Crown

noone1:

They do it how they do it because at the end of the day the car has to come with tires on it. They can't test and tune a car without tires on the wheels. That does not mean that the car can't accommodate other brands at the same limits.

Riiiiiight....but why not grab standard tires like they used to do before and bother not only developing the car but also wasting time and resources to also develop the tire specifically for the car? 

I'd also raise this scenario: How do you know off-spec Trofeos wouldn't save you where something like N0 Pzeros let you lose traction and crash? Sword cuts both ways. You show me a stock tire that saves you one way, I'll show you an alternate tire than saves you another way.

You contradict yourself again, you are making my point, that is just it you DON'T know, you only know with manufacturer approved tires, anything else its a lottery.

⇒ Carlos - Porsche 991 Carrera GTS

You're making the assumption that manufacturers are tuning for ultimate performance or safety, rather than just desired feel.

The 570S runs measly 275 rears and only comes with Pzero or Corsas. That's absolutely tiny compared to other cars in the class with that kind of power and price, not to mention many others offer higher performance compounds as well.

They specifically did this not for performance or safety or anything actually useful. They did it to handicap the car compared to the 650S and also to make the car a bit more exciting. Less tire, less grip.

Secondly, you don't know anything about the tires the manufacturer gives you. You have no idea what the limits are on any given road until you actually use it. No tire is going to suddenly just fail at 87 mph in the damp.

I'm pretty sure this guy had stock tires. Why did he nearly get in a head on collision in the dry? Clearly he had no problem going beyond the limits of even the stock setup.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=03wOaO3Ckas

Noone1, you are just arguing for the sake of arguing... 

⇒ Carlos - Porsche 991 Carrera GTS

Carlos from Spain:

Noone1, you are just arguing for the sake of arguing... 

Well, kudos to noone for sticking to RT's core principle 

2015 981 Cayman GT4 | Powerkit White - The fastest car on Rennteam
2013 Audi S3 | Glacier White

  it feels like I entered a Trump/Clinton thread all over again 

--

⇒ Carlos - Porsche 991 Carrera GTS

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kasI6HtxcH0

http://www.bmwblog.com/2017/01/26/michelin-pilot-sport-4-s-new-best-summer-tire/

No more tire or manual threads!  (Sarcasm) 

Leawood911:

No more tire or manual threads!  (Sarcasm) 

2015 981 Cayman GT4 | Powerkit White - The fastest car on Rennteam
2013 Audi S3 | Glacier White

Leawood911:

No more tire or manual threads!  (Sarcasm) 

Haha there are so many references to Rennteam memes in this short statement that it is impressive!
Would have been awesome if you could include chest hair and volvo's in there... 

Porsche, separates Le Mans from Le Boys

Carlos from Spain:

noone1:

They do it how they do it because at the end of the day the car has to come with tires on it. They can't test and tune a car without tires on the wheels. That does not mean that the car can't accommodate other brands at the same limits.

Riiiiiight....but why not grab standard tires like they used to do before and bother not only developing the car but also wasting time and resources to also develop the tire specifically for the car? 

The car of course drives with any other provided tire. The question is just... how good. With all due respect, noone1, your comments don´t give the impression that you know a lot about what you are talking about. Especially Porsche puts a lot of effort into tire development and the correlation between suspension, springs, dampers and the tires. I have to agree with RC that even the compound itself makes a big difference.

Different tires can improve the handling but they don´t necessarily have to. I talked to a Michelin engineer for example when the SuperSport came out and they tested the tire on the 997 models. They even made demo runs on racetracks with 997s equipped with this tire. The same tire on a front- or midengined car though might not give the same result, that´s what even the engineer mentioned. A lot has to do with, apart from compound, the carcass construction underneath.

bluelines:

Carlos from Spain:

Noone1, you are just arguing for the sake of arguing... 

