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    Latest SPORT AUTO Supertest (Track) 997 Carrera S

    Let's play some number games with the latest results from the SPORT AUTO Supertest (track test) with the 997 Carrera S equipped with 20 mm chassis incl. LSD and PCCB brake.

    BRAKING PERFORMANCE
    997 Carrera S with PCCB:
    100 kph to 0 kph - 32,2 m.
    200 kph to 0 kph - 130,7 m.
    Carrera GT:
    100 kph to 0 kph - 34 m.
    200 kph to 0 kph - 133,9 m.
    Porsche 996 Turbo
    100 kph to 0 kph - 36,1 m.
    200 kph to 0 kph - 144,2 m.
    Ferrari 360 Challenge Stradale
    100 kph to 0 kph - 35,4 m.
    200 kph to 0 kph - 139,8 m.
    Porsche GT3 Mk2 with PCCB
    100 kph to 0 kph - 34 m.
    200 kph to 0 kph - 141,5 m.

    Impressive braking performance!

    NORDSCHLEIFE TRACK TEST
    997 Carrera S
    8 min. 05 sec.
    GT3 Mk1
    8 min. 03 sec.
    Ferrari 360 Modena
    8 min. 09 sec.
    BMW M5 (new model, E60)
    8 min. 13 sec.
    BMW M3 E46
    8 min. 22 sec.
    Mercedes SL 55 AMG
    8 min. 12 sec.
    Aston Martin DB9
    8 min. 16 sec.
    Dodge Viper SRT-10
    8 min. 13 sec.

    Please don't forget that the 997 Carrera S has 355 HP "only".

    KLEINER KURS HOCKENHEIM TRACK TEST
    Porsche 997 Carrera S
    1 min. 14,3 sec.
    Porsche 996 Turbo
    1 min. 14,6 sec.
    Porsche GT3 Mk1
    1 min. 14,9 sec.
    Ferrari 360 Modena
    1 min. 15,1 sec.
    BMW M5 (new model, E60)
    1 min. 16,5 sec.
    BMW M3 E46
    1 min. 17,6 sec.

    Again, not bad for a 355 HP car.

    HANDLING TEST - SLALOM 36 m
    997 Carrera S
    136 kph
    Porsche GT3 RS
    134 kph
    BMW M5 (new model, E60)
    128 kph
    Lamborghini Gallardo
    131 kph
    Lotus Exige (192 HP version)
    133 kph

    And if somebody thinks that the Lotus Elise 111R does it better, think again.
    Slalom 18 m:
    997 Carrera S - 70,9 kph
    Lotus Elise 111R - 69,4 kph

    And a last thing:
    STRAIGHT LINE PERFORMANCE
    997 Carrera S
    0-100 kph - 4.8 sec.
    0-200 kph - 16.0 sec.
    Ferrari 360 Modena
    0-100 kph - 4.7 sec.
    0-200 kph - 16.1 sec.
    Ferrari 360 Challenge Stradale
    0-100 kph - 4.4 sec.
    0-200 kph - 15.5 sec.
    BMW M3 CSL
    0-100 kph - 4.8 sec.
    0-200 kph - 16.1 sec.
    Porsche GT3 Mk1
    0-100 kph - 4.8 sec.
    0-200 kph - 16.1 sec.

    Not bad for a 355 HP car with PSM, etc.

    I know, I know...just numbers. But impressive ones in my opinion.

    Re: Latest SPORT AUTO Supertest (Track) 997 Carrera S

    Quote:
    997 Carrera S with PCCB:
    100 kph to 0 kph - 32,2 m.
    200 kph to 0 kph - 130,7 m.
    Carrera GT:
    100 kph to 0 kph - 34 m.
    200 kph to 0 kph - 133,9 m.



    I don't get it.
    The CGT is lighter, has bigger tires, and the same PCCB. How come the 997S brakes better? Weight distribution?

