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    Re: Tesla

    CGX car nut:
    Leawood911:
    CGX car nut:

    Tesla’s new 4680 structural battery pack isn’t just unserviceable but it is also nearly impossible to breakdown to its basic components to recycle.  Evidently Tesla doesn’t plan on selling this product in regions, like the EU, that have product recyclable standards. 

    Nice to see you keeping up with the teardown. Interesting assumption on your part that repairability and recycling are the same. Perhaps you are jumping to conclusions.  Btw it must be hard to ignore all the praise related to the engineering from the leading experts.  My guess is you and I see a totally different reality. Which is cool. Enjoy. 

    Perhaps you should read more about the EU regulations on ELV before commenting.  Focus on the sections on ease of disassembly as a start. https://environment.ec.europa.eu/topics/waste-and-recycling/end-life-vehicles_en

    Has nothing to do with your guess that the 4680 batteries can’t be recycled.  Based on your previous post you still have not grasped statistics and how they can be manipulated.  You somehow link a guy leaving Tesla in good standing with autopilot crashes.  Frigging hopeless optimism is outstanding. 
    I don’t know why I bothered to post here.  You guys are welcome to your FUD.  It is really old news and can’t possibly give you much pleasure. 


    Re: Tesla

    Leawood911:
    CGX car nut:
    Leawood911:
    CGX car nut:

    Tesla’s new 4680 structural battery pack isn’t just unserviceable but it is also nearly impossible to breakdown to its basic components to recycle.  Evidently Tesla doesn’t plan on selling this product in regions, like the EU, that have product recyclable standards. 

    Nice to see you keeping up with the teardown. Interesting assumption on your part that repairability and recycling are the same. Perhaps you are jumping to conclusions.  Btw it must be hard to ignore all the praise related to the engineering from the leading experts.  My guess is you and I see a totally different reality. Which is cool. Enjoy. 

    Perhaps you should read more about the EU regulations on ELV before commenting.  Focus on the sections on ease of disassembly as a start. https://environment.ec.europa.eu/topics/waste-and-recycling/end-life-vehicles_en

    Has nothing to do with your guess that the 4680 batteries can’t be recycled.  Based on your previous post you still have not grasped statistics and how they can be manipulated.  You somehow link a guy leaving Tesla in good standing with autopilot crashes.  Frigging hopeless optimism is outstanding. 
    I don’t know why I bothered to post here.  You guys are welcome to your FUD.  It is really old news and can’t possibly give you much pleasure. 

    Finally one agrees with something you posted about why you even post here.  However, spend a bit of time thinking before you post about FUD.  That video proves that the battery pack isn’t easily disassembled for recycling beyond grinding the pack into pulp of multiple materials which somehow need to separated into the base materials. This is not the recyclability of an individual 4680 cell. 


    Re: Tesla

    Pilot:

    Who else thinks that all this green climate s**t will hurt our planet more in the end?

     

    Because it's all a lie to start off with. There is no proof. Zero scientific proof.

    Whatever is being called 'scientific' is just numbers being manipulated to fit a certain narrative.

    First rule of statistics, numbers don't lie, people do. Second rule of statistics, any set of numbers can be made to represent 2 opposite views. 


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    Re: Tesla

    FWrNeQZXEAM6Hht.png

     

    While we on the subject of Tesla's 'greatest invention', the 4680 battery.

    It would seems it barely improved anything, if at all, for charging. 

    It starts off super nice at 'close to' 250kW, but that speed quickly disappeared, dropping to under 100kW by 45% SoC. There is barely any area under the curve after that point.

    Just about any modern EV right now can maintain over 100kW charging till about 70% SoC. They don't hit a really high peak kW like Tesla's 250kW just for advertisement, most of them can only take advantage of 150kW plugs, but they all can maximize the amount of energy coming in. Tesla has some serious catching up to do.

    I can already predict some Tesla fanboy will mentione that just do quick charge from almost empty to 50%, as that only takes 12-13 mins, and repeat and rinse for the rest of the road trip. Cool, but that would really negates the greatest Tesla advantage of them all, better range on paper. 

    Can't have it both ways. 

     


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    Re: Tesla

    Whoopsy:
    Pilot:

    Who else thinks that all this green climate s**t will hurt our planet more in the end?

