Nov 11, 2004 2:14:25 AM
- CarreraGtRacer
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Board: Porsche - 911 - 997
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Nov 11, 2004 3:03:02 AM
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nberry
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- Reply to: CarreraGtRacer
Re: C6 Corvette Owns Porsche 997
Quote:
CarreraGtRacer said:
http://www.caranddriver.com/article.asp?section_id=15&article_id=8774&page_number=5
Road and Track also compared the 997S with the C6 and it found the Corvette as good if not better especially if price is taken into consideration. More importantly, the times around Buttonwillow a track perfect for the 997S found that the Corvette was faster by two seconds.Total time around this course is about two minutes so two seconds is meaningful.
So what is left for the Porschephiles to justify the $37,000 difference in price? "Well the Porsche is a better built car.Oh and btw it is CAR magazine performance car of the year."
Nov 11, 2004 5:38:02 AM
- Ray G
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Nov 11, 2004 12:49:48 PM
- Captain Bady
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Re: C6 Corvette Owns Porsche 997
Have you ever seen the build quality of the Corvette? Have you ever seen whats under the body? (not talking about the engine).
The Corvette is a great car value for money and to be honest if I could not afford a 997, I would go for a Corvette, but please don't say that the C6 is better because it makes me laugh.
Magazines live because car makers make them live....
The Corvette is a great car value for money and to be honest if I could not afford a 997, I would go for a Corvette, but please don't say that the C6 is better because it makes me laugh.
Magazines live because car makers make them live....
Re: C6 Corvette Owns Porsche 997
Quote:
Texas911 said:
They tested the non s because it was base model vs base model.
Motor Trend compared the non S. R&T compared the S.
Regarding Ferrari and the bang for the buck, the 360 appreciated in value unlike the 997 which is now being discounted.
Yes I am back. The board was becoming boring like the 997.
Nov 11, 2004 3:17:07 PM
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Carrageous
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Re: C6 Corvette Owns Porsche 997
Quote:
Texas911 said:
They tested the non s because it was base model vs base model.
Not QUITE the base model C6: in both C&D and R&T comparisons, the Vette had the Z51 suspension, which does make a difference. And in both, the 911 won in most measures, then got dinged for price, which is fair. We ALL wish you could get a new 911 for the price of a Corvette.
If you want to race, it looks like the C6 will match or beat the 911S. If you want a great car to drive and enjoy, the 911S is the better choice. Both magazines agreed they'd much rather be behind the wheel of the 911.
Sometimes, it's not about the money. Case in point: A night with Rosie O'Donnell, $53,815; a night with Nicole Kidman, $88,805.
You decide if you'd spend the extra money.
Dain
Re: C6 Corvette Owns Porsche 997
Nick, come off it, you are arguing against your own posts now. As you point out, and because it is true, ferrari's magic lies in its extremely limited production numbers. Yes they make a desirable product but then they dangle the few keys in front of the status hungry and enthusiasts and let them go at it as if it were a loose football in an NFL game.
If there were only a couple hundred CGT's available they would follow the enzo, especially if porsche could be counted on to ensure the investment with a permanent policy of restriction and black list.
As to value, any car costs what it costs and if you want it you will pay the freight. If you like the look of a porsche and its cachet you will pay. If it were just about VALUE we would all be driving mustangs.
Tom
If there were only a couple hundred CGT's available they would follow the enzo, especially if porsche could be counted on to ensure the investment with a permanent policy of restriction and black list.
As to value, any car costs what it costs and if you want it you will pay the freight. If you like the look of a porsche and its cachet you will pay. If it were just about VALUE we would all be driving mustangs.
Tom
Nov 11, 2004 3:27:15 PM
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GM Austin
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Re: C6 Corvette Owns Porsche 997
Quote:
Carrageous said:Quote:
Texas911 said:
They tested the non s because it was base model vs base model.
Not QUITE the base model C6: in both C&D and R&T comparisons, the Vette had the Z51 suspension, which does make a difference. And in both, the 911 won in most measures, then got dinged for price, which is fair. We ALL wish you could get a new 911 for the price of a Corvette.
If you want to race, it looks like the C6 will match or beat the 911S. If you want a great car to drive and enjoy, the 911S is the better choice. Both magazines agreed they'd much rather be behind the wheel of the 911.
Sometimes, it's not about the money. Case in point: A night with Rosie O'Donnell, $53,815; a night with Nicole Kidman, $88,805.
You decide if you'd spend the extra money.
Dain
There you go!
