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    Re: OFFICIAL: New 911 GT3 (991)

    We should really wait until the first reviews roll in before we turn up the heat on Porsche's non-manual model policy. I get it, manual is and will be always different than PDK, even in it's most refined version but we should give Porsche the chance to prove that PDK can be (almost) as fun or maybe (to some) even more fun than manual.

    For those who insist on manual, good times are ahead: Used GT3 prices dropped and used cars are widely available. My dealer, he is a pretty small one, already has two used GT3 (from customers who just ordered a PDK equipped 991 GT3). It seems that Porsche had the right feeling about PDK, now let the reviews roll in to actually prove it (or not).


    --

    RC (Germany) - Rennteam Editor Porsche 991 Turbo S (Sept. 2013), Cayenne GTS (958), BMW X3 35d (2013)


    Re: OFFICIAL: New 911 GT3 (991)

    RC:

    Used GT3 prices dropped and used cars are widely available. My dealer, he is a pretty small one, already has two used GT3 (from customers who just ordered a PDK equipped 991 GT3). It seems that Porsche had the right feeling about PDK, now let the reviews roll in to actually prove it (or not).

     

    not the case in the UK ..

    only 4 (997 only at the moment) GT3s in the entire UK Porsche network. 1 week ago, there were 8. Asking price wise, it's the same if not slightly higher than Oct 12 when I bought my 7.2 GT3.

    No RSs at all, and when they do appear, pricing is as described above.


    Re: OFFICIAL: New 911 GT3 (991)

    Porsche actually did conduct a detailed survey of existing GT3 and GT3 RS customers.

    Of their existing GT3 and GT3 RS customers, they found that 100% or respondents drive with a manual transmission.

    Apparently the existing GT3 customer base enjoy the interaction of changing gear as part of the driving experience, spending time to perfect their heel-n-toe shifts and throttle blips to let that Mezger engine sing!

    The GT3 developed a reputation of feeling truly outstanding to drive at any speed, on road or track. It was clearly the definitive established benchmark for owners and competitors.

    It is clear that the 991 GT3 was not designed with existing GT3 customers as the primary target.

    Indeed, for existing GT3 owners the 997 GT3 RS 4.0 is a far more attractive proposition.

    For 997 model PDK drivers, or drivers from other marques, the new 991 GT3 will be an amazing car.

    However, many existing GT3 owners are understandably looking forward to the announcement of the Porsche 991 GT3 RS...

    Re: OFFICIAL: New 911 GT3 (991)

    Boxster Coupe GTS:
    Porsche actually did conduct a detailed survey of existing GT3 and GT3 RS customers.

    Of their existing GT3 and GT3 RS customers, they found that 100% or respondents drive with a manual transmission.

    Apparently the existing GT3 customer base enjoy the interaction of changing gear as part of the driving experience, spending time to perfect their heel-n-toe shifts and throttle blips to let that Mezger engine sing!
    That is not to say that some or many would not enjoy the interaction of changing gear using paddles as part of the driving experience and letting the new engine spin to 9,000rpm etc

    Boxster Coupe GTS:
    The GT3 developed a reputation of feeling truly outstanding to drive at any speed, on road or track. It was clearly the definitive established benchmark for owners and competitors.

    It is clear that the 991 GT3 was not designed with existing GT3 customers as the primary target.
    That is not clear at all, just a sweeping generalisation.   It is likely to appeal to many existing GT3 owners (and some owners who haven't previously owned a GT3 for whatever reason).  Of course there are some existing owners that won't be interested in the new car.

    Boxster Coupe GTS:
    Indeed, for existing GT3 owners the 997 GT3 RS 4.0 is a far more attractive proposition.
    Again, another sweeping generalisation - for some owners that will be the case, but you simply can't generalise like that, not least because the 991 GT3 RS is the direct comparator, not the 991 GT3'

    Boxster Coupe GTS:
    For 997 model PDK drivers, or drivers from other marques, the new 991 GT3 will be an amazing car.
    And for many existing owners who are open to new technology and who appreciate the difference between the PDK-S gearbox and the traditional slick box automatic!
    Boxster Coupe GTS:
    However, many existing GT3 owners are understandably looking forward to the announcement of the Porsche 991 GT3 RS...