Well, kudos to noone for sticking to RT's core principle 

J.Seven

I abuse my tires until the end. When I see the second layer of steel belts breaking through on the rear I replace them.  Every three sets of reads I replace the fronts. Been doing this with 911s for hundreds of tires over the years. Since we rarely break 100 mph and never much beyond that I am more concerned with durability and cost.  Just so happens the Bridgestone tires I have been using a N tires.  Not much N left on the rears when I am done with them. Lol. 

Leawood911:

I abuse my tires until the end. When I see the second layer of steel belts breaking through on the rear I replace them.  Every three sets of reads I replace the fronts. Been doing this with 911s for hundreds of tires over the years. Since we rarely break 100 mph and never much beyond that I am more concerned with durability and cost.  Just so happens the Bridgestone tires I have been using a N tires.  Not much N left on the rears when I am done with them. Lol. 

Even at 100 mph, a disintegrating tire can be a death trap. 

Tires and brakes...something I never compromise with on a car. 

RC (Germany) - Rennteam Editor Porsche 991 Carrera 4 GTS Cabriolet (2015), Porsche Cayenne S Diesel (2017), Audi R8 V10 Plus (2016), Mini JCW (2015)

Heard a very disturbing rumor today from someone close to Audi Sport: The V10 engine will very likely disappear, the next gen Audi R8 and the next gen Huracan will have a V8 Biturbo top engine (R8 also gets a V6 Biturbo). Only the V12 n/a in the Aventador stays but to make this possible, the V10 has to go. So sad if true.  

Also, it is not even sure the V10 will actually stay for the facelift in 2018/2019. The V8 Biturbo not only offers better emissions but also allows for higher power upgrades and a hybrid adaptation. It will be very likely the same engine used for other models in the Audi/Lamborghini/VW Group model range.

RC (Germany) - Rennteam Editor Porsche 991 Carrera 4 GTS Cabriolet (2015), Porsche Cayenne S Diesel (2017), Audi R8 V10 Plus (2016), Mini JCW (2015)

RC:

Heard a very disturbing rumor today from someone close to Audi Sport: The V10 engine will very likely disappear, the next gen Audi R8 and the next gen Huracan will have a V8 Biturbo top engine (R8 also gets a V6 Biturbo). Only the V12 n/a in the Aventador stays but to make this possible, the V10 has to go. So sad if true.  

Also, it is not even sure the V10 will actually stay for the facelift in 2018/2019. The V8 Biturbo not only offers better emissions but also allows for higher power upgrades and a hybrid adaptation. It will be very likely the same engine used for other models in the Audi/Lamborghini/VW Group model range.

 

Where do I have to sign for a Perfomante? 

We're at the point where you can be the fastest or just sound like you're the fastest.



The secret of life is to admire without desiring.

Rossi:

RC:

Heard a very disturbing rumor today from someone close to Audi Sport: The V10 engine will very likely disappear, the next gen Audi R8 and the next gen Huracan will have a V8 Biturbo top engine (R8 also gets a V6 Biturbo). Only the V12 n/a in the Aventador stays but to make this possible, the V10 has to go. So sad if true.  

Also, it is not even sure the V10 will actually stay for the facelift in 2018/2019. The V8 Biturbo not only offers better emissions but also allows for higher power upgrades and a hybrid adaptation. It will be very likely the same engine used for other models in the Audi/Lamborghini/VW Group model range.

 

Where do I have to sign for a Perfomante? 

Try my dealer... 

I would get one in a second if I had the money "available" (dealer had one for autumn). Leasing isn't worth it in my opinion, also such a car is a keeper.

Now I am torn and don't really know what to do: The R8 GT seems to have been canceled (for whatever reasons) and the R8 facelift may not get a V10 anymore. Oh boy...seems I have to buy my R8.  

--

RC (Germany) - Rennteam Editor Porsche 991 Carrera 4 GTS Cabriolet (2015), Porsche Cayenne S Diesel (2017), Audi R8 V10 Plus (2016), Mini JCW (2015)

They are going in the wrong direction if they cancel the V10 to make room for hybrid tech. People have really to accept hybrid is just an inefficient inegalant stopgap tech

SciFrog:

They are going in the wrong direction if they cancel the V10 to make room for hybrid tech. People have really to accept hybrid is just an inefficient inegalant stopgap tech

It was my understanding that even the V12 will get some sort of hybrid tech. 

