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    Re: Welcome to the new Taycan Forum!

    WoP:

    I was debating a Taycan Turbo to replace the Model 3. But with the arrival of Model S Plaid+ I just cannot get myself to pay so much for the Taycan. Even though it's still the much nicer car with much nicer extras. But the performance and range gap to the Model S is getting ridiculous for the price.

    Smiley
     


    --

    2016 Porsche 981 GT4 | Racing Yellow
    2018 Audi S6 Avant | Ibis White


    Re: Welcome to the new Taycan Forum!

    CGX car nut:
    Gnil:
    CGX car nut:
    Gnil:

    Recommended resting times when driving a car on long distances  is 15 to 20 minutes every 2 hours . That solves the charging time ' vaste ' problem .

    Do you realize, pre-pandemic, it often took longer than 2 hours to get from the downtown area to the airport in most major U.S. metropolitan areas?  Using your heuristics, people would need to take rest stops driving to work. 

    People can choose not to follow recommended resting times. They increase the probability of having an accidents. 

     Can't be good for your sanity having to sit in 4h congested traffic every day for work. You end up probably frustrated ,angry, tired. Not good..... 

    On the matter, we were talking about long day drives/road trips  . Not commutes. 


    --

     

     964 Carrera 4 --  997.2 C2S , -20mm -- 991.2 GT3 RS 

     

    Moving goal posts; got it. 

    Following up on your logic.  Smiley


    --

     964 Carrera 4 --  997.2 C2S , -20mm -- 991.2 GT3 RS 


    Re: Welcome to the new Taycan Forum!

    Gnil:
    CGX car nut:
    Gnil:
    CGX car nut:
    Gnil:

    Recommended resting times when driving a car on long distances  is 15 to 20 minutes every 2 hours . That solves the charging time ' vaste ' problem .

    Do you realize, pre-pandemic, it often took longer than 2 hours to get from the downtown area to the airport in most major U.S. metropolitan areas?  Using your heuristics, people would need to take rest stops driving to work. 

    People can choose not to follow recommended resting times. They increase the probability of having an accidents. 

     Can't be good for your sanity having to sit in 4h congested traffic every day for work. You end up probably frustrated ,angry, tired. Not good..... 

    On the matter, we were talking about long day drives/road trips  . Not commutes. 


    --

     

     964 Carrera 4 --  997.2 C2S , -20mm -- 991.2 GT3 RS 

     

    Moving goal posts; got it. 

    Following up on your logic.  Smiley

    One posted the reality of living in a large U.S. metropolitan areas with populations greater than that of entire country of Switzerland. 


    Re: Welcome to the new Taycan Forum!

    WoP:

    Let me throw in my experience with the Model 3 here. 250 miles/400 km only in the summer, driven very slowly (85 mph already too fast) and no rain! Plus the car must be at 100% SOC when starting. A 20 minutes charge on an ionity charger maybe gets you from 20% to 80%. Driving a 250 miles leg on a 20 minute charge is impossible. I do admit there are no V3 superchargers here but the general charge curve doesn't change.

    The Model 3 has a high peak charge performance but drops off very fast. At 65% SOC you're already down to 100kw. 85% less than 50kw. In comparison Audi e-tron at 65% still 150kw (until almost 80% SOC). @85% still just below 100kw (Fastned has very interesting charging diagrams for various models). So the peak charging performance on a Tesla doesn't really tell you much ... Elon is a marketing genius.

    Sorry for the technical post ...

    Back to the Taycan topic. I was debating a Taycan Turbo to replace the Model 3. But with the arrival of Model S Plaid+ I just cannot get myself to pay so much for the Taycan. Even though it's still the much nicer car with much nicer extras. But the performance and range gap to the Model S is getting ridiculous for the price.

    Cheers,
    Wolfgang

     

    Teslas are very SoC sensitive for their charging rate, even the Taycan is that way also but less sensitive. For the e-Tron it really doesn't matter the SoC when plugged in, you get the same fast rate. 

    Basically Audi designed the e-Tron to be the perfect city EV, you can just plug it in whenever and get fast charge for top ups. 

    Think Bjorn did a video on the charing speed between Model 3, Taycan and e-Tron. The e-Tron finished not far behind the Taycan but both leave the Model 3 in the dust. So headline grabbing peak speed published are mostly meaningless.

     


    --

     

     


    Re: Welcome to the new Taycan Forum!

    Gnil:

    Recommended resting times when driving a car on long distances  is 15 to 20 minutes every 2 hours . That solves the charging time ' vaste ' problem .

    Our long drives are always at 1.5 hour driver switches- co driver gets 1.5 hour rests all day.  Typically one 10 minute gas refill in a 7 hour drive to the neighboring province.  Using EVs for this, would mean we fly.....


