Crown

Board: Motor Sports Language: English Region: Worldwide Share/Save/Bookmark Close

Forum - Thread


    2015 Mexican F1 Grand Prix

    Mexico next ...


    --


    997.1 C2S GT Silver/Cocoa, -20mm/LSD, PSE, short shifter, SportDesign rims, Zuffenhausen pickup, BMW Z4 2.5i Roadster Sterling Grey/Red


    Re: 2015 Mexican F1 Grand Prix

    Good to see you back in the regular swing of things. kiss


    Re: 2015 Mexican F1 Grand Prix

    apias:

    Good to see you back in the regular swing of things. kiss

    +100...kiss

    Easy - I know you've got a lot going on with your new career, but your regular inputs here are sadly missed..Smiley

    Really hope everything is well for you & yours...wink

     


    --

    "Things turn out best for people who make the best of the way things turn out."


    Re: 2015 Mexican F1 Grand Prix

    Thanks guys - very kind of you kiss


    --


    997.1 C2S GT Silver/Cocoa, -20mm/LSD, PSE, short shifter, SportDesign rims, Zuffenhausen pickup, BMW Z4 2.5i Roadster Sterling Grey/Red


    Re: 2015 Mexican F1 Grand Prix

    John H:
    apias:

    Good to see you back in the regular swing of things. kiss

    +100...kiss

    Easy - I know you've got a lot going on with your new career, but your regular inputs here are sadly missed..Smiley

    Really hope everything is well for you & yours...wink

     

    Smiley


    Re: 2015 Mexican F1 Grand Prix

    easy_rider911:

    Mexico next ...

     

    How's the shoulder? I am guessing it's well enough for you to type stuff :)


    --

     

     


    Re: 2015 Mexican F1 Grand Prix

    Looks as though LH, having clinched the title, is now exploring other sporting pursuits...heart

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Kf60JKnkUT0

     

     


    --

    "Things turn out best for people who make the best of the way things turn out."


    Re: 2015 Mexican F1 Grand Prix

    well that was embarrasing to watch! frown 


    --

    ⇒ Carlos - Porsche 991 Carrera GTS


    Re: 2015 Mexican F1 Grand Prix

    Would be interesting to hear about the answer given to Hamilton from his engineer about the tire life left on his prime. That tire change cost Hamilton the win. Had Hamilton stayed out, Rosberg will need to make up almost 30 seconds and then pass Hamilton to have a chance to win.

    The prime seems durable enough to last the distance, Perez did it. 

    I wonder if it's Mercedes's way of secretly paying back Nico. 


    --

     

     


    Re: 2015 Mexican F1 Grand Prix

    Bit of a boring race to watch.
    Predictable outcome; now that Lewis has secured the championship, they are favoring Nico to get as much points as possible for pos2.
    What happened with Vettel? Did he have an issue with his brakes? All three incidents after his initial puncture were related with brake balance or not braking enough.
    --

    Porsche, seperates LeMans from LeBoys

    Re: 2015 Mexican F1 Grand Prix

    Whoopsy:

    Would be interesting to hear about the answer given to Hamilton from his engineer about the tire life left on his prime. That tire change cost Hamilton the win. Had Hamilton stayed out, Rosberg will need to make up almost 30 seconds and then pass Hamilton to have a chance to win.

    The prime seems durable enough to last the distance, Perez did it. 

    I wonder if it's Mercedes's way of secretly paying back Nico. 

    The same can be said for taking Rosberg in. They took both drivers in just to be on the safe side. Rosberg was faster all weekend, so a deserved win. Smiley 


    --

    2012 Cayenne S White/Espresso 

    Ex: 993 Targa, 986S, 986 and 964 C2


    Re: 2015 Mexican F1 Grand Prix

    993Targa:
    Whoopsy:

    Would be interesting to hear about the answer given to Hamilton from his engineer about the tire life left on his prime. That tire change cost Hamilton the win. Had Hamilton stayed out, Rosberg will need to make up almost 30 seconds and then pass Hamilton to have a chance to win.

    The prime seems durable enough to last the distance, Perez did it. 

    I wonder if it's Mercedes's way of secretly paying back Nico. 

    The same can be said for taking Rosberg in. They took both drivers in just to be on the safe side. Rosberg was faster all weekend, so a deserved win. Smiley 

    maybe it was all clever tactics: Let Rosberg believe he is still competitive. I wouldn't be surprised if Mercedes (and LH) let him win the rest of the races... He will think that he lost the championship only because of bad luck and he will feel strong and hungry for next season, what Mercedes wants. 


    --

    Lotus 3-Eleven on order


    Re: 2015 Mexican F1 Grand Prix

    Are you guys seriously saying that Mercedes was favoring Rosberg when they pitted both drivers, the leader Rosberg first, for safety reasons (same tire that blew out on Rosberg and Vettel at Spa), at the tactically perfect time? And they should have allowed Hamilton, that wizard of tire strategy (Monaco), to stay out, and that not allowing him to stay out, after forcing Rosberg to pit, was handing an advantage to Rosberg?

