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    Re: GT2 standard sports bucket seats...

    Hey, guys... That time from Porsche is pure heaven and even if HvS is a little bit slower, GT2 will be the king for a long time in the future.
    Credible or not, 7.32 is extremely fast time and I don't believe that the difference between SA and Porsche will turns the the things in the opposite direction. Personally I expected something around 7.37 from Porsche and 7.42 from SA, but this is muuuuch beyond my expectations/dreams

    Re: GT2 standard sports bucket seats...

    Unless this means 8s faster than the 997TT (7.40 "official" time) thus 7.46 for SA, on par with 996GT2

    Still, for Porsche to claim it is on par with the CGT, the GT2 better deliver huge

    Re: GT2 standard sports bucket seats...

    Quote:
    intouch1 said:
    also take note, that Sport Auto is using a shorter version of the NBR as they do not close the track for their tests.
    manufacturers have exclusive days where they have the whole track and use the whole length of the track....and yes, they do test competitiors cars for evaluation...and yes, they know how to drive them and extract the best performance.




    Before putting posts like my above in words I use to think about what I write...

    - The text below the chart explicitly compares the claimed GT2 time to the CGT time; the CGT did 7:32 in the Sportauto Supertest
    - Sportauto does close the track for their supertest
    - The Viper and SL65 times are taken from Sportauto (at least they are identical to the Sportauto tests)

    To make it short: my post contains exactly the right wording for these Porsche numbers - pure marketing BS.

    Selling cars on the basis of these numbers is close to fraud. The benchmark figures in the chart are grossly inconsistent with press data. If a sales peson uses them to persuade potential GT2 buyers he is misleading them. Intolerable

    Re: GT2 standard sports bucket seats...

    Quote:
    SciFrog said:
    Unless this means 8s faster than the 997TT (7.40 "official" time) thus 7.46 for SA, on par with 996GT2

    Still, for Porsche to claim it is on par with the CGT, the GT2 better deliver huge



    Exactly my thinking. Porsche is trying to fool us again - like in case of the 997TT.

    The unfortunate thing is that many potential buyers are extremely gullible. This is confirmed in this thread, I am afraid

    Re: GT2 standard sports bucket seats...

    Quote:
    Ziggy said:
    Quote:
    TT Gasman said:
    Who gives a s**t about SportAuto, that's not the question here. 7.32 is an awesome time!



    Some people are incredible here.

    When SA posts a by-third-party-validated time of 7.54 for the 997TT they question it, yet when Porsche PR claims 7.32 for the GT2 they are adamant about its validity.



    I cannot remember too many posters questioning the Sportauto test of the 997TT.

    Re: GT2 standard sports bucket seats...

    here are the complete Sport Auto Hockenheim and Nordschleife (NBR) times:

    AC Schnitzer Tension ** 1.13,5 min 7.57 min 04/07

    AC Schnitzer BMW CLS II 1.13,4 min 8.16 min 11/97

    AC Schnitzer Topster ** 1.13,7 min 8.16 min 01/05

    Alfa Romeo 156 GTA 1.22,7 min 8,51 min 05/02

    Alpina Roadster S ** 1.14,4 min 8.15 min 07/05

    Alpina B10 3.2 1.21,3 min 8.50 min 04/98

    AMG SLK 230 K 1.21,2 min 9.07 min 05/97

    Aston Martin DB7 GT 1.19,0 min 8.23 min 07/03

    Aston Martin DB7 Vantage 1.21,1 min 8.41 min 09/99

    Aston Martin DB9 1.17,7 min 8.16 min 11/04

    Aston Martin V12 Vanquish 1.16,9 min 8.17 min 01/03

    Aston Martin V8 Vantage ** 1.14,8 min 8.03 min 10/05

    Aston Martin V12 Vanquish 1.16,9 min 8.17 min 01/03

    Audi S3 1.20,9 min 8.41 min 06/99

    Audi S4 1.21,1 min 8.42 min 08/98

    Audi S4 Avant 1.19,1 min 8.29 min 11/03

    Audi TT 1.8 quattro 1.19,9 min * 8.42 min 11/98

    Audi TT 2.0 TFSI 1.18,9 min 8.40 min 02/07

    Audi RS 6 1.17,6 min 8.20 min 09/02

    Audi RS 4 1.18,2 min 8.25 min 10/00

    Audi RS 4 ** 1.15,4 min 8.09 min 06/06

    BMW Alpina B3 33 1.19,3 min 8.36 min 07/99

    BMW M Roadster 1.18,2 min 8.32 min 09/97

    BMW M3 1.16,3 min * 8.22 min 12/00

    BMW M3 CSL ** 1.13,5 min 7.50 min 08/03

    BMW M3 SMG 1.18,4 min 8.35 min 03/97

    BMW M5 1.17,6 min * 8.28 min 03/99

    BMW M5 1.16,5 min 8.13 min 12/04

    BMW Z4 3.0 SMG 1.18,1 min 8.32 min 05/03

    BMW Z8 1.17,4 min 8.18 min 08/00

    BMW 335i Coupé 1.17,8 min 8.26 min 10/06

    BMW Z3 Coupé 3.0i 1.18,4 min 8.34 min 04/01

    BMW Z4 3.0si Coupé 1.17,8 min 8.32 min 08/06

    BMW M6 ** 1.14,4 min 8.09 min 12/05

    BMW M Coupé 1.17,2 min 8.22 min 10/98

    Brabus Mercedes CLK 5.8 1.18,3 min 8.38 min 12/98

    Brabus Mercedes C V8 Sportcoupé 1.19,8 min 8.35 min 02/02

    Callaway C12 Coupé 1.15,0 min 8.25 min 04/99

    Chevrolet Corvette 1.18,2 min 8.40 min 07/97

    Chevrolet Corvette-Jubiläumsmodell 1.15,9 min 8.18 min 09/03

    Chrysler Viper GTS 1.15,9 min 8.10 min 10/97

    Corvette C6 1.14,8 min 8.15 min 08/05

    Corvette Z06 1.11,7 min. 7.49 min 06/07

    Dodge Viper SRT-10 1.14,3 min * 8.13 min 10/04

    Donkervoort D8 180R 1.14,1 min 8.10 min 03/01

    Ferrari F 355 1.15,3 min 8.18 min 06/97

    Ferrari Challenge Stradale ** 1.13,0 min 7.56 min 02/04

    Ferrari 360 Modena 1.15,1 min 8.09 min 10/99

    Ferrari F 430 F1 1.12,7 min 7.55 min 01/06

    Ferrari 575M Maranello 1.14,7 min 8.05 min 12/02

    Ferrari 550 Maranello 1.16,1 min 8.07 min 06/98

    Ford GT 1.14,1 min 7.52 min 02/06

    Honda NSX 1.18,4 min 8.38 min 08/97

    Honda S 2000 1.18,9 min 8.39 min 01/00

    Honda Civic Type-R 1.20,9 min 8.47 min 11/01

    Honda NSX-R ** 1.14,6 min 8.09 min 08/02

    Jaguar XKR Coupé 1.19,3 min * 8.36 min * 07/98

    Jaguar XKR 1.16,9 min 8.25 min 12/06

    Koenigsegg CCR 1.09,8 min 7.34 min 03/06

    Lamborghini Diabolo GT 1.14,4 min 8.04 min 07/00

    Lamborghini Murcielago LP 640 ** 1.11,8 min 7.47 min 01/07

    Lamborghini Diabolo SV 1.16,4 min 8.09 min 12/97

    Lamborghini Gallardo 1.11,8 min 7.52 min 12/03

    Lamborghini Murciélago 1.12,0 min 7.50 min 06/02

    Lotec Porsche 911 Turbo 1.12,3 min 7.57 min 05/98

    Lotus Esprit Sport 350 1.15,3 min 8.13 min 05/99

    Lotus Exige ** 1.14,8 min 8.42 min 11/00

    Lotus Exige ** 1.16,5 min 8.32 min 08/04

    Maserati Gransport 1.16,2 min 8.18 min 09/05

    Maserati Coupé Cambiocorsa 1.19,2 min 8.30 min 10/02

    Maserati 3200 GT 3200 GT 1.18,4 min 8.37 min 09/00

    Mercedes C 55 AMG 1.18,6 min 8.22 min 07/04

    Mercedes C 43 AMG 1.19,5 min 8.51 min 02/98

    Mercedes CLK 430 1.20,8 min 8.52 min 09/98

    Mercedes CLK 55 AMG 1.18,2 min 8.29 min 05/00

    Mercedes SLK 55 AMG 1.17,1 min 8.24 min 04/05

    Mercedes CLK DTM AMG ** 1.12,5 min 7.54 min 03/05

