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    Re: OFFICIAL: New 991.2 GT3

    I am not sure about the RS. Its more track oriented and may not be right for me. I may keep the GT3 for a while to see what Porsche has coming in the next year or two.

    Also, I may track the car only under strict guidelines. NO passing in corners and drivers with similar driving abilities. I have no intention of absorbing a $175,000 hit just for a momentary thrill. On the public road, I have no problem. I am insured. But on a track, my wallet is exposed.


    --

    "A man wrapped up in himself makes for a very small bundle."


    Re: OFFICIAL: New 991.2 GT3

    nberry: On the public road, I have no problem. I am insured. But on a track, my wallet is exposed.

    Another reason to do Euro Delivery (Porsche insurance covers track)...


    --

     

    73 Carrera RS 2.7 Carbon Fiber replica (1,890 lbs), 06 EVO9 with track mods. Former: 16 Cayman GT4, 73 911S, Two 951S's, 996 C2, 993 C2, 98 Ferrari 550, 79 635CSi

     


    Re: OFFICIAL: New 991.2 GT3

    Grant:
    nberry: On the public road, I have no problem. I am insured. But on a track, my wallet is exposed.

    Another reason to do Euro Delivery (Porsche insurance covers track)...


    --

     

    73 Carrera RS 2.7 Carbon Fiber replica (1,890 lbs), 06 EVO9 with track mods. Former: 16 Cayman GT4, 73 911S, Two 951S's, 996 C2, 993 C2, 98 Ferrari 550, 79 635CSi

     

     I thought about that but can't get myself to use the GT3 to drive around Europe. It's not a touring car. its meant for spirited driving and very difficult to do in Europe with all their speed monitoring and slow mountain passes.

    BTW, I assume you will be ignoring the break-in guidelines recommended by Porsche?Smiley


    --

     

    "A man wrapped up in himself makes for a very small bundle."

     


    Re: OFFICIAL: New 991.2 GT3

    nberry:
    Grant:
    nberry: On the public road, I have no problem. I am insured. But on a track, my wallet is exposed.

    Another reason to do Euro Delivery (Porsche insurance covers track)...


    --

     

    73 Carrera RS 2.7 Carbon Fiber replica (1,890 lbs), 06 EVO9 with track mods. Former: 16 Cayman GT4, 73 911S, Two 951S's, 996 C2, 993 C2, 98 Ferrari 550, 79 635CSi

     

     I thought about that but can't get myself to use the GT3 to drive around Europe. It's not a touring car. its meant for spirited driving and very difficult to do in Europe with all their speed monitoring and slow mountain passes.

    BTW, I assume you will be ignoring the break-in guidelines recommended by Porsche?Smiley


    --

     

    "A man wrapped up in himself makes for a very small bundle."

     

    No, I'll do AP's recommended break-in which is much shorter than what it says in the manual (gradually increase revs over an abbreviated schedule).

    Driving in parts of Europe is terrific (especially compared to driving in much of SD, from my memory).  SD is one of my favorite US cities, but not for driving...


    --

     

    73 Carrera RS 2.7 Carbon Fiber replica (1,890 lbs), 06 EVO9 with track mods. Former: 16 Cayman GT4, 73 911S, Two 951S's, 996 C2, 993 C2, 98 Ferrari 550, 79 635CSi

     


    Re: OFFICIAL: New 991.2 GT3

    Grant:
    nberry:

    Porsche is accommodating a vocal minority.

    I'm grateful that the vocal minority includes some influential Porsche employees like Andreas Preuninger and Walter Röhrl Smiley


    --

     

    73 Carrera RS 2.7 Carbon Fiber replica (1,890 lbs), 06 EVO9 with track mods. Former: 16 Cayman GT4, 73 911S, Two 951S's, 996 C2, 993 C2, 98 Ferrari 550, 79 635CSi

     

    Sun doubts it's small minority - it may be a big one like 45% of global delivery....  we shall see soon enoughSmiley


    Re: OFFICIAL: New 991.2 GT3

    nberry:

    I am not sure about the RS. Its more track oriented and may not be right for me. I may keep the GT3 for a while to see what Porsche has coming in the next year or two.

    Also, I may track the car only under strict guidelines. NO passing in corners and drivers with similar driving abilities. I have no intention of absorbing a $175,000 hit just for a momentary thrill. On the public road, I have no problem. I am insured. But on a track, my wallet is exposed.

    Sun drives the SITT - South Island Track Tour self insured. Unless you've got some place to canyon slam or plan on running 2 lane in the Wild West [NV-AZ-UT-WY] you'll need to go to the track before you sell it this time so you know what you actually soldSmiley


    Re: OFFICIAL: New 991.2 GT3

    watt:
    nberry:

    I am not sure about the RS. Its more track oriented and may not be right for me. I may keep the GT3 for a while to see what Porsche has coming in the next year or two.

