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    Re: Murcielago successor/replacement

    Not impessed.


    --

    The secret of life is to admire without desiring.


    Re: Murcielago successor/replacement

    That's not new... that's a 2001 Revention

    Looks stupid if this is it. The front bumper and the lights... common. From the A-pillar onwards it has a lot of potential. Also with this aggressive front on the basic first model, how will they possibly introduce the dozens of special, LV, LP, LS and whatnot editions that usually come with 0.5 more HP and a slightly different bumper, maybe some new colors..

    I prey this is not it, that would be a lazy shit job. They are all talk about how amazingly new it will be and then they use in old and lazy exterior? It just doesn't make sense, so i don't believe this is it. The new design should be basic and clean like in the past.


    --

    indeed shifting is ancient technology - so is a fuel burning engine..  I happen to like both :) 


    Re: Murcielago successor/replacement

    Atzporsche:
    The new design should be basic and clean like in the past.


    So true! Smiley

    But somehow I'm afraid this won't happen. Smiley
     


    --

    The secret of life is to admire without desiring.


    Re: Murcielago successor/replacement

    skazzy:

     

     


    --

    ...the only thing stopping you in all likelihood, is you!


    Re: Murcielago successor/replacement

    who on earth was designing the front  ????


    Re: Murcielago successor/replacement

    I suppose who ever wants to spend over 350k on a car, wants are more flashy design.  Clean lines are actually much better but maybe this is how Lamborghini wants to separate their design from future Audi/Porsche products ? 


    --

    RC (Germany) - Rennteam Editor Porsche 997 Turbo, BMW X5 M, BMW M3 Cab DKG, Mini Cooper S JCW


    Re: Murcielago successor/replacement

    I am not convinced this is the final look, my guess is the real car is aggressive but not quite so cartoonish.


    Re: Murcielago successor/replacement

    Sad, but this might be very close to the final thing.

    J.Seven


    Re: Murcielago successor/replacement

    Anyone saw the pics on AMS of the yellow Aventator, looked way much better than the pics posted above, actually it looked abolutely amazing Smiley

    J.Seven


    Re: Murcielago successor/replacement

    To me it looks like a bigger Gallardo.Smiley


    Re: Murcielago successor/replacement

    Scan please my German friends


    --

    indeed shifting is ancient technology - so is a fuel burning engine..  I happen to like both :) 


    Re: Murcielago successor/replacement

     


    Re: Murcielago successor/replacement

    ^^^Photoshop.


    --

    ...the only thing stopping you in all likelihood, is you!



    Re: Murcielago successor/replacement

     Well, Reventon owners are going to feel rather dumb in a few months. Similar looks, more power, more tech, probably less than half the price... 


    Re: Murcielago successor/replacement

    Nah, Reventon owners like coloring and Vin Diesel movies
     


    --

    indeed shifting is ancient technology - so is a fuel burning engine..  I happen to like both :) 


    Re: Murcielago successor/replacement

    Click to enlarge

    Lambo.jpg


    --
    Happy Driving

    Re: Murcielago successor/replacement

     It's looking good to me 


    --

     997.2 C2S, PDK, -20mm


    Re: Murcielago successor/replacement

    Gnil:

     It's looking good to me 

     It is looking better than some of those ridiculous renders we've been seeing. Lets hope it turns out ok.


    Re: Murcielago successor/replacement

    fighter jet


    --
    Speed has never killed anyone, suddenly becoming stationary... That's what gets you.

    Re: Murcielago successor/replacement

    Lamborghini is going to great lengths to reveal the technical details of its successor to the Murcielago supercar, the upcoming Aventador LP700-4. Already we’ve seen details about its new V-12 engine and Independent Shifting Rod (ISR) automated manual gearbox, its F1-inspired pushrod suspension and now, just a few weeks out from the car’s 2011 Geneva Motor Show debut, we have details on its carbon fiber composite monocoque.

    The LP700-4 promises to be a technology-driven supercar, and one standout feature is its extensive use of carbon fiber in its construction. In fact, the central structure of the car is made entirely from carbon fiber and has been designed as a monocoque.

    This load-bearing structure of the vehicle is engineered as a “single shell” that functions physically as one component, thus taking full advantage of the extreme rigidity of carbon fiber. Formula 1 race cars have been built using this technique for many years--and have proven their crash worthiness time and again.

    Not only is this design very safe, it’s also very light. In this case, the LP700-4’s monocoque weighs in at just 324 pounds.

    The monocoque is connected at the front and rear with rigid aluminum sub-frames, on which the suspension, engine and transmission are mounted. The entire body-in-white (the body with no moving parts, trim, powertrain or chassis components) of the new V-12 supercar weighs only 505 pounds and boasts a torsional rigidity of 35,000 Newton meters per degree of twist.

    Lamborghini is also boasting about developing its carbon fiber components completely in-house. The automaker uses three main techniques for manufacturing the lightweight components: Resin Transfer Molding (RTM), Prepreg and Braiding. For more details on these processes, hit the next page for Lamborghini’s official explanation. 

