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    Re: Time For GIAC ECU Tuning?

    Yes, not many comparisons between Stage II power-kits for US and European tuners.

    Basically if GIAC (or anyone else) can achieve around 7.1 seconds for 100-200kph then that would be a good basis for comparison.  As Cannga has mentioned, don't trust dyno outputs.

    Also the RS-Tuning remap is more about smoothness than 100% power instantly.  Have a read of this article:

    http://www.worldcarfans.com/9080208.007/wcf-test-drive-cargraphic-porsche-911-turbo

    After just a moment behind the wheel it was easy to see why. Most tuners decided the 997 Turbo was too soft, too well rounded and too boring, so they did the equivalent of sticking a screwdriver through the exhaust and dropping the suspension to give the whole experience a little more life, a little of that old passion. Cargraphic, though, has gone its own way.

    >>Even after a year's driving my car I still can't get over how much smoother power delivery is now!

    I think the main differentiator though is the price.  Here in the UK the relative Stage II kits would be about (all fitted prices with taxes):

    Ruf = £11,000 (ecu, exhaust, air-filter, clutch, 1 yr warranty)

    CG/RST = £7,000 (ecu, exhaust, air-filter)

    GIAC = £4,000 (ecu, exhaust)

    So the big question is do you get what you pay for?  I personally think so.


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    Re: Time For GIAC ECU Tuning?

    Alex, so no warranty from cargraphic-rs tuning?


    --
    Dedi La vita è troppo corta per non guidare italiano.....

    Re: Time For GIAC ECU Tuning?

    ruf are the only guys I know of that give you a warranty. Obviously the parts all come with 2 year warranty though, but your Porsche one is GONE.
    --


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    Re: Time For GIAC ECU Tuning?

    Alex_997TT:

    ...snip...

    I think the main differentiator though is the price.  Here in the UK the relative Stage II kits would be about (all fitted prices with taxes):

    Ruf = £11,000 (ecu, exhaust, air-filter, clutch, 1 yr warranty)

    CG/RST = £7,000 (ecu, exhaust, air-filter)

    GIAC = £4,000 (ecu, exhaust)

    ......


    Smiley Does that £7,000 package *include* the Cargraphic smuffler?
    Every time Alex lists what people have to pay in Europe for car related things, I almost want to faint. There is no way, simply no way, I could afford my car if I were in Europe.

    Ok, maybe I could, but I might not sleep well.
    Or I will sleep on the couch by myself once the wife gets the bill? Smiley
    --

    Regards,
    Can
    997 Turbo + Bilstein Damptronic (Review) + Cargraphic Exhaust (Heavenly Race Car Noise Smiley Review)


    Re: Time For GIAC ECU Tuning?

    I am not sure what a smuffler is but prices include everything in brackets. Yup, not cheap, especially with crazy exchange rates right now all the German kits went up another 12% recently here :( As such I have now decided enough is enough and I am stopping with the mods. I have spent what a new GT2 would have cost me. So I am going to start saving for an RS6 I think as a family car going forwards. A much more 'sensible' option ;)
    --


    Click for bigger picture!


    Re: Time For GIAC ECU Tuning?

    cannga:


    HAHAHAHAHAHSmiley

    and the new one is not a muffler,is a "Smuffler" Smiley


    Yeah and she also knows exactly when I come home. All the glasses in the house start vibrating. No more secret late night parties.
    People at work say they get a gentle massage from the vibrating air whenever I enter the parking garage. It's getting ridiculous. Smiley

     

    HAHHAHAHAHAHSmiley


    --
    997 TT, what a car/che'mmmmmaghena!!!

    Re: Time For GIAC ECU Tuning?

    cannga:
    STRADALE:

    Cann,

    Have you looked at the possibility of going w/ the Cargraphic ECU as well? 

    You have their exhaust already right?

    From what I'm hearing it sounds like I would go either the GIAC or Cargraphic route for their ECU, what's your take?

    tia~

    The Cargraphic ECU tune is of great reputation and I believe the name behind the scene is RS Tuning, which of course means VERY serious brain power and experience. However, for whatever reason, I've not seen it mentioned much by US users. I don't know if it's the cost or what, but curiously enough, when I visit RSS / Stuttgart Performance web site, which is US Distributor of Cargraphic Exhaust in the US, I don't even see the Cargraphic ECU Tune mentioned. (Anyone corrects me if I'm wrong with anything above.)

