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    Re: Nürburgring - Tesla vs. Taycan

    Real world vs Musk world: 

    But now NHTSA's raw data set is available, and, if anything, it appears to contradict Musk's claims. The majority of the vehicles in the Tesla data set suffered from missing data or other problems that made it impossible to say whether the activation of Autosteer increased or decreased the crash rate. But when QCS focused on 5,714 vehicles whose data didn't suffer from these problems, it found that the activation of Autosteer actually increased crash rates by 59 percent.

    https://arstechnica.com/cars/2019/02/in-2017-the-feds-said-tesla-autopilot-cut-crashes-40-that-was-bogus/ 


    --

    ⇒ Carlos - Porsche 991 Carrera GTS


    Re: Nürburgring - Tesla vs. Taycan

    Based on my insurance premium the safety numbers are astounding. Sorry. Money talks. I doubt that would be the case if not safe. 
    First they ignore you

    then they laugh at you 

    then they fight

    then you win 

     

    Wise man say


     


    Re: Nürburgring - Tesla vs. Taycan

    Leawood,

    for someone who ridiculed everyone on here (to death) who dares to call shifting a PDK ‘manual shifting’, I find it odd you suddenly embrace Tesla’s Autopilot. 

     


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    997.2 4S / BMW X5 40e / Donkervoort GT 


    Re: Nürburgring - Tesla vs. Taycan

    Leawood911:

    Based on my insurance premium the safety numbers are astounding. Sorry. Money talks. I doubt that would be the case if not safe. 

    Link: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cPMvQphJQiE

    ...it sounds like you haven’t reviewed any contrary evidence? Smiley


    Re: Nürburgring - Tesla vs. Taycan

    Leawood911:

    Based on my insurance premium the safety numbers are astounding. Sorry. Money talks. I doubt that would be the case if not safe. 
    First they ignore you

    then they laugh at you 

    then they fight

    then you win 

     

    Wise man say


     

    If insurance costs are so inexpensive for Teslas, why did Musk decide to enter the insurance business a few months ago?   Your statement completely undercuts what was Musk's rationale at that time.  

    Also funny that no one here has mentioned that the U.S. federal government opened an investigation into defective Tesla batteries about a week ago:  https://abcnews.go.com/Technology/federal-probe-launched-tesla-battery-defects-alarming-number/story?id=66722728 


    Re: Nürburgring - Tesla vs. Taycan

    Rennteam - The International Electric Car Forum

    Guys, it is high time to change the name. Whenever I signed in the last year, then the Tesla and the Taycan threads far outweigh all other posts together. The petrol passion seems gone. Not even the new GT4 could save your lost manliness. Heck even bluelines is checking out EV as the next ride indecision


    --

    2017 991.2 Carrera 4 GTS | GT Silver Metallic - The GT3 Killah!
    2013 Audi S3 | Glacier White


    Re: Nürburgring - Tesla vs. Taycan

    CGX car nut:
    Leawood911:

    Based on my insurance premium the safety numbers are astounding. Sorry. Money talks. I doubt that would be the case if not safe. 
    First they ignore you

    then they laugh at you 

    then they fight

    then you win 

     

    Wise man say


     

    If insurance costs are so inexpensive for Teslas, why did Musk decide to enter the insurance business a few months ago?   Your statement completely undercuts what was Musk's rationale at that time.  

    Also funny that no one here has mentioned that the U.S. federal government opened an investigation into defective Tesla batteries about a week ago:  https://abcnews.go.com/Technology/federal-probe-launched-tesla-battery-defects-alarming-number/story?id=66722728 

    I pay $850 per year for the 911 turbo, the Tesla performance and a new Honda HRV. Two drivers. Progressive. Full coverage. $1000 deductible.  What do you pay?  It was $50 more for the Azera which was a four year old $16k worth car.  
    wow a government investigation into batteries. Jail all of them now. Lol. You guys never go into any of the benefits I mention like free supercharging or return policy or over the air update.  To date not a single model 3 has caught fire. I caution against acting like Porsche has never had growing pains. I have replace many 911 motors. 2.7 liter was total crap and I grew up watching old 911s burn on the side of the Autobahn. Lol. 


