Crown

Board: BMW M Language: English Region: Worldwide Share/Save/Bookmark Close

Forum - Thread


    M4 Sport Auto Supertest

    M4 DCT, 19" Michelin PSS.

    7.52 Ring

    1.12,8 Hockenheim


    Re: M4 Sport Auto Supertest

    Is that better or worse than what we expected?  Ring time seems pretty good, but Hockenheim is nothing special, right?


    --

    73 Carrera RS 2.7 Carbon Fiber replica (1,890 lbs), 06 EVO9 with track mods. Former: 73 911S, Two 951S's, 996 C2, 993 C2, 98 Ferrari 550


    Re: M4 Sport Auto Supertest

    Thanks! kiss The Ring time is slower than I expected. Too much torque, too little traction? 


    --

    2014 991 Carrera 4S | Dark Blue Metallic | PDK | S-PASM (-20mm) | PSE

    2010 Audi S5 cabrio | Ibis White


    Re: M4 Sport Auto Supertest

    Car is on street tires. 

    0-100km/h 4.2s

    0-200km/h 13.7s

    So, it is faster then 991 CS for example. 

    Actually, HvS prised M4 as high as possible.

     

     


    Re: M4 Sport Auto Supertest

    KresoF1:

    Car is on street tires. 

    0-100km/h 4.2s

    0-200km/h 13.7s

    So, it is faster then 991 CS for example. 

    Actually, HvS prised M4 as high as possible.

     

     

     Pretty good for 60% the price of the 991S (with 7% Euro Delivery Discount for US buyers) and real back seats.


    --

    73 Carrera RS 2.7 Carbon Fiber replica (1,890 lbs), 06 EVO9 with track mods. Former: 73 911S, Two 951S's, 996 C2, 993 C2, 98 Ferrari 550


    Re: M4 Sport Auto Supertest

    KresoF1:

    Car is on street tires. 

    0-100km/h 4.2s

    0-200km/h 13.7s

    So, it is faster then 991 CS for example. 

    Actually, HvS prised M4 as high as possible.

    Maybe I am wrong but I thought the 997.2 CS PDK laps the Ring in 7.50 and the 991 CS PDK in 7.39. Both on street tires.


    --

    2014 991 Carrera 4S | Dark Blue Metallic | PDK | S-PASM (-20mm) | PSE

    2010 Audi S5 cabrio | Ibis White


    Re: M4 Sport Auto Supertest

    Those are of course factory times and not HvS times. So maybe I am comparing apples and oranges.

    In any case, HvS lapped the Ring in 7:52 with a Panamera Turbo S. Is the M4 time still impressive?


    --

    2014 991 Carrera 4S | Dark Blue Metallic | PDK | S-PASM (-20mm) | PSE

    2010 Audi S5 cabrio | Ibis White


    Re: M4 Sport Auto Supertest

    bluelines:
    KresoF1:

    Car is on street tires. 

    0-100km/h 4.2s

    0-200km/h 13.7s

    So, it is faster then 991 CS for example. 

    Actually, HvS prised M4 as high as possible.

    Maybe I am wrong but I thought the 997.2 CS PDK laps the Ring in 7.50 and the 991 CS PDK in 7.39. Both on street tires.


    The 997.2 lap was on Cup tyres, estimated at 7sec difference in lap time. 


    --

    "Form follows function"


    Re: M4 Sport Auto Supertest

    bluelines:

    Those are of course factory times and not HvS times. So maybe I am comparing apples and oranges.

    In any case, HvS lapped the Ring in 7:52 with a Panamera Turbo S. Is the M4 time still impressive?

     Well the M4 costs 1/3 of the PTS and seats the same number of occupants in similar comfort - so I would say that's a good result to match it.


    --

    73 Carrera RS 2.7 Carbon Fiber replica (1,890 lbs), 06 EVO9 with track mods. Former: 73 911S, Two 951S's, 996 C2, 993 C2, 98 Ferrari 550


    Re: M4 Sport Auto Supertest

    Grant:
    bluelines:

    Those are of course factory times and not HvS times. So maybe I am comparing apples and oranges.

    In any case, HvS lapped the Ring in 7:52 with a Panamera Turbo S. Is the M4 time still impressive?

     Well the M4 costs a small fraction of the PTS and seats the same number of occupants in similar comfort - so I would say that's a good result to match it.


