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    Re: Hamilton may lose his points from Japanese GP

    Quote:
    easy_rider911 said:
    Quote:
    JimFlat6 said:
    Team McLaren has already buried the Union Jack in the manure pile..... Hold your nose if you want to fly that flag!



    Jim, these comments don't suit you. You're far better than that...



    Thank you for catching that.

    Meant in the context of discussing F1, the remark was directed in reference to British nationalism in F1 and team McLaren in particular. Please dont construe it to infer to the UK in general. I should have been more specific.

    F1 is a sport that generates enormous public nationalist sentiment. Regretfully, McLarens recent behaviour has besmirched Britains deserved reputation for unabated fairness in sport. Its sad really.



    Re: Hamilton may lose his points from the Japanese

    Quote:
    easy_rider911 said:
    Maybe you're right KresoF1 - maybe I have allowed the Hamilton-fever to affect me, but honestly, I'm trying really hard not to let my national bias affect my judgement.



    I agree with you Easy, this guy has worked very hard all season to get to where he is right now. They should not let a flimsy mistake rob the guy off his chance of winning the title. In my opinion, racing is about being competitive and these guys will do anything to win a race. take for instance Schumacher (Snr) he would have done the same thing as what hamilton did. I really admire the guy, when I heard that he will be driving for McLaren I was one of the first person to write him off and thats the truth, but this guy has proved himself race after race, even in races where the chips were down he picked up in the following race. The guy deserves it this year and I could bet that NO action will be taken by FIA. As Easy said let common sense prevail

    Re: Hamilton may lose his points from the Japanese

    So many more issues to take into consideration than a 18 second clip on YouTube. Hamilton did take an unusual line at this particular turn, but we don't know why?

    It could well have been due to cold brakes, low tyre pressures or both! It must be viewed in the whole context of a most unusual set of circumstances within a race which was very much a one-off.

    Hamilton WAS more than 5 car lengths behind the SC at one point, but that was the left-hander at which the SC took a much tighter line and visibly accelerated, probably worried that Hamilton could well have run into him.

    Has anyone heard what the SC driver's take is on the incident and Hamilton's general behaviour during the many laps that he was first in line.

    The fact that Hamilton was on the radio concerned about the closeness of Webber and Vettel is also in his favour!

    When interviewed during the race, Webber blamed the inexperience of Vettel for the crash. He later changed his tune and Alonso joined in (surprise surprise)

    Let's hope the stewards look at the whole race in the context of conditions and don't just take the opportunity to extend the Championship purely for the sake of it.

    Re: Hamilton may lose his points from the Japanese

    Quote:
    ITALOKOKO said:
    Quote:
    easy_rider911 said:
    Maybe you're right KresoF1 - maybe I have allowed the Hamilton-fever to affect me, but honestly, I'm trying really hard not to let my national bias affect my judgement.



    I agree with you Easy, this guy has worked very hard all season to get to where he is right now. They should not let a flimsy mistake rob the guy off his chance of winning the title. In my opinion, racing is about being competitive and these guys will do anything to win a race. take for instance Schumacher (Snr) he would have done the same thing as what hamilton did. I really admire the guy, when I heard that he will be driving for McLaren I was one of the first person to write him off and thats the truth, but this guy has proved himself race after race, even in races where the chips were down he picked up in the following race. The guy deserves it this year and I could bet that NO action will be taken by FIA. As Easy said let common sense prevail



    Oh, let me see if I follow you here: If a racing driver has been working very hard all season, and then break the rules, he should not receive a penalty for his actions. If a racing driver that has NOT been working very hard all season (do you feel there is somebody this year?), then it's Ok to give that driver a penalty?

    Why are you saying that a penalty should rob him of his chance of winning the title. He is still ahead whatever penalty he receives (if any) and can still defend his position in the Championship.

    Regards
    /Per

    Re: Hamilton may lose his points from the Japanese

    Quote:
    Per said:
    Quote:
    ITALOKOKO said:
    Quote:
    easy_rider911 said:
    Maybe you're right KresoF1 - maybe I have allowed the Hamilton-fever to affect me, but honestly, I'm trying really hard not to let my national bias affect my judgement.



