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    Re: Another new CSL on Rennteam...

    Porker:
    pride355:
    I never liked my 997.1 Carrera S and in general I don't like 997 driving characteristics. 991 is much better in this regard. 

    Thank you for your detailed reply! Always interesting to read such real life experiences and comparisons. I wish I could compare it to my impressions, but I still need to drive the 997.1 C2S with sport-suspension. I must say I enjoy a stiffly suspended car more than others, it gives me a sense of connection and directness, so I'm not sure if I would deem the sport suspension on the 997.1 too stiff.


    i personally did not find the -20mm sport suspension on the 997.1 to be too stiff. It, of course, always depends on the point of view and the conditions the car is used in. The car is certainly stiff but exhibits a nice characteristic. It is much different than the respective PASM system on the 997.1 model in that its damping character is more compliant and comprehensible. Judging by the cars you´ve owned so far and the road surfaces I have experienced in Belgium, you should be perfectly happy with that configuration.

    Maybe my memory has been dilluted over the years but I did prefer the steering of the 996 over the 997´s. Anyways, still miles better than most cars out there. Compared to the M3, the major difference for me was the low amount of weight on the front axle, as much feel as the steering might have you just do not have the crisp turn-in that cars with a more even weight distribution possess. 

    Onur is right in that the -20mm sport suspension enables the car to be very dependent on weight transfers but unlike him this is one of the strong points for me. It does take some time to get used to it and master it but I find it highly rewarding. 


    Re: Another new CSL on Rennteam...

    Porker:
    pride355:
    Porker:

    Thank you for your detailed reply! Always interesting to read such real life experiences and comparisons. I wish I could compare it to my impressions, but I still need to drive the 997.1 C2S with sport-suspension. I must say I enjoy a stiffly suspended car more than others, it gives me a sense of connection and directness, so I'm not sure if I would deem the sport suspension on the 997.1 too stiff.

    For example, I find the PSS10 on my CSL a little too softly sprung, but I can hardly imagine it being that much softer than the sport suspension in a 997.1. A GT3 has always felt perfectly acceptable to me as well.

    As you may also know, on less than perfect real world roads, stiff suspansion setups make the handling much worse and lessens your control over the car.


    --

    ONUR

    WAITING FOR THE BEST CAR EVER smiley

    11 E92 M3 CP - 09 Audi TTS Coupe - 07 997 Carrera S - 05 M3 Coupe - 03 M3 Coupe - 96 M3 Coupe EVO (PASS TIME HISTORY)

     


    Re: Another new CSL on Rennteam...

    I need some advice from the other CSL owners on the forum.  My car is currently at BMW for a full quality check and service, but I also want to do the brake upgrade as soon as possible.  Judging by some of the comments on here, as well as posts on some of the dedicated M3 forums (especially cslregister and m3cutters), there seems to be a general consensus around the following as being the best options for the CSL:

    * Calipers: AP Racing (6-pots front, 4-pots rear)
    * Pads: Pagid RS29 Yellow or PF (Performance Friction) pads
    * Discs: Less clear. OEM or PF or Alcon discs?
    * Braided S/S hoses: HEL or Goodridge
    * Brake fluid: ATE Superblue or Castrol SRF.

    My problem is that being a continent away from these suppliers, my only source of information is their respective websites - most of which are far from useful or informative.  By way of example, AP Racing only shows full "big-brake" upgrades specifically for the E46 M3 - which include their calipers, grooved discs and pads (front kit CP5575-1004, rear CP5144-1004).  If one searches for calipers only, they show a number of options - I think the ones for the E46 are in the CP5570 "family" (6-pots) and CP5100 "family" (4-pots), but there is no indication of whether these would be suitable for a CSL (nor any means of enquiring or ordering online).  The Pagid website lists a few options for rear E46 M3 pads (including the RS29s), but says (I quote) "no brake pads listed for the front axle".  None of these websites provide any information regarding pricing.

    My questions are as follows:
    * Which of the options listed above (or others) would you regard as being the optimal solution for the CSL?
    * Specifically, is it necessary to replace the cross-drilled OEM discs or are they adequate?
    * Would you consider ordering the full AP Racing kits, simply because it's easier?  Arguments against this would be that it would probably be enormously expensive (especially after adding shipping costs and local custom duties), as well as some negative comments I've seen regarding the AP discs (warping).
    * Are you aware of any dedicated BMW aftermarket suppliers who would be able to supply a complete package of parts picked from the above list, rather than having to order from a range of different suppliers (in the same way, for example, as Suncoast is an aftermarket Porsche specialist in the US or Worldsaparts is a Renault specialist in the UK)?

    Your advice would be much appreciated.  Smiley


    Re: Another new CSL on Rennteam...