    Re: Latest SPORT AUTO Supertest (Track) 997 Carrera S

    Quote:
    brunner said:
    Quote:
    997 Carrera S with PCCB:
    100 kph to 0 kph - 32,2 m.
    200 kph to 0 kph - 130,7 m.
    Carrera GT:
    100 kph to 0 kph - 34 m.
    200 kph to 0 kph - 133,9 m.



    I don't get it.
    The CGT is lighter, has bigger tires, and the same PCCB. How come the 997S brakes better? Weight distribution?



    Probably - the rear engined 911 has less tendency for "brake dive" compared to front or mid engined cars - so those rear meats actually have some usefullness .

    Re: Latest SPORT AUTO Supertest (Track) 997 Carrera S

    "And a last thing:
    STRAIGHT LINE PERFORMANCE
    997 Carrera S
    0-100 kph - 4.8 sec.
    0-200 kph - 16.0 sec.
    Ferrari 360 Modena
    0-100 kph - 4.7 sec.
    0-200 kph - 16.1 sec.
    Ferrari 360 Challenge Stradale
    0-100 kph - 4.4 sec.
    0-200 kph - 15.5 sec.
    BMW M3 CSL
    0-100 kph - 4.8 sec.
    0-200 kph - 16.1 sec.
    Porsche GT3 Mk1
    0-100 kph - 4.8 sec.
    0-200 kph - 16.1 sec. "


    Add the new E60 M5
    0-100 kph -4.7 sec.
    0-200 kph -13.9 sec.

    The M5 beats them all to 200 kph - and not too shabby around the track either for a big 4000 lb family sedan even if top speed electronically limited to about 160 mph ( 260 kph) !

    Re: Latest SPORT AUTO Supertest (Track) 997 Carrera S

    cool, thanks for those numbers, man do i wish the USA could get that -20mm suspension and LSD!

    Re: Latest SPORT AUTO Supertest (Track) 997 Carrera S

    Wow really impressive .

    Re: Latest SPORT AUTO Supertest (Track) 997 Carrera S

    Quote:
    MKW said:
    Quote:
    brunner said:
    Quote:
    997 Carrera S with PCCB:
    100 kph to 0 kph - 32,2 m.
    200 kph to 0 kph - 130,7 m.
    Carrera GT:
    100 kph to 0 kph - 34 m.
    200 kph to 0 kph - 133,9 m.



    I don't get it.
    The CGT is lighter, has bigger tires, and the same PCCB. How come the 997S brakes better? Weight distribution?



    Probably - the rear engined 911 has less tendency for "brake dive" compared to front or mid engined cars - so those rear meats actually have some usefullness .



    Hard to explain the braking delta vs 996GT3 Mk2...which is roughly 150 lbs lighter than 997S....perhaps difference btwn PCCB 1.0 (of Gt3) and PCCB 2.0 (of 997S) is another variable here?

    Re: Latest SPORT AUTO Supertest (Track) 997 Carrera S

    Quote:
    MKW said:
    "And a last thing:
    STRAIGHT LINE PERFORMANCE
    997 Carrera S
    0-100 kph - 4.8 sec.
    0-200 kph - 16.0 sec.
    Ferrari 360 Modena
    0-100 kph - 4.7 sec.
    0-200 kph - 16.1 sec.
    Ferrari 360 Challenge Stradale
    0-100 kph - 4.4 sec.
    0-200 kph - 15.5 sec.
    BMW M3 CSL
    0-100 kph - 4.8 sec.
    0-200 kph - 16.1 sec.
    Porsche GT3 Mk1
    0-100 kph - 4.8 sec.
    0-200 kph - 16.1 sec. "


    Add the new E60 M5
    0-100 kph -4.7 sec.
    0-200 kph -13.9 sec.

    The M5 beats them all to 200 kph - and not too shabby around the track either for a big 4000 lb family sedan even if top speed electronically limited to about 160 mph ( 260 kph) !