    Also, I may track the car only under strict guidelines. NO passing in corners and drivers with similar driving abilities. I have no intention of absorbing a $175,000 hit just for a momentary thrill. On the public road, I have no problem. I am insured. But on a track, my wallet is exposed.

    Sun drives the SITT - South Island Track Tour self insured. Unless you've got some place to canyon slam or plan on running 2 lane in the Wild West [NV-AZ-UT-WY] you'll need to go to the track before you sell it this time so you know what you actually soldSmiley

    Smiley


    --

    2015 981 Cayman GT4 | Powerkit White - The fastest car on Rennteam
    2013 Audi S3 | Glacier White


    Re: OFFICIAL: New 991.2 GT3

    TB993tt:
    absent:
     

    Supposedly the 2005 model was a lot easier to learn then the 2004 which I had.

    Never had the opportunity to drive it so just repeating what I heard, it took me a few days of driving in a city/suburbs environment to learn enough to not have any frustrating or embarrassing moments anymore (nothing sucks more then stalling a supercar at a stop light with everyone watching you).

    Yeah I think you are right they did something to the ECU on the later models so that it didn't stall as easily when starting off. 

     

    They did add the anti-stall function on the 05 cars.

    Same software is employed on the Porsche race cars.

    Stay off the throttle, gradually letting off the clutch and the ECU take care of the throttle application for a getaway without stalling. But the moment the gas pedal is touched, the ECU takes it's hands off. You are on your own. 

    It really feels weird at first, I drove a anti-stall CGT before but I keep stalling it as I wasn't aware of the software then wasn't trusting it. Then on the race car I trust it too much, I let go of the clutch too early Smiley

    One of my buddy with a CGT absolutely refused to go to downtown San Francisco in a CGT, go figures Smiley


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    Re: OFFICIAL: New 991.2 GT3

    vantagesc:
     

    Nice thing about older cars like my Lotus is that you don't care how fast you are going...all about the experience.

     

    This!

    I am in completely agreement.

    Older cars with the manual and without any aids means it's just drivers' interaction with the car.

    Modern manual with all the aids are just a pretender. 

     


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    Re: OFFICIAL: New 991.2 GT3

    watt:
    Grant:
    nberry:

    Porsche is accommodating a vocal minority.

    I'm grateful that the vocal minority includes some influential Porsche employees like Andreas Preuninger and Walter Röhrl Smiley


    --

     

    73 Carrera RS 2.7 Carbon Fiber replica (1,890 lbs), 06 EVO9 with track mods. Former: 16 Cayman GT4, 73 911S, Two 951S's, 996 C2, 993 C2, 98 Ferrari 550, 79 635CSi

     

    Sun doubts it's small minority - it may be a big one like 45% of global delivery....  we shall see soon enoughSmiley

     

    It will not be 45%.

    At best it could be 15-20%. 

    stretching it maybe 25% period.

     


    --

     

     


    Re: OFFICIAL: New 991.2 GT3

     

     

     I thought about that but can't get myself to use the GT3 to drive around Europe. It's not a touring car. its meant for spirited driving and very difficult to do in Europe with all their speed monitoring and slow mountain passes.


    --

     

    "A man wrapped up in himself makes for a very small bundle."

     

    nberry - have you ever driven on an alpine road in Europe?

    That's GT3 heaven, also if you stay within the laws you can have great fun in the mountains and don't forget the German Autobahn...Smiley

    Blueflame


    Re: OFFICIAL: New 991.2 GT3

    blueflame:

     

     

     I thought about that but can't get myself to use the GT3 to drive around Europe. It's not a touring car. its meant for spirited driving and very difficult to do in Europe with all their speed monitoring and slow mountain passes.


    --

     

    "A man wrapped up in himself makes for a very small bundle."

     

    nberry - have you ever driven on an alpine road in Europe?

    That's GT3 heaven, also if you stay within the laws you can have great fun in the mountains and don't forget the German Autobahn...Smiley

    Blueflame

    Many times. The roads are fantastic and very scenic. I particularly enjoyed driving outside the bigger cities and smaller country roads. But I also enjoy my creature comforts and not a B&B person. That often forces me into the city for my accommodations. The way to tour Europe is in a comfortable car and enjoy the wonderful views. To me, the GT3 is not that car. yes


    --

    "A man wrapped up in himself makes for a very small bundle."


    Re: OFFICIAL: New 991.2 GT3

    so true!!!! but even, i drove for an hour on a boring austrian highway yesterday under pouring rain (at varying speeds from 80kmh to 140kmh, depending on road conditions) but i still had fun. just feeling the car is great. varying the engine sound, some manual shifting etc. a wonderful car, under all circumstances!


