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    Re: 991 spyshots thread (continued) (for UNRELEASED models only) Thread Closed

    Super Darius:
    RC:
     

    Something new(?) I heard today about the upcoming 991 GT3 RS: According to one source, the GT3 RS is supposed to be very special, even for Porsche standards. This car has a thing or two which hasn't been done by Porsche yet. I don't have a clue what this means but expect something really special. Good news (hopefully) for future owners.

    SmileySmileySmileySmiley

    This adds to my hopes . Can't wait . Hope that I will not be disappointed 


    --

     997.2 C2S, PDK, -20mm


    Re: 991 spyshots thread (continued) (for UNRELEASED models only) Thread Closed

    Leawood911:

    my guess is a 9400 RPM redline to make up for the six speeds.

    The higher the redline, the more beneficial the closer (7) ratios will be.  Sure hope they keep the close-ratio 7speed strategy!


    --

    73 Carrera RS 2.7 Carbon Fiber replica (1,890 lbs), 06 EVO9 with track mods. Former: 73 911S, Two 951S's, 996 C2, 993 C2, 98 Ferrari 550


    Re: 991 spyshots thread (continued) (for UNRELEASED models only) Thread Closed

    Carlos from Spain:

    If true, such a tranny on a street car would be an incredible experience for the driver, nothing compared to a PDK, but I can't help cringe at the maintenance cost and issues of such a box as well as first-second year problems it may give 

    I feel the opposite is true in terms of maintenance and repair issues.  The PDK in the GT3 will prove to not be track worthy and expensive to repair when used in such a harsh manner.  The RS will address this with the sequential manual and it will require much less maintenance, and none ever if used mostly on the  street.

    It will be a blast to drive - recall a top gear episode where Capt. Slow drove a Mini rally car with such a transmission.  He never had so much fun shifting.


    Re: 991 spyshots thread (continued) (for UNRELEASED models only) Thread Closed

    Sounds everything nice but Porsche wants to make money too... Smiley
     
    I see no reason why Porsche can't make money using this type of transmission. After taking the gt1 block away from us it would be nice to provide something of real value and add distinction wit some real race car hardware.  The Gt3 PDK warranty failures will be a greater threat to profits. (There is a good reason the GT3 PDK is so different.  It is a racing experiment waiting to fail.)

     


    Re: 991 spyshots thread (continued) (for UNRELEASED models only) Thread Closed

    Leawood911:
    Carlos from Spain:

    If true, such a tranny on a street car would be an incredible experience for the driver, nothing compared to a PDK, but I can't help cringe at the maintenance cost and issues of such a box as well as first-second year problems it may give 

    I feel the opposite is true in terms of maintenance and repair issues.  The PDK in the GT3 will prove to not be track worthy and expensive to repair when used in such a harsh manner.  The RS will address this with the sequential manual and it will require much less maintenance, and none ever if used mostly on the  street.

    It will be a blast to drive - recall a top gear episode where Capt. Slow drove a Mini rally car with such a transmission.  He never had so much fun shifting.

    Not sure you are following the maintenance schedule and repair costs on the GT3 Cup cars with sequential (in use since 2006).  The boxes need to be rebuilt every season (if not sooner) at very high cost (more than $7k).

    The manual gearboxes in the previous Cup cars lasted WAY longer with very low maintenance costs.  The PDK boxes have been very reliable on track, afaik.  I'd still prefer Manaul over anything else.  And a 3-pedal sequential sounds like a great second option, but only within warranty period...


    --

    73 Carrera RS 2.7 Carbon Fiber replica (1,890 lbs), 06 EVO9 with track mods. Former: 73 911S, Two 951S's, 996 C2, 993 C2, 98 Ferrari 550


    Re: 991 spyshots thread (continued) (for UNRELEASED models only) Thread Closed

    will they really develop a completely different gearbox just for the RS?