    Seriously?


    Re: 2015 Mexican F1 Grand Prix

    No, I was just saying I was not surprised that Rosberg won from Hamilton. How they did it I don't know, but let's say the outcome is just too convenient...
    --

    Porsche, seperates LeMans from LeBoys

    Re: 2015 Mexican F1 Grand Prix

    Joost:
    No, I was just saying I was not surprised that Rosberg won from Hamilton. How they did it I don't know, but let's say the outcome is just too convenient...

    +1 kiss


    Re: 2015 Mexican F1 Grand Prix

    993Targa:
    Whoopsy:

    Would be interesting to hear about the answer given to Hamilton from his engineer about the tire life left on his prime. That tire change cost Hamilton the win. Had Hamilton stayed out, Rosberg will need to make up almost 30 seconds and then pass Hamilton to have a chance to win.

    The prime seems durable enough to last the distance, Perez did it. 

    I wonder if it's Mercedes's way of secretly paying back Nico. 

    The same can be said for taking Rosberg in. They took both drivers in just to be on the safe side. Rosberg was faster all weekend, so a deserved win. Smiley 

     

    Rosberg is faster all weekend, and only way Hamilton got a chance is to skip one pit stop. 


    --

     

     


    Re: 2015 Mexican F1 Grand Prix

    Joost:
    Bit of a boring race to watch.
    Predictable outcome; now that Lewis has secured the championship, they are favoring Nico to get as much points as possible for pos2.
    What happened with Vettel? Did he have an issue with his brakes? All three incidents after his initial puncture were related with brake balance or not braking enough.

     

    Think Vettel just out drove the car. He was pushing as hard as he can to try and catch the leaders after the contact on the 1st corner from the start.


    --

     

     


    Re: 2015 Mexican F1 Grand Prix

    Kimi is really doing some desperate moves. He starting to show his true pace but does no have the patience. He will be better in 16.


    --

    throt

    "I Have Done It!".

    991 GT3 pick up in October 2014.


    Re: 2015 Mexican F1 Grand Prix

    Whoopsy:
    993Targa:
    Whoopsy:

    Would be interesting to hear about the answer given to Hamilton from his engineer about the tire life left on his prime. That tire change cost Hamilton the win. Had Hamilton stayed out, Rosberg will need to make up almost 30 seconds and then pass Hamilton to have a chance to win.

    The prime seems durable enough to last the distance, Perez did it. 

    I wonder if it's Mercedes's way of secretly paying back Nico. 

    The same can be said for taking Rosberg in. They took both drivers in just to be on the safe side. Rosberg was faster all weekend, so a deserved win. Smiley 

     

    Rosberg is faster all weekend, and only way Hamilton got a chance is to skip one pit stop. 

    So, you're saying the team should have favored Hamilton, after ordering Rosberg, who was in the lead, in for tires, they should have kept Hamilton out, instead of operating neutrally, despite the fact that they had good reasons for ordering both drivers in for tires?


    Re: 2015 Mexican F1 Grand Prix

    Whoopsy:
    Joost:
    Bit of a boring race to watch.
    Predictable outcome; now that Lewis has secured the championship, they are favoring Nico to get as much points as possible for pos2.
    What happened with Vettel? Did he have an issue with his brakes? All three incidents after his initial puncture were related with brake balance or not braking enough.

     

    Think Vettel just out drove the car. He was pushing as hard as he can to try and catch the leaders after the contact on the 1st corner from the start.

    Vettel crashed out because he totally lost his head after cutting his tire down on Ricciardo's front wing.


    Re: 2015 Mexican F1 Grand Prix

    apias:
     

    So, you're saying the team should have favored Hamilton, after ordering Rosberg, who was in the lead, in for tires, they should have kept Hamilton out, instead of operating neutrally, despite the fact that they had good reasons for ordering both drivers in for tires?

     

    No no no. Hamilton knows his only shot at winning is to keep going, that's why he didn't stop the first time around, he believed his tires are still very good and can last the distance. The 2 camps kind of operate separately, so one team can use one strategy and a different one for the other. Rosberg's engineer feel like they needed that extra stop to change tires, and they brought him in, he was the leader so he gets first choice anyway.

    Hamilton disagreed with the tire wear information and believed he can do it on that set. Up until his engineer says it was a 'safety' issue. But we never got the extra info about the actual tire life left on those prime, especially in light of how Perez can go so far on a set of primes. So a conspiracy theory is floating around that in order to secure the victory for Rosberg, who well deserved it being the fastest all weekend, they had to bring in Hamilton for the extra stop. And hence Mercedes compromised their 'neutrality' by ordering Hamilton in.

