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    Re: 991 spyshots thread (continued) (for UNRELEASED models only) Thread Closed

    Thank Kreso!

    Dry sump?


    Re: 991 spyshots thread (continued) (for UNRELEASED models only) Thread Closed

    KresoF1:

    ...BTW, 991 GT3 RS will appeal to purists as well...

    Porsche 991 GT3 RS expected include the awesome 4.0 "Mezger" flat-six engine from the 991 GT3 RSR to provide homologation for the Le Mans racer...

    2013-Porsche-991-GT3-RSR_03.jpg

    ...with a proper w-i-d-e-b-o-d-y and manual gearbox available to keep existing GT3 and GT3 RS owners happy! Smiley

    Smiley SmileySmiley


    Re: 991 spyshots thread (continued) (for UNRELEASED models only) Thread Closed

    Porsche 991 Turbo winter testing in Sweden...

    (1 February 2013)

    "Camouflaged cars can pop up anywhere, as Motor Trend senior features editor Jonny Lieberman and photography editor Julia LaPalme found out when they spotted this 991-generation Porsche 911 Turbo almost 200 miles from the Arctic Circle in Sweden.
     
    Ignoring an irate engineer’s stern 'no pictures, please' request, LaPalme snapped these photos of the upcoming turbo model before the crew peeled out of the snow-covered gas station. We can see the headlights, bumpers, and taillights are still covered by black tape, much like other 911 Turbo prototypes we’ve spied in the past. Look closely, and you can also see what looks like a radar sensor in the front valance, possibly for an adaptive cruise control system.
     
    The large fixed rear wing is still present, and appears capable of raising for more downforce at speed. In addition to the active aero bits, this test mule wears the familiar large rear fender vents, which likely feed the engine’s dual intercoolers. Lieberman and company heard the 991 tester start up, and confirm the engine sound was rich with forced induction notes.
     
    As we’ve said previously, the next 911 Turbo could pack upwards of 550 hp. We’ll know for sure when the car arrives in a year or so..."
     
     
     
     
     

    Smiley SmileySmiley


    Re: 991 spyshots thread (continued) (for UNRELEASED models only) Thread Closed

    So I guess what we see here is the new Turbo wheel.


    --

    The secret of life is to admire without desiring.


    Re: 991 spyshots thread (continued) (for UNRELEASED models only) Thread Closed

    Rossi:

    So I guess what we see here is the new Turbo wheel.

    Yes, along with the new Turbo driving-lights-warts.... designed to keep the traditional Sport Chrono wart from getting too lonely..... Smiley


    --

    2011 Range Rover Sport S/C,  2009 Porsche 911S


    Re: 991 spyshots thread (continued) (for UNRELEASED models only) Thread Closed

    This car will be a performance monster, but I have to admit the looks are beginning to bore me.  Hope I will like it more in the flesh...


    Re: 991 spyshots thread (continued) (for UNRELEASED models only) Thread Closed

    I agree - looks are quite boring...  typical porsche design...  i guess the legacy / tradition strategy works...  Smiley


    Re: 991 spyshots thread (continued) (for UNRELEASED models only) Thread Closed

    The 964 and 993 Turbos were great looking, after that, not so much anymore.


    --

    2012 Cayenne S White/Espresso 

    Ex: 993 Targa, 986S, 986 and 964 C2


    Re: 991 spyshots thread (continued) (for UNRELEASED models only) Thread Closed

    The rims looks similar to Cayenne Sport Edition rims:

    Porsche-911-turbo-spied-side-view.jpg1359887050393Cay.jpg

     


    --


    Re: 991 spyshots thread (continued) (for UNRELEASED models only) Thread Closed

    It seems reasonable to assume there are aspects of the Porsche 991 Turbo design which are still to be revealed...

    2013-Porsche-991-Turbo_evo-magazine.jpg

    ...with the 2014 Porsche 991 GT2 to follow...

    2014-Porsche-991-GT2_evo-magazine.jpg

    Smiley SmileySmiley


    Re: 991 spyshots thread (continued) (for UNRELEASED models only) Thread Closed

    Rossi:

    So I guess what we see here is the new Turbo wheel.

    Yes and unfortunately design is pretty boring. I saw also new design for central locking turbo wheel and it also looks was too busy... I hate these ten/multispoke wheels.

    Porsche is not capable to design nice five spoke wheel lately.


    Re: 991 spyshots thread (continued) (for UNRELEASED models only) Thread Closed

    KresoF1:
    Rossi:

    So I guess what we see here is the new Turbo wheel.