    --

    2017 Range Rover Sport S/C,  2019 Porsche 911 Turbo


    Re: Welcome to the new Taycan Forum!

    Whoopsy:
    WoP:

    Let me throw in my experience with the Model 3 here. 250 miles/400 km only in the summer, driven very slowly (85 mph already too fast) and no rain! Plus the car must be at 100% SOC when starting. A 20 minutes charge on an ionity charger maybe gets you from 20% to 80%. Driving a 250 miles leg on a 20 minute charge is impossible. I do admit there are no V3 superchargers here but the general charge curve doesn't change.

    The Model 3 has a high peak charge performance but drops off very fast. At 65% SOC you're already down to 100kw. 85% less than 50kw. In comparison Audi e-tron at 65% still 150kw (until almost 80% SOC). @85% still just below 100kw (Fastned has very interesting charging diagrams for various models). So the peak charging performance on a Tesla doesn't really tell you much ... Elon is a marketing genius.

    Sorry for the technical post ...

    Back to the Taycan topic. I was debating a Taycan Turbo to replace the Model 3. But with the arrival of Model S Plaid+ I just cannot get myself to pay so much for the Taycan. Even though it's still the much nicer car with much nicer extras. But the performance and range gap to the Model S is getting ridiculous for the price.

    Cheers,
    Wolfgang

     

    Teslas are very SoC sensitive for their charging rate, even the Taycan is that way also but less sensitive. For the e-Tron it really doesn't matter the SoC when plugged in, you get the same fast rate. 

    Basically Audi designed the e-Tron to be the perfect city EV, you can just plug it in whenever and get fast charge for top ups. 

    Think Bjorn did a video on the charing speed between Model 3, Taycan and e-Tron. The e-Tron finished not far behind the Taycan but both leave the Model 3 in the dust. So headline grabbing peak speed published are mostly meaningless.

     

    Audi worked to remove driver guesswork out of recharging.  This is why Audi has included a significant buffer in the battery pack and this is an example of the various tradeoffs made in the product design and development phases. 


    Re: Welcome to the new Taycan Forum!

    Leawood911:

    Hi Wolfgang. I miss Austria and their autobahn. But it is speed limited like everywhere other than Germany. How much longer will Germany we unlimited?  Here my range was predicated at max of 70mph which is vastly more efficient than 85 mph (not counting your passes at 100 mph). So I agree, range for you is not the same as I would expect

    Not just Autobahn though, I do a couple of 300km/200m trips a week with a couple of additional small drives in that week. I would be absolutely miserable if I had to muck along at 70mph in those drives, its more like 90mph, so in my case I could not trust your model3 to get me home at the end of the day on a full charge either, on the GTS with the 90L tank I do all that with stopping 5 minutes to refill once in the whole week. EVs workout for you and many other people, but EVs are far from prime time. 


    --

    ⇒ Carlos - Porsche 991 Carrera GTS


    Re: Welcome to the new Taycan Forum!

    Whoopsy:
    WoP:

    Let me throw in my experience with the Model 3 here. 250 miles/400 km only in the summer, driven very slowly (85 mph already too fast) and no rain! Plus the car must be at 100% SOC when starting. A 20 minutes charge on an ionity charger maybe gets you from 20% to 80%. Driving a 250 miles leg on a 20 minute charge is impossible. I do admit there are no V3 superchargers here but the general charge curve doesn't change.

    The Model 3 has a high peak charge performance but drops off very fast. At 65% SOC you're already down to 100kw. 85% less than 50kw. In comparison Audi e-tron at 65% still 150kw (until almost 80% SOC). @85% still just below 100kw (Fastned has very interesting charging diagrams for various models). So the peak charging performance on a Tesla doesn't really tell you much ... Elon is a marketing genius.

    Sorry for the technical post ...

    Back to the Taycan topic. I was debating a Taycan Turbo to replace the Model 3. But with the arrival of Model S Plaid+ I just cannot get myself to pay so much for the Taycan. Even though it's still the much nicer car with much nicer extras. But the performance and range gap to the Model S is getting ridiculous for the price.

    Cheers,
    Wolfgang

     

    Teslas are very SoC sensitive for their charging rate, even the Taycan is that way also but less sensitive. For the e-Tron it really doesn't matter the SoC when plugged in, you get the same fast rate. 

    Basically Audi designed the e-Tron to be the perfect city EV, you can just plug it in whenever and get fast charge for top ups. 

    Think Bjorn did a video on the charing speed between Model 3, Taycan and e-Tron. The e-Tron finished not far behind the Taycan but both leave the Model 3 in the dust. So headline grabbing peak speed published are mostly meaningless.

     

    If you don’t actually count efficiency.  That is miles per minute vs KW per minute. 


    Re: Welcome to the new Taycan Forum!