    I agree with you Easy, this guy has worked very hard all season to get to where he is right now. They should not let a flimsy mistake rob the guy off his chance of winning the title. In my opinion, racing is about being competitive and these guys will do anything to win a race. take for instance Schumacher (Snr) he would have done the same thing as what hamilton did. I really admire the guy, when I heard that he will be driving for McLaren I was one of the first person to write him off and thats the truth, but this guy has proved himself race after race, even in races where the chips were down he picked up in the following race. The guy deserves it this year and I could bet that NO action will be taken by FIA. As Easy said let common sense prevail



    Oh, let me see if I follow you here: If a racing driver has been working very hard all season, and then break the rules, he should not receive a penalty for his actions. If a racing driver that has NOT been working very hard all season (do you feel there is somebody this year?), then it's Ok to give that driver a penalty?

    Why are you saying that a penalty should rob him of his chance of winning the title. He is still ahead whatever penalty he receives (if any) and can still defend his position in the Championship.

    Regards
    /Per



    Becouse we have seen driving like that many times before and no one so far didnt recived penalty. And for crash is responsible only Vettel, because he didnt look Webber. Without Vettel, nothing would happened.

    But if FIA wants to have open battle for championship until last race, like in Villeneuve case back in 97, then he will get penalty...

    Re: Hamilton may lose his points from the Japanese

    If it were a public road, for a rear-end collision, the fault I believe is always the person following. You can't blame what's happening in front of you, you should always leave yourself enough space to comfortably brake.

    Logically this stands out even more so in wet conditions.

    I think Lewis saw how close the cars were behind him, had to brake as safety car gap was too small, and SENSIBLY moved to the right so that he wasn't hit from behind. That's exactly what I would have done.

    The 5 car lengths was the result of the Safety car accelerating out of the bend, and Lewis getting out of the way of the red bull car behind him.

    If they penalize him for that, under those horrible weather conditions, it would negate all levels of common-sense.

    Re: Hamilton may lose his points from the Japanese

    Quote:
    Per said:
    Quote:
    ITALOKOKO said:
    Quote:
    easy_rider911 said:
    Maybe you're right KresoF1 - maybe I have allowed the Hamilton-fever to affect me, but honestly, I'm trying really hard not to let my national bias affect my judgement.



    I agree with you Easy, this guy has worked very hard all season to get to where he is right now. They should not let a flimsy mistake rob the guy off his chance of winning the title. In my opinion, racing is about being competitive and these guys will do anything to win a race. take for instance Schumacher (Snr) he would have done the same thing as what hamilton did. I really admire the guy, when I heard that he will be driving for McLaren I was one of the first person to write him off and thats the truth, but this guy has proved himself race after race, even in races where the chips were down he picked up in the following race. The guy deserves it this year and I could bet that NO action will be taken by FIA. As Easy said let common sense prevail



    Oh, let me see if I follow you here: If a racing driver has been working very hard all season, and then break the rules, he should not receive a penalty for his actions. If a racing driver that has NOT been working very hard all season (do you feel there is somebody this year?), then it's Ok to give that driver a penalty?

    Why are you saying that a penalty should rob him of his chance of winning the title. He is still ahead whatever penalty he receives (if any) and can still defend his position in the Championship.

    Regards
    /Per



    latest update..... I told you


    Lewis Hamilton will not be punished for alleged erratic driving behind the safety car in the Japanese Grand Prix.
    The 22-year-old had been thought to be under investigation and at risk of losing the 10 points for race victory.
    But the FIA has ruled Hamilton will not be penalised following an accident where Sebastian Vettel crashed into Mark Webber in Fuji last weekend.
    And Vettel has had a 10-place penalty on the Chinese Grand Prix starting grid replaced with a reprimand.

    Re: Hamilton may lose his points from the Japanese

    Quote:
    Alex (UK) said:
    I think Lewis saw how close the cars were behind him, had to brake as safety car gap was too small, and SENSIBLY moved to the right so that he wasn't hit from behind. That's exactly what I would have done.

    The 5 car lengths was the result of the Safety car accelerating out of the bend, and Lewis getting out of the way of the red bull car behind him.

    If they penalize him for that, under those horrible weather conditions, it would negate all levels of common-sense.



    Seriously, watch the video again.
    There is noone even remotely close to crashing into him from behind, as MW is quite a bit after Hamilton and not closing fast enough to hit him before the bend.
    Hamilton seems to accellerate INTO the SC and then slowing down dramatically halfway into the corner while pulling to the right.
    He may have had steering/gear/engine problems, but I fail to see how any other driver could have forced him to "play it safe" and pull to the side.

