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    Re: OFFICIAL: New 911 GT3 (991)

    Super Darius:
    RC:
     

    Also remember, there is a GT3 RS coming... Smiley

    when?

    damn...SmileySmiley

    + 1  When ?  SmileySmiley


    --

     997.2 C2S, PDK, -20mm


    Re: OFFICIAL: New 911 GT3 (991)

    Gnil:
    Super Darius:
    RC:
     

    Also remember, there is a GT3 RS coming... Smiley

    when?

    damn...SmileySmiley

    + 1  When ?  SmileySmiley

    Let's Porsche deliver the 991 GT3 first...! :p


    Re: OFFICIAL: New 911 GT3 (991)

    If you're impatient to wait for your GT3 - here's a lovely advert for an alternative....

    OMG

     


    --

    991 (what a car!) XC90 - Black/Black 2 kids, 1 dog


    Re: OFFICIAL: New 911 GT3 (991)

    bridggar:

    If you're impatient to wait for your GT3 - here's a lovely advert for an alternative....

    OMG

     

    Smiley SmileySmiley  Smiley  I have no words....Smiley


    --

    Suzy

     


    Re: OFFICIAL: New 911 GT3 (991)

    The local pimp would love that car angry

    "..........Yes it had the cam belt done."


    --

    "Form follows function"


    Re: OFFICIAL: New 911 GT3 (991)

    That is an abomination


    --

    Gen II Cayman S


    Re: OFFICIAL: New 911 GT3 (991)

    Super Darius:
    RC:
     

    Also remember, there is a GT3 RS coming... Smiley

    when?

    damn...SmileySmiley

    I was contacted by my OPC early this week who told me that they will have details on the new RS early next year...


    Re: OFFICIAL: New 911 GT3 (991)

    boytronic:
    Super Darius:
    RC:
     

    Also remember, there is a GT3 RS coming... Smiley

    when?

    damn...SmileySmiley

    I was contacted by my OPC early this week who told me that they will have details on the new RS early next year...

    thnaks...but i hope to know something before Christmas....i hope.Smiley


    --

    997TT RS Tuning stage II(sold),2011 Cayenne Turbo(sold),waiting 991 GT3 RS


    Re: OFFICIAL: New 911 GT3 (991)

    SuzyF:
    bridggar:

    If you're impatient to wait for your GT3 - here's a lovely advert for an alternative....

    OMG

     

    Smiley SmileySmiley  Smiley  I have no words....Smiley

    Oh boy.... Smiley


    --


    Re: OFFICIAL: New 911 GT3 (991)

    moo:
    SuzyF:

    I fully agree with everything you say and probably most of the people that buy the car will indeed never or rarely use its full potential. But what surprised my most of all and what no one in a review talks about, is the fact the the car is so easy and pleasant to drive at normal speeds and in citytraffic.

     

    like a BMW M5. feels very similar, just 250kg heavier.


     

     

    Are you comparing the drive feel of a BMW M5 to a 991 turbo Smiley  If so, that would be rather strange...


    Re: OFFICIAL: New 911 GT3 (991)

    moo:

    you should test-drive the M5. those who like the turbo typically also like the M5. the latter even looks much better than the aero-beetle. and it has real back seats, big trunk to keep the DD-avability fraction happy, and it has more comfy gadgets. turbo S sounds a bit better though. only a bit.

    p

    You indeed compared these cars... I have to tell you: you have very special views of high-performance cars... Not only you write things like that the F458 "turns in like no other car I know" (very strange as (i) the steering is overly synthetic compared to a GT3/GT2 or even the McLaren and (ii) the F458 has not the best handling as is documented widely by now). Now you also write that the M5 feels like a 991 turbo S... Honestly, typically I would assume you just speculate and have no access to these cars ("school boy problem" as it is usually called in Internet forums). As you posted pictures of a black F458 (with Austrian plates though) I assume you own the car indeed. Then it might be the case that you just don't have the experience to appropriately describe/compare the qualities of these cars. Sorry for the harsh words Smiley This is a bit ridiculous. Smiley I think it is important to state these concerns in order to prevent some other readers from drawing wrong conclusions about these cars...