    Yes and unfortunately design is pretty boring. I saw also new design for central locking turbo wheel and it also looks was too busy... I hate these ten/multispoke wheels.

    Porsche is not capable to design nice five spoke wheel lately.


    Absolutely agree, Kreso. Multispoke wheels just don't look right at a sportscar IMO. Smiley

    The master of good looking five spoke wheels is definitely Ferrari (unfortunately for Porsche customers). Smiley


    --

    The secret of life is to admire without desiring.


    Re: 991 spyshots thread (continued) (for UNRELEASED models only) Thread Closed

    Kreso - any info on the GT3 wing? Should we expect the design featured on the test mules or will we be pleasantly surprised?


    Re: 991 spyshots thread (continued) (for UNRELEASED models only) Thread Closed

    trip:

    Kreso - any info on the GT3 wing? Should we expect the design featured on the test mules or will we be pleasantly surprised?

    +1


    --


    Re: 991 spyshots thread (continued) (for UNRELEASED models only) Thread Closed

    No, There wont be any suprise regarding the rear wing.

    BTW, remember pics from Portugal. It was a cup car, not normal 991 GT3. For bigger(and IMO even uglier) rear wing you will have to wait for 991 GT3 RS.


    Re: 991 spyshots thread (continued) (for UNRELEASED models only) Thread Closed

    Kreso - Do you know if the "new"engine has a dry sump?


    Re: 991 spyshots thread (continued) (for UNRELEASED models only) Thread Closed

    KresoF1:

    No, There wont be any suprise regarding the rear wing.

    BTW, remember pics from Portugal. It was a cup car, not normal 991 GT3. For bigger(and IMO even uglier) rear wing you will have to wait for 991 GT3 RS.

    Damn....the hope is dead.....GT3 will stay with that double style Duck/Aero wing....SmileySmileySmileySmileySmiley

    Kreso, thank's for the info, but I want to believe that GT3 will get a nice wing after all.


    --


    Re: 991 spyshots thread (continued) (for UNRELEASED models only) Thread Closed

    Spyderidol:


    Kreso - Do you know if the "new"engine has a dry sump?




    Yes.

    Re: 991 spyshots thread (continued) (for UNRELEASED models only) Thread Closed

    Fantastic! Thank you.



    Re: 991 spyshots thread (continued) (for UNRELEASED models only) Thread Closed

    Guys,

    I wonder as well what will be the entry price ?? Why let me share my experience of today :

    I went to Porsche Zenter Letzebuerg (Luxemburg) and checked a brand newcomer in showroom : a fully loaded black carrera S, with aero kit : pretty sure it will really be similar to a gt3. But this was not the pb , the car looked awesome. Fully loaded, except power kit 430, but with all you can imagine, black painted wheel pdk, sport exhaust, full carbon, yellow stitching, glass roof , sport chrono +, etc etc ..... FULLY is really fully Smiley

    and guess what .? 179 950 euro with 15% VAT Smiley

    This is purely insane !!!    What will be the price of new gt3, and even worse, what would be turbo range ? > 200k ?

    come on, the car will be nice but a gt3 at 130k entry level will be disappointing or me ..... Not worth it ......

    what do you guess as tariff guys ?


    --

    997 Carrera S Triple Black Sold now ... Good car 997 GT3 triple black wow what a car !!!


    Re: 991 spyshots thread (continued) (for UNRELEASED models only) Thread Closed

    The option list is ridiculous across the range. You can't price up any Porsche with less than $15k in options. $3k for navigation? Basically free on any phone now... Make it standard... Paying for an iPod connection? LOL


    Re: 991 spyshots thread (continued) (for UNRELEASED models only) Thread Closed

    I agree! The price for new carrera with full options is really very high - much higher than previous one! if gt2 and turbo will cost more than 200k euro with full options it will be insane.


    Re: 991 spyshots thread (continued) (for UNRELEASED models only) Thread Closed

    I was at my local dealership over the weekend and they are expecting about a 30% price hike for the base GT3 and base Turbo in the US.  So expect the base GT3 to go up about 30-40K and the base Turbo to have a 40K plus increase.  So a "not too crazily optioned out" GT3 will be over 150K and a Turbo S to be "well over" 200K  Smiley in the US (who as everyone knows seem to have one of the best, if not the best pricing for Porsches vs ROW).  They do not expect to see them over here until 2014 sometime.  Hopefully he is wrong but from what we have seen for the prices of the new 991's so far he is probably not far off.

