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    Re: 997 GT2 + Walter Röhrl - video

    Quote:
    MKSGR said:
    Quote:
    Crash said:
    Quote:
    MKSGR said:
    Next Feb or March

    (The GT2 might complement the 599 well, don't you think. Thinking of track usage...)



    So you're going to take both?



    Maybe... However, right now: waiting for the Supertest (and, BTW, some 0-300 data would be nice ).



    This should be nice. I wonder which car is actually faster in 0-300 acceleration - the GT2 or the 599? You getting both should answer these questions nicely .

    Re: 997 GT2 + Walter Röhrl - video

    Quote:
    PorSchelover1 said:
    7:31 em n-ring




    I heard that and just about sh*t my pants!

    Re: 997 GT2 + Walter Röhrl - video

    Quote:
    mp said:
    3. Since the Turbo wasn't designed for Cup tires, using PASM and Cups probably didn't help matters.




    Just a little piece of additional information:

    Porsche claims that Cup tires on the 997TT improve the NBR time by ca. 7s...

    Porsche test drivers claim that a 7:42 is achievable (997TT with Cup tires) and that a 7:49 is achievable with standard tires.

    P.S.: I guess, in your post you are referring to PSM and not to PASM, right?

    Re: 997 GT2 + Walter Röhrl - video

    Quote:
    MKSGR said:
    Quote:
    turbosteff said:
    Quote:
    MKSGR said:
    Quote:
    KresoF1 said:
    I can already tell you some little thing... Sport Auto Horst von Saurma will achive 7.3Xmin on the Ring without any problem. Issue 1/2008 or 2/2008...



    That sounds very promising Looks like the car might be worth buying... However, I have taken the decision to not order any Porsche before having seen the Supertest

    It is not necessary to mention this. We all know your point of view. I am looking forward what you will post if HvS drives a 7.3x



    Simple answer: if HvS does a sub-7:40 this result would (in my opinion) highlight the rather unfavourable results of the 997TT supertest again. Why? Simply reason. Just assume that HvS is within a 5-8s range compared to the officially claimed Porsche figures with nearly all Porsche cars (Carrera GT, GT3, GT3RS, 997, GT2 etc. etc.). However, he misses Porsche's 997TT claim by nearly 15s. What does that imply? In my opinion that would underline the relevance of the 997TT Supertest and would also confirm my suspicion regarding Porsche's 997TT performance claims.

    BTW: if HvS does a below 7:40 time this would clearly highlight what a nice sportscar the new GT2 is Given our enthusiasm in the months before the first test reports on the 997TT and the disappointments that followed I, however, have learned to be cautious about the information available to date. In essence, the info is just based on what Porsche wants us to believe. We need independant verification before we get too excited.


    In another thread you wrote :
    "The claimed 7:32 for 997GT2 fit nicely into this sequence of "dream figures"

    Dream on Zuffenhausen is all I can say "
    And you told us we are all naive dreamers who went for the Porsche marketing bullshit. In your opinion it is absolutely impossible for a GT2 to get below 7.40.
    And now ?

    Re: 997 GT2 + Walter Röhrl - video

    Quote:
    turbosteff said:
    Quote:
    MKSGR said:
    Quote:
    turbosteff said:
    Quote:
    MKSGR said:
    Quote:
    KresoF1 said:
    I can already tell you some little thing... Sport Auto Horst von Saurma will achive 7.3Xmin on the Ring without any problem. Issue 1/2008 or 2/2008...



    That sounds very promising Looks like the car might be worth buying... However, I have taken the decision to not order any Porsche before having seen the Supertest

    It is not necessary to mention this. We all know your point of view. I am looking forward what you will post if HvS drives a 7.3x



    Simple answer: if HvS does a sub-7:40 this result would (in my opinion) highlight the rather unfavourable results of the 997TT supertest again. Why? Simply reason. Just assume that HvS is within a 5-8s range compared to the officially claimed Porsche figures with nearly all Porsche cars (Carrera GT, GT3, GT3RS, 997, GT2 etc. etc.). However, he misses Porsche's 997TT claim by nearly 15s. What does that imply? In my opinion that would underline the relevance of the 997TT Supertest and would also confirm my suspicion regarding Porsche's 997TT performance claims.