    Whether they will buy one is a different matter.

    Put simply, the GT3 is a road car capable of excelling on the track.  The GT3 RS is more of track car capable of being used on the road.


    Re: OFFICIAL: New 911 GT3 (991)

    Boxster Coupe GTS:
    Porsche actually did conduct a detailed survey of existing GT3 and GT3 RS customers.

    Of their existing GT3 and GT3 RS customers, they found that 100% or respondents drive with a manual transmission.

    Apparently the existing GT3 customer base enjoy the interaction of changing gear as part of the driving experience, spending time to perfect their heel-n-toe shifts and throttle blips to let that Mezger engine sing!

    The GT3 developed a reputation of feeling truly outstanding to drive at any speed, on road or track. It was clearly the definitive established benchmark for owners and competitors.

    It is clear that the 991 GT3 was not designed with existing GT3 customers as the primary target.

    Indeed, for existing GT3 owners the 997 GT3 RS 4.0 is a far more attractive proposition.

    For 997 model PDK drivers, or drivers from other marques, the new 991 GT3 will be an amazing car.

    However, many existing GT3 owners are understandably looking forward to the announcement of the Porsche 991 GT3 RS...

    Did these 100% have an alternative? Smiley Smiley

    I hope this was meant as some sort of a joke. Smiley

    I already know a couple of "old" GT3 customers who ordered the new one and already sold or are in the process of selling their current GT3. So I think you are wrong. Of course Porsche had existing GT3 customers in mind too with the new GT3.

    Opinions about the new GT3 will change as soon as the new GT3 kicks some ass on the track. Nobody likes to be slow(er), manual fun or not. Smiley


    --

    RC (Germany) - Rennteam Editor Porsche 991 Turbo S (Sept. 2013), Cayenne GTS (958), BMW X3 35d (2013)


    Re: OFFICIAL: New 911 GT3 (991)

    What a silly discussion.... Like every MT vs PDK discussion is...

    Point is that Porsche has decided not to offer the dinosaur MT anymore, so just get used to it. Ferrari did the same... Everyone can brag about it what they want, Porsche isn't gonna change their mind. They will sell the cars anyway. For every person that insists a MT and doesn't buy a GT3 because of that, there are 3 "new" costumers in line waiting to get one.

    If you own a 997 GT3 with manual, why would you want a 991 GT3 anyway?? Because it is faster? That's because it has a PDK and all the other modern technology. With a manual it would probably just have a slight advantage compared to the 997, if not a disadvantage. If that was the case, you were all bragging that the 991 wasn't a step forward and wasn't worth the money. For having fun with 3 pedals, a 997 GT3 is perfect... No need to buy a new one.

    in other words... No matter how Porsche decides to offer the car, it would never be the right decission for everyone. The only thing that matters for Porsche is that they make profit and a lot of it. It's business and they have to sell as much cars as they can. If they would only think of the purists, the company had already gone bankrupt years ago.

    FWIW: I love manuals! (Actually drive one)  But I also love the PDK.... 


    --

    I'm just another female petrolhead :)

     


    Re: OFFICIAL: New 911 GT3 (991)

    The discussion is silly but nevertheless necessary. I think there are lots of misunderstandings regarding PDK and I also think that those loving manual have a good point too, especially when it comes to the driving fun part, I get it.

    However, not wanting to get a car because it isn't offered with manual, regardless how good the whole package is, is not silly but quite frankly...dumb, if you ask me.
    I don't want people to misunderstand me, I get the whole emotion thing regarding manual and I agree that someone who pays 140-150k for a car should get what he/she wants but I would really hope that people wait until they can actually take a test drive in a new GT3 and THEN post their opinions. 

    Forget about car journalists (sorry if I offend anyone here but c'mon, most of them are driving different kind of cars privately) and their opinions about PDK or manual, people should be doing their OWN test drive and decide after that if the car is right for them or not.

    I also believe that there are going to be quite a few driving reports from OWNERS around September or latest October and we will get a pretty clear picture of how good or bad PDK is in the GT3 and if the car is still lots of fun, even with PDK.