     

    Because it's all a lie to start off with. There is no proof. Zero scientific proof.

    Whatever is being called 'scientific' is just numbers being manipulated to fit a certain narrative.

    First rule of statistics, numbers don't lie, people do. Second rule of statistics, any set of numbers can be made to represent 2 opposite views. 

    I'm with you Whoopsy. What do you think will stop this madness that we see around the world? It looks like our leaders are no leaders at all.


    --

    If I don't fly, I drive my .:RS :)


    Re: Tesla

    This should bring a tear of joy to a poster or two here.  Panasonic investment for Tesla made in their backyard. 
     

    Panasonic to build battery cell factory in Kansas

    Jul 14, 2022 - 03:02 pm

    Panasonic will probably build its new US battery factory, where the new 4680 cells for Tesla are to be produced, in Kansas. It is clear that Panasonic wants to build a battery factory there and that the funding application has already been approved – only which cells are to be built there is not yet specified by the Japanese company.

    As Panasonic and the economic development authority of the US state officially announce, the battery manufacturer has identified a plot of land in De Soto for the construction of the factory and the state of Kansas has approved a state incentive application submitted by Panasonic. Panasonic’s board of directors, however, still has to approve the project. Panasonic is not yet commenting on the timeline or production capacity.

    De Soto is located just west of Kansas City on the Kansas River. Giga Texas in Austin, where Tesla will initially assemble the 4680 cells, is about 700 miles or 1,130 kilometres further south.

    The factory is expected to create up to 4,000 new jobs and result in an investment of up to 4 billion US dollars (currently around four billion euros). However, the fact that the 4680 cells for Tesla are to be produced in the new factory is not mentioned in the official communications. There is only general mention of a “US-based EV Battery Facility“.

    However, the plans in Kansas fit with Panasonic’s previous announcements: series production of the new cells is to start in Japan in March 2023 and then be relocated to North America. The first sample cells from the pre-series production have already been delivered to Tesla.

    “With the increased electrification of the automotive market, expanding battery production in the U.S. is critical to help meet demand,” said Kazuo Tadanobu, President, CEO of Panasonic Energy. “Given our leading technology and depth of experience, we aim to continue driving growth of the lithium-ion battery industry and accelerating towards a net-zero emissions future.”

    “This project will transform the Kansas economy, creating high-quality, high-tech jobs while bringing a new industry to the state that will forge a more sustainable future,” said Governor Laura Kelly. “This is a significant milestone for Kansas that will drive economic growth and development.”

    Meanwhile, Reuters reports, citing statements by Panasonic Energy CTO Shoichiro Watanabe, that the battery maker plans to increase the energy density of its cells by 20 per cent by 2030. This will be made possible by a new mixture of electrolyte additives that will allow cells to be operated at a higher voltage without affecting the performance of the batteries. In addition, Panasonic is working on replacing more graphite with silicon-based materials.

    panasonic.com (PDF), kansascommerce.gov (both Kansas), reuters.com (Watanabe statement)


    Re: Tesla

    Pilot:
    Whoopsy:
    Pilot:

    Who else thinks that all this green climate s**t will hurt our planet more in the end?

     

    Because it's all a lie to start off with. There is no proof. Zero scientific proof.

    Whatever is being called 'scientific' is just numbers being manipulated to fit a certain narrative.

    First rule of statistics, numbers don't lie, people do. Second rule of statistics, any set of numbers can be made to represent 2 opposite views. 

    I'm with you Whoopsy. What do you think will stop this madness that we see around the world? It looks like our leaders are no leaders at all.

     

    After doubling down, tripling down, they have back themselves into a corner, they can't back away from that narrative anymore. Notice the 'buzz' word has changed from global warming to climate change? Earth's climate had always been changing, it did for 4 billion years, it will still change for the next 4 billion. With the 'climate change' buzz word, they have covered their bottom, anything is relevant now. 

    Those that dare to speak against are being persecuted like Christians in the Roman days. 

    The science part. The more they study, the less evidence they have to support that narrative. Drilling into ice cores in the poles? They showed the Earth goes through heating and cooling cycles regularly, studying the Sun? They found the Sun's activity greatly influences Earth's climate over anything else. The Earth's oscillating tile angle? That also affects the climate. We haven't even got to space matters that we still don't understand, like 95% of the 'stuff' in the universe, we have no idea whether they could interact silently with Earth and change our weather or not. 