    Actually, would argue the much-delayed M5 is pathetic....the even porkier SL55 beats it around a track....and SL55 hit US roughly 3 yrs prior to M5's alleged ?Fall'05 US intro date.....and haven't yet heard of 55 engine blowups or brakes fading after hard running....don't know what real-world M5 will show (esp if M3 is any prelude)....and BMW seems to use buggy software just like Merc, so that part is a wash....

    Re: Latest SPORT AUTO Supertest (Track) 997 Carrera S

    Anyone have the straight-line performance of the F430 for comparison? Is it necessary for the sake of fairness for the test to have been conducted by Sport Auto?

    Re: Latest SPORT AUTO Supertest (Track) 997 Carrera S

    Quote:
    RC said:
    Let's play some number games with the latest results from the SPORT AUTO Supertest (track test) with the 997 Carrera S equipped with 20 mm chassis incl. LSD and PCCB brake.

    BRAKING PERFORMANCE
    997 Carrera S with PCCB:
    100 kph to 0 kph - 32,2 m.
    200 kph to 0 kph - 130,7 m.
    Carrera GT:
    100 kph to 0 kph - 34 m.
    200 kph to 0 kph - 133,9 m.
    Porsche 996 Turbo
    100 kph to 0 kph - 36,1 m.
    200 kph to 0 kph - 144,2 m.
    Ferrari 360 Challenge Stradale
    100 kph to 0 kph - 35,4 m.
    200 kph to 0 kph - 139,8 m.
    Porsche GT3 Mk2 with PCCB
    100 kph to 0 kph - 34 m.
    200 kph to 0 kph - 141,5 m.

    M3 CSL
    100 kph to 0 kph - 32,4 m.
    200 kph to 0 kph - 129,7 m.

    Impressive braking performance!

    NORDSCHLEIFE TRACK TEST
    997 Carrera S
    8 min. 05 sec.
    GT3 Mk1
    8 min. 03 sec.
    Ferrari 360 Modena
    8 min. 09 sec.
    BMW M5 (new model, E60)
    8 min. 13 sec.
    BMW M3 E46
    8 min. 22 sec.
    Mercedes SL 55 AMG
    8 min. 12 sec.
    Aston Martin DB9
    8 min. 16 sec.
    Dodge Viper SRT-10
    8 min. 13 sec.
    M3 CSL
    7 min. 50 sec

    Please don't forget that the 997 Carrera S has 355 HP "only".
    AND M3 CSL 6 MORE !!!

    KLEINER KURS HOCKENHEIM TRACK TEST
    Porsche 997 Carrera S
    1 min. 14,3 sec.
    Porsche 996 Turbo
    1 min. 14,6 sec.
    Porsche GT3 Mk1
    1 min. 14,9 sec.
    Ferrari 360 Modena
    1 min. 15,1 sec.
    BMW M5 (new model, E60)
    1 min. 16,5 sec.
    BMW M3 E46
    1 min. 17,6 sec.
    m3 csl
    1 min 13,5 sec

    Again, not bad for a 355 HP car.
    AS ABOVE

    HANDLING TEST - SLALOM 36 m
    997 Carrera S
    136 kph
    Porsche GT3 RS
    134 kph
    BMW M5 (new model, E60)
    128 kph
    Lamborghini Gallardo
    131 kph
    Lotus Exige (192 HP version)
    133 kph
    M3 CSL
    135 kph

    And if somebody thinks that the Lotus Elise 111R does it better, think again.
    Slalom 18 m:
    997 Carrera S - 70,9 kph
    Lotus Elise 111R - 69,4 kph


    And a last thing:
    STRAIGHT LINE PERFORMANCE
    997 Carrera S
    0-100 kph - 4.8 sec.
    0-200 kph - 16.0 sec.
    Ferrari 360 Modena
    0-100 kph - 4.7 sec.
    0-200 kph - 16.1 sec.
    Ferrari 360 Challenge Stradale
    0-100 kph - 4.4 sec.
    0-200 kph - 15.5 sec.
    BMW M3 CSL
    0-100 kph - 4.8 sec.
    0-200 kph - 16.1 sec.
    Porsche GT3 Mk1
    0-100 kph - 4.8 sec.
    0-200 kph - 16.1 sec.