    Mercedes SLR McLaren 1.13,5 min 7.52 min 06/04

    Mercedes SL 65 AMG 1.15,6 min 8.14 min 02/05

    Mercedes C 32 AMG 1.20,6 min 8.37 min 09/01

    Mercedes SL 500 1.19,7 min 8.38 min 12/01

    Mercedes SLK 32 AMG 1.18,5 min 8.26 min 05/01

    Mercedes SL 55 AMG 1.15,9 min * 8.06 min * 04/02

    Mini Cooper S Works 1.22,2 min 8.55 min 09/04

    Mitsubishi Carisma GT Evo VI ** 1.18,4 min 8.25 min 11/99

    Mitsubishi Carisma GT Evo VII ** 1.18,2 min 8.25 min 11/02

    Morgan Aero 8 1.18,9 min 8.39 min 04/03

    Nissan 350 Z 1.18,8 min 8.26 min 10/03

    Opel Speedster Turbo 1.17,1 min 8.34 min 04/04

    Pagani Zonda S 1.11,8 min 7.44 min 07/02

    Pagani Zonda F 1.10,8 min 7.33 min 05/06

    Porsche 911 GT3 (996) 1.13,2 min 7.54 min 06/03

    Porsche 911 Carrera 4 (996) 1.16,6 min 8.23 min 02/01

    Porsche 911 GT3 (996) 1.14,9 min 8.03 min 08/99

    Porsche 911 Turbo (996) 1.14,6 min 7.56 min 06/00

    Porsche 911 GT3 (997) ** 1.11,7 min 7.48 min 07/06

    Porsche 911 Turbo (997) 1.11,9 min 7.54 min 5/07

    Porsche 911 Carrera (996) 1.15,9 min 8.17 min 01/98

    Porsche 911 GT3 RS (996) ** 1.11,8 min 7.47 min 03/04

    Porsche 911 GT3 RS (997) ** 1.11,1 min 7.48 min 03/07

    Porsche 911 Turbo Werkstuning (993) 1.14,3 min 8.12 min 06/97

    Porsche Carrera GT 1.08,6 min 7.32 min 01/04

    Porsche Boxster (986) 1.19,4 min 8.36 min 03/03

    Porsche 911 Carrera (993) 1.18,3 min 8.28 min 07/97

    Porsche 911 Carrera (996) 1.17,1 min 8.17 min 10/01

    Porsche 911 Carrera Cabrio (993) 1.18,3 min 8.28 min 04/97

    Porsche 911 Carrera S (997) 1.14,3 min 8.05 min 05/05

    Porsche 911 GT2 (996) 1.12,6 min 7.46 min 06/01

    Porsche 911 GT3 Cup (996) ** 1.09,1 min 7.49 min 02/99

    Porsche 911 Turbo (993) 1.14,1 min 8.12 min 03/97

    Porsche Cayman S 1.15,9 min 8.25 min 11/06

    Porsche Boxster (986) 1.19,3 min 8.54 min 04/97

    Porsche Boxster S (986) 1.18,3 min 8.32 min 12/99

    Porsche Boxster S (987) 1.16,2 min 8.23 min 04/06

    Renault Mégane Trophy 1.18,8 min 8.38 min 06/05

    Renault Clio Sport V6 1.20,2 min 8.49 min 07/01

    Subaru Impreza WRX STi ** 1.17,9 min 8.24 min 05/04

    Subaru Impreza GT Turbo 1.19,4 min 8.37 min 03/00

    TechArt Porsche GT Street 1.12,3 min 7.43 min 08/01

    VW Golf V6 4 Motion 1.22,9 min 9.09 min 04/00

    Re: GT2 standard sports bucket seats...

    puts the GT2 clearly into Carrera GT and Pagani Zonda F territory............

    Re: GT2 standard sports bucket seats...

    Quote:
    intouch1 said:
    puts the GT2 clearly into Carrera GT and Pagani Zonda F territory............



    Hey guys, please use your brains...

    - ca. 100hp less than CGT
    - car based on standard 997 vs. pure and dedicated race car design in case of CGT
    - GT2 equipped with PASM which has demonstrated its inability to perform well on the track

    How should it be physically possible that the GT2 is as fast as the CGT

    I cannot believe that some of you believe in this marketing bla bla

    Re: GT2 standard sports bucket seats...

    I find it hard to believe (I don't want to believe) that Porsche would so blatantly misquote performance figures for other brands. Is it possible that WR tested all of these cars and thes were the figures he achieved? Obviously none of us know the truth behind where the Gallardo and 599 times came from but the rest seem to come from Sport Auto. I really hope Porsche releases some info on where they obtained all of these numbers. If the GT2 does acheive a ring time below 7:35, I think many Porsche critics will be silenced.

    Re: GT2 standard sports bucket seats...

    Quote:
    MKSGR said:
    Quote:
    intouch1 said:
    puts the GT2 clearly into Carrera GT and Pagani Zonda F territory............



    Hey guys, please use your brains...