    I am of the camp that we cannot decide this one way or another, we still need to collect more data in order to make a good conclusion. If the collection period is another few hundred years, so be it. Scientists that's doing that work shouldn't be gunning for fame and glory in the short term, it is a thankless job for the good of mankind. But too bad that isn't the state of science right now, they all tried to shortcut the process and claim fame and fortune. 

    But if the narrative is changed to better air quality for humans, instead of the global warming bit, I am all for it. But it will need to start with the biggest pool of polluters first, not the smallest, like what governments are doing now. Powerplants, ocean going ships, jet aircrafts, commercial trucking, etc. Personal vehicles are the cleanest ever and targeting them don't even move the needle. 

     


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    Re: Tesla

    CGX car nut:

    This should bring a tear of joy to a poster or two here.  Panasonic investment for Tesla made in their backyard. 
     

    Panasonic to build battery cell factory in Kansas

    Jul 14, 2022 - 03:02 pm

    Panasonic will probably build its new US battery factory, where the new 4680 cells for Tesla are to be produced, in Kansas. It is clear that Panasonic wants to build a battery factory there and that the funding application has already been approved – only which cells are to be built there is not yet specified by the Japanese company.

    As Panasonic and the economic development authority of the US state officially announce, the battery manufacturer has identified a plot of land in De Soto for the construction of the factory and the state of Kansas has approved a state incentive application submitted by Panasonic. Panasonic’s board of directors, however, still has to approve the project. Panasonic is not yet commenting on the timeline or production capacity.

    De Soto is located just west of Kansas City on the Kansas River. Giga Texas in Austin, where Tesla will initially assemble the 4680 cells, is about 700 miles or 1,130 kilometres further south.

    The factory is expected to create up to 4,000 new jobs and result in an investment of up to 4 billion US dollars (currently around four billion euros). However, the fact that the 4680 cells for Tesla are to be produced in the new factory is not mentioned in the official communications. There is only general mention of a “US-based EV Battery Facility“.

    However, the plans in Kansas fit with Panasonic’s previous announcements: series production of the new cells is to start in Japan in March 2023 and then be relocated to North America. The first sample cells from the pre-series production have already been delivered to Tesla.

    “With the increased electrification of the automotive market, expanding battery production in the U.S. is critical to help meet demand,” said Kazuo Tadanobu, President, CEO of Panasonic Energy. “Given our leading technology and depth of experience, we aim to continue driving growth of the lithium-ion battery industry and accelerating towards a net-zero emissions future.”

    “This project will transform the Kansas economy, creating high-quality, high-tech jobs while bringing a new industry to the state that will forge a more sustainable future,” said Governor Laura Kelly. “This is a significant milestone for Kansas that will drive economic growth and development.”

    Meanwhile, Reuters reports, citing statements by Panasonic Energy CTO Shoichiro Watanabe, that the battery maker plans to increase the energy density of its cells by 20 per cent by 2030. This will be made possible by a new mixture of electrolyte additives that will allow cells to be operated at a higher voltage without affecting the performance of the batteries. In addition, Panasonic is working on replacing more graphite with silicon-based materials.

    panasonic.com (PDF), kansascommerce.gov (both Kansas), reuters.com (Watanabe statement)

    There was some concern expressed on the local news last night about the infrastructure needed in DeSoto to support an additional 4,000 jobs. It is the same sight that was previously the sunflower ammunition plant which in WWII employed 12,000 people. I think they will be able to work it out.


    Re: Tesla

    Whoopsy:
    Pilot:
    Whoopsy:
    Pilot:

    Who else thinks that all this green climate s**t will hurt our planet more in the end?

     

    Because it's all a lie to start off with. There is no proof. Zero scientific proof.

    Whatever is being called 'scientific' is just numbers being manipulated to fit a certain narrative.

    First rule of statistics, numbers don't lie, people do. Second rule of statistics, any set of numbers can be made to represent 2 opposite views. 

    I'm with you Whoopsy. What do you think will stop this madness that we see around the world? It looks like our leaders are no leaders at all.

     

    After doubling down, tripling down, they have back themselves into a corner, they can't back away from that narrative anymore. Notice the 'buzz' word has changed from global warming to climate change? Earth's climate had always been changing, it did for 4 billion years, it will still change for the next 4 billion. With the 'climate change' buzz word, they have covered their bottom, anything is relevant now. 