    BTW: if HvS does a below 7:40 time this would clearly highlight what a nice sportscar the new GT2 is Given our enthusiasm in the months before the first test reports on the 997TT and the disappointments that followed I, however, have learned to be cautious about the information available to date. In essence, the info is just based on what Porsche wants us to believe. We need independant verification before we get too excited.


    In another thread you wrote :
    "The claimed 7:32 for 997GT2 fit nicely into this sequence of "dream figures"

    Dream on Zuffenhausen is all I can say "
    And you told us we are all naive dreamers who went for the Porsche marketing bullshit. In your opinion it is absolutely impossible for a GT2 to get below 7.40.
    And now ?



    I think his gloominess was pretty well founded, based on the pretty average Turbo NBR times. Why do you feel the need to bash him like that anyway?

    Re: 997 GT2 + Walter Röhrl - video

    Quote:
    turbosteff said:
    Quote:
    MKSGR said:
    Quote:
    turbosteff said:
    Quote:
    MKSGR said:
    Quote:
    KresoF1 said:
    I can already tell you some little thing... Sport Auto Horst von Saurma will achive 7.3Xmin on the Ring without any problem. Issue 1/2008 or 2/2008...



    That sounds very promising Looks like the car might be worth buying... However, I have taken the decision to not order any Porsche before having seen the Supertest

    It is not necessary to mention this. We all know your point of view. I am looking forward what you will post if HvS drives a 7.3x



    Simple answer: if HvS does a sub-7:40 this result would (in my opinion) highlight the rather unfavourable results of the 997TT supertest again. Why? Simply reason. Just assume that HvS is within a 5-8s range compared to the officially claimed Porsche figures with nearly all Porsche cars (Carrera GT, GT3, GT3RS, 997, GT2 etc. etc.). However, he misses Porsche's 997TT claim by nearly 15s. What does that imply? In my opinion that would underline the relevance of the 997TT Supertest and would also confirm my suspicion regarding Porsche's 997TT performance claims.

    BTW: if HvS does a below 7:40 time this would clearly highlight what a nice sportscar the new GT2 is Given our enthusiasm in the months before the first test reports on the 997TT and the disappointments that followed I, however, have learned to be cautious about the information available to date. In essence, the info is just based on what Porsche wants us to believe. We need independant verification before we get too excited.


    In another thread you wrote :
    "The claimed 7:32 for 997GT2 fit nicely into this sequence of "dream figures"

    Dream on Zuffenhausen is all I can say "
    And you told us we are all naive dreamers who went for the Porsche marketing bullshit. In your opinion it is absolutely impossible for a GT2 to get below 7.40.
    And now ?



    Stefan,

    you ARE a naive dreamer

    Why? Simple reason: you believe everything they tell you. Right now, everything is just speculation based on a Porsche figure (which was, BTW, printed next to ridiculous performance data of competing sportscars...). You believe these marketing claims without proper reflection. And you also believe what a Porsche representative tells you at an official Porsche event. On the basis of that skewed and dubious information you even go as far as to doubt the fairness and independance of Sportauto.

    IF the official GT2 number shall be confirmed by Sportauto (or any other independant magazine) we can all accept that the GT2 performs well. On the basis of the current information this is just WISHFUL THINKING.

    Thus, my earlier post (the one you quoted above) is still 100% valid. Until we see independant verificantion of the marketing figures.

    With all due respect, you have not been around long enough to fully understand our discussions (that is my impression reading your posts). Just do a search on earlier discussions regarding 997TT and Z06. You might THEN understand what we are talking about. We have learned a lot from past events. This acquired knowledge is reflected in our posts. You should read them carefully. They may help avoiding wrong decisions

    Re: 997 GT2 + Walter Röhrl - video

    I would like to make a couple points. The Carrera GT was never tested with cup tires so one should keep that in mind when considering the claim that it is as fast the Carrera GT around the ring. The 996 GT2 was never tested with Cup tires either. I have a Carrera GT (which I have no plans on selling) and 996 GT2 and love both. However I will probably sell my 996 GT2 and buy the new 997 GT2 or the 430 scuderia. I will wait for both cars to be out and tested and then drive each before I make my decision. I will not rely on a car makers claims to make my decsion, after all they are in the business to sell these products.

