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    2009 F1 Italian Grand Prix in Monza

    A week and a half to go till the next race - I'm interested to see if Jenson Button can turn things around Smiley

    Monza is such a high speed circuit - it will be interesting to see whose car will be quickest - I expect the Red Bulls to be very quick there. Ferrari will also be quick plus they have a 'home' advantage Smiley I also expect Force India and BMW Sauber to continue their recent good form Smiley

    I don't expect this circuit to suit Brawn, McLaren, Renault, Toyota, Toro Rosso or Williams.

    Hopefully, Ferrari may make some announcements about their driver line up for 2010 Smiley And then all the other teams can start confirming race seats in the following weeks and months Smiley

    I expect Luca Badoer won't race in Monza - surely Ferrari will act to spare him further embarrassment SmileySmiley

     


    --

    Rennteam Moderator - 997.1 C2S Coupe GT Silver/Cocoa, -20mm/LSD, PSE, SportDesign rims, Zuffenhausen collection


    Re: 2009 F1 Italian Grand Prix in Monza

    Monza is a high speed , low downforce sprinter's circuit.

    I expect the cars w/KERS will have the clear advantage on this course.

    Also the ones that perform better on hard compound tires since softs will not really be a necessity.


    --

    ...the only thing stopping you in all likelihood, is you!


    Re: 2009 F1 Italian Grand Prix in Monza

    easy_rider911:

    I expect Luca Badoer won't race in Monza - surely Ferrari will act to spare him further embarrassment SmileySmiley

     

    After Badoer's performance in the two GPs he took part, I wondered what he actually does at Ferrari as a test driverSmiley.

    Does he just go round circles lap after lap to test components, tyres etc? In terms of speed he appeared to be a zero!

    Anyone knows?


    --
    It's not where you're going, it's how you get there that counts

    Re: 2009 F1 Italian Grand Prix in Monza

    reginos:
    easy_rider911:

    I expect Luca Badoer won't race in Monza - surely Ferrari will act to spare him further embarrassment SmileySmiley

     

    After Badoer's performance in the two GPs he took part, I wondered what he actually does at Ferrari as a test driverSmiley.

    Does he just go round circles lap after lap to test components, tyres etc? In terms of speed he appeared to be a zero!

    Anyone knows?


    I don't think test drivers ever push the car to its fullest. They perform little tests that are aimed at certain parts up into the car. Thus he probably never actually raced an F1 car, but was more piloting it in order to acquire testing data for various parts being tested.
     


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    Re: 2009 F1 Italian Grand Prix in Monza

    Luca Badoer was a racer, he last raced an F1 machine 10 years ago. A good development driver is someone who can work well with the engineers and knows what the racing drivers want out of the car and sets it up accordingly. For Ferrari to have him as their development driver for the past 10 years (winning 8 Constructors and 6 Drivers Championships during that period) he is not that bad bad at his daily job at all. He is just green as a racer and probably way too slow for a competitive come back (not that he was that quick to beggin with). All in all a bad choice but unfortunately Ferrari didn't have someone else readily available.


    --
    FERRARI RULES!!!

    Re: 2009 F1 Italian Grand Prix in Monza

    REALZEUS:

    Luca Badoer was a racer, he last raced an F1 machine 10 years ago. A good development driver is someone who can work well with the engineers and knows what the racing drivers want out of the car and sets it up accordingly. For Ferrari to have him as their development driver for the past 10 years (winning 8 Constructors and 6 Drivers Championships during that period) he is not that bad bad at his daily job at all. He is just green as a racer and probably way too slow for a competitive come back (not that he was that quick to beggin with). All in all a bad choice but unfortunately Ferrari didn't have someone else readily available.

     

    This morning, in the bathroom, I asked myself wether Ferrari put Badoer to conduct  testing at race conditions. You know, it is hard to understand how someone could perform so weak and still keep his seat for a second race.

    So despite testing limitations Ferrari has the chance to keep his test driver on the track for a whole weekend... Smiley


    Re: 2009 F1 Italian Grand Prix in Monza

    Ferdie:

    This morning, in the bathroom, I asked myself wether Ferrari put Badoer to conduct  testing at race conditions.

    HAHAHAHHASmiley Smiley

    Smiley


    --
    997 TT, what a car/che'mmmmmaghena!!!


    Re: 2009 F1 Italian Grand Prix in Monza

    reginos:
    easy_rider911:

    I expect Luca Badoer won't race in Monza - surely Ferrari will act to spare him further embarrassment SmileySmiley

     

    After Badoer's performance in the two GPs he took part, I wondered what he actually does at Ferrari as a test driverSmiley.