    Those that dare to speak against are being persecuted like Christians in the Roman days. 

    The science part. The more they study, the less evidence they have to support that narrative. Drilling into ice cores in the poles? They showed the Earth goes through heating and cooling cycles regularly, studying the Sun? They found the Sun's activity greatly influences Earth's climate over anything else. The Earth's oscillating tile angle? That also affects the climate. We haven't even got to space matters that we still don't understand, like 95% of the 'stuff' in the universe, we have no idea whether they could interact silently with Earth and change our weather or not. 

    I am of the camp that we cannot decide this one way or another, we still need to collect more data in order to make a good conclusion. If the collection period is another few hundred years, so be it. Scientists that's doing that work shouldn't be gunning for fame and glory in the short term, it is a thankless job for the good of mankind. But too bad that isn't the state of science right now, they all tried to shortcut the process and claim fame and fortune. 

    But if the narrative is changed to better air quality for humans, instead of the global warming bit, I am all for it. But it will need to start with the biggest pool of polluters first, not the smallest, like what governments are doing now. Powerplants, ocean going ships, jet aircrafts, commercial trucking, etc. Personal vehicles are the cleanest ever and targeting them don't even move the needle. 

     

    My sentiment as well. I like your systematic thought processes. As of now, I think that current green technology alternatives will in the long run do more harm than good.


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    If I don't fly, I drive my .:RS :)


    Re: Tesla

    No one seems to ever talk about all the related issues. For example, if sea levels are rising then where is the investment in sea walls and levees to protect low-lying cities. If today's food crops are less productive in arid climates then where is the scientific investment in developing food crops that will thrive as the climate gets warmer.........etc., etc.


    Re: Tesla

    See The Netherlands and Sri Lanka. 


    Re: Tesla

    964C2:

    No one seems to ever talk about all the related issues. For example, if sea levels are rising then where is the investment in sea walls and levees to protect low-lying cities. If today's food crops are less productive in arid climates then where is the scientific investment in developing food crops that will thrive as the climate gets warmer.........etc., etc.

     

    The theory is, if a government tax their citizens enough for climate change stuff, the sea will magically goes down, and their beach side estates will stay ok. Food and other things will take care of itself, magically, according to politicians. 

    Plus, those extra tax dollars can be spent to buy votes to stay in power. 

    Politicians are all just eyeing the easy dollar sign, they have no idea about anything. 🤷🏻‍♂️

    Sad state of governing. 

    To stop polluting power plants? That means spending money to build clean air power plants like nuclear. Solar, wind, hydro are attractive options, but not every country has the resources to implement those. An immediate stop to polluting power plants means instant power deficit, most countries will be knocked back to the Stone Age. 

    Cleaning up ocean vessels? Oh boy, the logistic cost of shipping stuff around the globe will exponentially grow, same with mandating clean commercial trucks. Instant political death. 

    Cleaning up jetliners? Another instant political death, air travel cost will skyrocketed. Not to mention there aren't any certified electric or even clean fuel burning planes yet.

    No politician will risk their career for doing the right thing for mankind. 

    In the last ten years I have picked up 3 hybrids and 4 full electric, and 2 more on order, any I going 'green'? Absolutely not! If government is stupid enough to subsidize and grant those clean cars an advantage, I am going to take full advantage of it. I paid enough taxes over the years to get the fruits of my labour/investment right here right now. That's how double entry accounting works, government owe be a giant deficit from all the taxes I paid, I am booking the credits back right now.

    If all of a sudden all the government assistance disappeared for green cars, I will stop buying and go right back the other way. 

     

     

     

     


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    Re: Tesla

    Can someone explain why Tesla’s Q2 inventories increased to $8.1 billion as revenue fell from $16.9 bn in Q1 to $14.6 bn while the company states automotive supply is at 4 days?


    Re: Tesla

    I just ordered (July 17th) a new Model 3 Performance but it won’t be here until late Nov / early Dec……At the rate of my Taycan Turbo delays the Tesla may still arrive before the Taycan. The Taycan was originally scheduled to be built in March. Was actually built July 4th but not here until September….