    Re: 997 GT2 + Walter Röhrl - video

    Markus,
    You, Andrej and I agree on most things regarding sportscars in general.

    But, few disagreements now and then are welcome in my opinion just to add spicy note to our discussions, personal bashings are NOT...

    RT12... Very fast indeed but, main reason is the fact that all press RT12 examples features more then 650hp... I respect RT12 highly but, I would never buy one...

    599GTB... Another very fast car... The best front engined sportscar currently on the market IMHO... Verdict? 430 Scuderia for me please! Why? I am 35 years old, not 55...

    997GT2... Official Porsche numbers are amazing... Price is OK IMO. Will von Saurma achive same number as W.Rohrl? No, but, it will be pretty close-trust me...

    Re: 997 GT2 + Walter Röhrl - video

    I've been working in motorsport and automotive industry long enough now to know that every car manufacturer prepares special cars for press. This is marketing driven and it will never change. Believe me.

    Re: 997 GT2 + Walter Röhrl - video

    The marketing has been working very well for Porsche lately I would say. Look how many people are buying into the Gt3RS hype in the US.

    Re: 997 GT2 + Walter Röhrl - video

    Quote:
    KresoF1 said:
    RT12... Very fast indeed but, main reason is the fact that all press RT12 examples features more then 650hp... I respect RT12 highly but, I would never buy one...




    Would you still not buy it if the producer guaranteed you (in writing!) that your car has a higher hp figure than the test car

    Just theoretically, of course

    Re: 997 GT2 + Walter Röhrl - video

    Quote:
    KresoF1 said:
    it will be pretty close-trust me...



    I always trust you

    Re: 997 GT2 + Walter Röhrl - video

    Quote:
    MKSGR said:
    Quote:
    KresoF1 said:
    RT12... Very fast indeed but, main reason is the fact that all press RT12 examples features more then 650hp... I respect RT12 highly but, I would never buy one...




    Would you still not buy it if the producer guaranteed you (in writing!) that your car has a higher hp figure than the test car

    Just theoretically, of course



    Just theoretically, of course, but if my name were Markus, I were in the market for a 599GTB and a certain Herr Alois guaranteed such a power output for his product, then yes .

    Re: 997 GT2 + Walter Röhrl - video

    Quote:
    Crash said:
    Quote:
    turbosteff said:
    Quote:
    MKSGR said:
    Quote:
    turbosteff said:
    Quote:
    MKSGR said:
    Quote:
    KresoF1 said:
    I can already tell you some little thing... Sport Auto Horst von Saurma will achive 7.3Xmin on the Ring without any problem. Issue 1/2008 or 2/2008...



    That sounds very promising Looks like the car might be worth buying... However, I have taken the decision to not order any Porsche before having seen the Supertest

    It is not necessary to mention this. We all know your point of view. I am looking forward what you will post if HvS drives a 7.3x



    Simple answer: if HvS does a sub-7:40 this result would (in my opinion) highlight the rather unfavourable results of the 997TT supertest again. Why? Simply reason. Just assume that HvS is within a 5-8s range compared to the officially claimed Porsche figures with nearly all Porsche cars (Carrera GT, GT3, GT3RS, 997, GT2 etc. etc.). However, he misses Porsche's 997TT claim by nearly 15s. What does that imply? In my opinion that would underline the relevance of the 997TT Supertest and would also confirm my suspicion regarding Porsche's 997TT performance claims.

    BTW: if HvS does a below 7:40 time this would clearly highlight what a nice sportscar the new GT2 is Given our enthusiasm in the months before the first test reports on the 997TT and the disappointments that followed I, however, have learned to be cautious about the information available to date. In essence, the info is just based on what Porsche wants us to believe. We need independant verification before we get too excited.


    In another thread you wrote :
    "The claimed 7:32 for 997GT2 fit nicely into this sequence of "dream figures"

    Dream on Zuffenhausen is all I can say "
    And you told us we are all naive dreamers who went for the Porsche marketing bullshit. In your opinion it is absolutely impossible for a GT2 to get below 7.40.
    And now ?