    I agree with those who say that the FIA often have let so many other - more serious - incidents pass without penalty, and hence feel that Hamilton should not be punished.
    However, if he does get a penalty from this incident it would be ok with me.

    Re: Hamilton may lose his points from the Japanese

    Quote:
    easy_rider911 said:
    As this story has developed during today, it now seems that Alonso has jumped onto the bandwagon clammering for his own team mate to be punished...

    http://news.bbc.co.uk/sport1/hi/motorsport/formula_one/7027743.stm

    Alonso has been guilty of bunching the cars behind him too when he has been the first car behind the safety car...Alonso wasn't even affected by this alleged wrongdoing...he only stands to gain from his team mate being punished...how low can Alonso stoop? Does he have no integrity at all? I guess not.



    easy, you shoul read also some spanish news also not just the brithis media that of course will do everything possible to defend hamilton so he can win the champion this year, because since 96 there was no brithis drive looking stron in f1, and it is normal... as is normal that the spanish press will defend alonso.

    And then if you are in a championship and know that your main rival can loose some points for bad behaviour wouldn't you be happy? so what it is wrong if alonso is happy that hamilton looses some points? I bet that hamilton will be very happy to hear that the stewards are taking points from alonso and raikkonen so he becomes already champion; and then would't be nice for f1 that the title will be decided in brazil instead seeing a final race where there is nothing more to be seen?

    Case closed

    No penalty for Hamilton.
    http://www.formula1.com/news/headlines/2007/10/6934.html

    According to The Daily Mail Hamilton threatened to leave F1, because he has been portrayed as a "bad person" during this incident.
    I guess he is in for a rough ride the coming years, if that really is true.

    Hamilton may lose points from Japanese GP

    Thank goodness sanity has prevailed. I thought that maybe a 10 place grid penalty at the next race or a 10 second pitlane stop-go penalty would be applied. In the end, no punishment at all for Lewis. BUT, the fact that Vettel's 10 place grid penalty has been reduced to a reprimand means to me that there was doubt as to who to punish SO they didn't punish anyone.

    @ed_moree: I wish I could understand Spanish Then I would happily read the Spanish media too.

    I have referred to the articles on the BBC News website. IMO it tries pretty hard to remain neutral. No media is perfect but IMHO it is not anywhere near as biased as the British tabloid newspapers can often be.

    With all due respect, I don't think it is normal, nor should it be normal, for the media to support its own national hero. The media should always try to stay neutral and fair.

    Maybe the British public are naive but this is what we expect...neutrality and fairness. It is our tabloid press that is rotten and biased.

    Unfortunately, much of the British media (generally) this year has been singing Hamilton's praises as if he were already as good as Prost, Senna or Schumi. I distance myself from that entirely. (Do you remember the hysteria when Hamilton kept finishing on the podium race after race?)

    Hamilton is a very talented driver who MAY go on to achieve many great things BUT he still needs to go out there and achieve those great deeds. Until he does so, I'm not going to consider him to be as good as the other former greats who have already achieved great feats.

    As for rivalry between team mates, sure, they are each trying to win the title. Sure, they are rivals BUT there is a big difference between healthy rivalry and wishing that the FIA deducts points from your own team mate.

    Team mates normally share test data, set up data, tyre choice information, fuel strategy data etc etc This season, the relationship between Alonso and Hamilton has really reached rock bottom. I do not know whether they share any data anymore.

    But the tone of Alonso's interviews makes it seem like he is competing against Hamilton as if Hamilton were in a totally different team to him. Surely this isn't right. It's not a sign of a noble character and doesn't look good from the youngest double world champion that F1 has ever seen.

    I obviously don't know Hamilton personally but I find it hard to believe that, if the points scores in the drivers championships were reversed, Hamilton would be speaking openly about how he would be happy if Alonso were to lose 10 points through some kind of penalty.

    Wishing bad things for one's rival (in one's heart) is one thing. Expressing it to the world's media just makes it so much worse.

    As for Alonso competing against Hamilton as if they were in separate teams, this is revealing. It is as if there really are 2 teams within McLaren supporting each driver. Alonso did, after all, try to incentivise his own engineers by offering to pay them extra money for every race that he finishes above Hamilton.

    I almost can't wait until this season is over. It's not fun anymore. It's just ugly.

    And after all that has happened, I certainly don't value having the championship decided at the final race. The drama makes it more fun BUT that's not why they compete. They compete to win and, if all you care about is winning, then it doesn't matter how early in the season you win the championship.