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    2022 992 GT3. 2019 BMW M850i Convertible. 2020 Tesla Model 3 Performance. 2020 Aston Martin Vantage. 2020 Mclaren 720S coupe. 🥳


    Re: Tesla

    CGX car nut:

    Can someone explain why Tesla’s Q2 inventories increased to $8.1 billion as revenue fell from $16.9 bn in Q1 to $14.6 bn while the company states automotive supply is at 4 days?

     

    Actually it fell from $18.8 billion to $16.9 billion Q1 to Q2.

    Tesla, or Elon, does accounting much differently than everyone else. The 'inventory' line means whatever stock they have on hand. Parts for making cars, finished cars waiting for transport and delivery, unfinished cars missing parts, mainly chips. As with all manufacturing factories, stock level for every part isn't the same, they basically tally up the shortest supply level, which is 4 days worth. For other JIT manufacturing companies, the supply level is measured in hours. 

    But with so much 'inventory', it means they can selectively include sales for future reporting, they can decide when to book them to inflating the quarterly numbers. 

    I believe they are also counting parts for making the incoming Cybertruck as inventory, jacking up that number even more.

    Tesla cars, are still great sells, most don't sit on lots for long, But transporting the finished cars to buyers is an issue, not just for them, but for everyone else. Hyundai basically sold every Ioniq 5/EV6 on the line and whatever coming into the line for the next few years, they 'could' book everything right here right now, or wait and spread out those sales for each quarters. 

    Before, Tesla been booking EV credit as profits depending on how bad the quarter looks, but the last quarter they used their bitcoin holdings as that buffer, inflating their cash holding amount and cash flow number, would have been cash flow negative if not for the bitcoin sell.

    The old saying about numbers don't lie, people do, stays true. The facts are all there, if someone isn't all wrapped up with a influential spokesperson sugar coating the numbers, they can see the truth. But majority of people are too mesmerized the other way and can't see through the facade. 

     

     

     


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    Re: Tesla

    Revenue posted was automotive alone, not total revenue which includes energy services. Your analysis still doesn’t fully address the rise in inventory including WIP, raw, and finished as the company clearly states supply chain issues remain a critical operating risk.  


    Re: Tesla

    Whoopsy:
    CGX car nut:

    Can someone explain why Tesla’s Q2 inventories increased to $8.1 billion as revenue fell from $16.9 bn in Q1 to $14.6 bn while the company states automotive supply is at 4 days?

     

    Actually it fell from $18.8 billion to $16.9 billion Q1 to Q2.

    Tesla, or Elon, does accounting much differently than everyone else. The 'inventory' line means whatever stock they have on hand. Parts for making cars, finished cars waiting for transport and delivery, unfinished cars missing parts, mainly chips. As with all manufacturing factories, stock level for every part isn't the same, they basically tally up the shortest supply level, which is 4 days worth. For other JIT manufacturing companies, the supply level is measured in hours. 

    But with so much 'inventory', it means they can selectively include sales for future reporting, they can decide when to book them to inflating the quarterly numbers. 

    I believe they are also counting parts for making the incoming Cybertruck as inventory, jacking up that number even more.

    Tesla cars, are still great sells, most don't sit on lots for long, But transporting the finished cars to buyers is an issue, not just for them, but for everyone else. Hyundai basically sold every Ioniq 5/EV6 on the line and whatever coming into the line for the next few years, they 'could' book everything right here right now, or wait and spread out those sales for each quarters. 

    Before, Tesla been booking EV credit as profits depending on how bad the quarter looks, but the last quarter they used their bitcoin holdings as that buffer, inflating their cash holding amount and cash flow number, would have been cash flow negative if not for the bitcoin sell.

    The old saying about numbers don't lie, people do, stays true. The facts are all there, if someone isn't all wrapped up with a influential spokesperson sugar coating the numbers, they can see the truth. But majority of people are too mesmerized the other way and can't see through the facade. 

     

     

     

    GAAP compliant?


    Re: Tesla

    cookieguy:
    Whoopsy:
    CGX car nut:

    Can someone explain why Tesla’s Q2 inventories increased to $8.1 billion as revenue fell from $16.9 bn in Q1 to $14.6 bn while the company states automotive supply is at 4 days?

     

    Actually it fell from $18.8 billion to $16.9 billion Q1 to Q2.