    PureBlue:

    I need some advice from the other CSL owners on the forum.  My car is currently at BMW for a full quality check and service, but I also want to do the brake upgrade as soon as possible.  Judging by some of the comments on here, as well as posts on some of the dedicated M3 forums (especially cslregister and m3cutters), there seems to be a general consensus around the following as being the best options for the CSL:

    * Calipers: AP Racing (6-pots front, 4-pots rear)
    * Pads: Pagid RS29 Yellow or PF (Performance Friction) pads
    * Discs: Less clear. OEM or PF or Alcon discs?
    * Braided S/S hoses: HEL or Goodridge
    * Brake fluid: ATE Superblue or Castrol SRF.

    My problem is that being a continent away from these suppliers, my only source of information is their respective websites - most of which are far from useful or informative.  By way of example, AP Racing only shows full "big-brake" upgrades specifically for the E46 M3 - which include their calipers, grooved discs and pads (front kit CP5575-1004, rear CP5144-1004).  If one searches for calipers only, they show a number of options - I think the ones for the E46 are in the CP5570 "family" (6-pots) and CP5100 "family" (4-pots), but there is no indication of whether these would be suitable for a CSL (nor any means of enquiring or ordering online).  The Pagid website lists a few options for rear E46 M3 pads (including the RS29s), but says (I quote) "no brake pads listed for the front axle".  None of these websites provide any information regarding pricing.

    My questions are as follows:
    * Which of the options listed above (or others) would you regard as being the optimal solution for the CSL?
    * Specifically, is it necessary to replace the cross-drilled OEM discs or are they adequate?
    * Would you consider ordering the full AP Racing kits, simply because it's easier?  Arguments against this would be that it would probably be enormously expensive (especially after adding shipping costs and local custom duties), as well as some negative comments I've seen regarding the AP discs (warping).
    * Are you aware of any dedicated BMW aftermarket suppliers who would be able to supply a complete package of parts picked from the above list, rather than having to order from a range of different suppliers (in the same way, for example, as Suncoast is an aftermarket Porsche specialist in the US or Worldsaparts is a Renault specialist in the UK)?

    Your advice would be much appreciated.  Smiley

    Hi PureBlue,

    I can only comment on my own experience, which has been with the AP-Racing six pots fronts and four pots rear. The discs are from AP-racing as well as the braided hoses. They came all together in a package.

    I started off with Pagid RS29 and ATE SuperBlue brake fluid and it worked perfectly fine, braking is fantastic and fading no issue, but I did miss the feeling of 'friction' I had with the Endless pads on my other M3. These have been installed on the CSL now as well, and they are a definite improvement over the Pagids. They don't come cheap though.

    Regarding discs, is it even possible to stay with OEM discs? My discs seems to have a larger diameter than the OEM discs. Alcon has always received high praise, but again, at a cost.

    Oh and should you see the light all of a sudden: Smiley

    http://www.turnermotorsport.com/p-16546-e46-m3-bilstein-clubsport-coil-over-suspension.aspx


    Re: Another new CSL on Rennteam...

    Thanks Porker.  Two questions:

    * I'm not familiar with the Endless pads.  Who are the suppliers and what is the full brand name?

    * I had previously looked at brakes on the Turner Motorsport site (no, I'm not going to be tempted by a set of coil-overs any time soon Smiley).  I noted that they describe the Pagid RS29s as being "unsuitable for road use".  Having used them on your CSL for a while, would you agree with this statement?

    I've just found a local (well, Johannesburg-based) company, which is the local distributor for AP Racing, Performance Friction and Goodridge - so they may be able to assist me in putting together a sensible solution.


    Re: Another new CSL on Rennteam...

    PureBlue:

    Thanks Porker.  Two questions:

    * I'm not familiar with the Endless pads.  Who are the suppliers and what is the full brand name?

    * I had previously looked at brakes on the Turner Motorsport site (no, I'm not going to be tempted by a set of coil-overs any time soon Smiley).  I noted that they describe the Pagid RS29s as being "unsuitable for road use".  Having used them on your CSL for a while, would you agree with this statement?

    I've just found a local (well, Johannesburg-based) company, which is the local distributor for AP Racing, Performance Friction and Goodridge - so they may be able to assist me in putting together a sensible solution.

    The brand name is 'Endless', I think they are US based. I've checked their website for a dealer in SA but couldn't find one. They're well known amongst Nordschleife regulars, they're often used during endurance events as they're known to be extremely dureable.

    That said, I had no complaints whatsoever about my Pagids. Both sets squeek like a pig during city driving though.

    http://www.endless-brake.info/news


    Re: Another new CSL on Rennteam...

    I believe Endless brakes are Japanese.

    They are big in Japanese motor sports.

    http://www.endless-sport.co.jp/EndlessMagazine/motorsports/index.html


    Re: Another new CSL on Rennteam...

    Thanks guys.  I'll add the Endless pads to my list for follow-up.  Smiley


     
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