    In the US, currently the 2 big guns are EVOMSit and GIAC. GIAC has been in existence longer & is used by some Porsche dealers. EVOMSit came on later but developed a quick reputation and has many happy users as well.

    Clearly both the EVOMSit and GIAC mods work, and work well. If I read between the lines correctly (no guarantee) the EVOMSit might have a bigger low end torque boost but trails off at higher RPM. The GIAC might have more torque higher up. All of this is hearsay & there has not been a head to head comparison with either dyno's or test drives.

    The "strange" thing about my search is that I do NOT want too much power, as this is a sure road to replacing the clutch (yikes!). Replacing clutch wouldn't be a big deal except it seems like the Sachs unit doesn't quite feel like stock & is not as easy to use as stock (again anyone feels free to correct).

    The second thing is it's critical to me that there must be some way of returning to stock power level easily. This would allow men to compare the 2 modes, and know the strengths and weaknesses of the mod so I could return it if it's not something I like (30 day or so refund period for both US companies). Plus I have teenage son, etc. So basically this leaves me with GIAC as the only choice for now.

    Check out this poll -- result not verified but interesting nevertheless: http://www.6speedonline.com/forums/997-turbo-gt2/168988-ecu-poll-users-reports.html .

     

    Thanks Cann!

    You're one of the few guys that I'd follow right into making the same decision without doing all of my normal DD, & legwork because I know you're like me when it comes to doing your homework ........ If you go GIAC, what else do I need to know.

    Please: Keep us informed. Smiley


    --

    08 PORSCHE Turbo Cabriolet, 06 Ferrari F430,  04 Durango HEMI,  04 Harley Davidson Screamin Eagle,  93 Harley Davidson Nostalgia

     


    Re: Time For GIAC ECU Tuning?

    Can, the Sachs clutch  feels only slightly stiffer than stock.


    --

    Doug

    Houston, Texas USA 

    997TT ...RUF550


    Re: Time For GIAC ECU Tuning?

    TT Gasman:

    Can, the Sachs clutch  feels only slightly stiffer than stock.


    Thanks Doug. Maybe you could help us; those who are still looking. I recall reading on 6speedonline -- don't have the exact thread, but it seems more than just one person -- that he's not happy with either the pedal feel of the Sachs Stage 2 clutch. Someone else mentions something about a difficult engagement point.

    1. Which one does Ruf use, same as this stage 2 http://www.awe-tuning.com/pages/shared/part_detail.cfm?PMaI=2&PMoI=41&PEI=17&PP=997tt_drivetrain.cfm&PPT=Drivetrain&IL=996stage2 ?

    2. You don't have any problem with pedeal feel or engagement point?

    Anyone else with Sachs clutch experience, feel free to jump in. TIA


    --

    Regards,
    Can
    997 Turbo + Bilstein Damptronic (Review) + Cargraphic Exhaust (Heavenly Race Car Noise Smiley Review)


    Re: Time For GIAC ECU Tuning?

    Can, I have the sachs 2 package sold by AWE which Eclou had before as well and the feel is exactly the same as stock in my opinion. the only difference is there is a hint of chatter when the car is cold but only in reverse. engagement point is the same as stock, but remember this is with the stock flywheel, once you go with the lightweight flywheel you'll hate yourself for doing it.


    --
     

    2007 997 TT Protomotive

     


    Re: Time For GIAC ECU Tuning?

    I don't want to sound like the broken record/cheerleader for RS Tuning but in recent months I too have been revisiting all the tuning options whilst considering the next "move" for my GT2....

    RS Tuning programming has to be the gold standard in programming firstly because they are one of very few with engine dyno set ups which can properly run modern Porsche turbo engines and they have the massive experience in building race engines, which means they know exactly just how far they can thermally stress these engines before components start to fail.

    For example for the GT2 the maximum power/torque they will sell you without installing rods is 635PS/820NM..... pay the ~10K Euro for Carrillos and you can have 650PS/850NM - a seemingly small increase for a lot of money but is illustrative of how well they know these engines (and how THEIR power affects them).