    Does he just go round circles lap after lap to test components, tyres etc? In terms of speed he appeared to be a zero!

    Anyone knows?

    I don't really care as long as BADoer is replaced at Monza. I do not want to see a Ferrari finish last at its home GP. It'll be like the early 90's all over again, when they didn't finish at allSmiley


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    Re: 2009 F1 Italian Grand Prix in Monza

    Ferdie:

    This morning, in the bathroom,

    TMI!, TMI! :D :D


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    Porsche, seperates LeMans from LeBoys

    Re: 2009 F1 Italian Grand Prix in Monza

    Luca Badoer is now known as "Look -how- Bad -you-are"


    Re: 2009 F1 Italian Grand Prix in Monza

    "Gazetta della sporte" wrote that Kubica will probably come to Ferrari.


    Re: 2009 F1 Italian Grand Prix in Monza

    Eunice:

    "Gazetta della sporte" wrote that Kubica will probably come to Ferrari.

    IMO Vettel is ideal for Ferrari. Besides being a great talent last year at Monza when the German and Italian anthems were played at the ceremony (Vettel and Scuderia Toro Rosso) it was "days of Michael Schumacher" all over again Smiley. Besides MS can guide young Vettel if they are both in the same team.


    --
    It's not where you're going, it's how you get there that counts

    Re: 2009 F1 Italian Grand Prix in Monza

    Vettel is one of the few drivers with a contract with Red Bull already signed and announced for 2010. It seems unlikely when there are so many other choices for Ferrari...


    --

    Rennteam Moderator - 997.1 C2S Coupe GT Silver/Cocoa, -20mm/LSD, PSE, SportDesign rims, Zuffenhausen collection


    Re: 2009 F1 Italian Grand Prix in Monza

    Joost:
    Ferdie:

    This morning, in the bathroom,

    TMI!, TMI! :D :D

    That was the official version.Smiley


    Re: 2009 F1 Italian Grand Prix in Monza

    easy_rider911:

    Vettel is one of the few drivers with a contract with Red Bull already signed and announced for 2010. It seems unlikely when there are so many other choices for Ferrari...

    You as a lawyer, of course knows that every contract has its price for getting out Smiley

    I don't think that any of the other drivers trying to climb the ladder (Kubica and Rosberg included) are as good overall as Vettel. Assuming that Alonso has already been measured for the red uniform, a ALO-VET pairing would be ideal IMO.

    I don't see Massa (though I don't rate him highly anyway) returning in top form and Kimi is too much of a free spirit to be relied upon. Also he will irritate Alonso so much that both will be under-performing.


    --
    It's not where you're going, it's how you get there that counts

    Re: 2009 F1 Italian Grand Prix in Monza

    reginos:
    easy_rider911:

    Vettel is one of the few drivers with a contract with Red Bull already signed and announced for 2010. It seems unlikely when there are so many other choices for Ferrari...

    .... every contract has its price for getting out Smiley


    True Smiley But can you imagine how many millions of euros we are talking about here Smiley

    The other crucial consideration is no 1 driver status.

    When Schumi was at Ferrari, Barrichello was under no illusion that he was no 2.

    Alonso left McLaren, amongst other things, because McLaren refused to treat him (a 2 time World Champ) as the no 1 driver over the rookie, Lewis Hamilton. Instead, McLaren preserved their equality even though the consequences were devastating. The team suffered and neither of the 2 'prima donnas' won the title (that was lost to Raikkonen).

    Given Alonso's history at McLaren, can one really expect Alonso to join Ferrari as an equal to whoever is in the other seat? Especially considering Alonso's uncontested no 1 status at Renault - i.e. Alonso is used to this.

    I think Alonso would reluctantly 'accept' Raikkonen as an equal (but it is unlikely Kimi will stay at Ferrari in 2010 - even though Kimi has a contract for 2010).

    I think Alonso would not like Massa as his equal - but Alonso should realise that Massa has made himself into much more of a Ferrari team player than Raikkonen has. Plus, Massa has kept a strong relationship with Schumi (as a mentor). Most significantly, Massa so nearly won the Drivers World Championship in 2008 - i.e. this makes it less easy for Alonso to claim that Massa is 'unworthy' of equal status.

    If neither Raikkonen nor Massa remain at Ferrari, and Ferrari secure Alonso and Vettel, Alonso would be happy with no 1 status (and Ferrari is the kind of 'hierarchical' team that would grant this) but Vettel is an ambitious young man who would prefer not to be anybody's no 2.