    Not saying Hamilton will win even if he stays out, by the end his tires will likely be very worn and may not be able to fend off Rosberg, but a dog fight like that near the end of the race might very well ended up with both crashing out and handing the victory to a 3rd party. Bringing him in will secure 1-2 finish for the team, and a win for Rosberg to please him somewhat, a consolation prize somewhat for losing the Championship and also to try and secure 2nd place in the Championship standing over Vettel.

     


    --

     

     


    Re: 2015 Mexican F1 Grand Prix

    They changed them both for safety reasons and because it was the right move, given the size of the gap. There was nothing wrong with Rosberg's tires either, he was ordered in as well. The "conspiracy theory" is nonsense.


    Re: 2015 Mexican F1 Grand Prix

    Agreed, there was nothing to be gained by taking the risk for Mercedes.  If Hamilton had not already secured the championship... Then different story.


    --

    2007 997TT Blk/Blk 2007 X3 Sil Gry/Taupe 2002 E46 M3 Slvr/Blk (gone)


    Re: 2015 Mexican F1 Grand Prix

    http://planetf1.com/news/lewis-merc-were-extra-warm-to-rosberg/


    --

    Lotus 3-Eleven on order


    Re: 2015 Mexican F1 Grand Prix

    Where, by "extra warm" he means not letting him have his way, no matter what. Hamilton is such a whiner.


    Re: 2015 Mexican F1 Grand Prix

    James Allen says:

    November 3, 2015 at 9:39 pm

    No, my information is that HAM’s tyres were more worn than ROS.

    So the precautionary stop was more to Ham’s benefit than ROS. HAM made it look otherwise


    Re: 2015 Mexican F1 Grand Prix

    Why did Mercedes change strategy and could Hamilton have won by staying out?

    The key moment of the Mexican Grand Prix came early in the second half of the race, when Mercedes decided to switch to Plan B, which was to make a second stop for a new set of medium tyres. Hamilton questioned it, but having analysed this carefully, would Hamilton have won the race if he had been allowed to stay out? 

    The interesting aspect of this, which has not been widely discussed, is that Hamilton had experienced higher wear than Rosberg on the tyres during the race, so he had more to gain from this precautionary stop than Rosberg. At this point there was no way of knowing that a Safety car would come out five laps later. But without the Safety Car the Mercedes drivers would have been trying to do around 45 laps on the mediums, on a track that was ramping up quickly in grip and speed. 

    Another aspect that has not been reported in the coverage of this story is that this rapid track improvement masked the tyre degradation, which was what caught Force India out on Perez car (see below). At one point Hamilton did a faster lap on the medium tyres than he had done in the first part of qualifying, which is highly unusual and shows how fast the pace was in the race as the track improved.

    The Strategy call to pit the Mercedes came as a precaution, in case there was a Safety Car later in the race. If a Safety car were to be deployed at a time when the Mercedes were caught out by it in the wrong position on track – if they had just passed the pit lane, for example, then they would have lost the race. 

    So once they had built a 27 second gap to Kvyat, it was obvious that changing the tyres was the right move; if you don’t have to risk running the tyres to the end of the race for 45 laps, then you don’t do that. You pit and change them, any team would do the same in Mercedes’ situation, with that advantage.

    The team decided to play it safe and pit both drivers. In hindsight it might have been better to pit Hamilton first, to avoid the controversy which arose as he did an extra lap while questioning the decision. Then again, he would have almost undercut Rosberg if he’d been given the first pit stop, which could have been controversial in its own way.

    To be fair, Hamilton clearly had limited knowledge of why Rosberg had stopped and perhaps assumed that his rival was in trouble with tyres, whereas he felt positive about his tyres. He saw an opportunity to challenge for the win – one he was keen to take, because for all his bravado after winning the championship and teasing Rosberg for the ‘gust of wind’ which was blamed for the German’s mistake in Austin, the fact is that Rosberg has now fixed his qualifying issues and has out-qualified Hamilton four races in a row. 

    Hypothetically, had Hamilton stayed out and not followed the instruction, he would have been able to lap in the mid 1m 22s, while Rosberg would have been able to do 1m 20s. So in the five laps before the Safety Car the gap would have come down to around 8 seconds. Hamilton would then have pitted under the Safety Car, but he’d be putting himself in the hands of a pit crew, whom he had disobeyed, to turn him around quickly… 

    If he’d tried to stay out, then at the restart he would be racing with a tyre offset to Rosberg of 16 laps, which would have meant a fairly easy overtake for Rosberg to win the race.

