7:16 AM Gnil	766347	1798
Porsche	Welcome to Rennteam: Cars and Coffee... (photos)	4/7/24 11:48 AM Boxster Coupe GTS	437670	565
Porsche	OFFICIAL: Cayman GT4 RS (2021)	5/12/23 12:11 PM W8MM	261546	288
Porsche	OFFICIAL: Porsche 911 (992) GT3 RS - 2022	3/12/24 8:28 AM DJM48	258424	323
Porsche	The new Macan: the first all-electric SUV from Porsche	1/30/24 9:18 AM RC	82993	45
Porsche	OFFICIAL: Taycan 2024 Facelift	3/15/24 1:23 PM CGX car nut	5340	50
Porsche	The moment I've been waiting for...	2/1/24 7:01 PM Pilot	877793	1364
Porsche	992 GT3	7/23/23 7:01 PM Grant	810294	3868
Porsche	Welcome to the new Taycan Forum!	2/10/24 4:43 PM nberry	388868	1526
Porsche	GT4RS	4/17/24 8:53 PM Gauss	386712	1452
Others	Tesla 2 the new thread	12/13/23 2:48 PM CGX car nut	369801	2401
Porsche	Donor vehicle for Singer Vehicle Design	7/3/23 12:30 PM Porker	367493	797
Ferrari	Ferrari 812 Superfast	4/21/23 8:09 AM the-missile	290912	550
Porsche	Red Nipples 991.2 GT3 Touring on tour	4/11/24 12:32 PM Ferdie	287074	668
Porsche	Collected my 997 GTS today	10/19/23 7:06 PM CGX car nut	259511	812
Lambo	Huracán EVO STO	7/30/23 6:59 PM mcdelaug	238081	346
Lotus	Lotus Emira	6/25/23 2:53 PM Enmanuel	226296	101
Others	Corvette C8	10/16/23 3:24 PM Enmanuel	220485	488
Others	Gordon Murray - T.50	11/22/23 10:27 AM mcdelaug	167454	387
Porsche	Back to basics - 996 GT3 RS	6/11/23 5:13 PM CGX car nut	139350	144
BMW M	2024 BMW M3 CS Official Now	12/29/23 9:04 AM RC	116030	303
Motor Sp.	2023 Formula One	12/19/23 5:38 AM Whoopsy	107771	685
Others	Valkyrie final design?	4/28/23 2:45 AM Rossi	99399	219
Porsche	2022 992 Safari Model	3/7/24 4:22 PM Whoopsy	83706	239
AMG	Mercedes-Benz W124 500E aka Porsche typ 2758	2/23/24 10:03 PM blueflame	74923	297
Porsche	992 GT3 RS	3/3/24 7:22 PM Whoopsy	53319	314
Motor Sp.	Porsche 963	3/16/24 9:27 PM Whoopsy	24763	237
Ferrari	Ferrari 296 GTB (830PS, Hybrid V6)	1/21/24 4:29 PM GT-Boy	20999	103
BMW M	2022 BMW M5 CS	4/8/24 1:43 PM Ferdie	19269	140
AMG	G63 sold out	9/15/23 7:38 PM Nico997	16484	120

Crown

Forum - Thread

BMW new 5-series sighting today...

I never seem to understand..

Re: I never seem to understand..

Re: I never seem to understand..

I see.

Re: I see.

Re: PS

Oh.

Re: Oh.

Re: I never seem to understand..

Forum

Boards