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    Re: So what kind of numbers will Car&Driver get?

    The numbers Porsche gives for engine output and accelleration are minimums with a new engine.

    Obviously, some of their cars test better with more time on their engines.

    Whats annoying is that seemingly all magazines, except for Excellence, never state the odometer mileage of the cars they test.

    Re: So what kind of numbers will Car&Driver get?

    Quote:
    RC said:
    Because people still seem to suffer from some sort of "dillusion"? Due to the high torque, abuse will be either "limited" (electronically) or "punished" (destroyed clutch disc). I'd say that both may be involved.




    I don't think C&D cares.

    Quote:
    RC said:
    But funny enough, I think that US magazines will mostly ask for manual tranny equipped cars, so there won't be a real back to back comparison available. I hope somebody proves me wrong though.



    I wouldn't be surprised if they made an exception, in this case.

    Re: So what kind of numbers will Car&Driver get?

    Quote:
    nberry said:
    Do you guy's have any idea what it takes to get a 3300 lb car to 60mph in less than 3.5 sec? Evey tenth of a second is precious and all the stars will have to align to get those type of numbers. If they bring it in around 3.7 it will be quite an achievement.



    Porsche already anounced a 3.7 second time. It had better be the minimum time, as JimFlat6 mentions above. C&D will no doubt do better than this time.

    Re: So what kind of numbers will Car&Driver get?

    Quote:
    devo said:
    Actually yes. The car weighs 3500 lbs. so it would more of an achievement. I think Porsches's claim will be replicated and they have posted these times. As far as the lower numbers, I feel C&D will manipulate better numbers to sell more rags.
    Finally, 3.4, 3.7, whatever, it's FAST. I personally don't care at all about 0-60. It's not an acurate inidicator of a car's performance/speed. 20-120, is more like it, nailing it exiting a hairpin, etc... u know what I mean.



    I agree. I'm more interested in 0-200 Km/h and 1/4 mile times. Separates the men from the boys... But the original question asked for 0-60 predictions and I don't recall seeing an official 1/4 mile time from Porsche.

    Re: So what kind of numbers will Car&Driver get?

    Quote:
    devo said:
    Don't take me literally when I say milliseconds. I'm fully aware of C&D's 997S test. I aslo own one. If I had to predict, I'd take two-four tenths of second off of Porsche's claims.




    That's what I did... for the manual. The reason I didn't for the tip is because I believe that the performance can't be improved as much.

    Re: So what kind of numbers will Car&Driver get?

    Quote:
    devo said:
    If you still believe that a manual will go to 60 faster than tip, you should read some of the many threads by other members who have more knowledge re: the matter than I do.



    I've read every post. I'm kinda pathetic.

    Re: So what kind of numbers will Car&Driver get?

    Quote:
    devo said:
    Is the M6 that fast?


    Yes, it is that fast...

    Re: So what kind of numbers will Car&Driver get?

    Quote:
    SoCal Alan said:
    Quote:
    nberry said:
    Do you guy's have any idea what it takes to get a 3300 lb car to 60mph in less than 3.5 sec? Evey tenth of a second is precious and all the stars will have to align to get those type of numbers. If they bring it in around 3.7 it will be quite an achievement.



    Porsche already anounced a 3.7 second time. It had better be the minimum time, as JimFlat6 mentions above. C&D will no doubt do better than this time.



    Re: So what kind of numbers will Car&Driver get?

    Quote:
    Turbo Al said:
    Remember, guys, the 997TT-TipS is pre-boosted, and with those VTG's, that means CONSTANT torque of 500lb-ft/680Nm+ (with overboost) from launch to 100mph/160kph. What Porsche needs to do for a faster 6-speed manual is to tune it up to over 520 peak HP and 550lb-ft/750Nm torque, and then I'd upgrade the clutch-like the Sachs GT1/level 2 I put in my upgraded 996TTS-it's a piece of cake to operate with the OEM dual mass flywheel-can you say 997Turbo S ?



    Al, I've only driven a 996TT in tiptronic (my neighbor is quite the GT afficiando ). Can you tell me how heavy the flywheel feels on the manual and exactly why you were interested in upgrading it and the clutch?