    - ca. 100hp less than CGT
    - car based on standard 997 vs. pure and dedicated race car design in case of CGT
    - GT2 equipped with PASM which has demonstrated its inability to perform well on the track

    How should it be physically possible that the GT2 is as fast as the CGT

    I cannot believe that some of you believe in this marketing bla bla



    English proverb: Time will tell.

    Re: GT2 standard sports bucket seats...

    Quote:
    fritz said:
    Quote:
    MKSGR said:
    Quote:
    intouch1 said:
    puts the GT2 clearly into Carrera GT and Pagani Zonda F territory............



    Hey guys, please use your brains...

    - ca. 100hp less than CGT
    - car based on standard 997 vs. pure and dedicated race car design in case of CGT
    - GT2 equipped with PASM which has demonstrated its inability to perform well on the track

    How should it be physically possible that the GT2 is as fast as the CGT

    I cannot believe that some of you believe in this marketing bla bla



    English proverb: Time will tell.



    I would love to see the Supertest now - could have an impact on my buying decisions...

    Re: GT2 standard sports bucket seats...

    Quote:
    MKSGR said:
    Quote:
    fritz said:
    Quote:
    MKSGR said:
    Quote:
    intouch1 said:
    puts the GT2 clearly into Carrera GT and Pagani Zonda F territory............



    Hey guys, please use your brains...

    - ca. 100hp less than CGT
    - car based on standard 997 vs. pure and dedicated race car design in case of CGT
    - GT2 equipped with PASM which has demonstrated its inability to perform well on the track

    How should it be physically possible that the GT2 is as fast as the CGT

    I cannot believe that some of you believe in this marketing bla bla



    English proverb: Time will tell.



    I would love to see the Supertest now - could have an impact on my buying decisions...



    I seriously think that you need to face up to the painful fact that your buying decision is not going to materially affect the course of world history.


    Re: GT2 standard sports bucket seats...

    Quote:
    fritz said:
    Quote:
    MKSGR said:
    Quote:
    fritz said:
    Quote:
    MKSGR said:
    Quote:
    intouch1 said:
    puts the GT2 clearly into Carrera GT and Pagani Zonda F territory............



    Hey guys, please use your brains...

    - ca. 100hp less than CGT
    - car based on standard 997 vs. pure and dedicated race car design in case of CGT
    - GT2 equipped with PASM which has demonstrated its inability to perform well on the track

    How should it be physically possible that the GT2 is as fast as the CGT

    I cannot believe that some of you believe in this marketing bla bla



    English proverb: Time will tell.



    I would love to see the Supertest now - could have an impact on my buying decisions...



    I seriously think that you need to face up to the painful fact that your buying decision is not going to materially affect the course of world history.





    Really That is a big shock to me

    Re: GT2 standard sports bucket seats...

    Quote:
    MKSGR said:
    Quote:
    fritz said:
    Quote:
    MKSGR said:
    Quote:
    fritz said:
    Quote:
    MKSGR said:
    Quote:
    intouch1 said:
    puts the GT2 clearly into Carrera GT and Pagani Zonda F territory............



    Hey guys, please use your brains...

    - ca. 100hp less than CGT
    - car based on standard 997 vs. pure and dedicated race car design in case of CGT
    - GT2 equipped with PASM which has demonstrated its inability to perform well on the track

    How should it be physically possible that the GT2 is as fast as the CGT

    I cannot believe that some of you believe in this marketing bla bla



    English proverb: Time will tell.



    I would love to see the Supertest now - could have an impact on my buying decisions...



    I seriously think that you need to face up to the painful fact that your buying decision is not going to materially affect the course of world history.





    Really That is a big shock to me



    I know. That's why I tried to break it to you gently.

    Re: GT2 standard sports bucket seats...

    Quote:
    fritz said:
    Quote:
    MKSGR said:
    Quote:
    fritz said:
    Quote:
    MKSGR said:
    Quote:
    fritz said:
    Quote:
    MKSGR said:
    Quote:
    intouch1 said:
    puts the GT2 clearly into Carrera GT and Pagani Zonda F territory............



    Hey guys, please use your brains...

    - ca. 100hp less than CGT
    - car based on standard 997 vs. pure and dedicated race car design in case of CGT
    - GT2 equipped with PASM which has demonstrated its inability to perform well on the track

    How should it be physically possible that the GT2 is as fast as the CGT

    I cannot believe that some of you believe in this marketing bla bla



    English proverb: Time will tell.



    I would love to see the Supertest now - could have an impact on my buying decisions...



    I seriously think that you need to face up to the painful fact that your buying decision is not going to materially affect the course of world history.





    Really That is a big shock to me



    I know. That's why I tried to break it to you gently.



