lukestern:
Whoopsy:
lukestern:
Porsche-Jeck:

Yes, I agree - especially with the keyword "yet"  It will be an interesting race for sure kiss

Fully agree that it is an interesting race and it's a joy being a spectator Smiley

But what to some extent is skewed in my opinion is the "Tesla vs. the rest" and wether Tesla will survive or not. I mean, the race is as much between BMW, Mercedes, Audi (to name a few) to compete with each others new products in different segments and how they can manage the transition and selling ICE vehicles in parallell with their new EVs. It's a thin line and the legacy and necessary investments in electrification will for sure not be smooth sailing.

Just because BMW launch their new 3-series doesn't mean that they will "kill" Audi A4 and Merc C-class sales. In the same way just because BMW or Audi launch a new EV doesn't mean it will kill the Teslas. I'd say that Tesla actually formed a new segment of car buyers that are more interested in tech than in the actual car. In this segment there are probably not that many who jump the Tesla ship that easy and buy a BMW 3-series EV instead. Of course it work out the other way around as well where a die hard BMW fan have zero interest in a Tesla 3 and wait for a 3 series EV (if that person at all is interested in an EV).

For Porsche it will be very interesting to see how things develop with the Taycan and how they sell that in parallell with the Panamera at a similar price point. Recent news show that demand looks very high and in it's niche this will be a fantastic car. Actually the car that interest me personally the most among all EV launches.

 

Taycan is a EV car, it sells in the EV segment. Which currently only has Tesla take the whole pie without competition at premium price end. Same with all the other EV from the other Germans.

Together they will gradually grow the EV segment to become bigger, but the sure thing is that Tesla will lose major market share, a fact as they current have 100% of the segment. 

In an exponential growing market it doesn't matter what market share Tesla has today. 5% market share for Tesla in a few years could be similar to the sheer number of cars equal to 300% of the market today. 

EV cars compete with EV cars, just like pickup trucks compete against pickup trucks, you don't hear people talking about Jesus those F150s are killing the sales of the Focus.

A more valid comparison would be a BMW 5-series diesel competing against a BMW 5-series petrol. It's just a different drivetrain. Not sure why you start to compare a truck with a Focus and the logic behind that? Totally different products, that serves different purpose for different customers.

As for the Taycan competing against Panamera. It's a moot point. They are different size for different segments. GM, Chrysler and Ford all sells full size pickups and mid sized pickups, and no one give a single fuck about Jesus those mid-sized pickups are stealing sales from the full sized. They only steal from competitors from the same segment. Nor did someone say damn those E-Class are stealing S-Class sales.

I think you underestimate a lot of customers. People will compromise a little in size to get the benefit of driving a Taycan instead of a Panamera with yesterdays tech. I think we will see dramatic changes quicker than you can imagine. But let's see who's right in a few years, I know we will never agree on this today so no idea to discuss this further. I have my stand point and you have yours. And that's perfectly fine Smiley

 

As a EV fanboy you are over estimating the attraction of EV.

The 2 cars are difference sized period. They are aiming for different segment. 

You are thinking they are the same size so you use a 5 series diesel vs a 5 series gasoline. Actually not just you, but every other Tesla fanboy thinks the same way. That Porsche is killing it's own product with another to deflect the issue that Taycan is aiming squarely at the Model S, well slight above to be exact. 

a diesel C-class doesn't steal from a gasoline 5 series, nor do a 5 series diesel stealing from a S-class. They all co-exists.

Panamera is a giant car, Taycan is not, I had them side by side in Weissach. The size difference is basically a E vs a S. Completely different segment, Only thing they have in common is the badge and 4 doors that's about it.

But if you insist that kind of logic, then the Model 3 should have killed the Model S isn't it? Newer car Smiley

 


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