    I think the real drama is not about who will win the title. Hamilton is a sure thing. The real drama will happen behind closed doors and over mobile phonecalls when the drivers are negotiating which team they will race for in 2008. The $64million question is whether Alonso will still be with McLaren next year. If not, which team will take him?

    Re: Case closed

    Quote:
    Dr. Phil said:
    No penalty for Hamilton.
    http://www.formula1.com/news/headlines/2007/10/6934.html

    According to The Daily Mail Hamilton threatened to leave F1, because he has been portrayed as a "bad person" during this incident.
    I guess he is in for a rough ride the coming years, if that really is true.



    There has been so much drama this season, it is as if Hamilton has had a whole career compressed into just one year...

    Re: Hamilton may lose points from Japanese GP

    Quote:
    easy_rider911 said:
    Thank goodness sanity has prevailed. I thought that maybe a 10 place grid penalty at the next race or a 10 second pitlane stop-go penalty would be applied. In the end, no punishment at all for Lewis. BUT, the fact that Vettel's 10 place grid penalty has been reduced to a reprimand means to me that there was doubt as to who to punish SO they didn't punish anyone.

    @ed_moree: I wish I could understand Spanish Then I would happily read the Spanish media too.

    I have referred to the articles on the BBC News website. IMO it tries pretty hard to remain neutral. No media is perfect but IMHO it is not anywhere near as biased as the British tabloid newspapers can often be.

    With all due respect, I don't think it is normal, nor should it be normal, for the media to support its own national hero. The media should always try to stay neutral and fair.





    Easy, I intended to respond to ed_moore but you took the words right out of my mouth !

    I think this whole Hamilton's penalty story is mostly a political matter and a media buzz.
    If we go back to the beginning, it came first from the site Autosport.com. From this sole article, the headtitles covering the subject varied very much on the different media, we didn't know exactly if Hamilton faced a "10-grid place" penalty, if he would lose "his 10 points from his fuji history", the BBC even talked about merely an "informal chat" with the stewards, etc. I have the impression that some more or less crazy rumours widespread from a single news, i.e the stewards were reviewing a new video of Hamilton behind the safety car.

    I also have a strong feeling it is a political issue. Among the strange events during the last 24 hours there is Koveleinen stating in to the media his opinion about Hamilton's behavior behind the safety car and the allegedly recommandations to him from Charlie Whiting during this period of the race. Why now ?

    Of course it is just my very 0.02$, I can be wrong, but for the moment I stick to it.

    Besides I have a bitter feeling in my mouth about the FIA. It seems impossible to live a season final based solely on fair sportiness performance, politics always have to come in. Remember 2003 and the Michelin tyres suddenly illegal ?

    On the ame note the spy sage is just a joke. Stealing information from each other is common place in formula 1. The only difference is this time compelling proofs have been found. Other than that it is just about dirty plays between big egoes (Dennis, Todt, Mosley) who absolutely want to be seen as they see themselves.

    Sometimes I feel the FIA just does not care about the fans.

    Were the stewards right not to punish Hamilton ? Of course they were. Because it is a mere race incident, as Kubica hitting the British (drive through penalty) or Vettel hitting Weber, or Montoya hitting Barrichello under the rain in Indianapolis 2003 (drive through, he retired short after and lost any title hope whereas there was only a 2-point gap with MS ). There are numerous examples like these and in each case no one had to be penalised in the first place.

    Besides no one outside the F1 drivers can know what is right or not under these circumstances, certainly not the stewards. One solution is to replaced them by former F1 drivers but: 1) do they fell like having this occupation whereas they can enjoy life ? 2) how can be ensured of them being unbiased ?.

    Of course when it is obvious one acted wrongly, like Massa exiting the pit in Montreal under red light, or put the others in danger, one should be punished but otherwise it has to be considered as race incidents and let the big boys express by themselves behind the wheels.

    I also never understood why the media have to support their fellow country man, it has always been something beyond me. I am French and I can't stand the "mandatory" support towards Prost when he was a pilot or a team manager, or Sebastien Bourdais for the time being.
    The Spanish press seems to be "incredible" in this area, althoug I am sure there are generally speaking some remarkable newspapers, I have read great articles from Al Pais for e.g. !
    The British press has the worst (the tabloids) as well as the best IMHO, for e.g. I love the Guardian ! I touroughly enjoy this unique asset to deliver deep-documented, rigourous articles while retaining this British "spirit" and sense of humour !