    I don't know the ins and outs of Motronic tuning but I understand that RS had Bosch Motorsport engineers working with them for the Alzen 996tt project so they will have learnt a lot about how the system worked best in terms of managing the thermal limits in realtion to component failure.....

    So in conclusion yes I will be using RS for my programming this time but fortunately I feel that the GT2 does not need that much more grunt (the 600PS/787NM will suffice)so it will not be costing me the usual crazy numbers Smiley


    --


    2009 997 GT2 RS Tuning 542PS/736NM


    Re: Time For GIAC ECU Tuning?

    TB993tt:

    I don't want to sound like the broken record/cheerleader for RS Tuning but in recent months I too have been revisiting all the tuning options whilst considering the next "move" for my GT2....

    RS Tuning programming has to be the gold standard in programming firstly because they are one of very few with engine dyno set ups which can properly run modern Porsche turbo engines and they have the massive experience in building race engines, which means they know exactly just how far they can thermally stress these engines before components start to fail.

    For example for the GT2 the maximum power/torque they will sell you without installing rods is 635PS/820NM..... pay the ~10K Euro for Carrillos and you can have 650PS/850NM - a seemingly small increase for a lot of money but is illustrative of how well they know these engines (and how THEIR power affects them).

    I don't know the ins and outs of Motronic tuning but I understand that RS had Bosch Motorsport engineers working with them for the Alzen 996tt project so they will have learnt a lot about how the system worked best in terms of managing the thermal limits in realtion to component failure.....

    So in conclusion yes I will be using RS for my programming this time but fortunately I feel that the GT2 does not need that much more grunt (the 600PS/787NM will suffice)so it will not be costing me the usual crazy numbers Smiley

     

    Toby so also for you i can stay relaxed going with Cargraphics/RS tuning stage 2?Smiley

     

    Thanks

    Ciao
    Dario


    --
    997 TT, what a car/che'mmmmmaghena!!!

    Re: Time For GIAC ECU Tuning?

    AAHTT:

    Can, I have the sachs 2 package sold by AWE which Eclou had before as well and the feel is exactly the same as stock in my opinion. the only difference is there is a hint of chatter when the car is cold but only in reverse. engagement point is the same as stock, but remember this is with the stock flywheel, once you go with the lightweight flywheel you'll hate yourself for doing it.

     

    Anthony,

    Thanks for the helpful feedback. What's the problem with the LWFW please?


    --

    Regards,
    Can
    997 Turbo + Bilstein Damptronic (Review) + Cargraphic Exhaust (Heavenly Race Car Noise Smiley Review)


    Re: Time For GIAC ECU Tuning?

    cannga:
    AAHTT:

    Can, I have the sachs 2 package sold by AWE which Eclou had before as well and the feel is exactly the same as stock in my opinion. the only difference is there is a hint of chatter when the car is cold but only in reverse. engagement point is the same as stock, but remember this is with the stock flywheel, once you go with the lightweight flywheel you'll hate yourself for doing it.

     

    Anthony,

    Thanks for the helpful feedback. What's the problem with the LWFW please?

    It's supposed to be very noisy (rattles/chatters) when idling.  It would give you a bit better spool up but from what I have heard it's not worth it unless you want to gain like 0.1s to 100mph.


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    Click for bigger picture!


    Re: Time For GIAC ECU Tuning?

    Alex_997TT:

    It's supposed to be very noisy (rattles/chatters) when idling.  It would give you a bit better spool up but from what I have heard it's not worth it unless you want to gain like 0.1s to 100mph.

     

    A proper install should be no louder than a GT3RS.


    Re: Time For GIAC ECU Tuning?

    Alex_997TT:
    cannga:
    AAHTT:

    Can, I have the sachs 2 package sold by AWE which Eclou had before as well and the feel is exactly the same as stock in my opinion. the only difference is there is a hint of chatter when the car is cold but only in reverse. engagement point is the same as stock, but remember this is with the stock flywheel, once you go with the lightweight flywheel you'll hate yourself for doing it.

     

    Anthony,

    Thanks for the helpful feedback. What's the problem with the LWFW please?

    It's supposed to be very noisy (rattles/chatters) when idling.  It would give you a bit better spool up but from what I have heard it's not worth it unless you want to gain like 0.1s to 100mph.