    Anything below 90mph is unacceptable in my view.
    An EV needs to cover at least 400 miles at speeds of 100mph before it becomes competitive in my view. 


    Re: Welcome to the new Taycan Forum!

    Leawood911:
    Whoopsy:
    WoP:

    Let me throw in my experience with the Model 3 here. 250 miles/400 km only in the summer, driven very slowly (85 mph already too fast) and no rain! Plus the car must be at 100% SOC when starting. A 20 minutes charge on an ionity charger maybe gets you from 20% to 80%. Driving a 250 miles leg on a 20 minute charge is impossible. I do admit there are no V3 superchargers here but the general charge curve doesn't change.

    The Model 3 has a high peak charge performance but drops off very fast. At 65% SOC you're already down to 100kw. 85% less than 50kw. In comparison Audi e-tron at 65% still 150kw (until almost 80% SOC). @85% still just below 100kw (Fastned has very interesting charging diagrams for various models). So the peak charging performance on a Tesla doesn't really tell you much ... Elon is a marketing genius.

    Sorry for the technical post ...

    Back to the Taycan topic. I was debating a Taycan Turbo to replace the Model 3. But with the arrival of Model S Plaid+ I just cannot get myself to pay so much for the Taycan. Even though it's still the much nicer car with much nicer extras. But the performance and range gap to the Model S is getting ridiculous for the price.

    Cheers,
    Wolfgang

     

    Teslas are very SoC sensitive for their charging rate, even the Taycan is that way also but less sensitive. For the e-Tron it really doesn't matter the SoC when plugged in, you get the same fast rate. 

    Basically Audi designed the e-Tron to be the perfect city EV, you can just plug it in whenever and get fast charge for top ups. 

    Think Bjorn did a video on the charing speed between Model 3, Taycan and e-Tron. The e-Tron finished not far behind the Taycan but both leave the Model 3 in the dust. So headline grabbing peak speed published are mostly meaningless.

     

    If you don’t actually count efficiency.  That is miles per minute vs KW per minute. 

     

    Do you check to see if your iPhone has how many minutes left for it's battery or how many % left? Let me repaves that, do you do minutes per Watt charging on your phone or do you go by % charging? I know if my phone is at 10%, I plug it in, in about 15mins it should be around 40-50%. Or you would rather have the phone tell you in that 15mins of charging you gained 4hrs of talk time or 4 hrs of Youtube play time? How about your cordless drill? How would you feel if the battery charger tells you drill rotations instead of battery capacity per minute charged?

    miles per minute is a meaningless metric. Driving speed, traffic, ambient temperature, equipment used inside the car can change that. 

    100% charge in the summer also doesn't equal to the same 100% charge in winter for range, but the charger's 'mile per minute' display don't account for that. 

    SoC is a much more useful metric. 

    Don't forget, Model 3 has a smaller battery yet it still charges slower than the other 2 with a bigger battery. There is more electrical throughput in the Audi and Porsche. 


    --

     

     


    Re: Welcome to the new Taycan Forum!

    He guys, a small deviation from your charging discussions. Just received (in one week) two additions to my garage. A Taycan Turbo and a 911 992 Turbo. Both cars are great. The Taycan is an amazing smooth and very fast car driving car. Great to drive, and easy to chargeindecision. The 992 Turbo impresses me perhaps a bit more. Compared to the 991-2 Turbo this is again a hugh improvement. Less a sports car but more a GT. But if you turn the driving mode to Sport plus a beast.

    For me the Taycan is a taste of what is to come and where the future will be. The 911 Turbo on the other hand feels like to last real EC super Porsche.

     

    IMG_0753.jpeg


    Re: Welcome to the new Taycan Forum!

    Dolomite Silver! Same as my car!! indecision


    --

     

     


    Re: Welcome to the new Taycan Forum!

    Good choice! I like to color a lot looks good on a Taycan, one more picture on the first dry day in weeks here in Belgium

    IMG_0751.jpeg

     

     


    Re: Welcome to the new Taycan Forum!

    Wonderful cars!  Congratulations!  


    Re: Welcome to the new Taycan Forum!

    fantastic combo


    Re: Welcome to the new Taycan Forum!

    Congratulations and that garage answers why Porsche offers a multitude of gray, silver, and black paint choices.  


    Re: Welcome to the new Taycan Forum!

    992 Turbo is green is it not?


    --

    991 Carrera Black Edition, X3 Black\Black - 2 kids, 1 dog


    Re: Welcome to the new Taycan Forum!

    It appears grey on my MacBook Pro.


    Re: Welcome to the new Taycan Forum!

    No its as agaat grey, enclosed a better picture

    E79DBE97-348E-4FAD-AF64-2D88A80E1D22.jpegFF684703-EB43-425F-A650-B58239DC93F5.jpeg

     


    Re: Welcome to the new Taycan Forum!