    --

    RC (Germany) - Rennteam Editor Porsche 991 Turbo S (Sept. 2013), Cayenne GTS (958), BMW X3 35d (2013)


    Re: OFFICIAL: New 911 GT3 (991)

    Must say Boxster Coupe GTS from my corner must call BS on some of that. For 100% of 997 GT3/RS owners 100% drive a manual? What choice do they have - there car is a manual. Also 997 GT3 owners finding now that the 4.0RS is an attractive proposition? Only if they are prepared to spend twice the money a new GT3 costs on a used one and only if they are car collectors... For 997 PDK drivers or owners of cars from other marques 991 GT3 will be an amazing car? I own one of the hardest core 993s on the Rennlist board. Have onwed 996.1 GT3, 993RS, 964RS etc. Theres even been magazines articles on it and it is Targa and track car. Never owner anything other than manual but have ordered the 991 GT3 like many other die hard 911 MT owners I know. I can count three on this board and another 6 from top of my head.....so this is definitely a generalized statement... I know someone close to some of the track testing on the new GT3 and we will be very surpised how good it is on teh track - infact there will be few who can argue a 4.0RS etc is a better experience. As for the road lets wait for some reviews on these boards from actual owners.... I try to keep an open mind. Must say took me 10 years to get my head around water cooled 911s (who would have thought) and ESC and TC (arent those for nannys?) but finally decided to open my mind and embrace the new breed....always have the old girl in the garage for air cooled MT kicks...

    Re: OFFICIAL: New 911 GT3 (991)

    RC:

    Opinions about the new GT3 will change as soon as the new GT3 kicks some ass on the track. Nobody likes to be slow(er), manual fun or not. Smiley

    RC,

    I agree 110% Smiley  There will be a mad clamor for PDK when people figure out its worth several seconds a lap in an otherwise identically endowed car.

    I simply want to go faster on the track.   The Walter Mitty in me wants to drive a car that is the fastest around a circuit, yet I can drive it to and from the track, and also everywhere else.  The more capable the car performs, the more I want one.  I expect PDK to be even better for me than a sequential shifter in a Cup car.

    I can afford a Cup car and the team to support it, but that takes too much organizational effort for me to enjoy, and is too similar to running a company -- I need a little escape from that sometimesSmiley  So, trackable road cars are in my sweet spot.  Porsche has hit a home run in the PDK 911 GT cars for a guy like me.


    --

    Mike

    Carrera GT + Tesla Roadster 1.5 & Model S + Panamera Turbo +  BMW Z8 + BMW 3.0 CSi + Bentley Arnage T + GT3 RS 4.0


    Re: OFFICIAL: New 911 GT3 (991)

    W8MM.

    Its really refreshing to hear someone like you who owns a Carrera GT and a 4.0RS say this!

    The guy who lent EVO mag the Mexico Blue 4.0RS is also a Carrera GT owner and has a stable of extoics like yourself. He was also facinating in his feedback of the 991 GT3 when the EVO staff let him take it for a 30 minute drive on British B roads as a reward for lending them his 4.0RS as a comparison car. He posted his individual thoughts on Pistonheads and it made very interesting reading and was in many ways far more complimentary that the journalists view. Infact it was high praise as he stated on typical british B roads the 991 GT3 was way more balanced and planted and just got its power down nicely. He also owned a 991S DD and I suspect hes now on the order list for a 991 GT3 or RS.

    Over the years Iv owned a number of cars that the journos have subsequently years down teh track waxed lyrical about. Cars like the 64Rs, 93RS and Ausi/Porsche RS2. Like my SS Daytona Ive found much of their hyperboole to be overstated and tinged with nostalgia. They clearly havent lived with or long term owned any of these "great cars" they talks so fondly of. Like the Daytona with no date and next to useless pusher screw protectors (and hard to read hnds on the white dial version) much of what people write is based on no ownership history or fact at all. the 964RS tried to kill you at over 80km ph on any bumpy B road ashfelt. Drove like a gokart and was really only good on super smooth ashfelt. The RS was ull of old world lag and drovee like an Audi 80 in traffic and anything below 4000 rpm feeling heavy and cumbersome, even on boost it went around corners like  wooden toy not having much feedback.

    Its so easy for journalists to drive the car for a day and say "its not as organic" or as "involving" or its "too fast in the real world". Heck todays Mini is too fast in the real world - we dont but sports cars to cruise around at 50kmph!