    -- http://www.jamesallenonf1.com/2015/11/insight-could-hamilton-have-won-staying-out-and-how-bottas-got-away-with-it/


    Re: 2015 Mexican F1 Grand Prix

    Interesting insight on the matter:

    http://www.bbc.com/sport/formula1/34703811


    --

    2003 BMW M3 CSL (sold) / 2008 Porsche 911 GT3 RS / 2013 MINI John Cooper Works GP / 2014 BMW Alpina D3 biturbo Touring


    Re: 2015 Mexican F1 Grand Prix

    Porker:

    Interesting insight on the matter:

    http://www.bbc.com/sport/formula1/34703811

     

    Smiley


    --

     

     


    Re: 2015 Mexican F1 Grand Prix

    I think the interesting insight is that so many people think it would have been more "fair" for Mercedes to have disadvantaged Rosberg's race by making him pit and then leaving Hamilton out in a lead inherited as a result of his own team making the other driver pit. It boggles the mind how anyone could possibly think that treating the drivers on an equal footing somehow favors the other, unless, of course. you think Hamilton can't win without handicapping Rosberg, so it's fair if they even the field by doing so.

    Have any of you actually stopped to think about the actual logic of what it is you are claiming?


     
    Edit

    Forum

    Board Subject Last post Rating Views Replies
    Porsche Sticky The moment I've been waiting for... 10/25/21 12:29 AM
    Pilot
     
     
     
     
     
    492526 1291
    Porsche Sticky OFFICIAL: New Porsche 911 Turbo S (2020) 11/8/21 7:43 PM
    Leawood911
    181160 1154
    Porsche Sticky Welcome to Rennteam: Cars and Coffee... (photos) 11/12/21 10:01 AM
    Boxster Coupe GTS
    71767 383
    Porsche Sticky SUN'S LAST RUN TO WILSON, WY - 991 C2S CAB LIFE, END OF AN ERA (Part II) 11/25/21 6:30 PM
    watt
    67321 686
    Porsche Sticky Porsche Taycan Turbo S - Short Review 11/19/21 6:44 AM
    bluelines
    53310 529
    Porsche Sticky ROAD TEST: New 992 Carrera 4S 3/3/21 10:57 PM
    Wonderbar
    49115 336
    Porsche Sticky Porsche extends the Taycan model range (Taycan 2WD) 2/1/21 12:42 PM
    Leawood911
    13461 29
    Porsche Sticky OFFICIAL: Cayman GT4 RS (2021) 11/18/21 3:28 PM
    RCA
    535 0
    Porsche Cayman GT4 10/5/21 7:04 PM
    Topspeed
    474318 3587
    Porsche OFFICIAL: 911 GT2 RS (2017) 9/28/21 3:25 AM
    WhoopsyM
    390083 3507
    McLaren McLaren on a winning streak 11/25/21 12:31 AM
    WhoopsyM
    386290 3949
    Porsche OFFICIAL: 991.2 GT3 RS (2018) 11/17/21 5:18 PM
    Rossi
    351756 3256
    Porsche OFFICIAL: 911 R (2016) 10/8/21 11:41 AM
    xpto
    321221 2647
    Porsche 992 GT3 12/2/21 3:02 AM
    Grant
    278982 3126
    Porsche OFFICIAL: The new Porsche 992 – a design icon and high-tech sports car 9/29/21 1:59 AM
    watt
    254887 1587
    Porsche OFFICIAL: New Panamera (2016) 2/11/21 9:22 AM
    Itsme
    169402 1379
    Lambo Lamborghini Huracan and variants 4/9/21 4:32 PM
    Topspeed
    120098 1225
    Porsche Donor vehicle for Singer Vehicle Design 9/22/21 1:28 AM
    Leawood911
    104536 749
    Porsche Welcome to the new Taycan Forum! 12/2/21 11:59 AM
    kudryavchik
    95501 1234
    McLaren F1 7/10/21 7:43 AM
    BiTurbo
    83337 209
    Lambo Aventador and SV 8/27/21 2:33 PM
    Topspeed
    74319 698
    AMG AMG GT R 7/8/21 3:07 PM
    CGX car nut
    74252 824
    Others Tesla 2 the new thread 11/30/21 2:32 PM
    RCA
    54045 1398
    Others Bugatti Chiron 11/4/21 5:58 AM
    WhoopsyM
    44124 500
    Ferrari Ferrari 812 Superfast 11/10/21 2:32 PM
    Topspeed
    41184 532
    Porsche Olive 991.2 GT3 Clubsport 1/1/21 7:58 PM
    throt
    39960 615
    Porsche GT4RS 11/28/21 2:38 PM
    bluelines
    38232 710
    Motor Sp. [2021] Formula 1 12/1/21 11:22 AM
    kudryavchik
    33424 1074
    BMW M BMW M2 Rumors 7/7/21 8:38 PM
    Jim_in_Iowa
    31202 394
    Ferrari 488 Replacement 4/17/21 8:28 PM
    Rossi
    28036 370
    251 items found, displaying 1 to 30.