     


    Re: 991 spyshots thread (continued) (for UNRELEASED models only) Thread Closed

    Grant:
    Leawood911:
    Carlos from Spain:

    If true, such a tranny on a street car would be an incredible experience for the driver, nothing compared to a PDK, but I can't help cringe at the maintenance cost and issues of such a box as well as first-second year problems it may give 

    I feel the opposite is true in terms of maintenance and repair issues.  The PDK in the GT3 will prove to not be track worthy and expensive to repair when used in such a harsh manner.  The RS will address this with the sequential manual and it will require much less maintenance, and none ever if used mostly on the  street.

    It will be a blast to drive - recall a top gear episode where Capt. Slow drove a Mini rally car with such a transmission.  He never had so much fun shifting.

    Not sure you are following the maintenance schedule and repair costs on the GT3 Cup cars with sequential (in use since 2006).  The boxes need to be rebuilt every season (if not sooner) at very high cost (more than $7k).

    The manual gearboxes in the previous Cup cars lasted WAY longer with very low maintenance costs.  The PDK boxes have been very reliable on track, afaik.  I'd still prefer Manaul over anything else.  And a 3-pedal sequential sounds like a great second option, but only within warranty period...


    --

    73 Carrera RS 2.7 Carbon Fiber replica (1,890 lbs), 06 EVO9 with track mods. Former: 73 911S, Two 951S's, 996 C2, 993 C2, 98 Ferrari 550

    Exactly . Leawood, I am afraid you are just fantasizing ! It would be great, but is ain't reality . My brother has a cup car and he spends a lot on his sequential gearbox at the end of each season .

    I have now 80'000 km  and many track days with my PDK and not a single problem . I will even go further to say, that PDK is probably more reliable then manual as you can not mess it up.

    And this comes from someone that prefers driving manual … but that knows PDK is better 


    --

     997.2 C2S, PDK, -20mm


    Re: 991 spyshots thread (continued) (for UNRELEASED models only) Thread Closed

    Has anyone heard of a potential "track package" being installed/ offered  in the 991 Turbo (not Turbo S). There was talk on another board that there was consideration by Porsche to offering the Turbo with a stick in said option group.  Can anyone validate this? I want to buy a Turbo (maybe turbo S) but price and the fact I would really like to row gears I holding me back. I had a 2010 TT with PDK and sold it after 17000 KM - bought my wife a Boxster S PDK that she likes a lot and I drive my 993tt. I like to shift gears. :)


    Re: 991 spyshots thread (continued) (for UNRELEASED models only) Thread Closed

    Didn´t you like the 997TTS? How do you compare it with the mighty 993TT ? That´s got to be a wonderful ownership experience.

    J.Seven


    Re: 991 spyshots thread (continued) (for UNRELEASED models only) Thread Closed

    Overdraft:

    Has anyone heard of a potential "track package" being installed/ offered  in the 991 Turbo (not Turbo S). There was talk on another board that there was consideration by Porsche to offering the Turbo with a stick in said option group.  Can anyone validate this? I want to buy a Turbo (maybe turbo S) but price and the fact I would really like to row gears I holding me back. I had a 2010 TT with PDK and sold it after 17000 KM - bought my wife a Boxster S PDK that she likes a lot and I drive my 993tt. I like to shift gears. :)

    No stick (ever), only "track options" so far are Dunlop UHP tires (same used as on GT3) and bucket seats. Not sure if both options are available for the US market though.

    There will be a GT2 RS (or maybe even a GT2...rumors are still confusing) though but even that car won't have a stick.

    You are aware that you can shift manually (paddles, gear lever) with PDK and that it works much better on the 991 Turbo S than on the previous 997 Turbo/S?


    --

    RC (Germany) - Rennteam Editor Porsche 991 Turbo S, Cayenne GTS (958), BMW X3 35d (2013)


    Re: 991 spyshots thread (continued) (for UNRELEASED models only) Thread Closed

    "You are aware that you can shift manually (paddles, gear lever) with PDK and that it works much better on the 991 Turbo S than on the previous 997 Turbo/S?"