    Tesla, or Elon, does accounting much differently than everyone else. The 'inventory' line means whatever stock they have on hand. Parts for making cars, finished cars waiting for transport and delivery, unfinished cars missing parts, mainly chips. As with all manufacturing factories, stock level for every part isn't the same, they basically tally up the shortest supply level, which is 4 days worth. For other JIT manufacturing companies, the supply level is measured in hours. 

    But with so much 'inventory', it means they can selectively include sales for future reporting, they can decide when to book them to inflating the quarterly numbers. 

    I believe they are also counting parts for making the incoming Cybertruck as inventory, jacking up that number even more.

    Tesla cars, are still great sells, most don't sit on lots for long, But transporting the finished cars to buyers is an issue, not just for them, but for everyone else. Hyundai basically sold every Ioniq 5/EV6 on the line and whatever coming into the line for the next few years, they 'could' book everything right here right now, or wait and spread out those sales for each quarters. 

    Before, Tesla been booking EV credit as profits depending on how bad the quarter looks, but the last quarter they used their bitcoin holdings as that buffer, inflating their cash holding amount and cash flow number, would have been cash flow negative if not for the bitcoin sell.

    The old saying about numbers don't lie, people do, stays true. The facts are all there, if someone isn't all wrapped up with a influential spokesperson sugar coating the numbers, they can see the truth. But majority of people are too mesmerized the other way and can't see through the facade. 

     

     

     

    GAAP compliant?

     

    TSLA had always been GAAP challenged. 

    Let's just say Elon have en eye for the most creative accountants available. Cultural thing. Elon does't like regulations, he feels rules are what constricting his 'creative ideas'. He always thinks rules don't apply to him as he 'is' the richest person on Earth. 

    And we keep thinking Enron was bad..........

    I have been reading their quarterly and year end reports for 10 years now, literally 40+ of those. I still don't get the how, or why,  the stock price got so inflated other than human influence. Elon's smoke and mirrors game is so on point. And I have read some pretty bad ones form Enron and WorldCom. 

    At most, at the most generous terms, I can pencil them in as a 50 billion company max. And I studied as an accountant. 

    For loans I would have only approve 15 cents on the dollar for stock collaterals max. Maybe 8 even. But Elon had sweetheart rates, and now he borrowed enough that he is the boss to the banks, not the other way around. 

     


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    Re: Tesla

    CGX car nut:

    Revenue posted was automotive alone, not total revenue which includes energy services. Your analysis still doesn’t fully address the rise in inventory including WIP, raw, and finished as the company clearly states supply chain issues remain a critical operating risk.  

     

    Creative accounting. I mentioned that in the last post. If the SEC doesn't question them, then they don't have to explain. And even if the SEC do raise an issue, their accountants most likely provide enough of an answer to put them off. 

    Tesla don't run a PR department, any questions, if Elon doesn't feel like answering during earnings call, it/they just got left hanging. 

    Their reports, mostly are consolidated, nothing really material is really itemized. One can only take an educated guess on what they had released and draw education conclusions from those. 

    Even gross margin is muddled by some of their 'zero cost' or arbitrary cost items. The zero cost line will be their software they 'sold' mostly, their pool of programmers are being employed whether they crank out stuff or not, it's a fix cost that they can fudge. Same with all the 'sale' of 'beta' software, he has a lot of leeway on how he wants to book those.

    Technically, a 'feature' their programmers came up with, can be counted as inventory if it hasn't been released yet, and they can book the 'cost' of writing that piece of feature, I mean, they did spend X amount of man hours writing that, and those X amount of man hours can be counted as cost, one way or another. Creative accounting again, as a software feature isn't a physical item like a door panel or a display screen in the warehouse where the physical item can be counted. 

     


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    Re: Tesla

     


    Re: Tesla

    So ti would seems like Elon have a tasted for married women.

    First it was Amber Heard before her divorce to Johnny Depp, now it's Nicole Shanahan, wife of Sergei Brin. 

    Hide your wives before meeting Elon seems to be the good advice 


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    Re: Tesla

    https://insideevs.com/news/600117/bmw-i4-edrive40-1000km-challenge/

    Mighty impressive for the BMW i4 to match and beat just about any Tesla for Bjorn's 1000km challenge.

    And people wrote off BMW for the EV changeover........

    For that extra 5 mins, I would much rather go with the much much much much nicer BMW.

