Rennteam 2.0 - EN - Forum - Ayrton Senna Movie - Page3

Mar 26, 2012 3:49:22 PM

Leawood911: Rennteam VIP; Loc: Kansas, USA , United States; Posts: 6894, Gallery; Registered on: Aug 29, 2006; Reply to: easy_rider911

Re: Ayrton Senna Movie

I watched that race live on TV like all the races the previous 10 years or so. I thought from viewing it that the steering simply broke. I also recall that this is what the technical investigation proved. Had the wheel not hit him in the head he would have walked away, no problem. This was not a bad accident, just a fluke, much like Dale E. in NASCAR (sorry for the reference, just similar shunt and outcome).

Senna was the greatest and russian roulette or playing 'Chicken' is certainly part of racing. Schumacher certainly knew this, and it is why he is no longer a factor - he simple can not play chicken anymore- lost the respect.

In a way it reminds me of how, in the old days, when the Indian captured you, you faked mental illness and they would leave you alone. Senna and other great drivers make it clear that they are just a little less afraid of the consequences. A bit crazy if you will. Kimi expresses it by being the ICE Man, that may server him well as he ages into the sport.

It is a shame that MS and Senna did not race each other more back in the day. Nice to see MS and Hamilton finally mix it up, that was one match up I missed since MS retired in anticipation of Hamilton entering the sport.

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Mar 26, 2012 4:54:18 PM

easy_rider911: Rennteam VIP; Loc: London , United Kingdom; Posts: 22190, Gallery; Registered on: Nov 8, 2004; Reply to: Leawood911

Re: Ayrton Senna Movie

@joost: yes, I noted too that Prost became a trustee of Senna's charitable foundation for helping poor children. One could assume this was a gesture of kindness to heal the wounds. Alternatively, a more cynical person might think Prost did this because he felt guilty and wanted to make amends. Who knows the truth? :) Prost is a very clever man. I wouldn't put the latter beyond him.

In terms of tone, I also felt that the Balestre-Prost relationship smacked of the 'establishment' and that Senna regarded himself as an outsider, mistreated by the sport's authorities.

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Mar 26, 2012 5:00:59 PM

easy_rider911: Rennteam VIP; Loc: London , United Kingdom; Posts: 22190, Gallery; Registered on: Nov 8, 2004; Reply to: easy_rider911

Re: Ayrton Senna Movie

@Leawood911: that's a very interesting explanation of the mental battle of wills between rivals. Yes, I certainly agree that this does form part of the equation. It is definitely a game of who will flinch first and also there's a bit of ego involved in the sense of 'don't mess with me, know your place'.

About the crash, I also interpreted the way Senna just kept on going forward off the track to mean the same thing: steering failure. How it hurt him is, I agree, some kind of freak accident. Maybe it takes a freak accident to overwhelm a driver like Senna who was himself a kind of irresistible 'force of nature'.

Who knows what Senna might have achieved had he continued racing? He was only 34 years old. By any standards, that's a tragically young age to die. If he had continued till age 40, he could have won several more titles. We will just never know.

997.1 C2S GT Silver/Cocoa, -20mm/LSD, PSE, short shifter, SportDesign rims, Zuffenhausen pickup, BMW Z4 2.5i Roadster Sterling Grey/Red

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Mar 26, 2012 5:08:41 PM

reginos: Rennteam VIP; Loc: Nicosia , Cyprus; Posts: 12094, Gallery; Registered on: Mar 20, 2005; Reply to: easy_rider911

Re: Ayrton Senna Movie

Prost (out of action as a driver in 1994) was one of the coffin bearers at AS's funeral.

A gesture like this eradicates everything that has happened earlier in life. Nobody does this just for appearances IMO.

"Form follows function"

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Mar 26, 2012 5:36:29 PM

Ferdie: Rennteam VIP; Loc: Europe , Germany; Posts: 8208, Gallery; Registered on: Jul 2, 2004; Reply to: reginos

Re: Ayrton Senna Movie

Just consider the battle of Hamilton and Alonso in 2007 and their mutual respect towards each other since they are running in separate teams. Guess the rivalry between Senna and Prost went even further as they fought the battle on all possible accounts. Obviously Senna needed Prost as a "moving target" to maximize his performance and I guess it goes without saying that Prost was fueled by Senna´s performance at least as much. At the end, their rivalry was one of the most impressive of recent F1 history. Without the two and the McLaren team, something would certainly be missing during the 80ies seasons.

I also think it is difficult to measure these characters with normal standards. None of the leading drivers in F1 would have gone such a long way, spent endless time in a variety of vehicles racing on closed circuits, fought down their opponents and made it to the pinnacle of motor racing with the attitude of the regular guy on the street. It might be worth noting that rally drivers, that some consider to compete in the actual pinnacle of motor racing, usually start off much later. Some of the politics that are obvious in F1 racing seem to have arrived in WRC as well, in my opinion the position of Loeb and Ogier at Citroen showed that to some extend. Nonetheless the lack of direct battle for position and the even bigger consequences in case of an accident seem to make these drivers appear more humble. If one considers the financial situation of WRC contenders, even up to the highest non-manufacturer teams, their far more grounded attitude becomes understandable though.

As a child, watching both Senna and Prost battling, I have preferred the latter´s more rational and educated driving over the former´s emotional and uncompromising approach. After all though, they were both great characters. Guess, if Schumacher would´ve had the same competition over his first career, his talent would´ve stood out even more so.

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Mar 27, 2012 5:39:09 AM

skazzy: Veteran; Loc: ... , Canada; Posts: 931, Gallery; Registered on: Oct 31, 2005; Reply to: Ferdie

Re: Ayrton Senna Movie

Easy, I am glad you gave it another watch and enjoyed the film this time around.

What I love the most about this film is that it is made purely from actual footage. There is no 'acting' to try and influence the audience or portray one's character as good or bad. Everything you see is pure, unaltered footage , yet it is so well put together, that it can appeal to people who know nothing about F1 or Senna. Film is a master piece.

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Mar 27, 2012 12:06:58 PM

easy_rider911: Rennteam VIP; Loc: London , United Kingdom; Posts: 22190, Gallery; Registered on: Nov 8, 2004; Reply to: skazzy

Re: Ayrton Senna Movie

Yes, the fact that it was composed of interviews, race footage etc means the facts are all there in front of us so we can make up our own minds. It also made the movie feel very immediate, like watching the events unfold in front of one's own eyes.

The only caveat is that, in the editing process, the key decision then becomes what to leave in and what to leave out from the film. How this editing is done can make a crucial difference to what the viewers will perceive as the truth.

997.1 C2S GT Silver/Cocoa, -20mm/LSD, PSE, short shifter, SportDesign rims, Zuffenhausen pickup, BMW Z4 2.5i Roadster Sterling Grey/Red

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