    I think his gloominess was pretty well founded, based on the pretty average Turbo NBR times. Why do you feel the need to bash him like that anyway?

    He (Horst) needs this. WE both go on Friday to Ferrari Frankfurt and try to get an scuderia for me and then

    Re: 997 GT2 + Walter Röhrl - video

    There is something I don't get from a few of you. A select few of you seems to think Horst von Saurma is king and his time should be the benchmark for comparing cars.

    O and sorry for being ignorant, but what credentials does he have? I know him only as a journalist, but was he a race car driver? Did he win anything? What was special about him that makes lap times more creditable than Walter Rohl other than his 'independence'? To me at least, a lap time by Sabine Schmitz has more weight than Mr Saurma.

    Now since he is a 'independent' tester, that means he has no intimate knowledge of the car he is testing, and since he was not involved in developing the handling of the cars, he would have no way of wrinking out the last bit of performance out of a car. Also, none of you actually know for sure whether he actually has access to a completely closed track for flying laps, ie accurate track times, so basically his times are all compromised.

    I'd rather compare factory published laps, sure they minght be 'ringer' times but since it's their cars, they should know a way or 2 to wrink out the last tiny bit of performance out of their cars, that to me at least will be what a car is truely capable of.

    For those of you who question the large gap between the factory time and HvS's time in the Turbo, it could just be that HvS is just not comfortable driving the Turbo fast, or his style is just not compatible with the handling of the Turbo while Walter Rohl has no problems with it. And this last point has been proven in this forum for quite a while, the Turbo is not a track-focused car, it is a super fast GT car but to wrink out all the performance out of it you will need to be a pro.

    I am in no way a competent track driver, I can drive fast but I know my limits and in the Turbo, my limit is lower than when I was in my C5 Corvette. On a favorite stretch of ~150km winding highway, I am about 5 mins slower in the Turbo than when I was in my C5 Corvette. Surprising or not, I was more comfortable doing high speed cornering in the Vette than in the Turbo. Does it means the C5 is faster than the Turbo? Yes in my case but I am sure a more competent driver will smoke the C5 in a Turbo. Same idea with HvS's lap times.

    Re: 997 GT2 + Walter Röhrl - video

    Quote:
    Whoopsy said:
    There is something I don't get from a few of you. A select few of you seems to think Horst von Saurma is king and his time should be the benchmark for comparing cars.

    O and sorry for being ignorant, but what credentials does he have? I know him only as a journalist, but was he a race car driver? Did he win anything? What was special about him that makes lap times more creditable than Walter Rohl other than his 'independence'? To me at least, a lap time by Sabine Schmitz has more weight than Mr Saurma.

    Now since he is a 'independent' tester, that means he has no intimate knowledge of the car he is testing, and since he was not involved in developing the handling of the cars, he would have no way of wrinking out the last bit of performance out of a car. Also, none of you actually know for sure whether he actually has access to a completely closed track for flying laps, ie accurate track times, so basically his times are all compromised.

    I'd rather compare factory published laps, sure they minght be 'ringer' times but since it's their cars, they should know a way or 2 to wrink out the last tiny bit of performance out of their cars, that to me at least will be what a car is truely capable of.

    For those of you who question the large gap between the factory time and HvS's time in the Turbo, it could just be that HvS is just not comfortable driving the Turbo fast, or his style is just not compatible with the handling of the Turbo while Walter Rohl has no problems with it. And this last point has been proven in this forum for quite a while, the Turbo is not a track-focused car, it is a super fast GT car but to wrink out all the performance out of it you will need to be a pro.

    I am in no way a competent track driver, I can drive fast but I know my limits and in the Turbo, my limit is lower than when I was in my C5 Corvette. On a favorite stretch of ~150km winding highway, I am about 5 mins slower in the Turbo than when I was in my C5 Corvette. Surprising or not, I was more comfortable doing high speed cornering in the Vette than in the Turbo. Does it means the C5 is faster than the Turbo? Yes in my case but I am sure a more competent driver will smoke the C5 in a Turbo. Same idea with HvS's lap times.