    Thanks,

    Hurst

    Re: So what kind of numbers will Car&Driver get?

    Quote:
    Hurst said:
    Quote:
    Turbo Al said:
    Remember, guys, the 997TT-TipS is pre-boosted, and with those VTG's, that means CONSTANT torque of 500lb-ft/680Nm+ (with overboost) from launch to 100mph/160kph. What Porsche needs to do for a faster 6-speed manual is to tune it up to over 520 peak HP and 550lb-ft/750Nm torque, and then I'd upgrade the clutch-like the Sachs GT1/level 2 I put in my upgraded 996TTS-it's a piece of cake to operate with the OEM dual mass flywheel-can you say 997Turbo S ?



    Al, I've only driven a 996TT in tiptronic (my neighbor is quite the GT afficiando ). Can you tell me how heavy the flywheel feels on the manual and exactly why you were interested in upgrading it and the clutch?

    Thanks,

    Hurst



    Hurst,

    I upgraded my 996TTS (TSCab) with an EVO stage 4 package with a GIAC engine chip for peak HP of 600, peak torque of 600+ lb-ft/800+Nm. The only mechanical mods. were a change of the headers, blow-off/diverter valves, connecting hoses, sport exhaust with 100cell cats, and Venturi flow airbox, using the stock turbo's (K24's) boosted to 1.2BAR. That extra torque (800+Nm) at 4,000rpm's is more than the stock clutch could handle. I had the mechanic who did the install test it and he could feel the clutch slip, so I changed to the Sachs GT1/level 2 street clutch to handle the extra torque. I decided to keep the stock dual mass flywheel, rather than change to a lightweight flywheel, since the advantages of the lightweight flywheel (more throttle response, especially at low rev's) didn't seem worth the extra noise and since the car is now plenty fast with the upgrade. I use this car as my summertime "daily driver" (I won't track this car, only my Noble M400-due in April after some minor "modifications" ), and my reason for upgrading it was for pure exhilaration and fun. I drove it last weekend as we had some clear weather. Man, what a blast, it's rated with the mods. good for 0-60mph in 3.8 and 0-100mph in 7.6, and it felt like it! When spring comes, I'll try to GPS some times to see how fast I can push her. Bottom line, I have NO difficulty driving the car with the stock clutch or the Sachs clutch with the dual mass flywheel-it is only slightly heavier feeling with the the stock flywheel, in some ways preferable to the stock clutch since it feels more firm-and no slippage yet. Occasionally a lightweight flywheel can be trickier to operate for some if they are not proficient at driving a stick, but I haven't tried the lightweight flywheel in this car. I am putting one in my Noble this spring-I'll write a review of that car for rennteam once it arrives (April or May at the latest).

    Re: So what kind of numbers will Car&Driver get?

    Now that is what I call a reply

    Re: So what kind of numbers will Car&Driver get?

    I have the '05 GT3 pressure plate and disk with the 964 RS lightweight flywheel. The improvement in engine response is huge! The car is without question faster with the LWFW...it's ~17 lbs lighter than the OEM dual mass unit.

    I had been considering an upgrade from my present Stage 2 to the Stage 4 program, but right now I'm happy with what the LWFW did in improving the car's acceleration.

    Re: So what kind of numbers will Car&Driver get?

    What you get with the LWFW is RIGHT NOW throttle response.

    Of any mods you can do to a current model Porsche, changing to a LWFW is the best one.

    It so drastically changes the car and how you drive it, that you will kick yourself for not having done it sooner.

    The only reason current Porsches do not have single mass flywheels in them is to please the luxury car buyers who need to be coddled with less mechanical feeling, slightly less noise and.... to delay throttle response so they will not be shocked that they bought a jldsdsdff fast sports car!

    And the single mass flywheel is not that noisy anyway!

    Of all the things they have done to 911s over the years in the name of making it more "desireable," the dual mass flywheel is their biggest crime!


    Re: So what kind of numbers will Car&Driver get?