VW Group seems to go this direction right now and I think it is a good solution until ELVs are ready to take over.

They have no choice, EU emissions regulations are getting stricter and stricter and with the VW emissions scandal, they are going to introduce real life driving emissions measurements (similar to what is common in the US) instead of those done on stationary dynoes. Tough times for sportscar manufacturers.

--

RC (Germany) - Rennteam Editor Porsche 991 Carrera 4 GTS Cabriolet (2015), Porsche Cayenne S Diesel (2017), Audi R8 V10 Plus (2016), Mini JCW (2015)

Today on the German Autobahn A8...traveling in style.  

(wife asked: Why don't we travel like that, me: we have two kids with us and I have no Aventador, wife: You could have one, me: You threatened to leave me if I get a Lamborghini, wife: That was a long time ago, me: Now I have no money left, great ). Oh well, our typical family discussion in the car. 

RC (Germany) - Rennteam Editor Porsche 991 Carrera 4 GTS Cabriolet (2015), Porsche Cayenne S Diesel (2017), Audi R8 V10 Plus (2016), Mini JCW (2015)

LOL

Today in Aspen we saw a R8 spider in black, nice presence, but also a black FF. That car is really unique, haven't seen the Lusso yet but the FF might be one off the nicest but unappreciated car these days (you can get one for about $150k).

RC:

 

Try my dealer... 

I would get one in a second if I had the money "available" (dealer had one for autumn). Leasing isn't worth it in my opinion, also such a car is a keeper.

Now I am torn and don't really know what to do: The R8 GT seems to have been canceled (for whatever reasons) and the R8 facelift may not get a V10 anymore. Oh boy...seems I have to buy my R8.  

1. Order a Performante and be prepared to give the  to whoever starts preaching you about co2, noise and the other bs you hear every now and then about global warming.

2. Keep the R8 and always polish that V10 cover till the end of time, unless you want to switch to the latest tech.

3. 911 GT3, if you want to let go of the R8. GT3 ticks all the boxes (PDK or Manual) and having tons of Porsche service centers nearby with no headaches to go through.

4. Ferrari FF or GTC4Lusso, you get 4WD + V12 and 2+2 seating and you'll run into shmee

1. I cannot order a Performante because I don't have the money right now (it is invested and provides a nice profit).

2. I cannot keep the R8 and get a Performante, I am no frigging multi millionaire.  With two kids and a shoe loving wife, I am glad I still have my hair left. 

3. No way I would exchange my R8 for a GT3. Not even for a GT2 RS (and I know the specs and know how it looks ). The R8 is my poor man's Huracan and I always loved the Huracan for it's amazing V10 n/a engine. There is no substitute other than a Aventador maybe...or a Ferrari F12 or the new 812 Superfast. 

4. I agree, I would love the FF but it cannot be a replacement for my R8, speaking of driving dynamics and drive feel. I drove the FF for a day (almost 300 km) and while I really like this car, it isn't even close to the R8 regarding drive feel.

--

RC (Germany) - Rennteam Editor Porsche 991 Carrera 4 GTS Cabriolet (2015), Porsche Cayenne S Diesel (2017), Audi R8 V10 Plus (2016), Mini JCW (2015)

Ok spill the beans on the GT2RS RC!

Tesla Model X P90D & 2016 BMW i8 & 2014 991 TTS Cab & 2014 BMW X5 & 2014 BMW i3 2017 - Porsche Mission E & 991.2 GT3 on order

EnglishManInNY:

Ok spill the beans on the GT2RS RC!

I already did if you read my older posts carefully... 

Car is coming this year, so patience. 

RC (Germany) - Rennteam Editor Porsche 991 Carrera 4 GTS Cabriolet (2015), Porsche Cayenne S Diesel (2017), Audi R8 V10 Plus (2016), Mini JCW (2015)

RC:

1. I cannot order a Performante because I don't have the money right now (it is invested and provides a nice profit).

2. I cannot keep the R8 and get a Performante, I am no frigging multi millionaire.  With two kids and a shoe loving wife, I am glad I still have my hair left. 