    Whoopsy, the thing with Von Saurma is that he is always able to get within a few seconds of factory testing times, which is what is important when using such tests for comparison. He is nearly as quick as Röhrl after all.

    Re: 997 GT2 + Walter Röhrl - video

    Quote:
    turbosteff said:
    Quote:
    Crash said:
    Quote:
    turbosteff said:
    Quote:
    MKSGR said:
    Quote:
    turbosteff said:
    Quote:
    MKSGR said:
    Quote:
    KresoF1 said:
    I can already tell you some little thing... Sport Auto Horst von Saurma will achive 7.3Xmin on the Ring without any problem. Issue 1/2008 or 2/2008...



    That sounds very promising Looks like the car might be worth buying... However, I have taken the decision to not order any Porsche before having seen the Supertest

    It is not necessary to mention this. We all know your point of view. I am looking forward what you will post if HvS drives a 7.3x



    Simple answer: if HvS does a sub-7:40 this result would (in my opinion) highlight the rather unfavourable results of the 997TT supertest again. Why? Simply reason. Just assume that HvS is within a 5-8s range compared to the officially claimed Porsche figures with nearly all Porsche cars (Carrera GT, GT3, GT3RS, 997, GT2 etc. etc.). However, he misses Porsche's 997TT claim by nearly 15s. What does that imply? In my opinion that would underline the relevance of the 997TT Supertest and would also confirm my suspicion regarding Porsche's 997TT performance claims.

    BTW: if HvS does a below 7:40 time this would clearly highlight what a nice sportscar the new GT2 is Given our enthusiasm in the months before the first test reports on the 997TT and the disappointments that followed I, however, have learned to be cautious about the information available to date. In essence, the info is just based on what Porsche wants us to believe. We need independant verification before we get too excited.


    In another thread you wrote :
    "The claimed 7:32 for 997GT2 fit nicely into this sequence of "dream figures"

    Dream on Zuffenhausen is all I can say "
    And you told us we are all naive dreamers who went for the Porsche marketing bullshit. In your opinion it is absolutely impossible for a GT2 to get below 7.40.
    And now ?



    I think his gloominess was pretty well founded, based on the pretty average Turbo NBR times. Why do you feel the need to bash him like that anyway?

    He (Horst) needs this.



    Arghhhh


    Re: 997 GT2 + Walter Röhrl - video

    Quote:
    Whoopsy said:
    There is something I don't get from a few of you. A select few of you seems to think Horst von Saurma is king and his time should be the benchmark for comparing cars.




    There is an essential misunderstanding in your question... We do NOT think that HvS is king. We only think that the Supertest is the only reasonable benchmark for comparing sportscars available as per today. I would be highly pleased if a different magazine would also start doing NBR tests.

    Re: 997 GT2 + Walter Röhrl - video

    Interestingly enough, I noticed that Horst has the fastest posted CGT ring time, faster than even Lord Rorhl.

    Re: 997 GT2 + Walter Röhrl - video

    So we are still at the same spot, does HvS/Supertest run the complete track that the factory tester runs? If they don't, then the times are still meaningless and connot be compared, it's apples vs oranges.

    As I am still quite clueless, when HvS run the compromised track, doesn't he has to go in and out of the pit? So when does his time starts? The moment he start the car? the moment he exit the pit? And his exit speed out of the pit could be different everytime. When does his lap time ends? When he re-enters the pit? He won't have the start/finish line to cross if he doesn't run the complete track.

    How do he time his laptimes? If he doesn't run the full track he probably can't use the track timing equipment. A passenger with a stop watch? A on track observer with a stop watch? Or a electronic transponder? GPS or Laser timing gear? If the times are from a stopwatch, then human reaction time and space/perspective comes into place and adds even more unknowns into his times.

    Re: 997 GT2 + Walter Röhrl - video

    Quote:
    Whoopsy said:
    So we are still at the same spot, does HvS/Supertest run the complete track that the factory tester runs? If they don't, then the times are still meaningless and connot be compared, it's apples vs oranges.