    Quote:
    JimFlat6 said:
    What you get with the LWFW is RIGHT NOW throttle response.

    Of any mods you can do to a current model Porsche, changing to a LWFW is the best one. It so drastically changes the car
    and how you drive it, that you will kick yourself for not
    having done it sooner.

    The only reason current Porsches do not have single mass flywheels in them is to please the luxury car buyers who need to be coddled with less mechanical feeling, slightly less noise and.... to delay throttle response so they will not be shocked that they bought a performance sports car!

    And the single mass flywheel is not that noisy anyway!

    Of all the things they have done to 911s over the years in the name of making it more "desireable," the dual mass flywheel is their biggest crime!





    Dock and Jim,

    I AM considering changing to a lightweight flywheel in the future-if I get bored with the car's current performance abilities.

    Re: So what kind of numbers will Car&Driver get?

    Al, thats not enough to get you off the hook buddy.

    You also better change those flexi 996TT motor mounts.

    Sincerely, you will really think its a completely diff car once you get rid of the dual mass flywheel and the stock motor mounts.

    The entire car will come alive and will feel like one unit directly working with you. You have a lot of power now, but the cumulative effects of the cushy stock motor mounts and dual mass flywheel dont do it justice. Comparison before and after, you will think that the stock units made the car seem like a lethargic fat woman.

    Changing them really does transform the car to what it should be. Total adrenaline with instant response.

    You will wonder why you have a Noble on the way!

    Re: So what kind of numbers will Car&Driver get?

    That's a beautiful setup you have in your car Dock.

    A light flywheel was one of the first mods I did to my old E36 M3. It makes a world of a difference for me.

    ----------

    Al, I'm ecstatic that you're deciding to get the light flywheel. It makes me happy

    Re: So what kind of numbers will Car&Driver get?

    how long till we get the numbers from magazines? anyone know?

    Re: So what kind of numbers will Car&Driver get?

    Quote:
    JimFlat6 said:
    Al, thats not enough to get you off the hook buddy.

    You also better change those flexi 996TT motor mounts.

    Sincerely, you will really think its a completely diff car once you get rid of the dual mass flywheel and the stock motor mounts.

    The entire car will come alive and will feel like one unit directly working with you. You have a lot of power now, but the cumulative effects of the cushy stock motor mounts and dual mass flywheel dont do it justice. Comparison before and after, you will think that the stock units made the car seem like a lethargic fat woman.

    Changing them really does transform the car to what it should be. Total adrenaline with instant response.

    You will wonder why you have a Noble on the way!



    First I'll push the 996TTS as is once some consistent spring weather comes. Then I'll decide on the flywheel change. What's the deal with the motor mounts?

    The Noble will be slightly modded, as well, just some minor "tweaks," like a fuel cell, propylene glycol, bigger IC, custom intercooler fans and blow-off valves, TPMS, Kinesis wheels, CF center console with digital gauges, tranny cooling system, special sport exhaust....

    The Noble weighs just over a ton, and turns on a dime, the 911Turbo is now a ferocious, street-legal projectile, but I won't track it.

    Re: So what kind of numbers will Car&Driver get?

    Quote:
    Hurst said:
    That's a beautiful setup you have in your car Dock.

    A light flywheel was one of the first mods I did to my old E36 M3. It makes a world of a difference for me.

    ----------

    Al, I'm ecstatic that you're deciding to get the light flywheel. It makes me happy



    Unless I am talked out of it, I'll probably do it this summer, but it's pretty dang fast and responsive now. And I can't afford to lose my driver's license.

    Re: So what kind of numbers will Car&Driver get?

    lets talk something important! the new 997tt will win the m6 on the arfield like the videos that gustav of m6.board shows m6 beating very easy the 996tt.... and 997tt vs gt2.. the gt2 beats it?

    i have a friend that have a old eclipse with 500 hp ...
    he invited me to run a 1/4 mile against him with my CARRERA S.. but the truth is that im thinking because i dont want to loose against a trash car.... the PORSCHE dont diserve this ... the 1/4 mile time of eclipse is something like >12.5

     
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