    Not bad for a 355 HP car with PSM, etc.

    I know, I know...just numbers. But impressive ones in my opinion.



    Re: Latest SPORT AUTO Supertest (Track) 997 Carrera S

    ...yes and the CSL's got semislicks. Put those on the 997S with -20mm and they're playing the same game again.

    Please learn how to quote, I really had to search your comments!

    Bye,
    Christian

    Re: Latest SPORT AUTO Supertest (Track) 997 Carrera S

    what was the test conditions

    Re: Latest SPORT AUTO Supertest (Track) 997 Carrera S

    THX Eliot for your comment!

    It was a joke to drive the M3 CSL with semislicks and the GT3 RS not!

    I think the better breaking performance is bacause the next Michelin Pilot Sport Generation. Maybe

    Re: Latest SPORT AUTO Supertest (Track) 997 Carrera S

    No kidding, the CSL has semi-slick Michelin Pilot Cups!! :P
    Even its braking in reality is not the one reported above, I have a magazine test comparison of the 997S vs the M3-CSL but with normal street tires, and the 997S without -20mm nor PCCBs out braked and out acceleratied the CSL thought the gears and whole kph range. It had no timed track laps to compare but you can get an idea of what would happen if you took the Michelin Cups off the CSL

    Re: Latest SPORT AUTO Supertest (Track) 997 Carrera S

    Have never read such an enthusiastic test from H.v.S., never! Outstanding results in every particular field.
    Thanks god tht I ordered this set up and now I#m looking forward to receiving my baby next mounth

    Re: Latest SPORT AUTO Supertest (Track) 997 Carrera S

    Great results. Just surprised at the 0-60 in light of some of the numbers reported by other sources. Either the other mags got it wrong, or maybe this 997S was fairly new...

    Re: Latest SPORT AUTO Supertest (Track) 997 Carrera S

    Quote:
    Tom said:
    Have never read such an enthusiastic test from H.v.S., never! Outstanding results in every particular field.
    Thanks god tht I ordered this set up and now I#m looking forward to receiving my baby next mounth



    Interesting, could you mention some of his comments or the things he touched on about the -20mm 997S for those of us that are germanicly-challenged?

    Re: Latest SPORT AUTO Supertest (Track) 997 Carrera S

    Dear Carlos, brief summary of the article:
    As introduction: PASM is just a compromise to satisfy the whole range of Porsche customers. The real set up for a sports car is the -20mm chassis. In Hockenheim lap time is fantastic 1,3 sec quicker! Big responsibility for this excellent performance has the limited slip differential.
    Quicker lap time is one aspect, gain of delight to drive the car is another one.H.v.S. literally: No Porsche before inspired in respect of dynamics, neutrality and safety of ride.Big role play the Michelin tyres in 'N1' specification. These tyres are all-rounder. Brilliant grip in dry condition and nearly no visible attrition after testing in Hockenheim and Nürburgring. And in the wet as good as in the dry! Last not least he praised the engine and transmission. Quote: Together with the 6 gear transmission and perfect clutch the engine burns down a firework which cannot be more impressive and lasting.uqte
    The engine has nearly the character of a racing engine.And the sound is similar to the aircooled ones.
    H.v.S.'s conclusion: The Carrera with sports chassis opens the window to motorsport in impressiv and inspiring way. The adorable dynamic of the car let forget that the ride is a bit more harsh than the standard one - but has still got sufficient comfort.The terrific engine registers with the fascinated crew as never before!