     


    Re: Murcielago successor/replacement

    They are focus on the weight and rigity more than ever, this a very good sign for the future of sports car. Competition will follow and within couple years we might finally see some interesting weight figures for our sports car. I´ve heard loosing weight is the next main step for Porsche engineers too.

    J.Seven


    Re: Murcielago successor/replacement

    Wow, the statement that Lambo is using RTM, Prepreg and braiding is REALLY impressive! Prepreg itself is not that special; you use pieces of carbon fibre (typically uni-directional or weaves), stack those, put them under pressure and heat them. This is one of the mainstream manufacturing techniques in the CFRP world.

    With braiding, I am not that familiar, but what I understood from it is that it is very interesting for especially tubular sections.

    RTM though is very special. The company I work for takes part in a european aerospace project to certify this as an aerospace manufacturing technique. Typically, you build very complex shapes with pure carbon fibres, put it in a complex mould, and then making CFRP out of it by letting the resin transfer through that mould. As this is a highly experimental technique (in the aerospace world), I am very impressed that lambo already applies this to their future car!


    --

    Porsche, seperates LeMans from LeBoys

    Re: Murcielago successor/replacement

    Joost, here's a good example of weaving.

     

    However, what I don't understand is the long term longevity and stiffness of the new breed of hypercars using Carbon Fiber monocoques and stressed members. 

    They all like to tout that this is the same technology and construction using in Formula One and other racing series, however, they do not mention that these chassis are typically removed from competition after a few races + testing sessions because they  fatigue, wear-out and lose their rigidity.


    --

    ...the only thing stopping you in all likelihood, is you!


    Re: Murcielago successor/replacement

    That almost certainly means Porsche will get RTM it's an inhouse product once developed.


    --

    indeed shifting is ancient technology - so is a fuel burning engine..  I happen to like both :) 


    Re: Murcielago successor/replacement

    Ferrari engineers are apparently very concerned about the unproven longevity of carbon fibre for the major passenger cell and this is why they have not as yet used it in a mainstream production car.


    Re: Murcielago successor/replacement

    ISUK:

    Ferrari engineers are apparently very concerned about the unproven longevity of carbon fibre for the major passenger cell and this is why they have not as yet used it in a mainstream production car.

     

    Ok, well that answered the question I asked. So at least one of the major super/hyper car manufacturers is giving pause for concern about hoping on the CF shell bandwagon.

    I can understand CF for non-stressed - non primary crash structure parts like the fender, quarter panel, roof, trunk, hood. But the cabin hmmm... I don't know yet.


    --

    ...the only thing stopping you in all likelihood, is you!


    Re: Murcielago successor/replacement

    Heist:
    ISUK:

    Ferrari engineers are apparently very concerned about the unproven longevity of carbon fibre for the major passenger cell and this is why they have not as yet used it in a mainstream production car.

     

    [...] So at least one of the major super/hyper car manufacturers is giving pause for concern about hoping on the CF shell bandwagon.


    I do think that Lamborghini sells far less copies of the Murcielago than Ferrari of their mainstream models. On top of that, Lamborghini has extensively researched the subject of carbon fibre in automotive appliances [Pagani was one of their employees] and can source information from Audi´s technical center in Neckarsulm. In fact, Audi uses RTM and Prepeg in the R8 Spyder and GT. Smiley


    Re: Murcielago successor/replacement

    Ferdie:


    I do think that Lamborghini sells far less copies of the Murcielago than Ferrari of their mainstream models. On top of that, Lamborghini has extensively researched the subject of carbon fibre in automotive appliances [Pagani was one of their employees] and can source information from Audi´s technical center in Neckarsulm. In fact, Audi uses RTM and Prepeg in the R8 Spyder and GT. Smiley

     

    I don't dispute any of that Ferdie but the probable area of concern is that no-one yet knows how these vital safety cell structures will hold up over 20+ years. It's more than likely the legal implications should a fatal crash occur at some point in the future in a letigious country like the US where the manufacturer would be vigourously pursued for knowingly selling a product that they had not tested the long term structural integrity of that's concerning Ferrari.

    I don't doubt it's vexing them as their competitors are switching to this method of construction to save weight and improve performance so they are at a disadvantage by pursuing their heavier aluminium technology. Lamborghini has a larger parent group who are possibly more willing to take a calculated risk in this area in an effort to use this as a test bed for the forming processes involved. BMW are going down a similar route of one piece carbon safety cell mouldings with their new range of small cars so no doubt VW know they will have to respond to this at some point in more mainstream cars to match any efficiency gains BMW achieve through this lighter material.


    Re: Murcielago successor/replacement

    ISUK:

    I don't dispute any of that Ferdie but the probable area of concern is that no-one yet knows how these vital safety cell structures will hold up over 20+ years.


    Iain,

    you certainly have a point here but both Lamborghini and Audi have quite some [long-time] knowledge about carbonfibre usage in automotive applications. The product itself is around for quite some time now, one close family member was working in that field more than 25 years ago already. The same applies to other production methods, just to name the glued bonding between various metal components as Lotus uses it on the Exige and Elise or Audi on the TT to even combine aluminium and steel coponents. All of those are tested in accelerated weather cycles to test their longterm longevity.

    Smiley


     
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