    Re: Nürburgring - Tesla vs. Taycan

    Boxster Coupe GTS:
    Leawood911:

    Based on my insurance premium the safety numbers are astounding. Sorry. Money talks. I doubt that would be the case if not safe. 

    Link: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cPMvQphJQiE

    ...it sounds like you haven’t reviewed any contrary evidence? Smiley

    Do yourself a favor and learn about the tech. It is amazing. Idiots who think the car can already drive itself are basically as dumb as drunk drivers. The fact is these are the steps it takes to get there and no one else is frigging doing it. If it was not for Tesla none of this would be happening and no disruption equals all of us are at the mercy of whatever old junk they keep selling us. Wake up folks. This is good for everyone. You all sound like horse owners at the then of the century. There posts will be sooooo funny when you look them over in even a couple of years. 


    Re: Nürburgring - Tesla vs. Taycan

    spudgun:

    Leawood,

    for someone who ridiculed everyone on here (to death) who dares to call shifting a PDK ‘manual shifting’, I find it odd you suddenly embrace Tesla’s Autopilot. 

     

    And as a manual driver I will always laugh my ass off at people who can shift manually without a clutch. I don’t get your point at all. I’m not saying autopilot is manual driving cause I’m sitting in the seat. Weak argument but illustrates again you guys will look silly soon.  Too funny. Next please. 
     

    As someone who routinely crosses the country I am most likely saving my life in the long term to let auto steer assist me (my car does not have the full self driving option, it’s not for me). Auto steer is very good all by itself and saves tons of effort and concentration which fades after 20 hours of driving. 


    Re: Nürburgring - Tesla vs. Taycan

    Why always so aggressive?  yes Noone will ‘look silly soon’ because this isn’t real life. It’s a car forum. Relax.


    --

    997.2 4S / BMW X5 40e / Donkervoort GT 


    Re: Nürburgring - Tesla vs. Taycan

    bluelines:

    Rennteam - The International Electric Car Forum

    Guys, it is high time to change the name. Whenever I signed in the last year, then the Tesla and the Taycan threads far outweigh all other posts together. The petrol passion seems gone. Not even the new GT4 could save your lost manliness. Heck even bluelines is checking out EV as the next ride indecision

    Rennpussies - The International Vibrating Cars Forum?  Smiley Smiley Smiley


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    RC (Germany) - Rennteam Editor Lamborghini Huracan Performante (2019), Mercedes E63 S AMG Edition 1 (2018), Mercedes C63 S AMG Cab (2019), Range Rover Evoque Si4 Black Edition (2019)


    Re: Nürburgring - Tesla vs. Taycan

    RC:
    bluelines:

    Rennteam - The International Electric Car Forum

    Guys, it is high time to change the name. Whenever I signed in the last year, then the Tesla and the Taycan threads far outweigh all other posts together. The petrol passion seems gone. Not even the new GT4 could save your lost manliness. Heck even bluelines is checking out EV as the next ride indecision

    Rennpussies - The International Vibrating Cars Forum?  Smiley Smiley Smiley

    Smiley
    I mean, who would have thought that electric cars stir up more emotions than petrol cars Smiley  I think we are on to something. RT 3.0 Smiley


    --

    2017 991.2 Carrera 4 GTS | GT Silver Metallic - The GT3 Killah!
    2013 Audi S3 | Glacier White


    Re: Nürburgring - Tesla vs. Taycan

    bluelines:

    Rennteam - The International Electric Car Forum

    Guys, it is high time to change the name. Whenever I signed in the last year, then the Tesla and the Taycan threads far outweigh all other posts together. The petrol passion seems gone. Not even the new GT4 could save your lost manliness. Heck even bluelines is checking out EV as the next rides