    Real ownership experiences are what counts and I believe the 991 GT3 in PDK will offer dimensions and layers of ownership satisfaction, easy of ownership.reliablity, speed nd dependability along with function and flexibility that the previous generation car couldnt come close to matching. Some of this of course will take a number of months of ownership to truely establish...


    Re: OFFICIAL: New 911 GT3 (991)

    W8MM:

    I agree 110% Smiley  There will be a mad clamor for PDK when people figure out its worth several seconds a lap in an otherwise identically endowed car.

    Carrera GT + Tesla Roadster 1.5 & Model S + Panamera Turbo +  BMW Z8 + BMW 3.0 CSi + Bentley Arnage T + GT3 RS 4.0

    There is no other otherwise identically endowed car (Manual 7 speed with close ratios).  If there were, I think the difference would be less than one second for a good driver on a typical track (less than 2 minutes laptime).


    --

    73 Carrera RS 2.7 Carbon Fiber replica (1,890 lbs), 06 EVO9 with track mods. Former: 73 911S, Two 951S's, 996 C2, 993 C2, 98 Ferrari 550


    Re: OFFICIAL: New 911 GT3 (991)

    Grant:

    There is no other identically endowed car (Manual 7 speed with close ratios).  If there were, I think the difference would be way less than one second on a typical track (less than 2 minutes laptime).

    Grant, 

    My comparison is not for Teo Fabi at the wheel -- it's for me driving Smiley

    Perhaps you over-estimate my talent?  I KNOW that I'm leaving at least 2 seconds per lap on the table @ Mid-Ohio in my RS 4.0 because of the iffy nature of my down-shifting on high speed corner entrances.  One place, for sure, is what now is called turn 11, a left-hander at the bottom of "Thunder Valley".  As I come roaring down the hill, I run out of revs and would like to shift up to 4th to add some more speed.  But, that would require me to shift back down to 3rd to get competitive exit torque.  That corner is taken most effectively by putting the left front wheel all the way up on the stripes, partly into the grass, and that woggles the chassis enough that one has to be perfect on rev-matching, and throttle-matching, during the down-shift not to cause real trouble.  So, ... since I'm too long of leg to heel-and-toe, and am forced to just make the synchronizers help me out, I simply idle down the hill before the corner running in 3rd right at the red line.  I can see cars catch up from behind while this "idling" action is underway.

    And that's just ONE corner.  The entrance to the chicane before the "Keyhole" is another place I could enter at least 10 mph faster if I didn't have to doubt the downshift's effects.

    Plus, removing the extra 300 milliseconds on every up shift just HAS to add up on a complete lap.

    I'm ready -- bring on the PDK Smiley


    --

    Mike

    Carrera GT + Tesla Roadster 1.5 & Model S + Panamera Turbo +  BMW Z8 + BMW 3.0 CSi + Bentley Arnage T + GT3 RS 4.0


    Re: OFFICIAL: New 911 GT3 (991)

    Change of topic - (FWIW I would get at GT3  with PDK-S and love it - the point is don't call it a manual because it has a manual mode, that is ridiculous)

    As Frayed pointed out (many pointless posts ago) the new engine can leverage that power and those revs much better with the new gear ratios. So what is the speed in gears 1-7 vs the 4.0 six speed manual!  You will be amazed and the performance advantage will be clear.  The ratios make all the difference.  More so than shift speed.  Of course it would be nice to adjust track by track because each track has its own gearing requirements.

    Still dreaming the RS might get a tamed down version of the sequential manual from the cup car and a third pedal for downshifting and stopping.  It would be much quicker and racier than the PDK-S.  A bit of a handful for the street perhaps (depending on the weight of the flywheel) but it would be payback in spades for the manual lovers!  Plus they need the tech for racing with the new motor so it is applicable.

     


    Re: OFFICIAL: New 911 GT3 (991)

    W8MM:

    Grant, 

    My comparison is not for Teo Fabi at the wheel -- it's for me driving Smiley

    ...Plus, removing the extra 300 milliseconds on every up shift just HAS to add up on a complete lap.

