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Re: PCCB's do you have them?miles/problems?
I have PCCB on my Turbo S. I drove the car last Saturday in a steady rain and noticed there seemed to be a lot of fade the more wet the rotors got. In other words, I had to apply more pressure to slow/stop then I normally would have to under dry conditions. Anyone else experience something similar? BTW, my car has about 850 miles.
May 10, 2005 9:12:30 AM
- 03-turbo911
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Re: PCCB's do you have them?miles/problems?
I didn't notice any fade but they are a bit different, feel wise, than the regular stock 996 turbo brakes. They don't seem to be powerful at the begining of brake application but that's only for the intial braking.
I also tracked my turbo S last week and I, must say, that I am more than impressed with the braking power and the resisitence to fade. I had no problems at all with any fade whatsoever. A huge difference between these new PCCB's and my older car with the regular brakes.
I also tracked my turbo S last week and I, must say, that I am more than impressed with the braking power and the resisitence to fade. I had no problems at all with any fade whatsoever. A huge difference between these new PCCB's and my older car with the regular brakes.
Re: PCCB's do you have them?miles/problems?
Quote:
4carl said:
Also can you use RS19s on them? Are th 19s easier on the rotors than the stock pads? thanks carl
PCCB is not PCCB. The 996 Turbo S has the latest PCCB generation, so do the 997 and 987.
The new generation is highly recommendable, braking performance is great, brake pedal feel is incredible.
I also didn't hear about any problems with durability on the track but of course I wouldn't expect the discs to last forever, I think 100000 km for rough street use and/or 30000 km for rough track use should be normal. The emphasis lies on the word rough. Of course this is just a personal estimate, nothing based on current facts.
May 11, 2005 12:51:31 AM
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MAVERICK
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Re: PCCB's do you have them?miles/problems?
Quote:
03-turbo911 said:
I didn't notice any fade but they are a bit different, feel wise, than the regular stock 996 turbo brakes. They don't seem to be powerful at the begining of brake application but that's only for the intial braking.
I've read that Ferrari's CCM (Ferrari version of PCCB) has the same characteristic when cold due, obviously, to the pad and rotor material composition. Consider making it a habit to bring the brakes to operating temperature every few minutes -- more often in cold and/or rainy weather -- and all will be fine. In life, everything has a pro and a con.
And keep in mind that those of you who are using CCB on your street cars are fortunate to have the latest generation that actually works, admittedly not perfect, at street temperatures as opposed to the obstinate first generation CCB that Gordon Murray experimented with on the McLaren F1 prototype.
Re: PCCB's do you have them?miles/problems?
I have driven a few different sorts of ceramic brakes, and I must say that I do not think they are suitable for normal street use. Personally I have no problem making the compromise, and run semi-race pads on all of the cars I drive regularly. I have had this discussion with a few pro race drivers as well, who agree that (until much more development occurs) it is a very expensive technology best left to race cars since there is quite a bit of compromise to them for street use. Depending on pad compound they take much longer to heat up than normal brakes, and as such as much less effective at lower speeds and lower operating temperatures -- this is the reason some of you guys have noted that "they don't work as well initially". I feel better with these kinds of brakes stopping from 120+ than I do stopping from 20!
The first time I was fortunate enough to drive a car equipped with seriously large ceramic brakes (an Enzo) I was more than a little shocked at how much pedal effort it took to really slow the car down at low speeds and low brake temps. These are the kinds of brakes that really do require effort to heat up and make effective! Perhaps "regular" brakes aren't as bad as they seem compared to PCCB, especially for regular road driving...
My recommendation to those of you who are having a hard time: Do a 100-0 stop before your daily commute
That should heat them up enough to be impressive and will wake you up as well! 
The first time I was fortunate enough to drive a car equipped with seriously large ceramic brakes (an Enzo) I was more than a little shocked at how much pedal effort it took to really slow the car down at low speeds and low brake temps. These are the kinds of brakes that really do require effort to heat up and make effective! Perhaps "regular" brakes aren't as bad as they seem compared to PCCB, especially for regular road driving...
My recommendation to those of you who are having a hard time: Do a 100-0 stop before your daily commute
That should heat them up enough to be impressive and will wake you up as well!
Re: PCCB's do you have them?miles/problems?
Quote:
syf0n said:
I have driven a few different sorts of ceramic brakes, and I must say that I do not think they are suitable for normal street use. Personally I have no problem making the compromise, and run semi-race pads on all of the cars I drive regularly. I have had this discussion with a few pro race drivers as well, who agree that (until much more development occurs) it is a very expensive technology best left to race cars since there is quite a bit of compromise to them for street use. Depending on pad compound they take much longer to heat up than normal brakes, and as such as much less effective at lower speeds and lower operating temperatures -- this is the reason some of you guys have noted that "they don't work as well initially". I feel better with these kinds of brakes stopping from 120+ than I do stopping from 20!
The first time I was fortunate enough to drive a car equipped with seriously large ceramic brakes (an Enzo) I was more than a little shocked at how much pedal effort it took to really slow the car down at low speeds and low brake temps. These are the kinds of brakes that really do require effort to heat up and make effective! Perhaps "regular" brakes aren't as bad as they seem compared to PCCB, especially for regular road driving...
Have you tried the PCCB mk2 from Porsche.