    It's not in the graph shown, but a Porsche Taycan Cross Turismo 4 did the thing in 9:40mins. @18 degrees. 

    Yet again Elon and Tesla are just sitting on their laurels and not doing anything against the competition.

    Who would want to buy a Model 3 anymore? There are literally dozens of better cars in it's class right now and the competition is just getting tougher. 


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    Re: Tesla

    IMG_1137.jpg

    Now no one can unseen this 


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    Re: Tesla

    Haha and for those interested in “alternative truth”:

    C3F8B94E-2457-4F83-A6CC-48F90E8B9779.jpeg


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    Porsche, separates Le Mans from Le Boys


    Re: Tesla

    California DMV accuses Tesla of falsely advertising Autopilot and Full Self-Driving features

    (5 August 2022)

    The California Department of Motor Vehicles has accused Tesla of false advertising in its promotion of the company’s signature Autopilot and Full Self-Driving technologies.

    The agency alleges the electric carmaker misled customers with advertising language on its website describing Autopilot and Full Self-Driving technologies as more capable than they actually are.

    The company “made or disseminated statements that are untrue or misleading, and not based on facts,” the DMV said in a pair of complaints filed with the state Office of Administrative Hearings on July 28.

    The DMV complaints point to the very names of the technologies, as well as other “misleading” language such as the following, which appears on the Tesla’s website Autopilot page:

    “All you will need to do is get in and tell your car where to go. If you don’t say anything, your car will look at your calendar and take you there as the assumed destination. Your Tesla will figure out the optimal route, navigating urban streets, complex intersections and freeways.”

    The remedies proposed by the DMV if it prevails could be severe, including revocation of the company’s licenses to make or sell its cars in California. But actual remedies would likely to be much softer.

    A DMV spokesperson said Friday via email that if its action succeeds, “the DMV will ask that Tesla will be required to advertise to consumers and better educate Tesla drivers about the capabilities of its ‘Autopilot’ and ‘Full Self-Driving’ features, including cautionary warnings regarding the limitations of the features, and for other actions as appropriate given the violations.”

    In June, Tesla Chief Executive Elon Musk underlined the importance of Full Self-Driving to the company. Without FSD, Tesla is “worth basically zero,” he said.

    The Full Self-Driving feature costs $12,000 and purports to automatically pilot the car on freeways, city streets, and neighborhood roads; automatically obeys traffic signals; and roam a parking lot without a driver to park itself.

    Despite the name, no car available for purchase by individuals is capable of fully autonomous driving from Tesla or any other company.

    Tesla cars never could “and cannot now, operate as autonomous vehicles,” the DMV claims assert.

    The DMV notes that Tesla’s website states that “the currently enabled features require active driver supervision and do not make the vehicle autonomous.”

    But, the DMV said, the disclaimer “contradicts the original untrue or misleading labels and claims, which is misleading, and does not cure the violation.”

    Tesla’s driver-assisting technologies have been popular features that help the carmaker stand out in an increasingly crowded electric vehicle market. But YouTube videos showing its systems placing cars in dangerous situations have drawn attention, including near head-on collisions with trucks and trains that require a driver to yank the steering wheel to avoid a crash. One video appears to show Tesla’s sensor system confusing the moon for a traffic light stuck on yellow.

    Autopilot, a less expensive feature that combines automatic cruise control with automatic steering and automatic lane changes, came under investigation by the National Highway and Traffic Administration when Teslas showed a pattern of plowing into emergency vehicles parked by the roadside.

    It’s unclear how many crashes involve Full Self-Driving technology, and if any of those crashes have led to death or injury. Tesla’s onboard computers are capable of communicating that information over the air to Tesla, but the company doesn’t share that data with the public.

    Recently, Musk claimed that FSD had not been a factor in any Tesla crash, although at least eight crash reports submitted by Tesla owners to federal safety regulators indicate otherwise.

    Tesla’s response to the DMV complaints, if any, has not yet been made public. Tesla has no media relations office. Musk did not respond to an invitation to tell Tesla’s side of the story.

    Link: https://www.latimes.com/business/story/2022-08-05/dmv-false-advertising-tesla


    Re: Tesla

    FUD!!! FUD!!! FUD!!!  That’s the typical response from the Tesla fan club on a serious issue.  



     
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