    Finally, I have noticed increasingly numbers of attacks / negative comments towards Hamilton, practically as many as for Alonso.
    But all greats F1 champions were admired on one side but attacked on the other, be it Alonso, Prost, Schumacher. One particularly used to be by some regarded as the vilain, then unanimously as a genius...once he past away the 1st May 1994.

    P.S: sorry for the spelling mistakes and perfectible style but I don't have much time.

    Re: Case closed

    Quote:
    Dr. Phil said:
    No penalty for Hamilton.
    http://www.formula1.com/news/headlines/2007/10/6934.html

    According to The Daily Mail Hamilton threatened to leave F1, because he has been portrayed as a "bad person" during this incident.
    I guess he is in for a rough ride the coming years, if that really is true.



    Who's crying now Dr. Phill? Hamilton is like yeah I wanna leave formula one because you are all very very bad persons.... nobody loves me.... I was expecting here that everyone will love me but nobody loves me.... ......!!!!!

    Come on Hamilton you are so close to winning this one so get your ass in the car and drive because FIA has allready decided that you have to win the championship!!!!

    Re: Case closed

    Many of you who claim Hamilton is guilty didn't even see the race and don't know the full story. Let me outline it for you.


    1. SC came out
    2. Hamilton drove normally but Webber was driving uncomfortably close behind him.
    3. Hamilton didn't like it. Talked to the team over radio to tell the Red Bull team to keep a safe distance behind him.
    4. The driving manners of Webber didn't change, so Hamtilon drove car out to the side to protect himself.
    5. Webber stepped on the brakes.
    6. Vettel had his eyes on Hamilton and didn't pay attention to what was happening in front of him.
    7. BANG!!! Vettel slammed into Webber.


    The whole incident was a mess. Webber, Hamilton and Vettel were all responsible. Further more Hamilton didn't really break any rules. The rules regarding how to drive behind the SC are pretty gray and up to discussion. Many drivers have been less than 5 car lengths behind the SC, have they been punished? No. They are more like norms than rules.

    Re: Case closed

    Quote:
    Dr. Phil said:
    According to The Daily Mail Hamilton threatened to leave F1, because he has been portrayed as a "bad person" during this incident.
    I guess he is in for a rough ride the coming years, if that really is true.



    Hereafter Hamilton's declarations from Reuters in order you to have a more precise opinion (claims made prior to the stewards decision):

    "McLaren's Lewis Hamilton fears stewards will damage his Formula One title hopes by punishing him on Friday for allegedly causing a collision at last weekend's Japanese Grand Prix.

    The 22-year-old British rookie, who could win the world title in Sunday's penultimate race of the season, is under investigation for erratic driving behind the safety car on his way to victory at the wet race in Fuji.

    "I had a good weekend, I didn't put a foot wrong, I didn't do anything to put anyone else in danger," he told reporters at the Chinese Grand Prix.

    "I've come away to China and all of a sudden I'm going to be punished for something.

    "I just think it's a real shame for the sport, Formula One's supposed to be about hard, fair competition," he added. "That's what I've tried to do this year, just be fair.

    "There's been some real strange situations this year where I'm made to look the bad person and, by the looks of it, this weekend be given a penalty.

    "If this is the way it's going to keep going it's not somewhere I really want to be."

    Hamilton's McLaren team had all of their constructors' championship points removed last month and were handed a $100 million fine after being found guilty of benefiting from information given to them by an employee of rivals Ferrari."

    Re: Hamilton may lose his points from the Japanese

    Quote:
    John H said:

    So many more issues to take into consideration than a 18 second clip on YouTube. Hamilton did take an unusual line at this particular turn, but we don't know why?

    It could well have been due to cold brakes, low tyre pressures or both! It must be viewed in the whole context of a most unusual set of circumstances within a race which was very much a one-off.

    Hamilton WAS more than 5 car lengths behind the SC at one point, but that was the left-hander at which the SC took a much tighter line and visibly accelerated, probably worried that Hamilton could well have run into him.

    Has anyone heard what the SC driver's take is on the incident and Hamilton's general behaviour during the many laps that he was first in line.

    The fact that Hamilton was on the radio concerned about the closeness of Webber and Vettel is also in his favour!