    RC - you are aware that a manual shifting transmission has a clutch and it must be used when shifting, that is what makes it a manual.  Furthermore - every automatic has provided some ability to induce automated shifts, big deal.  We all know this but would never call that shifting manually.  When a car salesman tell me this I laugh out loud at them.  You I expect much more from.  Shame...

    Unless you want us to lose all respect for your opinions don't ever, ever call that paddle thing in the PDK Shifting Manually.  It has nothing to do with manually shifting a manual transmission.  In order to shift manually there has to be a clutch under the left foot.  Are we clear on that?  Otherwise you are simply manually pushing a button on an automatic transmission. 

    Laughably you have repeated this many times - but yet we all know for a fact it is not the same as manually shifting using a clutch - which is what any smart/car person discussing shifting manually is referring to.  Period.  (not even going to comment on your observation that the Porsche SUV, whatever it is called, handles like a sports car, lol)

     


    Re: 991 spyshots thread (continued) (for UNRELEASED models only) Thread Closed

    Oh my.... Smiley

    Looking forward to another pointless discussion which transmission is better....

     


    --

    Suzy

     


    Re: 991 spyshots thread (continued) (for UNRELEASED models only) Thread Closed

    SuzyF:

    Oh my.... Smiley

    Looking forward to another pointless discussion which transmission is better....

     


    --

    Suzy


     

    Oh my - another person who thinks that a PDK paddle is like shifting a manual! On a car forum no less...

    By all means begin by ridicule and totally confusing the topic. Pretty funny since you consider leather and color options substantive.  Transmission choices are far from pointless. To defend the PDK as being 'just like a manual' you must be able to avoid facts and simply attack with non-sense so I am able to follow your logic to that extent.

    Yet this point is far from that discussion, substantive it may be.  Far from it. 

    I am simply trying to keep the definitions correct.  Do you seriously think using PDK paddles is the same as shifting a manual transmission?  I would love your input in this simple question.  A girls opinion.  It has nothing to do with which is better.  They are different, that is all.  They are well defined in terms of what they are. 

    Just trying to maintain some order in the definition of the terms else people might think RC favors the real manual.

    Anyone here really believe shifting a PDK paddle is just the same as shifting a true manual with a shifter and a clutch?  Show of hands please so I know who you are, lol.

     


    Re: 991 spyshots thread (continued) (for UNRELEASED models only) Thread Closed

    Leawood911:
    SuzyF:

    Oh my.... Smiley

    Looking forward to another pointless discussion which transmission is better....

     


    --

    Suzy


     

    Oh my - another person who thinks that a PDK paddle is like shifting a manual! On a car forum no less...

    By all means begin by ridicule and totally confusing the topic. Pretty funny since you consider leather and color options substantive.  Transmission choices are far from pointless. To defend the PDK as being 'just like a manual' you must be able to avoid facts and simply attack with non-sense so I am able to follow your logic to that extent.

    Yet this point is far from that discussion, substantive it may be.  Far from it. 

    I am simply trying to keep the definitions correct.  Do you seriously think using PDK paddles is the same as shifting a manual transmission?  I would love your input in this simple question.  A girls opinion.  It has nothing to do with which is better.  They are different, that is all.  They are well defined in terms of what they are.  J

    ust trying to maintain some order in the definition of the terms else people might think RC favors the real manual.

     

    First of all I like to say that I think both manual and PDK are equally good. It comes down to preference, which one to choose for a potential buyer.

    You are of course right when you say that shifting with a paddle is not the same as shifting with a MT and a clutch, that said, for me the most important fact is that you can control the gearbox yourself.  My Boxster is a manual and most of the time I like it, but there are occasions where I would definitely want a PDK. When I drive a PDK-equipped car, I never think "I wish I had a manual". 