    I've heard the LWFW's chatter on a 996 Turbo, it's not that bad. I wouldn't think it is bad enough to trouble someone with a Cargraphic *Loud* Exhaust like Anthony Smiley.

    I was wondering more if the faster spooling-up of a LWFW, together with the increased power from the ECU tune -- meaning even more faster spooling, subsequently cause a difficulty in engagement point. This seems to make sense in theory.


    --

    Regards,
    Can
    997 Turbo + Bilstein Damptronic (Review) + Cargraphic Exhaust (Heavenly Race Car Noise Smiley Review)


    Re: Time For GIAC ECU Tuning?

    I asked the same question on 6speedonline and here is the answer from a member there.
    He has Stage 2 Sachs with a LWFW. Reading between the various posts and speculating, I would think that if you have to replace the clutch, Sachs Stage 2 without the LWFW is the safest approach. http://www.awe-tuning.com/pages/shared/part_detail.cfm?PMaI=2&PMoI=41&PEI=17&PP=997tt_drivetrain.cfm&PPT=Drivetrain&IL=996stage2

    >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
    http://www.6speedonline.com/forums/997-turbo-gt2/168925-evo-hydraulic-accumulator-removal-kit-2.html

    >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
    Originally Posted by cannga View Post
    Thanks Larry for the helpful reply.

    Hmmm... I am wondering if the faster spooling-up of a LWFW, together with the increased power from the ECU tune -- meaning even more faster spooling, subsequently cause a difficulty in engagement point. This seems to make sense in theory.
    Anyone else with a LWFW would like chime in.
    ........

     

    >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
    Can,

    That is what I feel is happening. With the added power and quicker throttle response from the LWFW, the factory power assisted unit makes proper engagement a little challenging.

    The stock clutch has a numb feel as it is. When I upgraded to the Sachs setup, the engagement point became higher up in the overall pedal travel. The overall pedal feel (pressure) is not much different from stock. I just want a more defined engagement feel from the pedal so that modulation becomes easier.


    --
     

    Regards,
    Can
    997 Turbo + Bilstein Damptronic (Review) + Cargraphic Exhaust (Heavenly Race Car Noise Smiley Review)


    Re: Time For GIAC ECU Tuning?

    Thanks cannga for keeping us posted!


    Re: Time For GIAC ECU Tuning?

    Eunice:

    Thanks cannga for keeping us posted!

    You're welcome. Once again I am just learning from the guys ahead of me... mixed with some "google" research. Smiley


    --

    Regards,
    Can
    997 Turbo + Bilstein Damptronic (Review) + Cargraphic Exhaust (Heavenly Race Car Noise Smiley Review)


    Re: Time For GIAC ECU Tuning?

    Cannga, after 250 miles on my new setup, I can tell you that the engagement point for a Sachs2/Aasco LWFW is almost identical to stock.  If you can put up with the rattle (similar to GT3RS) you'll be fine.  I'll make a video in a few days for you to hear the difference...


    Re: Time For GIAC ECU Tuning?

    cannga:
    TT Gasman:

    Can, the Sachs clutch  feels only slightly stiffer than stock.


    Thanks Doug. Maybe you could help us; those who are still looking. I recall reading on 6speedonline -- don't have the exact thread, but it seems more than just one person -- that he's not happy with either the pedal feel of the Sachs Stage 2 clutch. Someone else mentions something about a difficult engagement point.

    1. Which one does Ruf use, same as this stage 2 http://www.awe-tuning.com/pages/shared/part_detail.cfm?PMaI=2&PMoI=41&PEI=17&PP=997tt_drivetrain.cfm&PPT=Drivetrain&IL=996stage2 ?

    2. You don't have any problem with pedeal feel or engagement point?

    Anyone else with Sachs clutch experience, feel free to jump in. TIA

    Can, I can't tell you the exact part for sure, but the return box with my stocker was a Sachs Racing 88-3082-999-752, pretty sure it's a street application. I have no idea what constitutes a stage 2 clutch.
     

    Again, this clutch is only slightly stiffer than the stock with a small change in the pick up point,. Feels similar to the GT2/3 clutch. No problem at all driving it. Although I'm not driving much these days as I had some knee surgery a week or so ago.