    --

    73 Carrera RS 2.7 Carbon Fiber replica (1,890 lbs), 06 EVO9 with track mods. Former: 73 911S, Two 951S's, 996 C2, 993 C2, 98 Ferrari 550

    So does the Cadillac CTS V?


    Re: M4 Sport Auto Supertest

    991 GT3 SA Hockenheim time was 1:09,6 so I think the M4 time is pretty impressive.


    Re: M4 Sport Auto Supertest

    SciFrog:
    Grant:
    bluelines:

    Those are of course factory times and not HvS times. So maybe I am comparing apples and oranges.

    In any case, HvS lapped the Ring in 7:52 with a Panamera Turbo S. Is the M4 time still impressive?

     Well the M4 costs a small fraction of the PTS and seats the same number of occupants in similar comfort - so I would say that's a good result to match it.


    --

    73 Carrera RS 2.7 Carbon Fiber replica (1,890 lbs), 06 EVO9 with track mods. Former: 73 911S, Two 951S's, 996 C2, 993 C2, 98 Ferrari 550

    So does the Cadillac CTS V?

     CTS-V is slower on the Ring and costs more than M4 though (until next generation comes with big twin-turbo V8).


    --

    73 Carrera RS 2.7 Carbon Fiber replica (1,890 lbs), 06 EVO9 with track mods. Former: 73 911S, Two 951S's, 996 C2, 993 C2, 98 Ferrari 550


    Re: M4 Sport Auto Supertest

    991 C2S SA Supertest times: (with PDK, PCCB, PASM, and Pirelli P Zero tires)

    NS: 7:44 min
    Hockenheim: 1:10,4 min
    0 - 100km/h (62mph): 4.2sec.
    0 - 200km/h (124mph): 14,1sec.


    Re: M4 Sport Auto Supertest

    JoeRockhead:

    991 GT3 SA Hockenheim time was 1:09,6 so I think the M4 time is pretty impressive.

     Well 3.2 sec on such a short track is an eternity, but at least some of that is due to the Cup tires on the GT3.


    --

    73 Carrera RS 2.7 Carbon Fiber replica (1,890 lbs), 06 EVO9 with track mods. Former: 73 911S, Two 951S's, 996 C2, 993 C2, 98 Ferrari 550


    Re: M4 Sport Auto Supertest

    To add 991CS is equiped with SPASM/PDCC. 

    Also in 0-250km/h new M4 is more then 1.5s faster then 991CS.

    So, on the autobahn 991CS will be spanked with sporty mide size coupe... €50K less in Germany with same equipment as well...

     


    Re: M4 Sport Auto Supertest

    KresoF1:

    So, on the autobahn 991CS will be spanked with sporty mide size coupe... €50K less in Germany with same equipment as well...

     

     This is not unusual - pretty common that the M3 is faster than the 911 going back 20 years to the E36 vs. 993 comparison for much less money.  911 has only won on subjective performance.


    --

    73 Carrera RS 2.7 Carbon Fiber replica (1,890 lbs), 06 EVO9 with track mods. Former: 73 911S, Two 951S's, 996 C2, 993 C2, 98 Ferrari 550


    Re: M4 Sport Auto Supertest

    KresoF1:

    To add 991CS is equiped with SPASM/PDCC. 

    Also in 0-250km/h new M4 is more then 1.5s faster then 991CS.

    So, on the autobahn 991CS will be spanked with sporty mide size coupe... €50K less in Germany with same equipment as well...

     

    Can the speed limit be lifted by BMW? Officially it is 250km/h?


    --

    "Form follows function"


    Re: M4 Sport Auto Supertest

    M drivers package code 07ME 280km/h limit. That is shame since car is capable to reach 300 km/h.


    Re: M4 Sport Auto Supertest

    KresoF1:

    M drivers package code 07ME 280km/h limit. That is shame since car is capable to reach 300 km/h.

    So in the end it will loose anyway... Smiley


    --

    2014 991 Carrera 4S | Dark Blue Metallic | PDK | S-PASM (-20mm) | PSE

    2010 Audi S5 cabrio | Ibis White


    Re: M4 Sport Auto Supertest

    Actually,  it won't.  Since 991CS needs over 45s to get to max speed. 45s of clear straight line autobahn...


    Re: M4 Sport Auto Supertest

    The air is getting thinner for Porsche

    Like I said many times before: Porsche needs to up their game, not only their prices.