    Hey, we have to aspire to someoneSmiley  And even if the manual up-shifting took an extra 300ms (I think that is generous to PDK), remember that this does not add directly to the bottom line (just a little less time accelerating, while the car is continuing to coast during shifting).

    I'm not sure why you are so concerned with best laptime in the absolute sense (you already admitted to not being on the level of a top pro driver, so course record is out of the question).  Why not just focus on best time for yourself in a particular car on a particular course?  There is always a faster car - why not just choose the one that's most fun?  I understand that your proportions make heel/toe difficult - glad that is not a particular concern for me (put I have plenty of others Smiley)


    --

    73 Carrera RS 2.7 Carbon Fiber replica (1,890 lbs), 06 EVO9 with track mods. Former: 73 911S, Two 951S's, 996 C2, 993 C2, 98 Ferrari 550


    Re: OFFICIAL: New 911 GT3 (991)

    Leawood911:

     

    As Frayed pointed out (many pointless posts ago) the new engine can leverage that power and those revs much better with the new gear ratios. So what is the speed in gears 1-7 vs the 4.0 six speed manual!  You will be amazed and the performance advantage will be clear.  The ratios make all the difference.  More so than shift speed.  Of course it would be nice to adjust track by track because each track has its own gearing requirements.

     

    While 7 closely stacked ratios is a huge deal, one should add that it's PDK that allows extraction of all those gears.  IMO, based on the car's specs and what has been written so far, the entire package including PDK was engineered as a complete unit and a MT would likely not suit this car well.

    Narrow powerband, peaky high revving motor, insane 9k redline enabled by PDK (built in over rev protection allows the designer to push that valvetrain to its limits).  7 speeds + PDK allows the motor to reside at max hp more of the time on track than with a MT.

    Of course the other major benefit for the majority of us who sometimes mess up a heel toe downshift is perfect rev matching at corner entry.  BUT, this is now accomplished in Porsche's current MT so this is less of a benefit due to PDK.  It's just a feature of newer modern transmissions (see new vette stingray as well).


    --

    991 GT3 incoming, 964 Turbo 3.6, E36 M3 ltw S54 conversion, bunch of other stuff


    Re: OFFICIAL: New 911 GT3 (991)

    frayed:
    Leawood911:

     

    As Frayed pointed out (many pointless posts ago) the new engine can leverage that power and those revs much better with the new gear ratios. So what is the speed in gears 1-7 vs the 4.0 six speed manual!  You will be amazed and the performance advantage will be clear.  The ratios make all the difference.  More so than shift speed.  Of course it would be nice to adjust track by track because each track has its own gearing requirements.

     

    While 7 closely stacked ratios is a huge deal, one should add that it's PDK that allows extraction of all those gears.  IMO, based on the car's specs and what has been written so far, the entire package including PDK was engineered as a complete unit and a MT would likely not suit this car well.

    Narrow powerband, peaky high revving motor, insane 9k redline enabled by PDK (built in over rev protection allows the designer to push that valvetrain to its limits).  7 speeds + PDK allows the motor to reside at max hp more of the time on track than with a MT.

    Of course the other major benefit for the majority of us who sometimes mess up a heel toe downshift is perfect rev matching at corner entry.  BUT, this is now accomplished in Porsche's current MT so this is less of a benefit due to PDK.  It's just a feature of newer modern transmissions (see new vette stingray as well).

    I agree with everything you said, except the part about MT not suiting this car well.  I think it would be awesome in MT form.

    And as far as protecting the motor from the "Money Shift" on missed downshift, this would be easy to do with MT as with PDK.  All they would need to do is provide a lockout in the manual shift pattern that would prevent manual selection of any gear that would cause an over-rev (based on vehicle speed).  They already do this with the Carrera's 7M to prevent selection of 6th, 7th, and Reverse gears from certain speeds and gears.  A very simple thing to extend this technology to save us from over-revs.  And no, I am not one of the people that thinks freedom to over-rev is an important facet of the manual gearbox.Smiley


    --

    73 Carrera RS 2.7 Carbon Fiber replica (1,890 lbs), 06 EVO9 with track mods. Former: 73 911S, Two 951S's, 996 C2, 993 C2, 98 Ferrari 550


    Re: OFFICIAL: New 911 GT3 (991)

    I'm with Frayed in this one!  This car and engine combo is made for the PDK.  No doubt about it.  If not PDK then seq manual for the RS! 