    Re: OFFICIAL: New 991.2 GT3

    nberry:

    Many times. The roads are fantastic and very scenic. I particularly enjoyed driving outside the bigger cities and smaller country roads. But I also enjoy my creature comforts and not a B&B person. That often forces me into the city for my accommodations. The way to tour Europe is in a comfortable car and enjoy the wonderful views. To me, the GT3 is not that car. yes

    A GT3 with Front Axle Lift and PDK-S is a pretty luxurious and comfortable car for a trip like that (and easy to park in a luxury hotel garage with the lift).  Maybe the LWB seats would be the only compromise, but I find them pretty comfy with a small lumbar pillow...


    --

     

     

    73 Carrera RS 2.7 Carbon Fiber replica (1,890 lbs), 06 EVO9 with track mods. Former: 16 Cayman GT4, 73 911S, Two 951S's, 996 C2, 993 C2, 98 Ferrari 550, 79 635CSi

     


    Re: OFFICIAL: New 991.2 GT3

    The only problem with the GT3 is that when you arrive at your final destination you really don't want to stop. 


    Re: OFFICIAL: New 991.2 GT3

    Agree with Grant that as long as you find the seats comfortable, a GT3 is easy to rack up miles and miles.  Though you may be tempted to exceed the local speed limits!  The biggest issue will be worry about parking in in garages / hotels / etc.

    I did a week long European tour in October 2015.  Munich --> Stuttgart --> Rhein Falls / Schaffhausen --> Zurich --> Lucerne --> Milan --> Lake Como --> Munich.  Roads in Germany are incredibly smooth.  Italy was similar to California, but better than LA.  We rented an Audi TT (the new one with virtual cockpit).  Pretty good car for touring.  Good enough ride quality, small / nimble for city driving, fits in narrow parking garages, and decent enough handling for mountain passes.  I believe we hit 135 mph on the autobahn, that is all I could muster with 200 hp. :)


    Re: OFFICIAL: New 991.2 GT3

    vantagesc:

    It's kind of an apples vs. oranges comparison because the GT500 would still be less stable than the R8 even if the GT500 had DCT.

    Probably true but still...manual makes no sense in a car like the GT500 with so much torque. Yes...it is fun...if you have the balls. Smiley Smiley

    Still I see what you are saying and comes down to whether the effort you spend shifting manually is "worth" the trouble.  Because modern cars are increasingly less communicative and emotional, so much of the entertainment value comes from the speed they deliver and whether that speed can be delivered in a way that is thrilling but not scary.  So I can definitely see it being the case that some cars, having DCT allows the extraction of performance with less effort that on balance is more thrilling than it would have been with manual.  Safer, easier, and faster.

    I shift my DCT (R8) only manually because it is so much fun. Not having a clutch to operate allows me to concentrate on the driving itself, which opens completely new horizons of possibilities. 

    Now you flip it around to a slower but older car.  Yes there has to be some performance, but the thrills come from feeling every inch of the road, feeling the weight move forward and back, feedback coming from the steering wheel, feeling vibration of the engine through the seat.  In that context, DCT is removing the interaction that is a key basis of entertainment.  In the case of a GT3, I think that car is "fast enough" for the road as well, and is a pretty composed car to boot, so it's a tossup between manual and PDK.

    I can see the pleasure of driving an Austin Healey with manual or maybe even a 964 RS. A modern car? Not so much, sorry. 


    --

    RC (Germany) - Rennteam Editor Porsche 991 Carrera 4 GTS Cabriolet (2015), Porsche Cayenne S Diesel (2017), Audi R8 V10 Plus (2016), Mini JCW (2015)


    Re: OFFICIAL: New 991.2 GT3

    RC:

    I can see the pleasure of driving an Austin Healey with manual or maybe even a 964 RS. A modern car? Not so much, sorry. 

    I think most people who drove the GT4 (including myself) considered the manual shifting one of the most endearing qualities of the car.


    --

    73 Carrera RS 2.7 Carbon Fiber replica (1,890 lbs), 06 EVO9 with track mods. Former: 16 Cayman GT4, 73 911S, Two 951S's, 996 C2, 993 C2, 98 Ferrari 550, 79 635CSi


    Re: OFFICIAL: New 991.2 GT3

    Grant:
    RC:

    I can see the pleasure of driving an Austin Healey with manual or maybe even a 964 RS. A modern car? Not so much, sorry. 

    I think most people who drove the GT4 (including myself) considered the manual shifting one of the most endearing qualities of the car.

    Grant, I'll second that!