    Regarding the subject if shifting with paddles should be called manual shifting, i think both options can be seen as controlling gears manually. The benefit of a PDK is that you don't need to operate the clutch yourself. The benefit of a MT is that it involves the driver more in the driving experience. But.... To me that shifting is only a very small part of the driving experience. I can have equal fun on both track and street with a PDK and still have the benefit to use an "auto-mode" when I want to drive in a more relaxed way or when driving in traffic.

    The heel and toe part is mentioned often in these kind of discussions, but let's be honest. Heel and toe is only necessary when driving 8/10th or more, to get the most out of the car. In daily use, no one needs to use that technique. Yes it can be fun to learn, but once you have that feeling and it becomes a kind if second nature, it's not more fun than shifting without that technique, since it doesn't add to the driving experience anymore. At least that how I feel about it.

    The thing is that ten different people can have ten different opinions on this subject, but we all know that the days of the MT are slowly coming to an end. It's been overtaken by technology and if that is good or bad... I don't know.  Manufacturers like Porsche need to move on and keep up with the technologies their competition is offering. Stagnation is going backwards. 

     

    But is shifting with paddles, the same as shifting with a clutch and a gearlever? To me it is. Should we call it the same? Maybe not, but I don't know how to call it differntly to be honest. 


    --

    Suzy

     


    Re: 991 spyshots thread (continued) (for UNRELEASED models only) Thread Closed

    Leawood911:
    SuzyF:

    Oh my.... Smiley

    Looking forward to another pointless discussion which transmission is better....

     


    --

    Suzy


     

    Oh my - another person who thinks that a PDK paddle is like shifting a manual! On a car forum no less...

    By all means begin by ridicule and totally confusing the topic. Pretty funny since you consider leather and color options substantive.  Transmission choices are far from pointless. To defend the PDK as being 'just like a manual' you must be able to avoid facts and simply attack with non-sense so I am able to follow your logic to that extent.

    Yet this point is far from that discussion, substantive it may be.  Far from it. 

    I am simply trying to keep the definitions correct.  Do you seriously think using PDK paddles is the same as shifting a manual transmission?  I would love your input in this simple question.  A girls opinion.  It has nothing to do with which is better.  They are different, that is all.  They are well defined in terms of what they are. 

    Just trying to maintain some order in the definition of the terms else people might think RC favors the real manual.

    Anyone here really believe shifting a PDK paddle is just the same as shifting a true manual with a shifter and a clutch?  Show of hands please so I know who you are, lol.

     

    you wont see my hand thats for sure. yes pdk can be shifted manually and it will shift when you want it to but no one should call it a "manual transmission", because its not. btw, you dont have to drive 8/10th to enjoy heel and toe, i used to do to do it all the time in my 997TT even when puttering around in town and i miss that a lot. all my cars now are automatic or double clutched and i always wish they had a real clutch, especially the crazy 12C (i know i know it would be slower, but who cares). too bad the real manual is dying/dead....

     


    --

    2011 CTT, 2013 12C Spider, 2013 A5 cab, 2014 4Runner Trail Edition

     

     


    Re: 991 spyshots thread (continued) (for UNRELEASED models only) Thread Closed

    AAHTT:

    you wont see my hand thats for sure. yes pdk can be shifted manually and it will shift when you want it to but no one should call it a "manual transmission", because its not. btw, you dont have to drive 8/10th to enjoy heel and toe, i used to do to do it all the time in my 997TT even when puttering around in town and i miss that a lot. all my cars now are automatic or double clutched and i always wish they had a real clutch, especially the crazy 12C (i know i know it would be slower, but who cares). too bad the real manual is dying/dead....

    Didn 't say you can't enjoy heel and toe at normal speeds, but it is not necessary to use it. I find myself very often using it when driving in town or so, but i do it without awareness. Like I said... It becomes kind of natural, but when I notice that I am doing it, I can only laugh at myself and ask why am I doing that!??!