    Now what is the speed in gears compared to the 4.0 - that would be enlightening.  ??

    Not certain I would want a manual that blocks gates to prevent over rev.  It is the clutch release that causes over rev.  I would prefer to not allow the clutch release in case of overrev - that would work in all gears.

     


    Re: OFFICIAL: New 911 GT3 (991)

    I have to laugh at you guy's. I know I'm going to love the 991GT3. Mind you, compared to what I'm driving now, literally anything would be a bonus..


    --

    throt

    "I didn't do it"


    Re: OFFICIAL: New 911 GT3 (991)

     

     
     
    Word has it that Volkswagen Group chief Ferdinand Piech approved this application. Piech used to drive a one-off Porsche 914 equipped with a boxer eight-cylinder, and, more recently, the chairman was said to be driving a Cayman fitted with a flat eight. Featuring four turbochargers, two intercoolers, four adjustable camshafts, a complex multistage intake manifold, and dual-stage exhaust, the 3.9-liter engine is expected to deliver 650 hp. It will be mounted low in the middle of the car, connecting to a seven-speed dual-clutch  box
    I can't wait for the 960
     
    -- 
     
     

    Re: OFFICIAL: New 911 GT3 (991)

    DJC:

     

     
     
    Word has it that Volkswagen Group chief Ferdinand Piech approved this application. Piech used to drive a one-off Porsche 914 equipped with a boxer eight-cylinder, and, more recently, the chairman was said to be driving a Cayman fitted with a flat eight. Featuring four turbochargers, two intercoolers, four adjustable camshafts, a complex multistage intake manifold, and dual-stage exhaust, the 3.9-liter engine is expected to deliver 650 hp. It will be mounted low in the middle of the car, connecting to a seven-speed dual-clutch  box
    I can't wait for the 960
     
    -- 
     
     

    You shouldn't believe everything you hear. Smiley

    According to my knowledge, Piech is not a fan of the Cayman. Also he is very focused on the 918 right now. Smiley

    Btw: Porsche CEO Matthias Müller is privately driving a 991 GT3 right now and will switch to the 991 Turbo S soon. Don't ask where I know this from. Smiley


    --

    RC (Germany) - Rennteam Editor Porsche 991 Turbo S (Sept. 2013), Cayenne GTS (958), BMW X3 35d (2013)


    Re: OFFICIAL: New 911 GT3 (991)

    So, is there any chance to see HP increase in the final 918 or this is it (8xx hp)? yes


    Re: OFFICIAL: New 911 GT3 (991)

    RC:
    DJC:

     

     
     
    Word has it that Volkswagen Group chief Ferdinand Piech approved this application. Piech used to drive a one-off Porsche 914 equipped with a boxer eight-cylinder, and, more recently, the chairman was said to be driving a Cayman fitted with a flat eight. Featuring four turbochargers, two intercoolers, four adjustable camshafts, a complex multistage intake manifold, and dual-stage exhaust, the 3.9-liter engine is expected to deliver 650 hp. It will be mounted low in the middle of the car, connecting to a seven-speed dual-clutch  box
    I can't wait for the 960
     
    -- 
     
     

    You shouldn't believe everything you hear. Smiley

    According to my knowledge, Piech is not a fan of the Cayman. Also he is very focused on the 918 right now. Smiley

    Btw: Porsche CEO Matthias Müller is privately driving a 991 GT3 right now and will switch to the 991 Turbo S soon. Don't ask where I know this from. Smiley

    Yeah its called the new baby Veyron!


    Re: OFFICIAL: New 911 GT3 (991)

    Ok. What is going on with the new GT3 RS. It is due for release in 1 or 2 weeks at Frankfurt and nobody on the Interweb has a scoop on it... Have Porsche successfully managed to keep it a secret??


    Re: OFFICIAL: New 911 GT3 (991)

    boytronic:


    Ok. What is going onith the new GT3 RS. It is due for release in 1 or 2 weeks at Frankfurt and nobody on the Interweb has a scoop on it... Have Porsche successfully managed to keep it a secret??





    Errr, because it was never meant to happen in Frankfurt?!