    D

     


    --
     

    Doug

    Houston, Texas USA 

    997TT ...RUF550


    Re: Time For GIAC ECU Tuning?

    Doug & bbbyu, thanks for the important feedback. I guess this means the LWFW doesn't **necessarily** change the engagement point.
    I feel more comfortable now with an ECU tune. Changing the clutch was the big sticky point. If the Sachs feels so similar to stock, then I have no problem. 

     


    --

    Regards,
    Can
    997 Turbo + Bilstein Damptronic (Review) + Cargraphic Exhaust (Heavenly Race Car Noise Smiley Review)


    Re: Time For GIAC ECU Tuning?

    Why don't you save yourself the cost of a new clutch and spend the extra on an RS Tuning remap? It's not like the Cargraphic powerkit is slower as a result of being kinder on the clutch...
    --


    Click for bigger picture!


    Re: Time For GIAC ECU Tuning?

    Alex_997TT:
    Why don't you save yourself the cost of a new clutch and spend the extra on an RS Tuning remap? It's not like the Cargraphic powerkit is slower as a result of being kinder on the clutch...


    I think the world of RS Tuning, and have read about the brain power involved, but...
    1. No dealer in the US that I know of.
    2. Expensive. And most likely *extremely* expensive as one moves up the power ladder, compared to US counterparts.
    3. There has never been an authoritative test, by impartial observers, that shows RS Tuning to be better than, say EVOMS (very possibly the top US tuner in terms of recent sales -- just guessing here).

    In addition, the issue of what defines a  "better" tune is very tricky as I have recently discovered. Objectively, it's easy: one check the dyno, or 60-130 time with VBOX, etc. Subjectively, it's another story altogether, for the behavior of two equally fast cars may be entirely different from one another. Since I drive my car daily, the subjective evaluation becomes even more critical. In other words, which tune is more FUN?

    As an example, below is an evalutaion from a poster on 6speedonline of 2 US tunes. I always take stranger's opinion with a grain of salt but this post to me is a particularly interesting and important one because the poster has one tune, a US company by the name of APR, then switch to another, GIAC, a big name in US Porsche tuning. In other words, this comparison is not a 20 minute test drive but a long term evaluation. Read between the lines and see how he's implying that the APR tune feels more "torquey" in the low end.
    Bottom line is there are multiple aspects to a tune and for me (YMMV), there currently is no convinving evident of the superiority of RS Tuning, objectively or subjectively, to a current big gun in the US like EVOMS.

    >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
    The benefits of the GIAC Flashloader system

    hi andrew this is khoi from canada it has been a while since our last talk i didn't had a chance to give you some feed back on my back to back experience between your performance 93 oct flash and my previous apr 93 oct program on my otherwise stock 997tt so here it goes if that can help anyone:
    1) yours seems to make more hp especially after 5000rpm but it the same smooth curve as stock this is especially good on track where smooth and high rpm is the norm
    2)yours max boost is 1.2 bar in sport mode
    3)no error or malfunctionning or cel even on track
    4)APR program feels more powerful though ie more torque (kick in th ass) in the street zone which is from 3500 to 5000 rpm and really change the overall character of th power delivery so more difficult to modulate on track but more fun on the streets and in higher gears
    5)APR max boost is 1.0 bar but gets there quicker even if i'm not quickly depressing the gas pedal whereas giac is like stock you have to mash the throttle to put it in overboost
    6)APR eliminates the overboost button/function they told me their program doesn't need overboost which can be actually easier that way
    7)APR program made my electric driver seat stop functionning after a week the problem was solved after a factory reflash on the seat though
    all in all in a nutshell from my personal point of view:
    APR better kick in the pants more torque less fiddling with the sport button(i hate having to push the sport button every time AND the suspension button back on normal pasm for street driving to put it my way) less stable program???(ie computer in seat, pasm?)
    GIAC smoother, more hp higher in the engine range, very stable , more max boost
    there hpoe it helps everyone


    --
     

    Regards,
    Can
    997 Turbo + Bilstein Damptronic (Review) + Cargraphic Exhaust (Heavenly Race Car Noise Smiley Review)


    Re: Time For GIAC ECU Tuning?