    As I am still quite clueless, when HvS run the compromised track, doesn't he has to go in and out of the pit? So when does his time starts? The moment he start the car? the moment he exit the pit? And his exit speed out of the pit could be different everytime. When does his lap time ends? When he re-enters the pit? He won't have the start/finish line to cross if he doesn't run the complete track.

    How do he time his laptimes? If he doesn't run the full track he probably can't use the track timing equipment. A passenger with a stop watch? A on track observer with a stop watch? Or a electronic transponder? GPS or Laser timing gear? If the times are from a stopwatch, then human reaction time and space/perspective comes into place and adds even more unknowns into his times.



    They use the exact same stretch.

    Re: 997 GT2 + Walter Röhrl - video

    Quote:
    Whoopsy said:
    So we are still at the same spot, does HvS/Supertest run the complete track that the factory tester runs? If they don't, then the times are still meaningless and connot be compared, it's apples vs oranges.

    As I am still quite clueless, when HvS run the compromised track, doesn't he has to go in and out of the pit? So when does his time starts? The moment he start the car? the moment he exit the pit? And his exit speed out of the pit could be different everytime. When does his lap time ends? When he re-enters the pit? He won't have the start/finish line to cross if he doesn't run the complete track.

    How do he time his laptimes? If he doesn't run the full track he probably can't use the track timing equipment. A passenger with a stop watch? A on track observer with a stop watch? Or a electronic transponder? GPS or Laser timing gear? If the times are from a stopwatch, then human reaction time and space/perspective comes into place and adds even more unknowns into his times.



    Sportauto does a full lap with flying start. The times are not from a stopwatch. If you looked at one of the Supertests you would notice that they publish around 20 (!) kph and g-force data points around the NBR track.

    The Supertest is the most compehensive and refined sportscar test (by far).

    Re: 997 GT2 + Walter Röhrl - video

    Quote:
    MKSGR said:
    Quote:
    mp said:
    3. Since the Turbo wasn't designed for Cup tires, using PASM and Cups probably didn't help matters.





    Just a little piece of additional information:

    Porsche claims that Cup tires on the 997TT improve the NBR time by ca. 7s...

    Porsche test drivers claim that a 7:42 is achievable (997TT with Cup tires) and that a 7:49 is achievable with standard tires.

    P.S.: I guess, in your post you are referring to PSM and not to PASM, right?



    Yes, I meant PSM - thanks.

    Porsche may not have dialed-in the Turbo's PSM for Cup tires. It doesn't surprise me to hear they achieved better times with Cups since WR doesn't use PSM.

    Re: 997 GT2 + Walter Röhrl - video

    I went to SportAuto's website and watched their 997TT NBR video, it doesn't show where he starts, it's definitely not where he finished that's for sure.

    So do they do their lap times during public lapping or do they booked and closed the whole track to do their lapping?

    Sorry to be so anal but since they have one of the most complete list of times, I am curious to find out how they do the tests and how comparable are they to the factory times. I don't speak or read German so their mag or website don't really gives me any help. I find it quite hard to believe that some of you refer to their times like quoting the bible but none of you actually know how exact they do the tests. RC did mentioned a while ago that they do not do a complete lap but I think some of you disagreed, do we have a definite answer on that?

    Interesting observation from the video, 1st he is not wearing a helmet, second he has PASM in normal, PSM off and Sports mode on. And it looks like he did his lapping in a chilly early morning.

    Re: 997 GT2 + Walter Röhrl - video

    Looking at SA's Ring map for the Turbo's test, it looks like they DON'T do a complete lap. There is a small gap between the Start & Finish line. If this is the case, it surely can't be a flying lap.

    None of this really matters as long as Porsche and others use the same method.

    I was extremely surprised to see HvS NOT wearing a helmet. He must like living dangerously.

    And finally, not sure how you managed to verify the settings (PASM, PSM etc) he used, along with it being a chilly morning? You must be better on your PC than I am?

    Re: 997 GT2 + Walter Röhrl - video

    Quote:
    Whoopsy said:
    I went to SportAuto's website and watched their 997TT NBR video, it doesn't show where he starts, it's definitely not where he finished that's for sure.

    So do they do their lap times during public lapping or do they booked and closed the whole track to do their lapping?