    Re: OFFICIAL: New 911 GT3 (991)

    RC:
    moo:

    you should test-drive the M5. those who like the turbo typically also like the M5. the latter even looks much better than the aero-beetle. and it has real back seats, big trunk to keep the DD-avability fraction happy, and it has more comfy gadgets. turbo S sounds a bit better though. only a bit.

    p

    I hate the M5 and I think I said this a thousand times on the forum. The M5 and the 991 Turbo S have nothing in common, absolutely zero. Not sure why you make this comparison over and over again and frankly said, I'm starting to feel annoyed and this is a territory you don't want to enter. 

    You have never driven a 991 Turbo S (you claimed otherwise a couple of days ago), this is for sure, otherwise you wouldn't make these claims. Unless of course you have perception issues, which would explain why being seen and heard in your car seems to be more important to you than actually enjoying the capabilities of your car. I'm not even sure anymore you own a 458 because I know a couple of 458 drivers and they all drive their cars quite fast (look at Onur in the forum or even CR, the owner of this site who owns a 458 Spider and has done almost 50k km in it and he added Trofeo tires to the car because it wasn't fast enough for him...on the street). 

    Maybe you should replace David Saltzberg as a consultant for The Big Bang Theory. You are funny. Smiley

    SmileySmileySmiley


    Re: OFFICIAL: New 911 GT3 (991)

    Sorry but I really don't consider an M5 on the 991 GT3 section, no offense. 

    Back ON-topic:

    Who's next in line to get their 991 GT3? 

    According to my Porsche dealer I should get somewhere next month. (If only this is trueangel) He confirmed me that my car was getting in production end of october. 

    Does somebody else have an update on their car?

     


    --

    - HS (Belgium)  -  '14 Porsche 991 GT3 (oct build) - '06 BMW 335I Coupe  


    Re: OFFICIAL: New 911 GT3 (991)

    I had a Dec.13th production date and last week was told it will be built mid Jan 2014. Delays are running 4-6 weeks. Information from other Porsche sites claim delays related to engine issues as well.


    Re: OFFICIAL: New 911 GT3 (991)

    My car (1st at my UK dealer) finally got a date today. Factory completion due 27th November. 


    Re: OFFICIAL: New 911 GT3 (991)

    Great news GT3ZZZ. I imagine you should then recieve your car around Xmas day!


    Re: OFFICIAL: New 911 GT3 (991)

    GT3ZZZ:

    My car (1st at my UK dealer) finally got a date today. Factory completion due 27th November. 

    Nice! Smiley 

    Hopefully this time no more delays! 


    --

    - HS (Belgium)  -  '14 Porsche 991 GT3 (oct build) - '06 BMW 335I Coupe  


    Re: OFFICIAL: New 911 GT3 (991)

    KresoF1:

    Christian,

    While I agree with you most of the time I have little bit different view on 991 GT3 Supertest results and comments from HvS. Even I exchanged few emails with my P source and told him that car did not reach Porsche claims in few areas(BTW, not only Porsche but, also claims from few well respected members of car press like Chris Harris or Steve Suttcliff)... Where you will ask?

    -for the first time in recent Porsche history Turbo(S) is faster on the track then GT3. Personally, I do not have any problem with that. I would be pretty pissed if my 200K € car is slower on the track then similar shape 150K € model(no matter how sporty it is).

    -second thing is pretty tricky one and has to do more with subjective "feeling" how sportscar should feel in its limit. SA clearly claim(and I do belive them!) that 991 GT3 is pretty tricky to drive on the limit. Remember what CH and SS claimed? That car is maybe even "tamed" in comparison to 997.2 GT3 models and that "everybody" car drive it fast. So, either SA stuff is wrong(and they are not) or CH and SS simply drove 991 GT3 way too slow and it did not show that tricky behaviour tendeny on its limit.

    -real "feel"... It is most subjective thing in sportscar perception and Porsche has made an decision to give pretty different overall "feel" to 991 Turbo S and 991 GT3. What is right and what is wrong. Both, I guess but, people will here argue most.

    ++++++++++++++++++++

    Just look at the power and torque chart of the GT3 vs Turbo S.  If I am correct, the latter makes at low to mid-range more than twice more torque than the GT3 and almost twice the HP!