    Naturally they are expecting the used car market to be good and a corresponding increase in those values as well, as the prices for the new 991's, especially in today's economy, a little tough to take Smiley.


    --

    '11 997.2 Turbo S  '11 Cayenne Turbo


    Re: 991 spyshots thread (continued) (for UNRELEASED models only) Thread Closed

    That sounds totally rubbish.


    Re: 991 spyshots thread (continued) (for UNRELEASED models only) Thread Closed

    I can believe 20% but more would be a nightmare... The 4.0 set the new benchmark for GT3 pricing. Regardless of it being the Mezger swan song Porsche must have realised they can easily raise the price of the GT3 and plenty of people will buy one, less so the ones who really want one. 


    Re: 991 spyshots thread (continued) (for UNRELEASED models only) Thread Closed

    Lets hope it is rubbish.  Hopefully that is what Porsche Germany is only thinking about for the US market, and have not come to a "final price" yet, but he was pretty clear that the price increase will be well above what people expect based on not only the 997 GT3 and Turbo prices, but also the increase in the price from the 997 to the 991's we have seen so far.  "Most will be shocked and wonder what justifies the increase."  Their words...not mine!  Maybe it is the economy, the anticipated fall in the US dollar/inflation (by 2014), making up for the over-priced 918's they cannot sell or the cost of the technology which will go into the GT3 and Turbo variants (who knows!), but a roughly 40K price increase is what is being strongly considered for the Turbo (so depending on which one that is still in the 25-30% range).  So that puts the 991 Turbo S in 200K plus territory and beyond depending on specs.  Believe me, I did a double take too when he told me that, and I thought I was hearing things until he talked about the Turbo S!

    My dealer was shocked and a little (well a lot actually!) in disbelief himself...after all he still has to sell the things Smiley!


    --

    '11 997.2 Turbo S  '11 Cayenne Turbo


    Re: 991 spyshots thread (continued) (for UNRELEASED models only) Thread Closed

    Why? The WHOLE world has been paying that much for Porsche since the beginning of time. You Americans finally realize how much it really cost us to buy one.  Gives you people a little perspective on the wealth required to be a Porsche owner and appreciate the Porsche ownership a little bit more. 


    Re: 991 spyshots thread (continued) (for UNRELEASED models only) Thread Closed

    Cars are cheaper in the US also because they sell many more of them in one market. And also because the competition is cheaper. That said, Panamera is expensive in the US, more than a Cayenne, and sells well. What will happen though is people are going to buy a cheaper engine. Turbo sales will be lower, as the "S" version are already plenty fast for 55mph speed limits.


    Re: 991 spyshots thread (continued) (for UNRELEASED models only) Thread Closed

    That is very true about the US pricing...we have always had an advantage compared to other countries such as Canada, Australia, the Asian and European markets, but there are probably less tarrifs and surcharges here as well.  Talking to my dealer I got the impression that although the US market is still important it is not the largest market now.  For example, it seems that a hefty proportion of the new 918's are going to China and the Asian market, less than 20% of the confirmed orders are to the US.  You would not have heard that 5-10 years ago about any Porsche.  Porsche is also trying to stop sales through the US market to more lucrative markets via US "grey market dealers".  Granted these numbers are probably not huge, but they are significant enough for concern to Porsche Germany. So why not make it less profittable for them, and even the playing field worldwide.  Also Porsche Germany knows that the US has been getting a pretty sweet deal all these years and it is probably time to "pony up".

    That aside though if one just does the math...looking at the C4S for example that has increased 10-15k going from the 997 to the 991.  Then add the other speculated additions of another turbo to make the twin turbo a triple turbo...probably 5-10K, and probably closer to 10;  then add the speculated 4 wheel steering which Nissan, Honda and GM have tried in the past and was frought with mechanical problems or was so expensive an option it was not a big seller, so a Porsche version would proabably also be a 5-10K addition to the car.  Will there be a sport PDK?...That might add another 2-5K.  And what about the engine...rumor has it at least the GT3 will get a sweet new engine no one has seen yet, and will they use that in the Turbo as well like they did in the pre-DFI Metzger days.  What will that cost?  Will there be a "super wide body" for the 991 Turbo and GT3RS as some have speculated...probably not as that would not make sense for the limited numbers in a mass production company to have another body assembly line, unless it is achieved by just a modified flare on the fender and wheel offsets.  But who knows.  And then add whatever option no one has heard of yet or add one of there usual overpriced options and one can get to 30-40K additional price pretty quickly.

    Depressing! 


    --

    '11 997.2 Turbo S  '11 Cayenne Turbo


     
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