    How cruel you are

    Re: GT2 standard sports bucket seats...

    Quote:
    MKSGR said:
    Quote:
    fritz said:
    Quote:
    MKSGR said:
    Quote:
    fritz said:
    Quote:
    MKSGR said:
    Quote:
    fritz said:
    Quote:
    MKSGR said:
    Quote:
    intouch1 said:
    puts the GT2 clearly into Carrera GT and Pagani Zonda F territory............



    Hey guys, please use your brains...

    - ca. 100hp less than CGT
    - car based on standard 997 vs. pure and dedicated race car design in case of CGT
    - GT2 equipped with PASM which has demonstrated its inability to perform well on the track

    How should it be physically possible that the GT2 is as fast as the CGT

    I cannot believe that some of you believe in this marketing bla bla



    English proverb: Time will tell.



    I would love to see the Supertest now - could have an impact on my buying decisions...



    I seriously think that you need to face up to the painful fact that your buying decision is not going to materially affect the course of world history.





    Really That is a big shock to me



    I know. That's why I tried to break it to you gently.



    How cruel you are



    Sometimes you have to be cruel to be kind.

    Hmmm, that sounds like a good text for a song. It's a shame I'm not very musical.

    We'll have to stop this now. We're using up all of rennteam's little boxes.

    Re: GT2 standard sports bucket seats...

    Quote:
    fritz said:
    Quote:
    MKSGR said:
    Quote:
    intouch1 said:
    puts the GT2 clearly into Carrera GT and Pagani Zonda F territory............



    Hey guys, please use your brains...

    - ca. 100hp less than CGT
    - car based on standard 997 vs. pure and dedicated race car design in case of CGT
    - GT2 equipped with PASM which has demonstrated its inability to perform well on the track

    How should it be physically possible that the GT2 is as fast as the CGT

    I cannot believe that some of you believe in this marketing bla bla



    English proverb: Time will tell.



    Universal proverb: If it sounds too good to be true, it probably is.

    Re: GT2 standard sports bucket seats...

    Quote:
    AUM said:
    Quote:
    fritz said:
    Quote:
    MKSGR said:
    Quote:
    intouch1 said:
    puts the GT2 clearly into Carrera GT and Pagani Zonda F territory............



    Hey guys, please use your brains...

    - ca. 100hp less than CGT
    - car based on standard 997 vs. pure and dedicated race car design in case of CGT
    - GT2 equipped with PASM which has demonstrated its inability to perform well on the track

    How should it be physically possible that the GT2 is as fast as the CGT

    I cannot believe that some of you believe in this marketing bla bla



    English proverb: Time will tell.



    Universal proverb: If it sounds too good to be true, it probably is.



    Probability is a numbers game.

    If you bet on a probability where your odds of being right are supposedly 99 to 1 and then lose, are you only 1% wrong?

    Of course not. You are still 100% wrong.

    Forget universal proverbs.

    Stick to the English ones.

    PS: I think you overlooked the fact that I did not commit myself either way when saying "Time will tell". Now, if we want to talk about real money here, I could be tempted to do so.

    Re: GT2 standard sports bucket seats...

    Quote:
    fritz said:
    PS: I think you overlooked the fact that I did not commit myself either way when saying "Time will tell".



    Chances are that you are a politician

    Re: GT2 standard sports bucket seats...

    Quote:
    MKSGR said:
    Quote:
    fritz said:
    PS: I think you overlooked the fact that I did not commit myself either way when saying "Time will tell".



    Chances are that you are a politician



    Now that was really offensive.

    Re: GT2 standard sports bucket seats...

    If SA does get a sub 7:37 time for the GT2, I think it will demonstrate how modern technology is beating physics in the so-called "time plateau" that the CGT supposedly benchmarked at ~7:30.

    I mean the 599, which imo is a hulking heaving GT with FR was able to achieve 7:47. That's impressive, because that setup/weight has never really been successful throughout history. A GT2 with ~90hp less and 500-600 kilos less fat should be able to do some serious damage. Technology...what a mother

    But only time will tell

    Re: GT2 standard sports bucket seats...

    Some people just can't handle the truth.

    Re: GT2 standard sports bucket seats...

    Quote:
    Hurst said:
    But only time will tell



    that is the truth!!!

    Re: GT2 standard sports bucket seats...







    Re: GT2 standard sports bucket seats...






    Re: GT2 standard sports bucket seats...




    Re: GT2 standard sports bucket seats...

    Simply gorgeus!

    Re: GT2 standard sports bucket seats...







    Re: GT2 standard sports bucket seats...







    Re: GT2 standard sports bucket seats...





     
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