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    My PDK review on a TRACK

    Yesterday  I went to a track in france ( Bresse)  and tried for the first time my PDK box in that situation.

    This track has two straights , and the rest is mostly in  2 nd  3rd gear as it has tight corners.

    - It was useless to use it on manual in sports mode plus.  It worked MUCH better in automatic Smiley

    - I was faster then the Gt3 996 MKII !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!  Smiley  Faster on the straights and faster in the curbs !!!!!!  ( they were 2 GT3 996 )  They could not keep up ( not by far, but still..... ) the acceleration of my car is just fantastic !!!

    I was on Michelin Cups, as were the Gt3.  PDK helped in the straights as I do not loose any time when changing gear. In the curves I had the advantage of the PSM, as I can go to the limit and not worry but the 996 Gt3 had to have a slight security reserve in order not to end up in the ditch.

    There was a Scuderia and the guy would not believe my car was standard. He asked what kind of mods I had..and insisted I was hiding something Smiley He could not admit he had waited 2 years, and spent 350'000 CHF for a car that was only slightly faster then my Carrera S Smiley 

    My car became the center of the lunch discussions as everyone was so impressed.

    The final excuse ' they' ended having, was to blame it all on the automatic PDK , even the guy from the Scud said : '' But I have to pull the paddles,  of course you have a big advantage '' Smiley

     

    The down parts : you only steer and break the car Smiley

    The puddles are in the way as sometimes you hit them by mistake !!!!!!

     

    But he final conclusion is : the Carrera PDK is very fast on the track ! Impressively fast for a 385 hp car  and the sports mode plus works perfectly !


    --
     997.2 C2S, PDK, -20mm


    Re: My PDK review on a TRACK

    Your impressions seem to be in line with the reviews I read of the PDK box in combination with the C2S, very fast but not as involving as you'd like.

    Although slower, I'd rather be in the 996 GT3 on track, I assume the guy had to work a lot harder, but that's what it's all about in my opinion, not raw pace...

    Nevertheless, as a complete package, your car is unbeatable, it'll happily drive around in traffic and beat GT3's at the racetrack...


    --

    Re: My PDK review on a TRACK

    I confirm, really fast. I even did a run against an Wauxhall competition, well he got me finally.

    Just a pitty that with the PDK we lose all the man work.


    --

     Cayenne Turbo - Mini Cooper S - 997 GT3


    Re: My PDK review on a TRACK

    You are right about the Auto mode. The fastest Sport Auto NBR 7:50 time was done in Auto mode Sport Plus.

    BTW I think the Sport Plus gearshift points (what they call Race Strategy) apply only to the Auto mode. In manual mode there shouldn't be any difference between Sport and Sport Plus. That's how I understand it.

     


    --
    It's not where you're going, it's how you get there that counts

    Re: My PDK review on a TRACK

    Great write up - many thanks!

    It is impressive to read how well this car behaves. Hard to imagine how the new GT3 RS will work!


    Re: My PDK review on a TRACK

    Having driven lately the MK2 with PDK  on twisty roads I can only agree that it's probably the fastest-easiest way as you can

    fully concentrate on the break-points n corners butit takes out huge chunks of the personal involvement and driving pleasure.

    Faster clearly - more fun - not for me at least


    Re: My PDK review on a TRACK

    Thanks for the write up. As PDK equipped 997's become more prevalent on tracks worldwide this scenario will replay, and the inevitable conclusion is that although PDK is faster it's less "involving" than a manual. So the "fastest" has lost a good deal of its gloss, dethroned by "involvement". Don't suppose you dined on any of those famous blue footed chickens while in Bresse??


    --
    Carpe Diem

    Re: My PDK review on a TRACK

    How is "involvement" defined?

    I believe that for the normal sportscar driver changing gears manually is a distraction from the more involving aspects of driving fast, like steering, braking, choosing the cornering lines, car control etc. I'd rather be involved in all the above aspects of driving rather than use the clutch pedal and shift through the manual gate.

    I accept that for the supertalented drivers who can do all the above perfectly plus synchronise with a manual gearbox exceptionally well, driving a 6 speed is more satisfying. Such people are a small % of drivers though, so for the vast majority of us here the discussion here is very academic.


    --
    It's not where you're going, it's how you get there that counts

    Re: My PDK review on a TRACK

    reginos:

    How is "involvement" defined?

    I believe that for the normal sportscar driver changing gears manually is a distraction from the more involving aspects of driving fast, like steering, braking, choosing the cornering lines, car control etc. I'd rather be involved in all the above aspects of driving rather than use the clutch pedal and shift through the manual gate.

    I accept that for the supertalented drivers who can do all the above perfectly plus synchronise with a manual gearbox exceptionally well, driving a 6 speed is more satisfying. Such people are a small % of drivers though, so for the vast majority of us here the discussion here is very academic.