    Sorry to be so anal but since they have one of the most complete list of times, I am curious to find out how they do the tests and how comparable are they to the factory times. I don't speak or read German so their mag or website don't really gives me any help. I find it quite hard to believe that some of you refer to their times like quoting the bible but none of you actually know how exact they do the tests. RC did mentioned a while ago that they do not do a complete lap but I think some of you disagreed, do we have a definite answer on that?

    Interesting observation from the video, 1st he is not wearing a helmet, second he has PASM in normal, PSM off and Sports mode on. And it looks like he did his lapping in a chilly early morning.



    They use a closed circuit and the same length as factory testers do. The only difference is the driver, basically. This has been discussed countless times already.

    Re: 997 GT2 + Walter Röhrl - video

    Quote:
    mp said:
    Looking at SA's Ring map for the Turbo's test, it looks like they DON'T do a complete lap. There is a small gap between the Start & Finish line. If this is the case, it surely can't be a flying lap.

    None of this really matters as long as Porsche and others use the same method.

    I was extremely surprised to see HvS NOT wearing a helmet. He must like living dangerously.

    And finally, not sure how you managed to verify the settings (PASM, PSM etc) he used, along with it being a chilly morning? You must be better on your PC than I am?



    I checked his settings when the car goes in the shaded area of the track, the lights on the console buttons glows more and you can see which buttons are engaged. He even had his A/C on ECO setting if you looked carefully.

    Most caucasians are pretty resistant to cold, so they only wear longsleeves when it's really chilly.

    From the video, I can see the sun is shining more on an oblique angle, close to the horizon. It can only mean early morning or late dusk, and sunlight is more orange in dusk, the video did not have a orange hue to it so it must be early morning.




    Crash: I know the issue of whether SportAuto use the complete track to test has been discussed MANY times before, but each time, other than a few comments along the line that 'yeah, SportAuto uses the complete track and do flying laps', there wasn't a single solid proof that they really does use the complete closed track. NBR are routinely booked by the car manufacturers to do close course testing, but the question is whether SportAuto mag has enough influence/capital to afford to rent out the whole complete track everytime they test a car?

    I watched a few more of the video on SportAuto's website and there still isn't one that shows they actually did do a complete flying lap. They may have a diagram showing the car's data on various points on the track, but some of the data could as well be interpolated from other data points.

    If you are so sure that they do indeed do a complete track lap, may I ask you to show us your proof?

    Re: 997 GT2 + Walter Röhrl - video

    Quote:
    Whoopsy said:
    I went to SportAuto's website and watched their 997TT NBR video, it doesn't show where he starts, it's definitely not where he finished that's for sure.

    So do they do their lap times during public lapping or do they booked and closed the whole track to do their lapping?

    Sorry to be so anal but since they have one of the most complete list of times, I am curious to find out how they do the tests and how comparable are they to the factory times. I don't speak or read German so their mag or website don't really gives me any help. I find it quite hard to believe that some of you refer to their times like quoting the bible but none of you actually know how exact they do the tests. RC did mentioned a while ago that they do not do a complete lap but I think some of you disagreed, do we have a definite answer on that?

    Interesting observation from the video, 1st he is not wearing a helmet, second he has PASM in normal, PSM off and Sports mode on. And it looks like he did his lapping in a chilly early morning.



    You are under the (wrong) impression that this is a video of one of their timed laps. Just reread my earlier post. The info posted their is valid.

    Re: 997 GT2 + Walter Röhrl - video

    Quote:
    mp said:
    Looking at SA's Ring map for the Turbo's test, it looks like they DON'T do a complete lap. There is a small gap between the Start & Finish line. If this is the case, it surely can't be a flying lap.




    You guys are really perseverant...

    The laps ARE flying laps. We checked that out quite some time ago.

    P.S.: You guys can be assured that sound reasons do exists that make some guys here accept the Supertest data as benchmark data. We are not ignorant or gullible. We have been thinking and reading this stuff for years now.

    Re: 997 GT2 + Walter Röhrl - video

    Quote:
    Whoopsy said:
    .... I find it quite hard to believe that some of you refer to their times like quoting the bible but none of you actually know how exact they do the tests. .....


    Thats exactly my point.

     
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