    Re: Latest SPORT AUTO Supertest (Track) 997 Carrera S

    Quote:
    VKSF said:
    Actually, would argue the much-delayed M5 is pathetic....the even porkier SL55 beats it around a track....and SL55 hit US roughly 3 yrs prior to M5's alleged ?Fall'05 US intro date.....and haven't yet heard of 55 engine blowups or brakes fading after hard running....don't know what real-world M5 will show (esp if M3 is any prelude)....and BMW seems to use buggy software just like Merc, so that part is a wash....



    The AMG philosophy reminds me of "American-iron" rolling thunder like Viper and Corvette down to the thumpa thumpa exhaust , low end grunt and the way they get good course times : result of tip toeing around curves and making up for it in the straights.
    I prefer the BMW E60 M5's "Ferrari 360/ Porsche GT3" -like engineering of high rpms and handling.
    Each reflects / respects it's company's way of doing things as it should be and the consumer has more choices for what rings his bell - grunt or rpms. That's a good thing for builder and buyer .
    When my Sepang Bronze Touring arrives, I'll see what Dinan has up their sleeves . It's be a nice daily driver , with the 997 Turbo/DSG for weekends. After 34 years , "hasta la bye-bye" clutch pedals .

    Re: Latest SPORT AUTO Supertest (Track) 997 Carrera S

    it might be perfect for a track day or weekend drive but almost impossible to live with the -20mm in everyday basis and crappy roads

    Re: Latest SPORT AUTO Supertest (Track) 997 Carrera S

    Quote:
    Tom said:
    Dear Carlos, brief summary of the article:
    As introduction: PASM is just a compromise to satisfy the whole range of Porsche customers. The real set up for a sports car is the -20mm chassis. In Hockenheim lap time is fantastic 1,3 sec quicker! Big responsibility for this excellent performance has the limited slip differential.
    Quicker lap time is one aspect, gain of delight to drive the car is another one.H.v.S. literally: No Porsche before inspired in respect of dynamics, neutrality and safety of ride.Big role play the Michelin tyres in 'N1' specification. These tyres are all-rounder. Brilliant grip in dry condition and nearly no visible attrition after testing in Hockenheim and Nürburgring. And in the wet as good as in the dry! Last not least he praised the engine and transmission. Quote: Together with the 6 gear transmission and perfect clutch the engine burns down a firework which cannot be more impressive and lasting.uqte
    The engine has nearly the character of a racing engine.And the sound is similar to the aircooled ones.
    H.v.S.'s conclusion: The Carrera with sports chassis opens the window to motorsport in impressiv and inspiring way. The adorable dynamic of the car let forget that the ride is a bit more harsh than the standard one - but has still got sufficient comfort.The terrific engine registers with the fascinated crew as never before!



    Thanks a lot Tom!

    Re: Latest SPORT AUTO Supertest (Track) 997 Carrera S

    Quote:
    Dilinger said:
    it might be perfect for a track day or weekend drive but almost impossible to live with the -20mm in everyday basis and crappy roads



    Speak for your self, for starters those that have tried it say its similar to PASM in sport mode, I have tried PASM in sport mode and its perfectly fine for everyday basis, its a sportcar, even on crappy roads I would use Sport Mode all the time on the PASM. -20mm is perfect for such a car and its use. Maybe its becasue I'm 32 and I drive sportquads and sportbikes and I'm used to harsh rides, etc. but to each his own. Its like the GT3, for some people the GT3 is perfect for everyday driving and roads. PASM is a compromise but not for everybody, i.e. its not the type of roads or use that dictates which suspension is more appropriate, its the driver.