    Not certain how you define aggressive?  Not meant to be and not like the comments lumping anyone who makes a positive Tesla comment in some hate group or just flat out a Pussy (RC ? You are better than that)

    Perhaps aggressive may be applied to the other side - ??  You do have to expect at some point that people will point out flawed thinking just because we care enough to inform.   Just tell me to shut up and you guys can have your circle jerk back.  It is pretty clear to anyone that you guys are totally close minded.  I just love a good debate  but it’s no fun since the arguments aimed at me are both weak and just insults.  The biggest dig I have made is my prediction that your arguments will not age well and will look funny in the future.  That’s just my opinion.  Call it aggressive if you like. 

     

     

     


    Re: Nürburgring - Tesla vs. Taycan

    ...turn up the volume! Smiley

    Link: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wCdNgTks3cs


    Re: Nürburgring - Tesla vs. Taycan

    Looks like it's fun to drive.smiley


    --

    Having everything is nice, but it's even nicer to make sure everything you've got is actually worth having.


    Re: Nürburgring - Tesla vs. Taycan

    nberry:
    MKSGR:
    nberry:
    MKSGR:
    Leawood911:

    Actually the Model 3 compares well to the Taycan. But the Taycan has less tech, safety, room, range or cost. Not to mention it is cluttered on the inside. The average model3 owner will have just as much fun or more driving than the Taycan owner. IMHO, for the savings one could go out to dinner every day.  

     

     

    Tesla 3 is a cheap and good car. Taycan is a high-end product. If you can afford a Taycan you will never consider a Tesla 3 Smiley

    Not only is this statement arrogant, it is factually wrong. You’re at grasping at straws and making you silly. There is no way to justify the price difference considering what both cars have to offer. Admit it and move on by acknowledging those who are buying the Taycan are doing so only because it’s produced by Porsche. 

    That is your opinion, trying to justify that you don‘t need money to play the real game??? I repeat: the Tesla is cheap and mostly for those who would not spend the money on the high-end product. 

    Our own Whoopsy (Nick) isn't interested in the Taycan and bought an Audi EV for half the price. Can he afford a Taycan?Smiley

    But you're right I may need a Starbucks after reading the European comments regarding the Taycan.Smiley 

     

    To be fair had I not bought the Panamera Turbo S I probably would have bought the Taycan Turbo S. But then again maybe not as the Taycan is inferior to the Panamera in all the metrics that matters to me, most importantly it's a hybrid, best of both world right now. I can be clean and silent inside the city with all the benefits provided by the city to the 'clean' cars, yet I can open it up with glorious engine sound once I am outside the city. Because of the Panamera I don't have an interest in buying the Taycan.

    And a slight correction, I bought the e-Tron for half the price of a Model X, not Taycan. Model X was the direct competitor when I shop around.

    It's my city runaround car, 0-60 makes zero sense for that usage and extended range is also pointless when I can charge at home every night. 


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    Re: Nürburgring - Tesla vs. Taycan

    Tesla is a piece of junk. Lacks durability.

    the-economics-of-driving-seven-teslas-for-2-5-million-miles


    --

    Having everything is nice, but it's even nicer to make sure everything you've got is actually worth having.


    Re: Nürburgring - Tesla vs. Taycan

    nberry:

    Tesla is a piece of junk. Lacks durability.

    the-economics-of-driving-seven-teslas-for-2-5-million-miles

    Interesting article, thanks! Smiley

    Based on this sample, it looks like they are averaging $2,767.56 in maintenance per Tesla per annum...

    81933F94-BC38-4BC0-B098-BDB467DAF747.jpeg

    86DA71A3-9DBA-4EE5-B78B-B4F386B1CD5B.jpeg

    CD110F80-7AC4-4963-898D-EBE54EB89D1A.jpeg

    2BC3B15D-B356-46F0-AD8E-79C160207638.jpeg

    ...no doubt that many taxi firms will consider switching to EVs over time... Smiley


    Re: Nürburgring - Tesla vs. Taycan

    "Software also strained under such heavy loads"

    Hmm, I didn't know software can have wear and tear.................Fancy wording for a shitting coding job.