    --

    RC (Germany) - Rennteam Editor Porsche 991 Turbo S, Porsche Boxster S (981), Jeep Grand Cherokee SRT (2014), BMW X3 35d (2013)


    Re: M4 Sport Auto Supertest

    JoeRockhead:

    991 C2S SA Supertest times: (with PDK, PCCB, PASM, and Pirelli P Zero tires)

    NS: 7:44 min

    Kreso, I don't get what we argue about. In the SuperTest the 991 is 8 seconds faster, with almost identical power to weight ratio, but the 991 has far less torque than the M4. Hence I had expected more from the M4, especially since BMW have been sending so strong messages about the new M4 being a more track oriented car than before.


    --

    2014 991 Carrera 4S | Dark Blue Metallic | PDK | S-PASM (-20mm) | PSE

    2010 Audi S5 cabrio | Ibis White


    Re: M4 Sport Auto Supertest

    The M4 is actually a supped up 4 series BMW and we all know that. So I'm not surprised the M4 isn't the track car. However, does it really matter? At the M4's price tag, the track performance isn't really that important and I am pretty sure that M GmbH is working on updates, upgrades and optional features at additional cost, so stay tuned.


    --

    RC (Germany) - Rennteam Editor Porsche 991 Turbo S, Porsche Boxster S (981), Jeep Grand Cherokee SRT (2014), BMW X3 35d (2013)


    Re: M4 Sport Auto Supertest

    RC:

    The M4 is actually a supped up 4 series BMW and we all know that. So I'm not surprised the M4 isn't the track car. However, does it really matter? At the M4's price tag, the track performance isn't really that important and I am pretty sure that M GmbH is working on updates, upgrades and optional features at additional cost, so stay tuned.

    My expectations were based on leaked material and official BMW videos from testing on the Ring with the low weight, the powerful engine, the sharp handling, the track performance, etc. I really got the feeling that BMW was back, for the track. That is why I thought that the time really matters. 

    I am pretty sure they will come with upgrades too. Hopefully even a worthy CSL successor.  The last proper sports car BMW M managed to build IMHO.


    --

    2014 991 Carrera 4S | Dark Blue Metallic | PDK | S-PASM (-20mm) | PSE

    2010 Audi S5 cabrio | Ibis White


    Re: M4 Sport Auto Supertest

    Figures always tell a part of the story. Especiially straight line numbers. For some these statistics are very significant for others pointless.

    Otherwise, some time ago everybody would have bought a GT-R, instead of Ferrari and the 997 Turbos would be piling up unwanted, in warehousing yards.

     


    --

    "Form follows function"


    Re: M4 Sport Auto Supertest

    997 Turbos are piling up on eBay. $60-70K for one nowadays.

    M4 numbers look pretty good, but at the end of the day it's just a BMW with a bit more aggressive looks. I'd probably look for a 997 Turbo for the price of an M4, assuming I didn't need extra space.

    I think BMW M cars are great cars for people who like BMW M cars. BIt pricey for something not that cool though IMO.


    Re: M4 Sport Auto Supertest

    reginos:

    Figures always tell a part of the story. Especiially straight line numbers. For some these statistics are very significant for others pointless.

    Otherwise, some time ago everybody would have bought a GT-R, instead of Ferrari and the 997 Turbos would be piling up unwanted, in warehousing yards.

     


    --

    "Form follows function"

    I do not think that 991 CS is actual competitor for M4. IMO it is Cayman GTS. Now, for almost the same money as Cayman GTS you can get M4. Call me crazy, but I would take M4.


    Re: M4 Sport Auto Supertest

    reginos:

    Figures always tell a part of the story. Especiially straight line numbers. For some these statistics are very significant for others pointless.

    Absolutely. I find lap times interesting because they tell a lot about the handling of the car. Straight line numbers are less interesting to me.


    --

    2014 991 Carrera 4S | Dark Blue Metallic | PDK | S-PASM (-20mm) | PSE

    2010 Audi S5 cabrio | Ibis White


    Re: M4 Sport Auto Supertest

    KresoF1:
     

    I do not think that 991 CS is actual competitor for M4. IMO it is Cayman GTS. Now, for almost the same money as Cayman GTS you can get M4. Call me crazy, but I would take M4.