    When interviewed during the race, Webber blamed the inexperience of Vettel for the crash. He later changed his tune and Alonso joined in (surprise surprise)

    Let's hope the stewards look at the whole race in the context of conditions and don't just take the opportunity to extend the Championship purely for the sake of it.



    To add to what I said above (before the decision was made) both Sir Stirling Moss and Murray Walker agreed that it would be a travesty if Hamilton was penalised.

    Thank goodness common sense prevailed...

    http://news.bbc.co.uk/player/sol/newsid_...p=wm&news=1

    Re: Case closed

    "There has been so much drama this season, it is as if Hamilton has had a whole career compressed into just one year... " - I surely hope that will not be the case!

    Re: Case closed

    "I had a good weekend, I didn't put a foot wrong, I didn't do anything to put anyone else in danger," he told reporters at the Chinese Grand Prix.

    "I've come away to China and all of a sudden I'm going to be punished for something.

    "I just think it's a real shame for the sport, Formula One's supposed to be about hard, fair competition," he added. "That's what I've tried to do this year, just be fair.

    "There's been some real strange situations this year where I'm made to look the bad person and, by the looks of it, this weekend be given a penalty.

    "If this is the way it's going to keep going it's not somewhere I really want to be."

    He's either a crybaby, or really stretching his "I'm a good guy, look at my big, brown eyes...would they ever lie to you? Would they ever harm you?"- routine.

    It's pretty clear he tried to sabotage Alonso's qualifying run some GPs ago (NBR?), and now he is Snowwhite?
    I think not.

    I dont think he has been dealt any more or les blows than anyone else this season - so instead of his "boohoo, everybody is after me, , I'm a victim " responses, Id rather see him sucking it up and let his driving do the talking.

    Is it just me, or are these F1 drivers some overpaid, dramaqueen crybabies??

    Re: Case closed

    Hamilton is 22 years old. Alonso is only 24 years old. I wonder whether I would have coped perfectly all the time with what they have to cope with.

    Re: Case closed

    Quote:
    Dr. Phil said:
    I dont think he has been dealt any more or les blows than anyone else this season - so instead of his "boohoo, everybody is after me, , I'm a victim " responses, Id rather see him sucking it up and let his driving do the talking.



    He has actually dealt with more drama than anyone else this season. Remember that he was more or less a nobody when he joined F1 and is now written about in magazines, papers and news sites all over the world.

    Conflicts:

    1. The beef with Alonso + the pit lane-gate at Hungary.
    2. The spy scandal off course which could have led to Hamilton loosing points.
    3. Finally the investigation regarding a crash that was caused by Vettel not keeping is eyes on the car in front of him.

    Hamilton has unlike Alonso whined this season and what Hamilton have said lately is just a cry of mental exhaustion. He's simply tired of all the drama, especially now when he's so close to winning. It's been one very turbulent season for him.

    Re: Case closed

    Sorry guys, but I have a hard time feeling sorry for young guys who make millions doing what they like the most.
    It's not like they save the World or anything - they drive a frigging car for crying out loud - and already at this young age, a qualified guess says that they have made enough money so they can retire if they wanted to.
    To me it seems like a pretty sweet trade-off: Public exposure for millions, fame, and front row seats to everything life has to offer.

    Sure, there are absolutely downsides to being famous and to becoming an F1 star overnight - but it's not exactly sensational news that being in F1 - let alone having ambitions to win the championships - will expose you to the public eye.

    They either have extremely unprofessional advisors who didnt warn them about or educate them to handle the pressure of being an F1 pilot - or they are what I said before: Spoilt dramaqueens.

    You cant win F1 by being and feeling like a victim - and hence all his "boohoo, they dont like me.." sobbing is totally misplaced and IMO not authentic at all. He is NOT the innocent little boy he tries so hard to portray.
    It would be a lot more honest, and become him a whole lot more, if he made a counterattack or simply ignored the accusations/drama/allegations that any F1 star will face.

    I acknowledge that being this young and being famous at the same time can be a real test of character, andd if he/they want out it's fine by me.
    If he wants to stay in F1, he ought to focus more on being the winner he wants to be - and less on being a victim.

    Re: Case closed

    To be honest I have no idea how hard racing in a F1 car could be but I can assume that it's not easy - I can't even focus for that long racing on a Playstation F1 game and do lap times within a second for more than 5 laps......

    Sure, they make tonnes of money but isn't that to do with demand an supply?

    In the end, he's just like any other on the grid having a good old moan. That's why I'm not watching any pre-race build up which will cover all that crap.