    It ran Linux, one of the most stable long run OS. Only way for it to crash like that would be a un-corrected memory leak that accumulated over time. Failed to clear variables after use perhaps. But these are literally minor things that a regular reboot would fixed. The OS was suppose to shut down and reboot when they turn off the car and restart. 

    Had it ran Windows, then it would have been a perfectly acceptable excuse, Windows crash by itself just doing nothing anyways. 


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    Re: Nürburgring - Tesla vs. Taycan

    Whoopsy:

    "Software also strained under such heavy loads"

    Hmm, I didn't know software can have wear and tear.................Fancy wording for a shitting coding job.

    It ran Linux, one of the most stable long run OS. Only way for it to crash like that would be a un-corrected memory leak that accumulated over time. Failed to clear variables after use perhaps. But these are literally minor things that a regular reboot would fixed. The OS was suppose to shut down and reboot when they turn off the car and restart. 

    Had it ran Windows, then it would have been a perfectly acceptable excuse, Windows crash by itself just doing nothing anyways. 

    These comments are almost as ill informed as your belief that Porsche’s blended brake regen is more efficient than direct gen without friction brakes. You may get some from Porsche’s friction brakes but it’s a complication for zero reason. 
    your software comment is just silly but I love how for you Audi range and speed are just perfect. That says it all except for the return policy stuff which is an amazing ace in the hole. Not to mention that customers seem to be pretty happy. I’m guessing Tesla is happier about keeping them happy than convincing haters. Too funny guys. Keep it coming. Smiley


    Re: Nürburgring - Tesla vs. Taycan

    Thanks Nick. I wonder how much an ICE fleet costs?  Of course they won’t be nearly as safe. What’s that worth?


    Re: Nürburgring - Tesla vs. Taycan

    Leawood911:
    Whoopsy:

    "Software also strained under such heavy loads"

    Hmm, I didn't know software can have wear and tear.................Fancy wording for a shitting coding job.

    It ran Linux, one of the most stable long run OS. Only way for it to crash like that would be a un-corrected memory leak that accumulated over time. Failed to clear variables after use perhaps. But these are literally minor things that a regular reboot would fixed. The OS was suppose to shut down and reboot when they turn off the car and restart. 

    Had it ran Windows, then it would have been a perfectly acceptable excuse, Windows crash by itself just doing nothing anyways. 

    These comments are almost as ill informed as your belief that Porsche’s blended brake regen is more efficient than direct gen without friction brakes. You may get some from Porsche’s friction brakes but it’s a complication for zero reason. 
    your software comment is just silly but I love how for you Audi range and speed are just perfect. That says it all except for the return policy stuff which is an amazing ace in the hole. Not to mention that customers seem to be pretty happy. I’m guessing Tesla is happier about keeping them happy than convincing haters. Too funny guys. Keep it coming. Smiley

     

    This is simple physics dude. Energy conversion is not 100% efficient. A car moving has kinetic energy, that keeps it moving. That's the coasting part. Normal ICE cars do that, so does every other car except Tesla. 

    Since Tesla can't do brake blending, they have to resort to lift off regen, converting perfectly fine kinetic energy to electric energy with a bit of a loss every time. That's wasting perfectly good energy for no reason. The moment a Tesla driver touches the brakes the friction brake engages and all those kinetic energy are lost to heat. Every other EV/hybrids on the market has regen braking. The cars coast to conserve energy until one brakes, then those energy got converted to electricity just like a Tesla. But the driver controls how much or how little they want to convert by modulating the brake pedal. I can stop the Audi or both my Porsche hybrids using regen alone without dipping into the friction brakes. 

    Now Tesla is already has one of the most efficient electric drivetrain, that masked the energy loss during braking. But imagine Tesla can get brake blending working, they would be that much more efficient in their energy usage. They are the market leader, but they still need to innovate to stay ahead. 