    Re: Latest SPORT AUTO Supertest (Track) 997 Carrera S

    i speak for myself Carlos,
    but it is actually an important factor in which roads you are driving. Have you ever visited Greece?If not come by and you know what i m talking about,a car can even dissapear in a hole in the middle of the road. Roads are terribler here.
    If i lived in Germany i would for sure take the -20mm
    As a have the PASM i can tell you 2 things:

    PASM in SPORT is not perfect for everyday use.Most of the members here will agree that the SPORT setting in PASM is too hard for everyday driving and no confort at all.Thats why most of them use the normal setting.I know now, that you will say its a matter of the driver and personal preference.
    BUT for what its worth, i love stiff suspension settings and i enjoy a harsh ride.Despite this i rarely use the sport setting because the roads here are so crappy than not only my back will break but the car will also fall apart after a year will all those holes in the street and the cockpit will become TOO noisy.

    Moreover, although irrelevant in this subject in some tight curves i enjoy the progressiveness of the soft tuned suspension due to the feedback that it gives the driver

    Re: Latest SPORT AUTO Supertest (Track) 997 Carrera S

    Haven't been to greece, but I have been to a Greek Restaurant in London in my college years were I got in a big "bar fight" (Greek & Spanish guys vs Turkish guys) that the police had to break up with dogs and everything...long story

    Greek roads?

    Re: Latest SPORT AUTO Supertest (Track) 997 Carrera S

    Carlos i swear sometime ago a simular pic was in a Greek newspaper!! and it was true

    we have some good roads but when they want to fix a small part or hole they always make it with no allingment with the existing road.Every 10 meters the car bumps.

    I can really tell you that even the precautions i take, my car's cockpit has alredy started to tickle

    Re: Latest SPORT AUTO Supertest (Track) 997 Carrera S

    Quote:
    RC said:

    HANDLING TEST - SLALOM 36 m
    997 Carrera S
    136 kph
    Porsche GT3 RS
    134 kph
    BMW M5 (new model, E60)
    128 kph
    Lamborghini Gallardo
    131 kph
    Lotus Exige (192 HP version)
    133 kph

    And if somebody thinks that the Lotus Elise 111R does it better, think again.
    Slalom 18 m:
    997 Carrera S - 70,9 kph
    Lotus Elise 111R - 69,4 kph





    How can the 997 S handle better than a GT3 RS?! That staggers me...

    Everybody has bad roads

    I've driven in Greece, Spain, Turkey, Italy, France, UK, USA and you can always find bad roads. Everybody in Chicago thinks their roads are terrible. Everybody in LA thinks their roads are terrible.

    The point is how YOU percieve them - not the reality. When I test drove the 997S, deliberately on some of the worst roads in Chicago, I thought the standard setting on PASM was way, way too soft, and the "sport" setting about right for everyday driving. I actually think for track work you could do with a stiffer setup than "sport" in PASM.

    Dilinger you would feel right at home here: the roads are as bad as the ones I remember from pre Olympic games Athens about 10 years ago...

    How can the 997 S handle better than a GT3 RS?

    One word: tires. Better tire technology.

    If there's any meaningful transfer of technology from F1 it's in the makeup and performance of tires.

    That's why the 997S out slalom's the 996 GT3RS

    Re: How can the 997 S handle better than a GT3 RS?

    Quote:
    Le Chef said:
    One word: tires. Better tire technology.

    If there's any meaningful transfer of technology from F1 it's in the makeup and performance of tires.

    That's why the 997S out slalom's the 996 GT3RS



    Also - sometimes a stiffer suspension is NOT faster around a given course because it will cause the car to stutter over bumps and throw it off line. You'll frequently read comments in the English car mags where they're often testing on bumping roads that some cars with a slightly softer set up are actually quicker over a given course because the tires are staying in better contact with the road and likely giving the driver more confidence as well.

    Re: How can the 997 S handle better than a GT3 RS?

    It's true that tyres have come a long way, and those Michelin PS2 really are awesome, but doesn't the GT3 RS use a R compound tyre with even more grip?
    Besides that, in the Evo car of the year 2005, which the 997 S won, they compared corner speeds and the GT3 RS was just a bit faster.
    Perhaps it isn't made for slalom...

     
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