Bragging rights and chicks. Porsche says "success" better.
Performance aside. Build quality aside.
More sophisticated women will notice you and want to see you in a 911.
I'd rather discuss a 911's attributes with a CFO, or Development Officer; the more likely alternative is discussing Corvette perf with a Pontiac owner.
If money, power, financial success is attractive to you and the people you admire, "un_fortune_ately" there's only one obvious choice.
Fact: wanting a great car is a blatently _materialistic_ desire. Ultimately materialism goes with Capitalism and is all about wealth and power. Comparing Corvette and Porsche in this regard? Porsche sez it best.
More sophisticated women will notice you and want to see you in a 911.
I'd rather discuss a 911's attributes with a CFO, or Development Officer; the more likely alternative is discussing Corvette perf with a Pontiac owner.
If money, power, financial success is attractive to you and the people you admire, "un_fortune_ately" there's only one obvious choice.
Fact: wanting a great car is a blatently _materialistic_ desire. Ultimately materialism goes with Capitalism and is all about wealth and power. Comparing Corvette and Porsche in this regard? Porsche sez it best.
Re: Bragging rights and chicks.? Porsche equals AARP driver
In Germany, customer data indicates a average purchaser age of 55. I suspect its the same in the US.
I suggest that Porsche's long options list and color charts
are a sneaky way to give older buyers something to do in their spare time and to condition them from their constant perusal of same to become psychological addicted to choosing
all things Porsche.
Regrettably, the Porsche 997S ias sold is apparently a second place match with a C6 on a racetrack, has a smaller trunk, costs way more, costs more to maintain and gets worse
gas mileage. But, you can choose from a mind boggling list
of dainty interior options. How quaint!
I think any CFO, analyzing the C6 and 997S data would advise you to avoid the allure of deviating stitching
and polished exhaust tips and go with the winner.
I suggest that Porsche's long options list and color charts
are a sneaky way to give older buyers something to do in their spare time and to condition them from their constant perusal of same to become psychological addicted to choosing
all things Porsche.
Regrettably, the Porsche 997S ias sold is apparently a second place match with a C6 on a racetrack, has a smaller trunk, costs way more, costs more to maintain and gets worse
gas mileage. But, you can choose from a mind boggling list
of dainty interior options. How quaint!
I think any CFO, analyzing the C6 and 997S data would advise you to avoid the allure of deviating stitching
and polished exhaust tips and go with the winner.
Conc: R&T has anxious misleading money-worried judges
Quote:
nanabols said:
Road and Track Corvette C6 vs 911 Carrera S Dec04
What a transparently silly conclusion:
Funny 997s nicely beats the Corvette in their "points" by a good margin and then LOSES because of cost!
Tells me the staff at R&T don't have much income and are plagued with money worries.
Re: Conc: R&T has anxious misleading money-worried judges
Quote:\
MaxErnst said:Quote:
nanabols said:
Road and Track Corvette C6 vs 911 Carrera S Dec04
What a transparently silly conclusion:
Funny 997s nicely beats the Corvette in their "points" by a good margin and then LOSES because of cost!
Tells me the staff at R&T don't have much income and are plagued with money worries.
How do you explain that the Corvette was 2 seconds faster around Buttonwillow a track perfectly suited for the 911?
Re: Conc: R&T has anxious misleading money-worried judges
Quote:
nberry said:Quote:\
MaxErnst said:Quote:
nanabols said:
Road and Track Corvette C6 vs 911 Carrera S Dec04
What a transparently silly conclusion:
Funny 997s nicely beats the Corvette in their "points" by a good margin and then LOSES because of cost!
Tells me the staff at R&T don't have much income and are plagued with money worries.
How do you explain that the Corvette was 2 seconds faster around Buttonwillow a track perfectly suited for the 911?
I dunno, doesn't bother me THAT much anyway.
I'm just commenting on their silly conclusion based upon their _own_ points scoring system.
Like they're telling people how to spend their money!
"it's a great car, better than the corvette, but we can't recommend people buy it because it costs too much."
Frickin' silly!
Re: Conc: R&T has anxious misleading money-worried judges
How Do you explain the 2 seconds faster?
How many runs did they do?
The 997 was higher in 0-60, 1/4 mile, slalom, brakes, and steering.
You are right it DOESNT make sense that the C6 was faster at the track. Leads me to think that there are too many variables, mainly the driver.
I highly doubt that the C6 was fatser is faster at that particular track. It might have been faster that one time on that track, but I don't think it is right to say WITH CONFIDENCE that the C6 is faster at that track after just one, 2 3 or even 5 runs.