    But instead of working to improve, Elon sells the one pedal driving as a 'feature' mail That's arrogant.

    I am sorry but how is that hate? It's just an observation, and a performance suggestion for Elon and his cars. 

    See what I mean from a few posts ago? You Tesla fans love to turn everything into us vs them. Whenever sometime gets pointed out, they are automatically a hater. Smiley Literally no one can critic a Tesla cause if you do you are a hater, there is no middle ground for you bunch.Smiley

    And what's the deal with return policy? For what reason I would want to return the Audi? I love the Audi and hence why I bought it in the first place. How's that an ace in the hole? Perhaps because people don't return normal cars but they do return Teslas?

    Literally whatever 'feature' you Tesla fans pointed out as over the competition doesn't work for me. Be it Supercharger, one pedal driving, long range, amazing acceleration, return policy, etc. None of those apply to me and useless to me, this is why I bought the Audi. Competition is great in market place, people doesn't need to buy into a monopoly, competitors can offer features that's different and might work for other people. I hate to buy into a monoploy and being forced fed whatever Elon decided is 'good' for customers.


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    Re: Nürburgring - Tesla vs. Taycan

    Leawood911:

    Thanks Nick. I wonder how much an ICE fleet costs?  Of course they won’t be nearly as safe. What’s that worth?

     

    My comment earlier isn't even about cost or anything. It's just pointing out the software stuff is easy to fix from Tesla if they do better QA testing in house. 

    Writing software is not rocket science, and literally in universities programming class first thing they teach is watch for memory leaks due to not keeping track of variables. This is not even the first coding bug Tesla has that they failed to correct, the other one is the well know log writing bug. 


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    Re: Nürburgring - Tesla vs. Taycan

    Whoopsy:

    And what's the deal with return policy? For what reason I would want to return the Audi? I love the Audi and hence why I bought it in the first place. How's that an ace in the hole? Perhaps because people don't return normal cars but they do return Teslas?

    Serves you right, how dare you buy an E-tron for half the money of a super sexy looking Model X minivan with that quality interior and ample service infrastructure? May the Tesla minions fall upon you for that disrespect to the leader, and having the audacity of thinking for yourself.Smiley You just wait, next year when Teslas are working as autonomous taxis for their owners like our leader promised, you will be sorry! Smiley


    --

    ⇒ Carlos - Porsche 991 Carrera GTS


    Re: Nürburgring - Tesla vs. Taycan

    If I'm not mistaken, coasting in an ELV only works good it asynchronous motors are used (like the early Tesla S/X). When using synchronous motors with permanent magnets the kinetic energy while coasting has to work against those magnets. This is one reason why Porsche put a gearbox in into the rear engine, because they can get this motor out of the drive train when running on long-range-mode. 


    Re: Nürburgring - Tesla vs. Taycan

     Btw you can make any Tesla coast like an ICE car just with a setting is you choose to do so. The point in driving a tesla is that you always use the regen and only the brake for emergencies. By never using the brake you convert all energy back into the battery. Anytime you use the friction brake energy is lost as heat.  Please explain how using blended braking can ever be more efficient than blended braking?

    As a software engineer I will ignore your silly software comment. You don’t have a clue but thats okay. It makes for a good insult for those who need the confirmation bias. 
     

    I don’t think anyone will build a car for you. Range does not matter, self driving is no good, speed is not a problem either way and it must be expensive and look good.   Not much audience for that. 
    Your return comment is priceless.  You all read that one again!!  Is it that other cars are not returned so they don’t need a return policy or is it that you can not return it and that’s why they are not returned.  Think about it. I’m still laughing. Lets imagine all automakers had a return policy. None except for Tesla would have any returns cause their so good. 