    I think all drivers will not perform all of those simultaneous tasks perfectly, but that provides a reason to keep practicing.  If you go to the same track often, you will eventually be able to drive it with your eyes closed (unless local track is Spa or NoS) and having fewer systems to control yourself will lead to boredom more quickly (and the desire for a newer/faster car).

    Operating three pedals, a stick and a wheel mean to me that I'll continue to practice and improve over a longer period (and stay interested and excited longer).  Getting it perfect happens less often, so it is more special when it does happen.  I just hope Porsche continues to offer both gearboxes - each has a good reason to exist.


    --
    73 Carrera RS 2.7 Carbon Fiber replica (1,890 lbs) Former: 73 911S, Two 951S's, 996 C2, 993 C2


    Re: My PDK review on a TRACK

    DaveC:

     Don't suppose you dined on any of those famous blue footed chickens while in Bresse??

    They are indeed exellent, but no, I had some bad  beef tongue for lunch !!!! Smiley


    --
     997.2 C2S, PDK, -20mm

    Re: My PDK review on a TRACK

    I drove around the Leipzig P circuit 10 days ago in a 997 4S convertible with ceramic brakes and PDK.  I was pushing to the limit for 1h in 3 stints, trying to keep up with a GT3RS (failed but I was not too bad)!

    Bottom line body control is too soft on PASM sports with side motion and diving present (I had great difficulty in a particular medium speed double apex corner from which followed a short and very tight opposite corner), but then again that is why I had lowered and angled and tweaked my own 997S MkI.  BTW if you do not know the circuit, it is short and sharp so lots of braking and twists. 

    The PDK on the other hand is really very good (in sports for the track) except on the button front, even by the afternoon I was still making mistakes until I decided to use the right button only on up and left solely for down.  The problem is not upshifts as much as downshift, you need to press the button too hard for it to be natural, let alone the placement of these things.  All people driving them, including instructors, were of the same opinion.

    I agree that normal mode PDK is not suited for the track, but then again we all know it focuses on lower consumption.

    Bottom line the buttons for me detract from the whole experience, you love a car when it molds around you for 9/10th and you mold around it for the last drop of sensation, these buttons brake the equation.

    Roll on my GT3 then!

    Note: my instructor took an RS and showed how it was done, cutting and then drifting like an animal on fire around corners at very high speeds.  People were just in awe, and thanking themselves their stomach only had to endure 1 lap of this madness.  I really have a long way to go

     


    Re: My PDK review on a TRACK

    Grant:

    I just hope Porsche continues to offer both gearboxes - each has a good reason to exist.

     

    I agree 100% and may I add that both are excellent in what they are meant for.

     


    --
    It's not where you're going, it's how you get there that counts

    Re: My PDK review on a TRACK

    reginos:

    How is "involvement" defined?

    I believe that for the normal sportscar driver changing gears manually is a distraction from the more involving aspects of driving fast, like steering, braking, choosing the cornering lines, car control etc. I'd rather be involved in all the above aspects of driving rather than use the clutch pedal and shift through the manual gate.

    I accept that for the supertalented drivers who can do all the above perfectly plus synchronise with a manual gearbox exceptionally well, driving a 6 speed is more satisfying. Such people are a small % of drivers though, so for the vast majority of us here the discussion here is very academic.


    I also don't love to use clutch and don't find it extra involving racing on a track.

    One may find using the clutch more fun but not more involving. I do also prefer to concentrate on the braking/turning point and fastest line than concentrating on heel-toeing 3 times shifting from 6th to 3rd.

     


    --

    ONUR

    09 Audi TTS Ibis

    07 997 Carrera S / 05 M3 Coupe / 03 M3 Coupe / 96 M3 Coupe EVO (ALL BUT HISTORY)

     


    Re: My PDK review on a TRACK

    Grant:

    I think all drivers will not perform all of those simultaneous tasks perfectly, but that provides a reason to keep practicing.  If you go to the same track often, you will eventually be able to drive it with your eyes closed (unless local track is Spa or NoS) and having fewer systems to control yourself will lead to boredom more quickly (and the desire for a newer/faster car).

    Operating three pedals, a stick and a wheel mean to me that I'll continue to practice and improve over a longer period (and stay interested and excited longer).  Getting it perfect happens less often, so it is more special when it does happen.  I just hope Porsche continues to offer both gearboxes - each has a good reason to exist.

     


     

    100% Agree Smiley

    But I prefer PDK type gearbox. Smiley


    --

    ONUR

    09 Audi TTS Ibis

    07 997 Carrera S / 05 M3 Coupe / 03 M3 Coupe / 96 M3 Coupe EVO (ALL BUT HISTORY)

     


    Re: My PDK review on a TRACK

    When I was alone on the track ( no car to chase and take over) I did get slightly bored using PDK in automatic. There was not enough to do.