How many runs did they do?
The 997 was higher in 0-60, 1/4 mile, slalom, brakes, and steering.
You are right it DOESNT make sense that the C6 was faster at the track. Leads me to think that there are too many variables, mainly the driver.
I highly doubt that the C6 was fatser is faster at that particular track. It might have been faster that one time on that track, but I don't think it is right to say WITH CONFIDENCE that the C6 is faster at that track after just one, 2 3 or even 5 runs.
Nov 11, 2004 8:51:53 PM
- SoCalHoosier
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Re: Conc: R&T has anxious misleading money-worried judges
Look at the 0-100 times... that would probably explain the slower lap times for he 997S. This was a problem also in the 996 where after 70-80 acceleration was bad.
All about the gearing but you can't escape overall hp when your car is turning into a pig.
All about the gearing but you can't escape overall hp when your car is turning into a pig.
Nov 12, 2004 4:36:28 AM
- CarreraGtRacer
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Nov 12, 2004 6:30:18 AM
- ADias
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Re: Conc: R&T has anxious misleading money-worried judges
This guy Nick continues to be up to no good. He claims the 360 "appreciated." Maybe, if the car is lightly used and is a garage queen. I would like to see the resale value of a 2-year old 360 used as a daily driver w/ 20k miles. Anything w/less use is just a stupid toy for a boy who never grew up.
And as far as the thread topic... of course, the Vette is great value. But who cares? I would never want one.
And as far as the thread topic... of course, the Vette is great value. But who cares? I would never want one.
Nov 12, 2004 7:28:12 AM
- Ray G
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Re: C6 Corvette Owns Porsche 997
The C6 Z51 package is a big package, which includes new springs, dampers, stabilizer bars, tires, uprated brake rotors, unique transmission, and heavy duty steering and transmission coolers. A C6 with Z51 is almost as fast as the C5 Z06 around a track.
If C&D wanted to be fair, they could have compared a non-Z51 with a base 997, a Z51 C6 with a 997 + sport suspension (or 997S), and the C6 Z06 with the 997TT next year or so. But, I guess their whole point and conclusion was preordained: the C6 is more performance per dollar.
I think this is yet another reason why Porsche should never have bothered selling a new 911 with less performance than the 997S.
If C&D wanted to be fair, they could have compared a non-Z51 with a base 997, a Z51 C6 with a 997 + sport suspension (or 997S), and the C6 Z06 with the 997TT next year or so. But, I guess their whole point and conclusion was preordained: the C6 is more performance per dollar.
I think this is yet another reason why Porsche should never have bothered selling a new 911 with less performance than the 997S.
Re: C6 Corvette Owns Porsche 997
Quote:
Ray G said:
The C6 Z51 package is a big package, which includes new springs, dampers, stabilizer bars, tires, uprated brake rotors, unique transmission, and heavy duty steering and transmission coolers. A C6 with Z51 is almost as fast as the C5 Z06 around a track.
True, but Chevy only charges $1,500 for this option (the price of metallic paint on the Porsche
)
Re: C6 Corvette Owns Porsche 997
I just don't care that a Corvette is slightly faster than a 997 in any form. The Corvette is still butt ugly in my opinion (even worse than the previous version) and the interior quality/look is still horrible. If all you want is a fast *cheap* machine......by all means the Corvette is probably the best available. If you want something with a little more finesse, taste, quality, and a beautiful design, the 997 is tough to beat in any form. If a new Vette was $30K and hit 60 in 3 seconds.....I still wouldn't buy it.
Re: Bragging rights and chicks. Porsche says "success" better.
Quote:
MaxErnst said:
Performance aside. Build quality aside.
More sophisticated women will notice you and want to see you in a 911.
I'd rather discuss a 911's attributes with a CFO, or Development Officer; the more likely alternative is discussing Corvette perf with a Pontiac owner.
If money, power, financial success is attractive to you and the people you admire, "un_fortune_ately" there's only one obvious choice.
Fact: wanting a great car is a blatently _materialistic_ desire. Ultimately materialism goes with Capitalism and is all about wealth and power. Comparing Corvette and Porsche in this regard? Porsche sez it best.
Doesn't all this argue Ferrari over Porsche? I think the fact this argument is being put forth is exactly why Porsches are getting softer and more GT while Ferrari is staying true to being all sports car. Then again, racing like men instead of advertising SUVs during F1 races like ladies will keep you focused on sports cars.
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