3. No way I would exchange my R8 for a GT3. Not even for a GT2 RS (and I know the specs and know how it looks ). The R8 is my poor man's Huracan and I always loved the Huracan for it's amazing V10 n/a engine. There is no substitute other than a Aventador maybe...or a Ferrari F12 or the new 812 Superfast. 

4. I agree, I would love the FF but it cannot be a replacement for my R8, speaking of driving dynamics and drive feel. I drove the FF for a day (almost 300 km) and while I really like this car, it isn't even close to the R8 regarding drive feel.

--

 

RC (Germany) - Rennteam Editor Porsche 991 Carrera 4 GTS Cabriolet (2015), Porsche Cayenne S Diesel (2017), Audi R8 V10 Plus (2016), Mini JCW (2015)

 

But it must be one of the few cars out there that have a better engine sound than your wonderful V10. I heard for good an FF and Aventador on Portimão circuit at full throtlle for many laps and for my surprise the V12 Ferrari had a better racing sound,. Both were wonderful to hear. The Aventador was on Chris Harrys hands while the FF was with Harry Metclafe, wonderful day, had the chance to ride on Aventador on passenger seat.

--

J.Seven

The Aventador sounds amazing, the FF and the F12 sound very good (especially the F12 and especially at higher rev figures, probably the reason why you enjoyed the F12 sound so much). The great thing about the V10 engine is the fact that it sounds good even at lower rev figures. I can drive around at 3000 rpm and people still turn their heads when I approach them from a farther distance. Take the GT3 RS, it sounds really great but under 4000 rpm, it sounds like...nothing. 

RC (Germany) - Rennteam Editor Porsche 991 Carrera 4 GTS Cabriolet (2015), Porsche Cayenne S Diesel (2017), Audi R8 V10 Plus (2016), Mini JCW (2015)

Yes, I was referring to high revs sound. 

During the morning Chris was on the Aventador accelerating while car was stopped, to 6000rpm and dear God, engine made all kind of weird and exotic noises, everybody was with their hands on the head, amazing stuff. This was in 2011 when Aventador was being presented so the impact was even bigger.

--

J.Seven

RC:

Heard a very disturbing rumor today from someone close to Audi Sport: The V10 engine will very likely disappear, the next gen Audi R8 and the next gen Huracan will have a V8 Biturbo top engine (R8 also gets a V6 Biturbo). Only the V12 n/a in the Aventador stays but to make this possible, the V10 has to go. So sad if true.  

Also, it is not even sure the V10 will actually stay for the facelift in 2018/2019. The V8 Biturbo not only offers better emissions but also allows for higher power upgrades and a hybrid adaptation. It will be very likely the same engine used for other models in the Audi/Lamborghini/VW Group model range.

 

Bad news about the V10. but at the end we all knew this will happen sooner or later. Of course I hoped the R8 facelift still would have the V10. Furthermore it's just a matter of time when the great V12 n/a will disappear even in the Aventador.

So, what to do? I don't really know. To keep the R8 comes in mind. But we should be honest: after some years the industry will offer other, newer and more attractive cars with sufficient power and modern communication and controls.

I know for sure sooner or later I will buy the latest car technology as I'm a tech guy (a little bit). We should give the V10 some good last years and than we should say "good bye". Just to celebrate this really great engine and all the other V10 here's a link to a former article in the "Auto Bild" which covers the most popular V10 engines with sound files respectively movies. The text is written just in German but the sound is international....

http://www.autobild.de/artikel/die-zehn-besten-v10-sounds-8423851.html

It makes no sense at all to ditch the V10, who cares about a few cars driving around with a V10, almost all of them with low mileage. Sports cars are about feel and emotions, not about emissions and fuel consumption.

Nothing new. With every advances someone complains that the old stuff was better. Progress marches on. Eventually the cars become vintage and cost way more to maintain and barely get driven anymore. Some will fetch high $$, most won't.