    Congratulations. It's like getting two birthday cakes, you don't have enough stomach to eat as much as you like of both kiss


    --

     

     964 Carrera 4 --  997.2 C2S , -20mm -- 991.2 GT3 RS 

     


    Re: Welcome to the new Taycan Forum!

    Love Agate Grey👍


    Re: Welcome to the new Taycan Forum!

    That interior is stunning.


    Re: Welcome to the new Taycan Forum!

    This car was on stock at Porsche Dusseldorf. The car is with almost all options available. Got a good discount and the new one and a really good price for the “old” 911 Turbo (5 year old). 


    Re: Welcome to the new Taycan Forum!

    Congrats ! Nice looking garage doors too. 


    Re: Welcome to the new Taycan Forum!

    JR-550:

    No its as agaat grey, enclosed a better picture

    E79DBE97-348E-4FAD-AF64-2D88A80E1D22.jpegFF684703-EB43-425F-A650-B58239DC93F5.jpeg

     

    Great ! Finally, some pics of new porsche models ! Congrats and enjoy in good health ! Smiley


    Re: Welcome to the new Taycan Forum!

    They look amazing!  Beautiful 🤩 

    nice pair. 
     


    Re: Welcome to the new Taycan Forum!

    Btw - IMHO the number of miles per hour a car can charge is an important measure - especially if speed and acceleration is similar when comparing two cars. 
     This would be the same as comparing top speed or 0-60 which is especially useful if cars get similar gas mileage. 
     

    In other words if an EV charges at a lower number of miles per hour and has worse performance that can’t be good. Even if it can stuff more kWh into the battery.  This would be like bragging that an ICE car goes almost as fast but can consume fuel faster. 


    Re: Welcome to the new Taycan Forum!

    lovely pair of cars


    --
    Speed has never killed anyone, suddenly becoming stationary... That's what gets you.

    Re: Welcome to the new Taycan Forum!

    Hard to find a more pleasing pair, congratskiss


    Re: Welcome to the new Taycan Forum!

    WoP:

    Let me throw in my experience with the Model 3 here. 250 miles/400 km only in the summer, driven very slowly (85 mph already too fast) and no rain! Plus the car must be at 100% SOC when starting. A 20 minutes charge on an ionity charger maybe gets you from 20% to 80%. Driving a 250 miles leg on a 20 minute charge is impossible. I do admit there are no V3 superchargers here but the general charge curve doesn't change.

    The Model 3 has a high peak charge performance but drops off very fast. At 65% SOC you're already down to 100kw. 85% less than 50kw. In comparison Audi e-tron at 65% still 150kw (until almost 80% SOC). @85% still just below 100kw (Fastned has very interesting charging diagrams for various models). So the peak charging performance on a Tesla doesn't really tell you much ... Elon is a marketing genius.

    Sorry for the technical post ...

    Back to the Taycan topic. I was debating a Taycan Turbo to replace the Model 3. But with the arrival of Model S Plaid+ I just cannot get myself to pay so much for the Taycan. Even though it's still the much nicer car with much nicer extras. But the performance and range gap to the Model S is getting ridiculous for the price.

    Cheers,
    Wolfgang

    Very interesting, Wolfgang. Thanks for sharing. Smiley

    I love the Taycan Turbo S and before I got my Trackhawk (I know, a dinosaur and as anti-Tesla as it gets Smiley), I considered a Taycan Turbo S or a Turbo, maybe even a 4S (lease rates were really high for the "Turbo" models). Looking at Tesla S Plaid performance, I wouldn't get the Taycan either. Out of principle. Yes, the Taycan is beautiful, the quality level is very high and it is really a very nice and sporty EV. Not for double the money of a Tesla S Plaid and with a worse performance, sorry.

    Once my Trackhawk lease runs out in around 4 years, I will very likely choose an EV. Not because I want it but because it probably will make sense in 4 years, from various perspectives. My experience with US cars hasn't always been positive and while they are fun to drive, those little quality issues sometimes drive me mad. My Trackhawk has now 2500 km and I love it but it started squeaking from the rear axle a few weeks ago, especially when it rained and it drove me nuts, especially since my mechanic couldn't find the culprit (he just put some silicon spray on every part he believed was involved and he was done but it didn't help). Yesterday, we found the culprit (different mechanic with more brain Smiley): A simple plastic cover on a rear damper. A little bit of grease on it and the noise was gone. I will get a new damper next month, with the oil exchange. Nothing really big or to worry about but these little things can be very annoying.  


    --

    RC (Germany) - Rennteam Editor Lamborghini Huracan Performante (2019), Mercedes GLC63 S AMG (2020), Mercedes C63 S AMG Cab (2019), Jeep Grand Cherokee Trackhawk (2019 EU)


     
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