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    McLaren's little secret

    It would seems McLaren held back a little secret on the spec of the MP4-12C, that 7 speed box was actually an 8 speed.

    ImageUploadedByTapatalk1376169976.572806.jpg

    'Borrowed' a picture off a member on MLife.

    A few members there have seen the 8th gear and factory tech says it's needed at 300km/hr and above to protect the engine.

    Pretty cool as now there is a unofficial 8th gear club. 


    Re: McLaren's little secret

    It seems like it's only a matter of time before every car has a CVT.


    --


    Re: McLaren's little secret

    6300rmp at 318km/h - must be a 8gear. Cool that they dont talk about!


    Re: McLaren's little secret

    Actually, top speed is 333km/h at 6900rpm in 6th gear. 7th gear is soo long at MP4-12C that it could hit almost 370km/h in it(at 100km long straigh with 10% downhill...).


    Re: McLaren's little secret

    Lars997:

    6300rmp at 318km/h - must be a 8gear. Cool that they dont talk about!

    Cool or deceiving? Smiley


    --

    RC (Germany) - Rennteam Editor Porsche 991 Turbo S (Sept. 2013), Cayenne GTS (958), BMW X3 35d (2013)


    Re: McLaren's little secret

    RC:
    Lars997:

    6300rmp at 318km/h - must be a 8gear. Cool that they dont talk about!

    Cool or deceiving? Smiley

    Nah, they just didn't want Ferrari to know... smiley


    --

    2011 Range Rover Sport S/C,  2009 Porsche 911S


    Re: McLaren's little secret

    ha! this opens up interesting performance possibilities for the P1!


    Re: McLaren's little secret

    Are any of you aware of the upcoming small McLaren ? If will be revealed at the geneva show, 420 HP and about lotus Elise size .


    --

     997.2 C2S, PDK, -20mm


    Re: McLaren's little secret

    Gnil:

    Are any of you aware of the upcoming small McLaren ? If will be revealed at the geneva show, 420 HP and about lotus Elise size .

    Do you have any more info (powertrain, price, etc)?  Sounds interesting!


    --

    73 Carrera RS 2.7 Carbon Fiber replica (1,890 lbs), 06 EVO9 with track mods. Former: 73 911S, Two 951S's, 996 C2, 993 C2, 98 Ferrari 550


    Re: McLaren's little secret

    Gnil:

    Are any of you aware of the upcoming small McLaren ? If will be revealed at the geneva show, 420 HP and about lotus Elise size .


    Never heard about this one. I wonder if this time they'll get the design right at this one. Smiley


    --

    The secret of life is to admire without desiring.


    Re: McLaren's little secret

    My brother was yesterday at a McLaren dealer and he told him about this new model . It should be 911 competition .

    Model will be 2015

    He also mentioned a face lift for the MP4 next year, and 650 HP

    Now I don't know if that was dealer BS, but according to my brother , he sounded to be pretty sure 


    --

     997.2 C2S, PDK, -20mm


    Re: McLaren's little secret

    Gnil:

    My brother was yesterday at a McLaren dealer and he told him about this new model . It should be 911 competition .

    Model will be 2015

    He also mentioned a face lift for the MP4 next year, and 650 HP

    Now I don't know if that was dealer BS, but according to my brother , he sounded to be pretty sure 

    I have heard rumors, but I never heard it would be the size of an Elise.  I thought a little lighter than 12C with the same 3,8L V8 and no turbos - price similar to GT3.


    --

    73 Carrera RS 2.7 Carbon Fiber replica (1,890 lbs), 06 EVO9 with track mods. Former: 73 911S, Two 951S's, 996 C2, 993 C2, 98 Ferrari 550


    Re: McLaren's little secret

    Gnil:
    He also mentioned a face lift for the MP4 next year, and 650 HP
     


    650 hp = perfect

    Now let's see if they can improve the design. Smiley


    --

    The secret of life is to admire without desiring.


    Re: McLaren's little secret

    Btw, there is NO 8th speed on MP4-12C. It's DCT is 7 gear with 7th gear used as overdrive as on 991 turbo models.