I test drove recently a 997S with PCCB and my opinion was the exact opposite of yours!
The pedal is very sensitive right from the start with the engine and car "cold" and it the braking performance at normal speed wasn't poor at all, nor was it better to be 100% honest, it just felt EXACTLY like normal steel brakes with a more sensitive pedal.
Maybe the Ferrari CCM brakes are different, I have not tried them.
Anyone car to comment?
Thanks.
PS: FWIW, it is on my 996 that the brake pedal feels a bit "spongious".
Re: PCCB's do you have them?miles/problems?
Quote:
Fanch said:Quote:
syf0n said:
I have driven a few different sorts of ceramic brakes, and I must say that I do not think they are suitable for normal street use. Personally I have no problem making the compromise, and run semi-race pads on all of the cars I drive regularly. I have had this discussion with a few pro race drivers as well, who agree that (until much more development occurs) it is a very expensive technology best left to race cars since there is quite a bit of compromise to them for street use. Depending on pad compound they take much longer to heat up than normal brakes, and as such as much less effective at lower speeds and lower operating temperatures -- this is the reason some of you guys have noted that "they don't work as well initially". I feel better with these kinds of brakes stopping from 120+ than I do stopping from 20!
The first time I was fortunate enough to drive a car equipped with seriously large ceramic brakes (an Enzo) I was more than a little shocked at how much pedal effort it took to really slow the car down at low speeds and low brake temps. These are the kinds of brakes that really do require effort to heat up and make effective! Perhaps "regular" brakes aren't as bad as they seem compared to PCCB, especially for regular road driving...
Have you tried the PCCB mk2 from Porsche.
I test drove recently a 997S with PCCB and my opinion was the exact opposite of yours!
The pedal is very sensitive right from the start with the engine and car "cold" and it the braking performance at normal speed wasn't poor at all, nor was it better to be 100% honest, it just felt EXACTLY like normal steel brakes with a more sensitive pedal.
Maybe the Ferrari CCM brakes are different, I have not tried them.
Anyone car to comment?
my exp w/ the CCM in my stradale and PCCB in mt CGT is the same as yours w/ your 997S.
Re: PCCB's do you have them?miles/problems?
I have a new (05) 996 Turbo S Cab to be picked up from the dealer at the beginning of next month. It is currently sitting and waiting for me (pictures in another thread); I am under the assumption that this car is equipped with PCCB 2.0, so when I finally get to go for a spin I will let you know what I think!
I did not mean to mislead with my earlier statement -- I'm sure this new version of PCCB will be a great improvement over the original. I was merely trying to remind some that the origins of these types of braking systems are founded in racing, and so there will always be some compromise of things like "initial bite" when adapted for street use.
Cheers,
Richard
I did not mean to mislead with my earlier statement -- I'm sure this new version of PCCB will be a great improvement over the original. I was merely trying to remind some that the origins of these types of braking systems are founded in racing, and so there will always be some compromise of things like "initial bite" when adapted for street use.
Cheers,
Richard
Re: PCCB's do you have them?miles/problems?
2K miles on my '05 Turbo S with second-gen PCCB. It performs better cold than first-gen, but still needs some warm-up. Stopping is impressive, but turn-in is much improved over my '02 Turbo which had OEM iron brakes. Suspension seems to set up better as the rebound damping doesn't have to push as much weight back to the ground.
Re: PCCB's do you have them?miles/problems?
Quote:
syf0n said:
I have a new (05) 996 Turbo S Cab to be picked up from the dealer at the beginning of next month. It is currently sitting and waiting for me (pictures in another thread); I am under the assumption that this car is equipped with PCCB 2.0, so when I finally get to go for a spin I will let you know what I think!
I did not mean to mislead with my earlier statement -- I'm sure this new version of PCCB will be a great improvement over the original. I was merely trying to remind some that the origins of these types of braking systems are founded in racing, and so there will always be some compromise of things like "initial bite" when adapted for street use.
Cheers,
Richard
The PCCB breaks are awesome. Ive owned several 996 models, and these are the best brakes yet. Plus virtually no brake dust.
Jul 9, 2005 6:23:08 PM
- Cyber_chondriac
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Re: PCCB's do you have them?miles/problems?
I have an '03 GT2 in which I've done 7000miles. The only problem I've had with the PCCBs was when some grit became trapped in one of the callipers - sounded like the pad had gone. Porsche stripped down the calliper at its next service - problem solved. Occasionally you get some squeeling - but I put that down again to rubbish getting trapped - but it always goes after a few miles. Unless very cold - I've never noticed any loss of brake performance -- even in the first few miles. By the time the engine is warm enough for high speed driving - so are the brakes......
Carbon/ceramic brakes are a must for any car I now buy - they are awesome (and also look the business too). I test drove a 360 Stradale today which will be replacing my GT2. The ferrari implementation is just as impressive - although I have to say - braking performance - and the perception of everything else was just totally over-shadowed by the noise that thing makes.
Carbon/ceramic brakes are a must for any car I now buy - they are awesome (and also look the business too). I test drove a 360 Stradale today which will be replacing my GT2. The ferrari implementation is just as impressive - although I have to say - braking performance - and the perception of everything else was just totally over-shadowed by the noise that thing makes.
Jul 26, 2005 2:37:20 PM
- watt
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