     

     


    --

    Rennteam Moderator - 997.1 C2S Coupe GT Silver/Cocoa, -20mm/LSD, PSE, SportDesign rims, Zuffenhausen collection


    Re: 2009 F1 Italian Grand Prix in Monza

    It's official Fisichella is confirmed for Monza!! that's a nightmare


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    Forza rennteam 2.0!


    Re: 2009 F1 Italian Grand Prix in Monza

    mikigta:

    It's official Fisichella is confirmed for Monza!! that's a nightmare

    really....SmileySmiley

     

    but i'm not a ferrari fan,so i'm happy!!Smiley

     

    ahahhahahaSmiley


    --
    997 TT, what a car/che'mmmmmaghena!!!

    Re: 2009 F1 Italian Grand Prix in Monza

    Fisi is an excellent driver, something he proved last Sunday. I wonder why his compatriots do not relish the moment of seing an Italian driver in the cockpit of a Ferrari...


    --
    FERRARI RULES!!!

    Re: 2009 F1 Italian Grand Prix in Monza

    REALZEUS:

    Fisi is an excellent driver, something he proved last Sunday. I wonder why his compatriots do not relish the moment of seing an Italian driver in the cockpit of a Ferrari...

    Just my opinion Fisichella is not an excellent driver he drive  fo two years the renault world champion car he won only 1 race.

    Btw i don't like the person, i prefer Badoer 100 time over Fisichella and i was very happy when Luca drive the Ferrari....Smiley

    Smiley


    --

    Forza rennteam 2.0!


    Re: 2009 F1 Italian Grand Prix in Monza

    mikigta:
    REALZEUS:

    Fisi is an excellent driver, something he proved last Sunday. I wonder why his compatriots do not relish the moment of seing an Italian driver in the cockpit of a Ferrari...

    Just my opinion Fisichella is not an excellent driver he drive  fo two years the renault world champion car he won only 1 race.

    Btw i don't like the person, i prefer Badoer 100 time over Fisichella and i was very happy when Luca drive the Ferrari....Smiley

    Smiley

    same here...unfortunately i don't like Fisichella like person too,is like Max Biaggi the Motorcicle driver,he had everytime excuses when Valentino Rossi wins races against him:the engine is not good,the plug is dirty,ecc..hahahSmiley

    Fisi is the same:there is traffic on qualifying,there is a hole in a tyre ,ecc..

    Sure i'm slower than him,but i don't whant to go to drife an F1...Smiley

    Luca badoer was slow,but at least don't talk for nothing..Smiley

     

    IMHOSmiley


    --
    997 TT, what a car/che'mmmmmaghena!!!

    Re: 2009 F1 Italian Grand Prix in Monza

    He may be a likeable person but he is dangerously slow! His best lap in Spa  was some 2.2 secs off Raikkonen's best! Surely, he is not worthy of a Ferrari cockpit...


    --
    FERRARI RULES!!!

    Re: 2009 F1 Italian Grand Prix in Monza

    easy_rider911:
    reginos:
    easy_rider911:

    Vettel is one of the few drivers with a contract with Red Bull already signed and announced for 2010. It seems unlikely when there are so many other choices for Ferrari...

    .... every contract has its price for getting out Smiley


    True Smiley But can you imagine how many millions of euros we are talking about here Smiley

    The other crucial consideration is no 1 driver status.

    When Schumi was at Ferrari, Barrichello was under no illusion that he was no 2.

    Alonso left McLaren, amongst other things, because McLaren refused to treat him (a 2 time World Champ) as the no 1 driver over the rookie, Lewis Hamilton. Instead, McLaren preserved their equality even though the consequences were devastating. The team suffered and neither of the 2 'prima donnas' won the title (that was lost to Raikkonen).

    Given Alonso's history at McLaren, can one really expect Alonso to join Ferrari as an equal to whoever is in the other seat? Especially considering Alonso's uncontested no 1 status at Renault - i.e. Alonso is used to this.

    I think Alonso would reluctantly 'accept' Raikkonen as an equal (but it is unlikely Kimi will stay at Ferrari in 2010 - even though Kimi has a contract for 2010).

    I think Alonso would not like Massa as his equal - but Alonso should realise that Massa has made himself into much more of a Ferrari team player than Raikkonen has. Plus, Massa has kept a strong relationship with Schumi (as a mentor). Most significantly, Massa so nearly won the Drivers World Championship in 2008 - i.e. this makes it less easy for Alonso to claim that Massa is 'unworthy' of equal status.

    If neither Raikkonen nor Massa remain at Ferrari, and Ferrari secure Alonso and Vettel, Alonso would be happy with no 1 status (and Ferrari is the kind of 'hierarchical' team that would grant this) but Vettel is an ambitious young man who would prefer not to be anybody's no 2.