    Re: OFFICIAL: New 911 GT3 (991)

    The 991 GT3 RS is expected to be at dealers around spring 2014, so Porsche needs to make this car official at some point. Not sure however if it is going to be the IAA in Frankfurt, the Macan has been postponed too and it was cleary scheduled for the IAA a couple of months ago. Same goes to the 991 Targa, lots of people are waiting for it.

    The biggest surprise for me was that the new 991 Turbo and Turbo S Cabriolets will be at the IAA, for a spring 2014 release. I didn't expect that. I won't speculate why but I kind of have the feeling that there is a reason for that. Maybe Porsche doesn't have as many pre-orders for the 991 Turbo/Turbos S as expected (pure speculation) or maybe they wanted to make room for new 911 models at the following car shows (after IAA) like the LA Autoshow 2013 or Detroit and Geneva 2014.


    --

    RC (Germany) - Rennteam Editor Porsche 991 Turbo S (Sept. 2013), Cayenne GTS (958), BMW X3 35d (2013)


    Re: OFFICIAL: New 911 GT3 (991)

    RC:

    The 991 GT3 RS is expected to be at dealers around spring 2014, so Porsche needs to make this car official at some point. Not sure however if it is going to be the IAA in Frankfurt, the Macan has been postponed too and it was cleary scheduled for the IAA a couple of months ago. Same goes to the 991 Targa, lots of people are waiting for it.

    The biggest surprise for me was that the new 991 Turbo and Turbo S Cabriolets will be at the IAA, for a spring 2014 release. I didn't expect that. I won't speculate why but I kind of have the feeling that there is a reason for that. Maybe Porsche doesn't have as many pre-orders for the 991 Turbo/Turbos S as expected (pure speculation) or maybe they wanted to make room for new 911 models at the following car shows (after IAA) like the LA Autoshow 2013 or Detroit and Geneva 2014.

    i hear the GT3RS is scheduled for early spring 2014 presentation and sommer-early fall 2014 sales start. but just like you i would be pleased to be wrong and to see it in frankfurt.

    p


    Re: OFFICIAL: New 911 GT3 (991)

    Some German dealers seem to have production allocations for March 2014, so summer or early fall sounds a little weird but things right now change so fast at Porsche, everything is possible.


    --

    RC (Germany) - Rennteam Editor Porsche 991 Turbo S (Sept. 2013), Cayenne GTS (958), BMW X3 35d (2013)


    Re: OFFICIAL: New 911 GT3 (991)

    Thanks RC. Let's see if Porsche surprise us :)


    Re: OFFICIAL: New 911 GT3 (991)

    RC:

    Some German dealers seem to have production allocations for March 2014, so summer or early fall sounds a little weird but things right now change so fast at Porsche, everything is possible.

    the sooner the RS comes the better. i need to complement my daily-driver softcore fiat 458 by something hardcore.Smiley 20

    peter


    Re: OFFICIAL: New 911 GT3 (991)

    Hey RC -- interesting to see Manthey Racing run a 4.4-litre flat-six at the VLN 6-hour in the Porsche 911 GT3 RSR...

    Manthey Racing: "Two-time class victory at the VLN..."

     
    (26 August 2013)
     
    Wochenspiegel driver trio finished second in championship 
     
    Meuspath - Two class wins and another class podium are the successful yield Manthey-Racing-6h at this year's race, which is traditionally considered VLN season highlight! In changeable weather in the Eifel newly developed 4.4-liter engine also celebrated a successful first strike in the rear of the yellow-green RSR from Meuspath.
     
    After just one month break over 200 vehicles went in the fifth round of the VLN Endurance Championship at the start in which Manthey Racing the known Porsche 911 GT3 RSR had called in traditional yellow green livery in the SP8 class for the first time. Two reasons prompted Olaf Manthey to "rise" to the new category. "After the crew of the week is to mirror Porsche so promising position in the championship standings, we want the guys in no way take away points," said Manthey.
     
    The second motivation was the premiere of the brand new and increased to 4.4-liter displacement six-cylinder boxer was his baptism of fire with flying colors in the longest VLN race of the season. "For many years we offer performance improvements for street-legal GT3 and the racing appropriate derivatives. This engine is now based on the 4.2 liter engine developed by us for the 997 GT3 and now has a displacement of 4.4 liters. We are now planning a bit of fine tuning for the aggregate and also plan for the remaining VLN races with this engine to go to the start, "the team leader held with a view to the in-house development project.
     