    Re: McLaren's little secret

    So the above pic is a screenshot from a videogame ?


    Re: McLaren's little secret

    BiTurbo:

    So the above pic is a screenshot from a videogame ?


    ... or a PS. Smiley


    --

    The secret of life is to admire without desiring.


    Re: McLaren's little secret

    BiTurbo:

    So the above pic is a screenshot from a videogame ?

    Maybe a nice software feature by Mclaren...SmileySmiley

    Seriously, friend of mine owns MP4-12C and I drove his car few times. There is NO 8th gear,

    BTW, Graziano did NOT produced yet DCT gearbox with 8 gears.

    IMHO pics like the one aboe do not do any credit to Mclaren whatsoever...


    Re: McLaren's little secret

    Gnil:

    My brother was yesterday at a McLaren dealer and he told him about this new model . It should be 911 competition .

    Model will be 2015

    He also mentioned a face lift for the MP4 next year, and 650 HP

    Now I don't know if that was dealer BS, but according to my brother , he sounded to be pretty sure 

    If I am allowed a prediction, no matter how risky:

    McLaren Automotive will be out of business or looking for a buyer within 2 years in order to survive.

    That was the fate of all independent manufacturers. A large variety of names comes to mind.  From DeLorean to Lotus and from TVR to Ferrari and Lamborghini . They either fold or are taken over.

    Ron Dennis is too proud or rather arrogant  to be taken over by a proper manufacturer. He was with a giant like Mercedes and managed to break up. So most probably the company will be enter a saga of change of ownership by a series of investors and entrepreneurs. Similar to what has been going on in Lotus and Aston Martin. 

    I predict a bleak future for McLaren Automotive. On a positive note, those who buy their cars, might end up with a good investment due to rarity, when McLaren is out of business. 

     

     


    --

    "Form follows function"


    Re: McLaren's little secret

    Could be...though they have already a huge investor in (Bahrain holding).


    Re: McLaren's little secret

    It will depend on Ron Dennis's attitude if he sees his influence being reduced.

    Moreover, even a strong investor would not pump good money after bad indefinitely.


    --

    "Form follows function"


    Re: McLaren's little secret

    I know its a risky game investing into an independant sportscar manufacturer. Though there is definitely a market. And recent developments (soften sportcar attitude at Porsche, BMW, Mercedes...) helps those who are targeting that sportscar purists.

    Indepent of personal preferences or somecomparisons between 12C, 458, 911 turbo/GT2....there is no doubt, they definitely got something right and well done. 

    The smaller Mac (MP4-13c???) will target even more the 911.... V8 450hp, approx €145k.

     


    Re: McLaren's little secret

    Technology is one thing, money is another. The investment required for new models in automotive industry is enormous. Even if you develop the best car, still in the high end sports car market the volumes are too small to generate enough cash for profitability, if you are inependent. And this  is where such ambitious manufacturers are being caught out.

    The new 911 rival will capture some sales, like the SLS, the M3 ( now M4) and a variety of others have been doing. McLaren will not have the benefit of large volumes to spread its costs. No way they will sell 20.000 units to make Porsche levels of profit. If they sell 2000 or 3000 cars at Porsche prices they will be financially doomed. If they charge at a level commensurate with the cost, they will appear too expensive and they will fail to sell.  Pricing this car will be very tricky. 

    The P1 is a hypercar for billionaires. No problem there as it seems there are plenty of money no object buyers around the world. Even in this segment sales are 50% of what they expected.

    The 12C is the only fresh 458 rival, so it has had some beginner's luck. Some people are fed up or don't like Ferrari or are novelty seekers. We don't  know its profitability, though. The real test for the 12C will be when the new Lamborghini comes out and  Porsche (finally) bring the 960 to the market and McLaren will have to spend cash to rennovate their car.

    Building a 911 rival will be a totally different project financially. Much more difficult.

     

     

     


    --

    "Form follows function"


    Re: McLaren's little secret

    Yep...lets see. I am always fan of wealthy competition. I am happy to see a variety of (different) sportscars and appreciate manufacturers as Porsche, Ferrari, Lamborghini, Aston Martin and McLaren.