    Tomorrow, I will wake up 5 mins before the start and just watch the race!

    Re: Case closed

    Quote:
    Dr. Phil said:
    Sorry guys, but I have a hard time feeling sorry for young guys who make millions doing what they like the most.
    It's not like they save the World or anything - they drive a frigging car for crying out loud - and already at this young age, a qualified guess says that they have made enough money so they can retire if they wanted to.
    To me it seems like a pretty sweet trade-off: Public exposure for millions, fame, and front row seats to everything life has to offer.



    With that paragraph you clearly show that you know nothing about hard work. Motor sports car incredibly expensive and with Hamilton not coming from a wealthy family his father made huge sacrifices to help Hamilton become the fantastic F1 driver he is.

    Hamilton didn't become a F1 driver over night. If' you've ever practised sports on an elite level you would have kept your mouth shut. You get what you give. Hamilton gave his life to driving and now he's getting rewarded for it.

    Re: Case closed

    Quote:
    luwalira said:
    Quote:
    Dr. Phil said:
    Sorry guys, but I have a hard time feeling sorry for young guys who make millions doing what they like the most.
    It's not like they save the World or anything - they drive a frigging car for crying out loud - and already at this young age, a qualified guess says that they have made enough money so they can retire if they wanted to.
    To me it seems like a pretty sweet trade-off: Public exposure for millions, fame, and front row seats to everything life has to offer.



    With that paragraph you clearly show that you know nothing about hard work. Motor sports car incredibly expensive and with Hamilton not coming from a wealthy family his father made huge sacrifices to help Hamilton become the fantastic F1 driver he is.

    Hamilton didn't become a F1 driver over night. If' you've ever practised sports on an elite level you would have kept your mouth shut. You get what you give. Hamilton gave his life to driving and now he's getting rewarded for it.



    I don't think Lasse was criticizing Hamilton's driving or hard work. What he WAS criticizing was Hamilton's pussy-whipped attitude and whining. He's right - when you earn more money per season than most people do in their lifetimes, you have no good reason to complain over some rough articles in the press. There are many oter guys out there who would gladly take his seat and not complain about petty things. I trained in competitive skiing for 10 years, being away from home and freezing my butt off for over 100 days each year. Do I deserve 50 million dollars because of it? Many people invest huge amounts of time and effort into their sports (my parents also extended themselves financially to allow me to train and so did many of my friends' parents), but most don't get these kinds of rewards out of it. So, I'll stick with Lasse on this one: he can either suck it up or leave F1. With so much cash he has no reason to whine, no matter how good he may be.

    Re: Case closed

    Quote:
    luwalira said:
    With that paragraph you clearly show that you know nothing about hard work. Motor sports car incredibly expensive and with Hamilton not coming from a wealthy family his father made huge sacrifices to help Hamilton become the fantastic F1 driver he is.

    Hamilton didn't become a F1 driver over night. If' you've ever practised sports on an elite level you would have kept your mouth shut. You get what you give. Hamilton gave his life to driving and now he's getting rewarded for it.



    First of all, I dont like the way you talk to me.
    Since you know absolutely nothing about me, you have no way of knowing and no right to conclude what I do or do not know about hard work.
    You can disagree with me all you want, that's your right - but your demeaning tone-of-voice is way off.

    Secondly: You're missing my point.
    Surely anyone who's at the top of their game has to work hard to get there. That's pretty obvious.
    I find it ridiculous to complain about a natural part of being famous and being the best at a hi-profile sport like F1.
    If he wanted to avoid the criticism and bad PR, he should have picked another job.

    Re: Case closed

    Quote:
    Crash said:
    I don't think Lasse was criticizing Hamilton's driving or hard work. What he WAS criticizing was Hamilton's pussy-whipped attitude and whining. He's right - when you earn more money per season than most people do in their lifetimes, you have no good reason to complain over some rough articles in the press. There are many oter guys out there who would gladly take his seat and not complain about petty things. I trained in competitive skiing for 10 years, being away from home and freezing my butt off for over 100 days each year. Do I deserve 50 million dollars because of it? Many people invest huge amounts of time and effort into their sports (my parents also extended themselves financially to allow me to train and so did many of my friends' parents), but most don't get these kinds of rewards out of it. So, I'll stick with Lasse on this one: he can either suck it up or leave F1. With so much cash he has no reason to whine, no matter how good he may be.



    Bingo! Thanks

     
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