    Re: OFFICIAL: New 991.2 GT3

    We can argue all day long about manual shifting but my opinion on this is pretty clear. It is a relict of the past and if you guys enjoy it, so be it. I will probably be in the same boat when I am driving a V10 n/a engine in 10 years from now and most people will then smile at me and say it is too slow (compared to the then available turbo hybrids or ELVs with 1000 hp and more  system power in the same car class). 

    I get it when people love the drive feel of manual. What I do not get is if people feel special driving manual. Like I said before, every granny and adolescent learns to drive manual in Europe, nothing special about it. That "special" feel is more of a US thing...I guess.


    --

    RC (Germany) - Rennteam Editor Porsche 991 Carrera 4 GTS Cabriolet (2015), Porsche Cayenne S Diesel (2017), Audi R8 V10 Plus (2016), Mini JCW (2015)


    Re: OFFICIAL: New 991.2 GT3

    RC:

    What I do not get is if people feel special driving manual. Like I said before, every granny and adolescent learns to drive manual in Europe, nothing special about it. That "special" feel is more of a US thing...I guess.

    Don't care about "special".  I just find it fun...


    --

    73 Carrera RS 2.7 Carbon Fiber replica (1,890 lbs), 06 EVO9 with track mods. Former: 16 Cayman GT4, 73 911S, Two 951S's, 996 C2, 993 C2, 98 Ferrari 550, 79 635CSi


    Re: OFFICIAL: New 991.2 GT3

    Grant:
    RC:

    What I do not get is if people feel special driving manual. Like I said before, every granny and adolescent learns to drive manual in Europe, nothing special about it. That "special" feel is more of a US thing...I guess.

    Don't care about "special".  I just find it fun...

    Smiley No problem with that. Smiley


    --

    RC (Germany) - Rennteam Editor Porsche 991 Carrera 4 GTS Cabriolet (2015), Porsche Cayenne S Diesel (2017), Audi R8 V10 Plus (2016), Mini JCW (2015)


    Re: OFFICIAL: New 991.2 GT3

    I would be interested in knowing what percentage is choosing manual vs PDK. IIRC, Andreas Preuninger mentioned in an interview that Porsche expects 35% manuals vs 65% PDK. I find that highly optimistic (for manual). I would honestly be surprised if more than 20% of the GT3 buyers would choose manual. 

    btw, if I say something, that has already been said before, please correct me, I haven't read through all the pages of every thread. There are just too many lol.


    Re: OFFICIAL: New 991.2 GT3

    I think 1/3 manual worldwide will be close.  I think more than that in US and U.K. ...


    --

     

    73 Carrera RS 2.7 Carbon Fiber replica (1,890 lbs), 06 EVO9 with track mods. Former: 16 Cayman GT4, 73 911S, Two 951S's, 996 C2, 993 C2, 98 Ferrari 550, 79 635CSi

     


    Re: OFFICIAL: New 991.2 GT3

    Grant:

    I think 1/3 manual worldwide will be close.  I think more than that in US and U.K. ...


    --

     

    73 Carrera RS 2.7 Carbon Fiber replica (1,890 lbs), 06 EVO9 with track mods. Former: 16 Cayman GT4, 73 911S, Two 951S's, 996 C2, 993 C2, 98 Ferrari 550, 79 635CSi

     

    That sounds about right.


    --

    "Don't worry about avoiding temptation, as you grow older it will avoid you"  Churchill


    Re: OFFICIAL: New 991.2 GT3

    Nacelle1:
    Grant:
    RC:

    I can see the pleasure of driving an Austin Healey with manual or maybe even a 964 RS. A modern car? Not so much, sorry. 

    I think most people who drove the GT4 (including myself) considered the manual shifting one of the most endearing qualities of the car.

    Grant, I'll second that!

    Me too!


    --

    2015 981 Cayman GT4 | Powerkit White - The fastest car on Rennteam
    2013 Audi S3 | Glacier White


    Re: OFFICIAL: New 991.2 GT3

    Is PDLS in black no longer an option ? 


    Re: OFFICIAL: New 991.2 GT3

    Gauss:

    Is PDLS in black no longer an option ? 

    Not on the configurator but PDLS interior housing is darker than the housing for OEM headlights. It would make a difference depending on your exterior color.


    --

    "A man wrapped up in himself makes for a very small bundle."


    Re: OFFICIAL: New 991.2 GT3

    Yes, only the housing is darker, but not entirely like on the gen.1 :


    Re: OFFICIAL: New 991.2 GT3

    Correct. The option as of yet is not available. However, starting in November Porsche is adding more options like deviated stitching. They may include what you're looking for. I don't want to delay the build date of my car which is now July 21st.


    --

    "A man wrapped up in himself makes for a very small bundle."


     
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