    I actually even went off track as I lost my concentration , thinking about refluing and looking at the gauge, and  keeping my foot fully on the throttle......and then.... I arrived too fast into the next corner

    So for me , when there was the challenge to toke over the Gt3 996  or to try to stay as long as I could in front of the Scuderia, that was fine, but when there was nothing else then just doing a nice line, I missed the gear change challenge a lot .


    --
     997.2 C2S, PDK, -20mm

    Re: My PDK review on a TRACK

    Gnil:

    When I was alone on the track ( no car to chase and take over) I did get slightly bored using PDK in automatic. There was not enough to do.

    I actually even went off track as I lost my concentration , thinking about refluing and looking at the gauge, and  keeping my foot fully on the throttle......and then.... I arrived too fast into the next corner

    So for me , when there was the challenge to toke over the Gt3 996  or to try to stay as long as I could in front of the Scuderia, that was fine, but when there was nothing else then just doing a nice line, I missed the gear change challenge a lot .

    Schumacher used to lose his concentration sometimes when he was in front without challenge and made mistakes. No need to worry you are not the only one Smiley


    --
    It's not where you're going, it's how you get there that counts

    Re: My PDK review on a TRACK

    Grant:

    I think all drivers will not perform all of those simultaneous tasks perfectly, but that provides a reason to keep practicing.  If you go to the same track often, you will eventually be able to drive it with your eyes closed (unless local track is Spa or NoS) and having fewer systems to control yourself will lead to boredom more quickly (and the desire for a newer/faster car).

    Operating three pedals, a stick and a wheel mean to me that I'll continue to practice and improve over a longer period (and stay interested and excited longer).  Getting it perfect happens less often, so it is more special when it does happen.  I just hope Porsche continues to offer both gearboxes - each has a good reason to exist.

     

    Exactly my point of view !
     

     

    Reading this review of the PDK, it makes me think of the reviews of the Nissan GT-R : track driving becoming too "easy".

    I'm still learning on track, and working to improve on gear shifts is part of the challenge !

     

     


    Re: My PDK review on a TRACK

    pride355:I do also prefer to concentrate on the braking/turning point and fastest line than concentrating on heel-toeing 3 times shifting from 6th to 3rd.

     

     

    If you are talking about heel-toeing, then you are talking about downshifting while braking. You should only have to heel-toe once (not 3 times) to get from 6th to third: just wait longer during braking to make the gear change.


    --
    "Rational arguments don't work on religious people, otherwise there'd be no religious people."-House

    Re: My PDK review on a TRACK

    Here's my personal opinion:

    1. PDK is the superior transmission because it just does a better job of changing gears. This is not a statement of personal preference. Its an objective statement about gear shifting performance

    2. PDK is the better choice for most (but clearly not all) drivers

    -its probably the choice for those who race (hell, there hasn't ben a clutch pedal in F1 since 1995)

    -its probably the choice for those who want the ultimate in versatility: the daily driver who still enjoys the track from time to time but isn't obsessed with the track, or spending thousands of dollars a year on tires and brakes and mods...

    3. Manual is the choice for those who still want the involvement of a manual, and that's most track aficionados (note: not necessarily those who race). Having said that, it is interesting that the F430 Scuderia and the new F458 Italia are only available with flappy paddles.


    --
    "Rational arguments don't work on religious people, otherwise there'd be no religious people."-House

    Re: My PDK review on a TRACK

     The OP reminds me of stories I've heard from the track including autocross that new Cayman S's with PDK are regularly beating gen I 997s with manual transmissions.


    --
    "Rational arguments don't work on religious people, otherwise there'd be no religious people."-House

    Re: My PDK review on a TRACK

    Silver Bullet:

     The OP reminds me of stories I've heard from the track including autocross that new Cayman S's with PDK are regularly beating gen I 997s with manual transmissions.

     It's not unusual for a well driven manual tranny Caymans S to do the same...


    --

    73 Carrera RS 2.7 Carbon Fiber replica (1,890 lbs), 98 Ferrari 550 Maranello.  Former: 73 911S, Two 951S's, 996 C2, 993 C2


    Re: My PDK review on a TRACK

    I'm just back from 4 days at the Nurburgring, driving Thursday and Friday from 8 AM to 8 PM with short brackes, and Saturday from 8 Am to 2 PM +  a few laps on wednesday and some on Sunday before leaving.

    PDK was a blast on that track ! As I said, I have been bored on some easy tracks with my PDK, not enough challenge when there was no car to overtake, but in the Ring, there is already so much challenge that PDK was just very nice to use and gave me a slighter better chance to keep up with some GT3 drivers.


    --

     997.2 C2S, PDK, -20mm


     
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