    A reasonable/rational person would choose the M4 (430hp+ / 550Nm+) for $65k, not to mention what it will do with minor mods being a turbocharged car with a high rev limiter vs 911 CS 400hp / 440Nm for $105k before adding tons of options Smiley


    Re: M4 Sport Auto Supertest

    When I owned BMWs in the '90s Roundel always had features comparing the M3 to the 911 and sometimes a Ferrari was thrown  in.  Not sure I've ever seen a Pano that featured a Porsche in comparison to any BMW but I could be wrong. Porsche seems to aspirational for BMW owners but it does not seem to be reciprocal, objective measurements nothwithstanding.


    --

    "Don't worry about avoiding temptation, as you grow older it will avoid you"  Churchill


     
    Edit

    Forum

    Board Subject Last post Rating Views Replies
    Porsche Sticky SUN'S LAST RUN TO WILSON, WY - 991 C2S CAB LIFE, END OF AN ERA (Part I) Thread Closed 9/24/20 12:47 AM
    watt
    576549 2849
    Porsche Sticky The moment I've been waiting for... 12/30/20 9:03 AM
    rhino
     
     
     
     
     
    356480 1279
    Porsche Sticky OFFICIAL: New Porsche 911 Turbo S (2020) 4/10/21 2:32 PM
    Joost
    85804 1085
    Porsche Sticky Welcome to Rennteam: Cars and Coffee... (photos) 4/4/21 8:01 AM
    bluelines
    43212 328
    Porsche Sticky ROAD TEST: New 992 Carrera 4S 3/3/21 10:57 PM
    Wonderbar
    35022 336
    Porsche Sticky Porsche Taycan Turbo S - Short Review 10/19/20 6:12 PM
    Leawood911
    32645 380
    Porsche Sticky SUN'S LAST RUN TO WILSON, WY - 991 C2S CAB LIFE, END OF AN ERA (Part II) 4/12/21 3:07 PM
    watt
    14786 298
    Porsche Sticky Porsche extends the Taycan model range (Taycan 2WD) 2/1/21 12:42 PM
    Leawood911
    4099 29
    Porsche OFFICIAL: New 991.2 GT3 (2017) 7/27/20 2:13 AM
    DJM48
    560679 5257
    Porsche OFFICIAL: 991 Turbo and Turbo S 4/20/20 8:24 AM
    schmoell
    533242 4260
    Porsche Cayman GT4 4/12/21 7:44 PM
    bluelines
    400375 3577
    McLaren McLaren on a winning streak 4/12/21 2:20 PM
    RCA
    355109 3914
    Porsche OFFICIAL: 911 GT2 RS (2017) 12/27/20 4:06 PM
    Topspeed
    352104 3486
    Porsche OFFICIAL: 991.2 GT3 RS (2018) 11/5/20 9:55 PM
    DaveGordon
    312209 3242
    Porsche OFFICIAL: 911 R (2016) 12/8/20 7:51 PM
    DJM48
    309514 2646
    Porsche OFFICIAL: The new Porsche 992 – a design icon and high-tech sports car 2/28/21 8:05 PM
    Topspeed
    215075 1542
    Porsche Tesla Roadster 9/23/20 8:22 PM
    bluelines
    182143 4279
    Porsche OFFICIAL: New Panamera (2016) 2/11/21 9:22 AM
    Itsme
    160217 1379
    Others Alfa Romeo 4C 9/23/20 10:22 AM
    RCA
    137923 792
    Porsche 992 GT3 4/12/21 3:10 PM
    Boxster Coupe GTS
    107064 1995
    Lambo Lamborghini Huracan and variants 4/9/21 4:32 PM
    Topspeed
    105245 1225
    McLaren F1 2/25/21 11:33 AM
    RCA
    76978 207
    Porsche Welcome to the new Taycan Forum! 3/15/21 7:26 PM
    Enmanuel
    69338 1151
    AMG AMG GT R 11/19/20 11:47 PM
    Topspeed
    64433 819
    Lambo Aventador and SV 3/15/21 3:59 PM
    Topspeed
    63304 679
    Porsche 991 Speedster 9/3/20 4:29 PM
    Topspeed
    56261 878
    Porsche Nürburgring - Tesla vs. Taycan 11/23/20 6:10 PM
    Topspeed
    42881 596
    Others Bugatti Chiron 4/12/21 3:42 PM
    RCA
    36235 476
    Porsche Olive 991.2 GT3 Clubsport 1/1/21 7:58 PM
    throt
    33497 615
    BMW M BMW M2 Rumors 3/21/21 5:01 PM
    Topspeed
    28526 385
    272 items found, displaying 1 to 30.