    Depending on the track, no wonder the GT3 stands no chance vs the Turbo S.

    Another comparison I find interesting is the chart of the GT3 vs that of the Carrera S engine.  Below about 5,500 RPM the GT3 pulls not more HP than the Carrera S engine and never more torque, regardless of engine speed.

     


    Re: OFFICIAL: New 911 GT3 (991)

    PBS2010:
    KresoF1:

    Christian,

    While I agree with you most of the time I have little bit different view on 991 GT3 Supertest results and comments from HvS. Even I exchanged few emails with my P source and told him that car did not reach Porsche claims in few areas(BTW, not only Porsche but, also claims from few well respected members of car press like Chris Harris or Steve Suttcliff)... Where you will ask?

    -for the first time in recent Porsche history Turbo(S) is faster on the track then GT3. Personally, I do not have any problem with that. I would be pretty pissed if my 200K € car is slower on the track then similar shape 150K € model(no matter how sporty it is).

    -second thing is pretty tricky one and has to do more with subjective "feeling" how sportscar should feel in its limit. SA clearly claim(and I do belive them!) that 991 GT3 is pretty tricky to drive on the limit. Remember what CH and SS claimed? That car is maybe even "tamed" in comparison to 997.2 GT3 models and that "everybody" car drive it fast. So, either SA stuff is wrong(and they are not) or CH and SS simply drove 991 GT3 way too slow and it did not show that tricky behaviour tendeny on its limit.

    -real "feel"... It is most subjective thing in sportscar perception and Porsche has made an decision to give pretty different overall "feel" to 991 Turbo S and 991 GT3. What is right and what is wrong. Both, I guess but, people will here argue most.

    ++++++++++++++++++++

    Just look at the power and torque chart of the GT3 vs Turbo S.  If I am correct, the latter makes at low to mid-range more than twice more torque than the GT3 and almost twice the HP!

    Depending on the track, no wonder the GT3 stands no chance vs the Turbo S.

    Another comparison I find interesting is the chart of the GT3 vs that of the Carrera S engine.  Below about 5,500 RPM the GT3 pulls not more HP than the Carrera S engine and never more torque, regardless of engine speed.

     

    Exactly as expected... the turbo S is a torque monster. and gt3 a highly  optimised rev. monster.  i ordered a gt3 this time instead of a turbo s, partly because i never liked the additional weight in my 2011 turbo s, although maybe the 991 version will erase driver perception of that noticeable issue, and partly gt3 seems like more of a breakthrough vs. the last one, and torque shredding is less appealing to me as I ageSmiley


    Re: OFFICIAL: New 911 GT3 (991)

    Another win for the GT3


    Re: OFFICIAL: New 911 GT3 (991)

    PBS2010:
    KresoF1:

    Christian,

    While I agree with you most of the time I have little bit different view on 991 GT3 Supertest results and comments from HvS. Even I exchanged few emails with my P source and told him that car did not reach Porsche claims in few areas(BTW, not only Porsche but, also claims from few well respected members of car press like Chris Harris or Steve Suttcliff)... Where you will ask?

    -for the first time in recent Porsche history Turbo(S) is faster on the track then GT3. Personally, I do not have any problem with that. I would be pretty pissed if my 200K € car is slower on the track then similar shape 150K € model(no matter how sporty it is).

    -second thing is pretty tricky one and has to do more with subjective "feeling" how sportscar should feel in its limit. SA clearly claim(and I do belive them!) that 991 GT3 is pretty tricky to drive on the limit. Remember what CH and SS claimed? That car is maybe even "tamed" in comparison to 997.2 GT3 models and that "everybody" car drive it fast. So, either SA stuff is wrong(and they are not) or CH and SS simply drove 991 GT3 way too slow and it did not show that tricky behaviour tendeny on its limit.

    -real "feel"... It is most subjective thing in sportscar perception and Porsche has made an decision to give pretty different overall "feel" to 991 Turbo S and 991 GT3. What is right and what is wrong. Both, I guess but, people will here argue most.