    IMO the MP4-12C is an excellent piece of automotive engineering, and really, really fast. Thats what I hear from a lot of drivers.

    IMO also...I am not very happy with the route Porsche has taken the last 2 years (991 design,size,GT-ish, comfort / Macan ...) . 960 comes too late.

     

     

     


    Re: McLaren's little secret

    As regards Porsche IMO, the 991 Carerra S (which is the archetypal Porsche) should have been something like the 991 GT3 in performance, technology, feel and image (but without the wings). The GT3 should have been even higher and sportier, a true Ferrari rival.

    As things are now the 991 Carrera S is very competent but not memorable.

    I hope the 960 is in the market in 2015 with this unique turbo flat 8 to redress the balance after the introduction of the Porsche/Audi Macan.

     

     


    --

    "Form follows function"


    Re: McLaren's little secret

    reginos:

    As regards Porsche IMO, the 991 Carerra S (which is the archetypal Porsche) should have been something like the 991 GT3 in performance, technology, feel and image (but without the wings). The GT3 should have been even higher and sportier, a true Ferrari rival.

    As things are now the 991 Carrera S is very competent but not memorable.

    I hope the 960 is in the market in 2015 with this unique turbo flat 8 to redress the balance after the introduction of the Porsche/Audi Macan.

     

     


    --

    "Form follows function"

    Smiley lets hope so....!!! We haven´t seen yet a 960 prototype, or? I heard also of some delay. 2015 would be very close after the GT2 introduction (later 2014 as MY2015). So I guess 960 is likely to come in 2016...

     

    Your description of the 991 Carrera S gets it to the point.


    Re: McLaren's little secret

    reginos:

    Technology is one thing, money is another. The investment required for new models in automotive industry is enormous. Even if you develop the best car, still in the high end sports car market the volumes are too small to generate enough cash for profitability, if you are inependent. And this  is where such ambitious manufacturers are being caught out.


    The difference I see between McLaren and other small-scale manufacturers is the quality of their products. Most other brands, such as Artega or Wiessmann, (unfortuately) have a comparatively weak market position due to their products´ qualities and target group. McLaren on the other hand has produced a very convincing model with quite a few variants coming up in the future. I also believe that they have very little overhead expenses. If an investor will put money in a small-scale manufacturer, McLaren surely must be one of the most promising possibilities.


    Re: McLaren's little secret

    If McLaren succeed they will set a very positive record. I cannot think of any newcomer to the industry who managed to survive since the 1940s or any limited-production brand that managed to remain independent.

    We shall see yes


    --

    "Form follows function"


    Re: McLaren's little secret

    McLaren stated a few years back when the road car programme began that it would be a 3-car line-up - with the middle one would come first (MP12-4C) followed by the range topper then the junior one (911 competitor, supposedly).  e.g.  http://www.carmagazine.co.uk/News/Search-Results/Industry-News/McLaren-plans-three-models-including-60k-sports-car/

     


    --

    2011 987S, 1964 Type 1


    Re: McLaren's little secret

    KresoF1:
    BiTurbo:

    So the above pic is a screenshot from a videogame ?

    Maybe a nice software feature by Mclaren...SmileySmiley

    Seriously, friend of mine owns MP4-12C and I drove his car few times. There is NO 8th gear,

    BTW, Graziano did NOT produced yet DCT gearbox with 8 gears.

    IMHO pics like the one aboe do not do any credit to Mclaren whatsoever...

    8th gear is only selectable above 300km/hr as per the investigation on McLaren forum. Engineers from McLaren confirmed the existence and say it's there for emission. I haven't been able to select 8th but that doesn't means it's not there. a few members on McLaren forum have seen it on the main straight of the ring on their recent trip early August.


    Re: McLaren's little secret

    The 8th gear might not be a gear as such, but a kind of electronic overdrive in which the control unit adjusts parameters to pre-programmed conditions over the above quoted speed.

    It might read 8, but this could be a virtual gear. With this explanation, we could have a 7 speed gearbox but an 8th gear indication.


    --

    "Form follows function"


     
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