    From the start, drove regular driver Jochen Krumbach and the two Porsche works drivers Joerg Bergmeister and the GT3 RSR Nick Tandy forward and were around long on podium. Drop below the minimum level prescribed time during a pit stop of five hundredths was greeted by the race with a hefty stop-and-go penalty, so you missed the end with only 20 seconds behind the jump to's podium. "Although, of course, a third place overall would have been nicer - with two class wins and another podium finish in the Cup2 in the bag, we return back to Meuspath satisfied," Manthey summarized the results of Saturday together.
     
    Georg Weiss, Michael Jacobs and Jochen Krumbach Oliver Kainz already laid the foundation for training in the now fifth podium finish in the SP7 class in fifth VLN race! Starting driver Kainz presented with great pace and his rider could burn anything. Constantly to be found in the top 10, the mirror-week penalty after 37 rounds crossed the finish line as the seventh overall, continuing his winning streak continues. "We are very pleased to be in this strong and dominated by top pilots get involved competitive environment," Kainz beamed furious after his first stint. "It has shown once again how important a good placement in training!" Co Krumbach was happy as a double starter over two class wins in a race: "When came after more than three hours, the expected rain and the tires Poker began, we were right place at the car of George. "By changing class of" thick "the championship chances assisted by Manthey Racing Porsche Wochenspiegel have further improved. By far three class wins and two second places have Kainz, White and Jacobs halfway through the season very good chance at the title in Europe's most popular endurance racing series.
     
    At a great fourteenth overall Frank Kräling, Marc Gindorf, Peter Scharmach and Marco Schelp drove the orange white and single cup penalty under Mantheyscher named and made with second place in the Cup 2 class third class podium success for Manthey Racing at half race of the VLN perfect ! The fourteenth place overall is even more remarkable because the 911 GT3 Cup was displaced by yellow crime in qualifying ten places back and the quartet was forced to go from 37 start on the grid. "I am totally happy - this is my first finish this year," said Schelp was happy. "This is now hopefully so on!"
     
    From a promising start thirteenth place the Pinta Porsche went into the race. But for Michael Illbruck and Robert Renauer - first supported the 6h race by Marco Seefried - it was a rather streaky race weekend. Already in qualifying the Porsche 911 GT3 R rear right badly damaged in a collision on the suspension and the body. However, the Manthey mechanic repaired the car in record time so that the Pinta Porsche it still make it in time to the starting grid. In the first race then stopped a puncture at the end of the first stint of the advance towards Elfers Top 10 An almost complete Nordschleife lap with speed 50 km / h cost countless placements before the GT3 R was able to resume the chase through the Green Hell again after repair. Placement to placement, the trio battled back again as Seefried crashed after the so-called "Eiskurve". "I can not tell anyone how much I resent my fault," held a deeply troubled driver. "I've had a white vest and had always the great goal once to be driving a Porsche Manthey prepared - and then this happened to me! I really hope I get another chance. "
     
    The sixth round of the VLN Endurance Championship starts on 14 September. The 36th RCM DMV Grenzlandrennen leads again on the usual distance of four hours. 
     
    Racing Cars
     
    NR. PILOTS VEHICLE CLASS
    12 Klohs, Judge 911 GT3 R SP9
    39 Schelp, brother in law 911 GT3 Cup SP9
    40 Pinta, Renauer, nn 911 GT3 R SP9
    59 White, Jacobs, Kainz 911 GT3 RSR SP7
    60 Krumbach, nn 911 GT3 RSR SP7
    145 Krumbach, nn 911 GT3 RSR SP8
    95 Kräling, Gindorf, nn 911 GT3 Cup Cup2
    96 Kohler, Menzel, nn 911 GT3 Cup Cup2
     
    Event Calendar
     
    14.09.2013 - 36th RCM DMV Grenzlandrennen
    28.09.2013 - 45th ADAC Barbarossa Cup
    12.10.2013 - ROWE DMV 250-mile race
    26.10.2013 - 38th DMV Münsterlandpokal 
     
     

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