    RSS (Road Sport Supply) is the Cargraphic reseller in the US. Have there been any comparisons between US tuners and Ruf? RS-Tuning are at least as good as Ruf, perhaps better. I think a lot of it boils down to just how many horses you are planning for. Yes Ruf and Cargraphic get crazy expensive after Stage II conversions (about 550bhp), but are you really going to be able to use more power than that on public roads? I find that I can barely get all that power down through the tires now. You have to be going in a dead straight line to unleash more than 0.8 bar of boost even in 3rd gear. Otherwise traction control kicks in and takes the power away! The idea of 700+ bhp one day sounds great in theory but unless you are doing regular track days or mile straights it will be money down the drain! So my strong recommendation would be to get the best Stage II kit you can afford. You certainly won't then ever be wanting for more power, especially if you go for a kit with great torque curves.
    --


    Click for bigger picture!


    Re: Time For GIAC ECU Tuning?

    An interesting glimpse into the world of tuning -- how the ECU codes are modified. Author is the President of AWE Tuning, a well known US Porsche tuner with a strong affiliation with GIAC (eclou's car uses the AWE-GIAC power package and went to 186 mph at the Texas mile). I have no affiliation with either.

    BTW, in case you don't know, the US tuning community is one of extreme hyper-activity. Surely a lot of fun, with the 2 top dogs, GIAC and EVOMSit, gunning for each other almost on a daily basis (kidding about the gunning; I mean competing Smiley). Very good for customers.

    The author did not indicate who the "new kids on the block" are, for obvious reason, but it's fairly safe to assume the 3 most active tuners for 997 Turbo in the US -- GIAC, EVOMSit, and Switzer (See Alex's table above & http://www.switzerperformanceinnovation.com/ ) -- are not. They all carry a  high level of expertise and sophistication. That Tym Switzer for example seems to be some sort of genius magician.

    (Another company that deserves some attention is Protomotive. Very well known with 996 Turbo's but not so much with 997 -- I don't know why. A friend who posts here, AAHTT, actually uses Protomotive in his 997 and my butt's dyno tells me it's one of the fastest cars I've EVER been in. And I've been in a few fast ones. Smiley Results of both eclou's GIAC & AAHTT's Protomotive tuned cars are also posted in Alex's Performance Table above.)

    >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
    http://www.6speedonline.com/forums/997-turbo-gt2/142660-benefits-giac-flashloader-system-3.html

    ...
    There are vast differences among the different "classes" of software out there for our cars.

    First, one must differentiate between software that is created using third party tuning programs and software created in the same manner that the OEMs, like Bosch and Siemens, use. This is a very important distinction as the method used to create the end product dictates how thorough, stable, and sophisticated it will perform.

    All the "new kids on the block" fall into the third party tuning classification. They are using recently available products that allow them to superficially tweak the performance tables in the ECU to increase power. However, the depth to which these third party programs allow changes to be made is relatively shallow. These tools are basically dumbed down browser-based interfaces that allow end users to manipulate superficial performance tables via graphical representations. These tuning programs started popping up on the market in droves in the last couple years, and are named WinOLS, Optican, Piasini, and Cartech (among others). A company can purchase these programs/tools, hook them up to an ECU, and with a little guidance from whom they bought it from, start playing around with these low level performance tables.

    The "OEM type" of interface is via programming tools written and developed by the same company actually doing the performance tuning. This means that the people working at this level can understand and modify in the same language as the people who originally programmed the fuel injection ECU. The level of understanding to work in this native environment is so high that, until the third party programming tools came about, very few people in the automotive performance aftermarket were qualified to go there. Which is why until very recently, there were very few companies offering performance software for German cars.

    However, do not confuse one's ability to tune an ECU with the ability to tune it well. These new Windows-based third party translator tuning tools are pale versions of the powerful tools developed by the companies that speak the same native machine language that Bosch does. A German car ECU's operating system relies on very sophisticated command software utilizing functions that cross reference operational conditions and database data on multiple levels. A single 3D graph that represents an engine parameter does not really represent how deeply the ignition timing, or air/fuel ratio, or boost level function that is is representing is accounted for in the actual operation of the engine.
    ...