    What makes someone a tesla hater is simple. There is a middle ground. But when you use such absurd logic to arrive at such silly  conclusions (my Audi is fast enough!!) is kinda shows a little hate. Maybe Elon envy?  Smiley


    Re: Nürburgring - Tesla vs. Taycan

    schmoell:

    If I'm not mistaken, coasting in an ELV only works good it asynchronous motors are used (like the early Tesla S/X). When using synchronous motors with permanent magnets the kinetic energy while coasting has to work against those magnets. This is one reason why Porsche put a gearbox in into the rear engine, because they can get this motor out of the drive train when running on long-range-mode. 

     

    Getting the motor out of the drivetrain is as simple as adding a clutch. No EV are direct drive, it has to go through a gear set to reduce the rpm and differential function. The clutch can be build with the gearset. The 918 has such a thing for 5 years now, the front motor disengages above the rpm range, like 265km/hr

    The 2 speed gearbox is there for the balanced performance at low and high speed. Electric motor has a optimum rpm range, above that the output is greatly reduced. Using a 2 gear setup it takes the rpm back down to optimal range. Plus adding better low end acceleration.

     


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    Re: Nürburgring - Tesla vs. Taycan

    Leawood911:

     Btw you can make any Tesla coast like an ICE car just with a setting is you choose to do so. The point in driving a tesla is that you always use the regen and only the brake for emergencies. By never using the brake you convert all energy back into the battery. Anytime you use the friction brake energy is lost as heat.  Please explain how using blended braking can ever be more efficient than blended braking?

    As a software engineer I will ignore your silly software comment. You don’t have a clue but thats okay. It makes for a good insult for those who need the confirmation bias. 
     

    I don’t think anyone will build a car for you. Range does not matter, self driving is no good, speed is not a problem either way and it must be expensive and look good.   Not much audience for that. 
    Your return comment is priceless.  You all read that one again!!  Is it that other cars are not returned so they don’t need a return policy or is it that you can not return it and that’s why they are not returned.  Think about it. I’m still laughing. Lets imagine all automakers had a return policy. None except for Tesla would have any returns cause their so good. 

    What makes someone a tesla hater is simple. There is a middle ground. But when you use such absurd logic to arrive at such silly  conclusions (my Audi is fast enough!!) is kinda shows a little hate. Maybe Elon envy?  Smiley

     

    Either you can't read or can't comprehend or really ignorant or literally brain washed by Elon.

    Which part of regen braking and blended braking you didn't quite understands? Whenever you press the brake pedal, the initial part of the travel activate regen braking and without using the friction brakes. In my 918 it's 0.5g, in the Panamera it's 0.4g and so is the Taycan. Audi didn't published the figure but it feels about the same as my Panamera so ~0.4g. Do you know how hard 0.4g braking is? That's harder than normal city braking. Literally one can drive them all week all month without activating the friction brakes. There is a energy gauge right there on the instrument cluster, one can literally use it to moderate the braking to stay within regen zone.  If one is in a emergency or whatever, the extra brake pressure beyond 0.4g will be diverted to the physical friction brakes. This is one reason the 918 was so amazing with it's brakes, it does not ever fade unlike in a P1 on track, literally the carbon brakes are only doing 2/3 of the work of the brakes in a P1.

    In a Tesla, the moment you touches the brake pedal, regen is turned off and friction brakes takes over. That's total energy loss. And it happens if someone turned off the un-natural 'one pedal driving' 'feature' of a Tesla to make it drives like a normal car. 

    Ah, another assumption from you. You are a software engineer huh? That's cool. Back in the days at it's peak i had ~500 of them working for me in my IT outsourcing company, sold it to IBM. I studied computer science in university and it's how I made my first bucket of gold. I critic software engiineers' work and send them back to re-code for a living. 

    Oh and about that Audi, it's an EV, that means it's a city people mover car, how fast do I need to be in city traffic? Heck my Honda Ridgeline is fast enough too, I need it to haul stuff. You want to diss that truck too? I have enough toys that goes 0-60 under 3 seconds or top 200mph in top speed or break 1.2g in lateral g. The Audi does over 329km per charge, that's over 3 weeks worth of city driving for me, anything more is overkilled and a waste of money to buy longer range.