    ++++++++++++++++++++

    Just look at the power and torque chart of the GT3 vs Turbo S.  If I am correct, the latter makes at low to mid-range more than twice more torque than the GT3 and almost twice the HP!

    Depending on the track, no wonder the GT3 stands no chance vs the Turbo S.

    Another comparison I find interesting is the chart of the GT3 vs that of the Carrera S engine.  Below about 5,500 RPM the GT3 pulls not more HP than the Carrera S engine and never more torque, regardless of engine speed.

     

    With close ratio 7 speed gearbox and 9k redline, the GT3 will rarely be below 7k rpm if well driven on a track (and never below 6k).  Low and mid range torque are irrelevant in such a setting.


    --

    73 Carrera RS 2.7 Carbon Fiber replica (1,890 lbs), 06 EVO9 with track mods. Former: 73 911S, Two 951S's, 996 C2, 993 C2, 98 Ferrari 550


    Re: OFFICIAL: New 911 GT3 (991)

    just looking at the cover above - what is astonishing that the Cayman is part in almost on every comparison ! Price-value is very very good !  


    Re: OFFICIAL: New 911 GT3 (991)

    In this comparison they placed the GT86 above the Cayman yes


    --

    "Form follows function"


    Re: OFFICIAL: New 911 GT3 (991)

    The Lap times, Ranking and Verdict.

    I don't rely too much on magazines myself (...unless my favourite car wins ).

    autocar 002.jpgautocar 001.jpgautocar.jpg


    --

    "Form follows function"


    Re: OFFICIAL: New 911 GT3 (991)

    In the votes by ALL the drivers, the GT3 was either 1st or 2nd...that's petty conclusive. However is don't see any rationale in how they choose the test subjects, they choose cars that have nothing to do with each other in terms of being a "drivers car"yes


    --


    Re: OFFICIAL: New 911 GT3 (991)

     

    With close ratio 7 speed gearbox and 9k redline, the GT3 will rarely be below 7k rpm if well driven on a track (and never below 6k).  Low and mid range torque are irrelevant in such a setting.

    ++++++++++++++++++++++++++

     

    Your comment ought to be nuanced on the following points:

    • close ratio 7 speed gearbox”:  this is primarily company BS. The box is still not a close-ratio at all.  What is true is that the ratios are closer than on the other, regular Porsches, but they are not close ratios at all.  The 7th is still overdrive by large standards.  Below is a table of the km/h achieved from 5,000rpm on the last five gears.  It speaks for itself.  How can one say that a 7-gear box that permits reaching 200km/h at 8,250rpm (top HP engine speed), in fourth gear … with 3 more gears to go! Is a close-ratio 7-gear box?  How often do you need to take corners well above 200km/h and how useful is it to have 3 more gears to work on these types of corners?  On a track?  On the road?

     

    RPM

    7th gear

    (km/h)

    6th gear

    (km/h)

    5th gear

    (km/h)

    4th gear

    (km/h)

    3rd gear

    (km/h)

    5 000

    190,91

    167,05

    144,47

    119,67

    93,23

    5 250

    200,45

    175,40

    151,70

    125,66

    97,90

    5 500

    210,00

    183,75

    158,92

    131,64

    102,56

    5 750

    219,55

    192,10

    166,14

    137,63

    107,22

    6 000

    229,09

    200,45

    173,37

    143,61

    111,88

    6 250

    238,64

    208,81

    180,59

    149,59

    116,54

    6 500

    248,18

    217,16

    187,81

    155,58

    121,21

    6 750

    257,73

    225,51

    195,04

    161,56

    125,87

    7 000

    267,27

    233,86

    202,26

    167,54

    130,53

    7 250

    276,82

    242,22

    209,48

    173,53

    135,19

    7 500

    286,36

    250,57

    216,71

    179,51

    139,85

    7 750

    295,91

    258,92

    223,93

    185,50

    144,51

    8 000

    305,45

    267,27

    231,15

    191,48

    149,18

    8 250

    315,00

    275,63

    238,38

    197,46

    153,84

    8 500

    324,55

    283,98

    245,60

    203,45

    158,50

    8 750

    334,09

    292,33

    252,83

    209,43

    163,16

    9 000

    343,64

    300,68

    260,05

    215,41

    167,82

     