    --

    Regards,
    Can
    997 Turbo + Bilstein Damptronic (Review) + Cargraphic Exhaust (Heavenly Race Car Noise Smiley Review)


    Re: Time For GIAC ECU Tuning?

    I ran across some interesting remark from the early days of 997 Turbo tuning: the importance of octane specific tuning. Author is EVOMS's founder, Todd Zuccone.
    BTW, in these early days, EVOMS and GIAC worked together. How and why they split to become the 2 dominant (in the US) & competing forces today would probably makes for a most interesting read! I recently took a very informal poll on 6speedonline and it came out 50/50 between the 2. Click here for poll. As EVOMS ECU tune comes out a bit later than GIAC's, it is probable that they are the one gaining ground. Just speculating.

    >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
    http://www.6speedonline.com/forums/997-turbo-gt2/53693-process-has-started-official-evolution-997tt-thread-5.html

    Part of our R&D process is to test these different items prior to modifying the program. We could have just starting tuning the ecu right away, however driving the car on a regular basis with the PIWIS has proven itself to be invaluable especially since we live in the desert and it is HOT. I am 100% convinced at this point that if this car gets tuned on US 93 octane or European 98 RON octane fuel that the performance gains achieved on these fuels will be severely affected if not eliminated entirely if installed on a car that can only get 91-octane. I will go into this more in detail once we make more progress with the 91 octane tuning. Additionally, we will be offering a 91 octane safe file as well as a 93-octane file and a race gas file to meet the needs of all of our customers.


    --

    Regards,
    Can
    997 Turbo + Bilstein Damptronic (Review) + Cargraphic Exhaust (Heavenly Race Car Noise Smiley Review)


    Re: Time For GIAC ECU Tuning?

    By sheer coincidence Smiley, the above post is related to a question Alex asked me earlier, about whether I have considered an ECU flash from England-based RS Tuning. I now wonder what octane RS Tuning used in their ECU development. Did they use California grade (91 PON = 95 RON equivalent) gasoline? I don't know the answer, but obviously it would behoove anyone in California to check this issue if it is a European tuner he wants to use.

    Below is a quote from the same thread, from Alex Ross of Sharkwerks, a prominent & highly reputable Porsche shop in Calif., again stressing the importance of octane-specific ECU tuning. By the way, I mentioned the GIAC-AWE "alliance", EVOMS-Sharkwerks is the "other" alliance, or cooperation, or something like that . So there you have the 2 top dogs of US ECU tuning and their interaction

    >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>

    Todd you bring up a valid point about "safe" tuning and for the correct octane. I've seen some stuff from tuners (not going to name names because that isn't respectful) that just slap on files they "say" are for 91 octane but how do they really know if they don't even own the car, test their files or even have 91 octane in there state, country or region? We've even sliced open a few motors with clear evidence of extremely aggressive tuning, detonation and so forth on customer cars that have had other programing. Too many times either from Europe or other parts of the US I've ridden/driven in cars tuned way too aggressively for 91 octane. As I said I can't blame those said tuners too much, usually they're just selling a file they've rew-written on their laptop nowhere near a car or 91 octane but the result is a car that pings like mad (not cool). 91 octane is ****- no doubt about that but it's a fact of life in California/Arizona so we need to be tuned for it:P


    --

    Regards,
    Can
    997 Turbo + Bilstein Damptronic (Review) + Cargraphic Exhaust (Heavenly Race Car Noise Smiley Review)


    Re: Time For GIAC ECU Tuning?

    Do those US based owners with the Ruf 550 conversion feel no difference with low octane fuel? I very much doubt it! Yes European tuners such as Ruf and RS-Tuning remap are based on 98 RON petrol but they can run on normal 95 RON just fine. I know that the RS-Tuning ECU mapping sits on top of the factory mapping, so it adjusts just like the stock car would, I am unsure if others take this approach. The CG powerkit is more about releasing untapped power thats already there than just forcing more power on the car. This is what makes this kits power delivery so smooth and why it gives you more torque than pretty much any other stage II kit.
    --


    Click for bigger picture!


    Re: Time For GIAC ECU Tuning?

    By the way, your stock car won't be putting out 480 bhp on low octane 95 RON. 98 RON is required for this.
    --


    Click for bigger picture!


     
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