    Oh did you know the Audi is almost half the price of a comparable Model X? Literally it looks expensive and nicely finished and it looks good but cost LESS than a comparable Tesla? 

    I have bought over 60 cars already, not a since one of them I had wanted to return (Well maybe the lone Lexus but that's another story) Like if I know I might return the car, I wouldn't even buy it in the first place isn't it? Do a test drive and that will tell me all I need to know if a car is right or not, that plus all the research before even buying a car.

    The only middle ground Tesla people would accept is that while I don't have a Tesla, I won't criticize them either as Elon is god and his cars are the greatest and I might even suck his dick. 

    I criticize Porsche plenty already, and Ferrari, AND Lamborghini, AM I a hater of Porsche Ferrari Lamborghini? Shit I even says bad things about Pagani too, so am I a Pagani hater also? But I am friends with Chris Pagani though........................

     


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    Re: Nürburgring - Tesla vs. Taycan

    Whoopsy:
    schmoell:

    If I'm not mistaken, coasting in an ELV only works good it asynchronous motors are used (like the early Tesla S/X). When using synchronous motors with permanent magnets the kinetic energy while coasting has to work against those magnets. This is one reason why Porsche put a gearbox in into the rear engine, because they can get this motor out of the drive train when running on long-range-mode. 

    Getting the motor out of the drivetrain is as simple as adding a clutch. No EV are direct drive, it has to go through a gear set to reduce the rpm and differential function. The clutch can be build with the gearset. The 918 has such a thing for 5 years now, the front motor disengages above the rpm range, like 265km/hr

    The 2 speed gearbox is there for the balanced performance at low and high speed. Electric motor has a optimum rpm range, above that the output is greatly reduced. Using a 2 gear setup it takes the rpm back down to optimal range. Plus adding better low end acceleration.

    This video includes a few interesting comments on the Taycan drivetrain...

    Link: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TzkdrdwQvls

    Smiley


    Re: Nürburgring - Tesla vs. Taycan

    Whoopsy:
    Leawood911:

     Btw you can make any Tesla coast like an ICE car just with a setting is you choose to do so. The point in driving a tesla is that you always use the regen and only the brake for emergencies. By never using the brake you convert all energy back into the battery. Anytime you use the friction brake energy is lost as heat.  Please explain how using blended braking can ever be more efficient than blended braking?

    As a software engineer I will ignore your silly software comment. You don’t have a clue but thats okay. It makes for a good insult for those who need the confirmation bias. 
     

    I don’t think anyone will build a car for you. Range does not matter, self driving is no good, speed is not a problem either way and it must be expensive and look good.   Not much audience for that. 
    Your return comment is priceless.  You all read that one again!!  Is it that other cars are not returned so they don’t need a return policy or is it that you can not return it and that’s why they are not returned.  Think about it. I’m still laughing. Lets imagine all automakers had a return policy. None except for Tesla would have any returns cause their so good. 

    What makes someone a tesla hater is simple. There is a middle ground. But when you use such absurd logic to arrive at such silly  conclusions (my Audi is fast enough!!) is kinda shows a little hate. Maybe Elon envy?  Smiley

     

    Either you can't read or can't comprehend or really ignorant or literally brain washed by Elon.

    Which part of regen braking and blended braking you didn't quite understands? Whenever you press the brake pedal, the initial part of the travel activate regen braking and without using the friction brakes. In my 918 it's 0.5g, in the Panamera it's 0.4g and so is the Taycan. Audi didn't published the figure but it feels about the same as my Panamera so ~0.4g. Do you know how hard 0.4g braking is? That's harder than normal city braking. Literally one can drive them all week all month without activating the friction brakes. There is a energy gauge right there on the instrument cluster, one can literally use it to moderate the braking to stay within regen zone.  If one is in a emergency or whatever, the extra brake pressure beyond 0.4g will be diverted to the physical friction brakes. This is one reason the 918 was so amazing with it's brakes, it does not ever fade unlike in a P1 on track, literally the carbon brakes are only doing 2/3 of the work of the brakes in a P1.