      

    IMO whoever goes to Ferrari with Alonso (assuming KImi leaves and Massa is not fit to drive) won't really accept him as No.1(no matter what the contract says especially since team orders are not legal anymore), unless he is a total newcomer to F1. Alonso although talented and twice WC doesn't radiate the same authority and charisma as the great Michael Schumacher.

    If Massa returns he is already a Ferrari hero after his accident and 2008 runner up position.If Kimi stays (and he will stay if the money is not good elsewhere) he is already a Ferrari champion and a hard nut to crack.

    Things won't be rosy for Alonso at Maranello, unless Badoer is kept as his team mate!


    --
    It's not where you're going, it's how you get there that counts


    Re: 2009 F1 Italian Grand Prix in Monza

    Whats all this Alonso Ferrari hype anyway, people have short memories..

    I seem to remember Hamilton spanking Alonso at McLaren on a regular basis,,he is not as good as one thinks,,imo....

    Fisi has huge pressure now, its a cant win situation for him at the moment, if he finishes out of the first six it would be considered a kack result...


    --
     

    throt

    "I didn't do it"


    Re: 2009 F1 Italian Grand Prix in Monza

    At least Fisichella can say I am driving for Ferrari, something Alonso have been dying to do for a long long time.


    Re: 2009 F1 Italian Grand Prix in Monza

    REALZEUS:

    He may be a likeable person but he is dangerously slow! His best lap in Spa  was some 2.2 secs off Raikkonen's best! Surely, he is not worthy of a Ferrari cockpit...

    Sunday we will see FisichellaSmiley

    IMO for me the best is Schumacher also with only one leg and one eye... but i don't know if he would have been able to finish the race in first 8th positions ...better of badoer for sureSmiley

    These cars is very different from the f2006...and without test.... that's why Badoer was so slow

    Just my opinionSmiley


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    Forza rennteam 2.0!


    Re: 2009 F1 Italian Grand Prix in Monza

    rain expected for the race... Vettel repeat of last year? :)


    --
    Dedi La vita è troppo corta per non guidare italiano.....

    Re: 2009 F1 Italian Grand Prix in Monza

    do you guys think Banco Santander and Ferrari's deal, which will be officially announce tomorrow Thursday, will grow even more all the rumours about Alonso going to Ferrari for next 2010 season ??

    In other words, and this question is focused for those italian rennteamers, do you think Alonso could move to Ferrari in 2010 ??? , what are the real chances, I am completely bored of the multiple false rumours about Alonso moving to the Scuderia, and making it public before October.


    --


    Re: 2009 F1 Italian Grand Prix in Monza

    Alex18_996CC:

    do you guys think Banco Santander and Ferrari's deal, which will be officially announce tomorrow Thursday, will grow even more all the rumours about Alonso going to Ferrari for next 2010 season ??

    In other words, and this question is focused for those italian rennteamers, do you think Alonso could move to Ferrari in 2010 ??? , what are the real chances, I am completely bored of the multiple false rumours about Alonso moving to the Scuderia, and making it public before October.

     

     

    For me Banco SAntader isn't a sponsor like other...they follow Alonso in Mclaren i think they anticipated him in FerrariSmiley maybe not in the next season but when kimi left in 2011.... Alonso-Massa is a nice couple.

    Smiley

     


    --

    Forza rennteam 2.0!


    Re: 2009 F1 Italian Grand Prix in Monza

    Qualifying:

    1 Hamilton, Lewis 1:24.066  
    2 Sutil, Adrian + 0.195  
    3 Räikkönen, Kimi + 0.457  
    4 Kovalainen, Heikki + 0.779  
    5 Barrichello, Rubens + 0.949  
    6 Button, Jenson + 0.964  
    7 Liuzzi, Vitantonio + 0.977  
    8 Alonso, Fernando + 1.006  
    9 Vettel, Sebastian + 1.114  
    10 Webber, Mark + 1.248  
    11 Trulli, Jarno - 0.455  
    12 Grosjean, Romain - 0.338  
    13 Kubica, Robert - 0.200  
    14 Fisichella, Giancarlo - 0.165  
    15 Heidfeld, Nick + 0.209  
    16 Glock, Timo - 0.030  
    17 Nakajima, Kazuki + 0.008  
    18 Rosberg, Nico + 0.055  
    19 Buemi, Sebastien + 0.154  
    20 Alguersuari Jr., Jaime

    + 0.885

     

    Anyone knows where to get the start weight from?


     
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