    Luckily it's almost impossible in the Boxster to heel and toe when wearing high heels. i would wear out the right shoes earlier than the left ones and those are mostly expensive shoes!  Smiley


    --

    Suzy

     


    Re: 991 spyshots thread (continued) (for UNRELEASED models only) Thread Closed

    SuzyF:
    AAHTT:

    you wont see my hand thats for sure. yes pdk can be shifted manually and it will shift when you want it to but no one should call it a "manual transmission", because its not. btw, you dont have to drive 8/10th to enjoy heel and toe, i used to do to do it all the time in my 997TT even when puttering around in town and i miss that a lot. all my cars now are automatic or double clutched and i always wish they had a real clutch, especially the crazy 12C (i know i know it would be slower, but who cares). too bad the real manual is dying/dead....

    Didn 't say you can't enjoy heel and toe at normal speeds, but it is not necessary to use it. I find myself very often using it when driving in town or so, but i do it without awareness. Like I said... It becomes kind of natural, but when I notice that I am doing it, I can only laugh at myself and ask why am I doing that!??!

    Luckily it's almost impossible in the Boxster to heel and toe when wearing high heels. i would wear out the right shoes earlier than the left ones and those are mostly expensive shoes!  Smiley


    --

    Suzy

     

     

    pdk will wear the right show even faster, remember, no left foot work... unless you left foot brake like old people with arthritisSmiley


    --

    2011 CTT, 2013 12C Spider, 2013 A5 cab, 2014 4Runner Trail Edition

     

     


    Re: 991 spyshots thread (continued) (for UNRELEASED models only) Thread Closed

    SuzyF:
     

    Luckily it's almost impossible in the Boxster to heel and toe when wearing high heels. i would wear out the right shoes earlier than the left ones and those are mostly expensive shoes!  Smiley


    --

    Suzy

     

     

    The solution, as taught by my mom to my wife, is to keep a pair of flat sole slip ons in the car for driving. That way, the driving part becomes a lot easier and the heels won't get marked by the floor mats. 

    But, my wife just took the easy route and stop driving cars with a clutch pedal.

     

     


    Re: 991 spyshots thread (continued) (for UNRELEASED models only) Thread Closed

    AAHTT:
     

    pdk will wear the right show even faster, remember, no left foot work... unless you left foot brake like old people with arthritisSmiley

    If you want a bit of challenge and efficiency, you can with PDK start to do left foot braking.

    It is very efficient and rewarding when you manage to do it properly, coming into a corner at good speed, and braking , accelerating nearly at the same time .


    --

     997.2 C2S, PDK, -20mm


    Re: 991 spyshots thread (continued) (for UNRELEASED models only) Thread Closed

    Gnil:

    If you want a bit of challenge and efficiency, you can with PDK start to do left foot braking.

    It is very efficient and rewarding when you manage to do it properly, coming into a corner at good speed, and braking , accelerating nearly at the same time .

     

    I tried that with an Peugeot hire car a while back.  The dash lit up like a christmas tree and the engine switched offSmiley


    --

    Gen II Cayman S


    Re: 991 spyshots thread (continued) (for UNRELEASED models only) Thread Closed

    Gnil:
    AAHTT:
     

    pdk will wear the right show even faster, remember, no left foot work... unless you left foot brake like old people with arthritisSmiley

    If you want a bit of challenge and efficiency, you can with PDK start to do left foot braking.

    It is very efficient and rewarding when you manage to do it properly, coming into a corner at good speed, and braking , accelerating nearly at the same time .


    --

     997.2 C2S, PDK, -20mm

    It should be mentioned that left foot braking requires some exercise and I wouldn't necessarily start with it on a public road. Smiley I would rather concentrate on a clean driving line. From my experience, most drivers have huge difficulties keeping a clean line and sometimes they even bring so much nervousness into the car that it is very counter-productive. 