    In a Tesla, the moment you touches the brake pedal, regen is turned off and friction brakes takes over. That's total energy loss. And it happens if someone turned off the un-natural 'one pedal driving' 'feature' of a Tesla to make it drives like a normal car. 

    Ah, another assumption from you. You are a software engineer huh? That's cool. Back in the days at it's peak i had ~500 of them working for me in my IT outsourcing company, sold it to IBM. I studied computer science in university and it's how I made my first bucket of gold. I critic software engiineers' work and send them back to re-code for a living. 

    Oh and about that Audi, it's an EV, that means it's a city people mover car, how fast do I need to be in city traffic? Heck my Honda Ridgeline is fast enough too, I need it to haul stuff. You want to diss that truck too? I have enough toys that goes 0-60 under 3 seconds or top 200mph in top speed or break 1.2g in lateral g. The Audi does over 329km per charge, that's over 3 weeks worth of city driving for me, anything more is overkilled and a waste of money to buy longer range.

    Oh did you know the Audi is almost half the price of a comparable Model X? Literally it looks expensive and nicely finished and it looks good but cost LESS than a comparable Tesla? 

    I have bought over 60 cars already, not a since one of them I had wanted to return (Well maybe the lone Lexus but that's another story) Like if I know I might return the car, I wouldn't even buy it in the first place isn't it? Do a test drive and that will tell me all I need to know if a car is right or not, that plus all the research before even buying a car.

    The only middle ground Tesla people would accept is that while I don't have a Tesla, I won't criticize them either as Elon is god and his cars are the greatest and I might even suck his dick. 

    I criticize Porsche plenty already, and Ferrari, AND Lamborghini, AM I a hater of Porsche Ferrari Lamborghini? Shit I even says bad things about Pagani too, so am I a Pagani hater also? But I am friends with Chris Pagani though........................

     

    Sorry about my tone. I know nothing about how the Porsche regen works. I do know you can switch it off in the Tesla or at least reduce it a lot. If you don’t use the brake in the Tesla ( one pedal driving) the. you must/may agree that the regen is pretty darn efficient compared to any other solution.  I don’t think they spent much time combing the brake systems because the ultimate goal is to never use the brake. Not a big deal to me but it may be to you. 


    The point in returning cars is not how many you would have returned. It is a point that no other makes dare such an offer. Not everyone buys the type of cars you do.  I think this point is now cleared up. 

    If you know software then you know that there is not enough information in that article for you to speculate about the software issue, its cause or what the solution might be. If it were as simple as you say then ...  Again, your speculation is what I question not your wealth. I’m really not in your league but that’s fine with me. I still get a tiny opinion. 

    Regarding your Audi choice, I am all in favor of you liking it. Not many would not care about the things you care about or dismiss as worthless the features you don’t need like speed or range or safety. Most are a bit different in what they use to determine their car or choice.  I’m happy you like your car. Your points are valid for you and your needs. Mine are just okay for me and of course since I’m a nice guy I like to share my pleasant discoveries.  
    Regarding Elon. I have watched countless interviews of him and I have never witnessed a more calm, thoughtful, intelligent and visionary person.  He speaks very softly and with much command of the topic. His accomplishments are certainly tremendous. I get why someone like that makes lofty statements and set high goals. Including impossible time tables.  Of all the human beings on the planet he not only sounds genuinely concerned about making the world better but he has done a lot to fix it. He is a tireless worked and good father. I fail to see how being impressed by him and admiring his work is a bad thing on any conceivable level. I don’t get the dislike of the guy at all. I should not even like him because I certainly don’t agree with him on many levels like climate change but at least he does something useful about it and does not just play politics. 

    I know this is a car forum. To me that’s anything with four wheels. I did not know this was a internal combustion forum. Smiley  Time to spread the love for all type of cars. 


     
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