    • 9k redline”:  again, company BS, probably to have something to say relative the 458 which indeed has top HP and limiter at 9,000.  Peak HP on the GT3 is achieved 750rpm earlier.  The rest may be useful on a track but useless on a road except when you may want to hear the engine screaming, which may only happen from time to time.  The GT3 is a road car primarily and for people who will go to the track with it, via public roads and back.  So my point is that on usual road conditions, the so-called 9,000 redline adds nothing except the nuisance of a lot of noise and the low torque;  also, on the road these engine specs add close to nothing relative to the regular Carrera
    • the GT3 will rarely be below 7k rpm if well driven on a track (and never below 6k)”: watching the various videos posted and whose links are on this forum, it does not seem to be the case always.  And on a public road, this will almost always impossible.

    My bottom line is that the gearing on even the sportier Porsches is way too tall.

    All comments welcome.


    Re: OFFICIAL: New 911 GT3 (991)

    Carlos from Spain:

    In the votes by ALL the drivers, the GT3 was either 1st or 2nd...that's petty conclusive. However is don't see any rationale in how they choose the test subjects, they choose cars that have nothing to do with each other in terms of being a "drivers car"yes

           If you read the whole article they did the direct comparisons in sub-groups, before comparing across:

    Ford vs Toyota

    Ariel vs Radical

    Cayman vs Jaguar vs A45

    GT3 vs F12 vs Aston Martin

    The GT3 did very well (for its price especially), and in this context a F12  owner might be tempted to add the Porsche to his garage. But I wouldn't think this person would get the GT3 instead of this imperious Ferrari.


    --

    "Form follows function"


    Re: OFFICIAL: New 911 GT3 (991)

    reginos:
    Carlos from Spain:

    In the votes by ALL the drivers, the GT3 was either 1st or 2nd...that's petty conclusive. However is don't see any rationale in how they choose the test subjects, they choose cars that have nothing to do with each other in terms of being a "drivers car"yes

           If you read the whole article they did the direct comparisons in sub-groups, before comparing across:

    Ford vs Toyota

    Ariel vs Radical

    Cayman vs Jaguar vs A45

    GT3 vs F12 vs Aston Martin

    The GT3 did very well (for its price especially), and in this context a F12  owner might be tempted to add the Porsche to his garage. But I wouldn't think this person would get the GT3 instead of this imperious Ferrari.

    The problem is: if you have GT Porsches and an F12 you might end up not using the F12 because the GTs are more fun to drive. This is at least my experience when I tried it last (GT2 and 599GTB)… I feel that people who like GT Porsches don't like mid-engined heavy Ferraris so much...


    Re: OFFICIAL: New 911 GT3 (991)

    reginos:

    The Lap times, Ranking and Verdict.

    I don't rely too much on magazines myself (...unless my favourite car wins ).


    What a shame that they could not record a time for the new Catherham 620R. Would have been very interesting IMO. Smiley


    --

    The secret of life is to admire without desiring.


    Re: OFFICIAL: New 911 GT3 (991)

    MKSGR:
    reginos:
    Carlos from Spain:

    In the votes by ALL the drivers, the GT3 was either 1st or 2nd...that's petty conclusive. However is don't see any rationale in how they choose the test subjects, they choose cars that have nothing to do with each other in terms of being a "drivers car"yes

           If you read the whole article they did the direct comparisons in sub-groups, before comparing across:

    Ford vs Toyota

    Ariel vs Radical

    Cayman vs Jaguar vs A45

    GT3 vs F12 vs Aston Martin

    The GT3 did very well (for its price especially), and in this context a F12  owner might be tempted to add the Porsche to his garage. But I wouldn't think this person would get the GT3 instead of this imperious Ferrari.

    The problem is: if you have GT Porsches and an F12 you might end up not using the F12 because the GTs are more fun to drive. This is at least my experience when I tried it last (GT2 and 599GTB)… I feel that people who like GT Porsches don't like mid-engined heavy Ferraris so much...

    Was there any GTB advantage on long trips in terms of wet road stability, cruising and driver fatigue factor?


    --

    "Form follows function"


     
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