    --

    RC (Germany) - Rennteam Editor Porsche 991 Turbo S, Cayenne GTS (958), BMW X3 35d (2013)


    Re: 991 spyshots thread (continued) (for UNRELEASED models only) Thread Closed

    The Targa!!! Smiley

    The last shot reveals the rear sits but, we don't know how the top will retract behind them. 


    Re: 991 spyshots thread (continued) (for UNRELEASED models only) Thread Closed

    Just saw these same pics on a dutch website. The roof panel is the black part behind the seats on the last picture. Parts of it are hidden above the engine-compartment. 

    There is also a wind deflector on the windshield, preventing buffeting when the roof is retracted.

    --

    Suzy

     


    Re: 991 spyshots thread (continued) (for UNRELEASED models only) Thread Closed

    These are not photographs, just some good (or less ) renderings.

    I'm very surprised the Targa hasn't been announced yet, I expected it end of Nov. or Dec.


    --

    RC (Germany) - Rennteam Editor Porsche 991 Turbo S, Cayenne GTS (958), BMW X3 35d (2013)


    Re: 991 spyshots thread (continued) (for UNRELEASED models only) Thread Closed

    RC:

    These are not photographs, just some good (or less ) renderings.

    I'm very surprised the Targa hasn't been announced yet, I expected it end of Nov. or Dec.


    --

    RC (Germany) - Rennteam Editor Porsche 991 Turbo S, Cayenne GTS (958), BMW X3 35d (2013)

    According to the Dutch website/magazine (Autovisie), these are the official (leaked) renderings of the patent.

    http://www.telegraaf.nl/autovisie/autovisie_nieuws/porsche/22137353/__Exclusief__Dit_is_de_Porsche_911_Targa___.html

    The Targa will be introduced in Detroit (January). 


    --

    Suzy

     


    Re: 991 spyshots thread (continued) (for UNRELEASED models only) Thread Closed

    The Targa looks much better in reality, especially the sideline is quite bad in these (older) renderings.

    I expected the press announcement end of Nov./early Dec..


    --

    RC (Germany) - Rennteam Editor Porsche 991 Turbo S, Cayenne GTS (958), BMW X3 35d (2013)


    Re: 991 spyshots thread (continued) (for UNRELEASED models only) Thread Closed

    RC:

    The Targa looks much better in reality, especially the sideline is quite bad in these (older) renderings.

    I hope so, because this looks really bad. Not a fan of the retro Targa Smiley


    --

    2012 Cayenne S White/Espresso 

    Ex: 993 Targa, 986S, 986 and 964 C2


    Re: 991 spyshots thread (continued) (for UNRELEASED models only) Thread Closed

    I've never been a Targa fan, retro or 993 - 997 glass roofers. Now the new "retro" Targa I actually do like. The roof line is correct. The roof line of the original Targ's ruined it for me. It looks like Porsche has nailed it. Good job.

    -J


    Re: 991 spyshots thread (continued) (for UNRELEASED models only) Thread Closed

    2014 Porsche 911 GT3 RS at the Nurburgring...

    2014-Porsche-991-GT3-RS_01.jpg

    2014-Porsche-991-GT3-RS_02.jpg

    2014-Porsche-991-GT3-RS_03.jpg

    2014-Porsche-991-GT3-RS_04.jpg

    2014-Porsche-991-GT3-RS_05.jpg

    2014-Porsche-991-GT3-RS_06.jpg

    2014 Porsche 911 GT3 RS at the Nurburgring -- Gallery Link

    Smiley SmileySmiley


    Re: 991 spyshots thread (continued) (for UNRELEASED models only) Thread Closed

    2014 Porsche 911 GT3 RS at the Nurburgring... (video)

    ...turn up the volume... Smiley

    2014 Porsche 911 GT3 RS at the Nurburgring -- Video Link

    Smiley SmileySmiley


     
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