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    Re: Next Porsche Product Line

    Hasn't Wiedeking saved Porsche from the troubled times with the 996 and especially the Cayenne?

    --

    Porsche 911 GT3 - Guards Red 997 MKII Clubsport


    Re: Next Porsche Product Line

    Ron (Houston):

    Can anyone guess what car will go to the right side of the picture next ?

    1385348396619porsche.jpg

    I strongly prefer to contemplate a new model on the left side of the picture.


    Re: Next Porsche Product Line

    Porsche now makes sports cars, sedans and trucks. They only need a minivan to complete the lineup.mail


    Re: Next Porsche Product Line

    JimFlat6:

    Porsche now makes sports cars, sedans and trucks. They only need a minivan to complete the lineup.mail

    So far, the Panamera and Cayenne completed the model range quite nicely in my opinion. The Macan is a different story though. The Macan Diesel with 204 hp and a price tag of under 50k EUR will create a huge brand dilution but it will hurt the Macan most I'm afraid. I'm not so sure that the Macan will keep it's value, so careful with buying one (I would prefer a lease). My dealer expects a huge used Macan market after the first three years after introduction because the usual lease period is three years here in Germany. Then, prices will very likely start to tumble, maybe up to a very undesired point.


    --

    RC (Germany) - Rennteam Editor Porsche 991 Turbo S, Cayenne GTS (958), BMW X3 35d (2013)


    Re: Next Porsche Product Line

    I read that the Cayenne Diesel is the car with the lowest depreciation in Germany. Why would that be different for the Macan Diesel?


    --

    2012 Cayenne S White/Espresso 

    Ex: 993 Targa, 986S, 986 and 964 C2


    Re: Next Porsche Product Line

    Brand dilution and lack of exclusivity has been evident for well over a decade..surprise

    Not surprising really when Porsche is now just one arm of the VW Group which means 'mass production' is the order of the day! 

    It's the price we've had to pay for the evolution of the 911 to continue... so not all bad!

     


    --

    "Things turn out best for people who make the best of the way things turn out."


    Re: Next Porsche Product Line

    993Targa:

    I read that the Cayenne Diesel is the car with the lowest depreciation in Germany. Why would that be different for the Macan Diesel?

    It wouldn't. The Macan S and the Macan Turbo will be a different story though, maybe even the S Diesel. This is where the real problem lies.

    You pay 100k EUR for a fully equipped Macan Turbo and three years later... Smiley The Macan Diesel will be around 60k EUR with some options, making it priced at around 35-39k EUR after three years and let's say 30000 or 40000 km. Now take the Macan Turbo after the same period of time and I bet that the used car prices will be somewhere around 50-55k EUR, if not much lower. 

    The base Diesel buyers won't have real issues. The problem will be created for the buyers of the more expensive models.

    Also, since Porsche is expected to sell much more Macan than Cayenne, the second hand car markets will be flooded with Macan at some point, especially after the typical three year lease period runs out here.

    Right now it seems that Porsche Germany expects to sell mostly S Diesel and Diesel (later on) but I heard that the Macan Turbo demand is higher than expected.


    --

    RC (Germany) - Rennteam Editor Porsche 991 Turbo S, Cayenne GTS (958), BMW X3 35d (2013)


    Re: Next Porsche Product Line

    Currently, no manufacturer involved in WRC (World Rally Champoinship) has the guts to make its car available for public use. The current Polo WRC featurs around 300hp, AWD, and a good gravel suspension. 

    I am convinced if you civilise a WRC in the way a GT3 is civilised, with the appropriate badge to ask for the necessary price, it would be a match, i.e. A WRC Polo with Porsche badge for 90 K-Euro.

    https://encrypted-tbn3.gstatic.com/images?q=tbn:ANd9GcQv33dLnMq11TuxJo3Qtus43j5_4JZYlH1Vt1r1A9TtfePtiRMemA

     


    Re: Next Porsche Product Line

    vevesse:

    Currently, no manufacturer involved in WRC (World Rally Champoinship) has the guts to make its car available for public use. The current Polo WRC featurs around 300hp, AWD, and a good gravel suspension. 

    I am convinced if you civilise a WRC in the way a GT3 is civilised, with the appropriate badge to ask for the necessary price, it would be a match, i.e. A WRC Polo with Porsche badge for 90 K-Euro.

    https://encrypted-tbn3.gstatic.com/images?q=tbn:ANd9GcQv33dLnMq11TuxJo3Qtus43j5_4JZYlH1Vt1r1A9TtfePtiRMemA

    I loved the Audi A1 Quattro special edition model when it came out and almost got one. Then, I realized that this car is still too heavy and not really fast enough and of course my wife talked me out of it. Smiley

    The current Polo WRC would have been a great product with AWD, 300 hp and maybe let's say 1200 kg weight. Unfortunately VW decided to offer 220 hp without AWD only. Lame.

    I also met a Mini engineer once and asked why they do not offer a powerful AWD Mini with 300 hp or so. Now they have one (the Countryman) but it is too big, too heavy and not powerful enough. Lame again. 

    The Lancia Delta HF Integrale was an amazing car and I loved it, even if it wasn't very reliable (the street version, not the group N version). My last Integrale was tuned to around 280 hp and when I fully accelerated from a stop light, the front axle went up around 10 cm or so. Smiley Great for show. Unfortunately I also had a broken driveshaft at some point, well... Smiley

    Fun times...I miss them. Last time I met Ronald Holzer, he was driving a 911 Cab. Smiley


    --

    RC (Germany) - Rennteam Editor Porsche 991 Turbo S, Cayenne GTS (958), BMW X3 35d (2013)


    Re: Next Porsche Product Line

    Ron (Houston):

    Can anyone guess what car will go to the right side of the picture next ?

    1385348396619porsche.jpg

    According to the Press, the following new models are in the pipeline for the next 5-6 years:

    • "small Panamera" (3 or 5 series size?)
    • front engined coupe possibly with with 4 doors based on new model Panamera
    • mid engined flat 8 supersports
    • Panamera (new model) Sport Turismo estate.

    With these total production will reach/exceed 200.000 units.


    --

    "Form follows function"


    Re: Next Porsche Product Line

    RC:
    vevesse:

    Currently, no manufacturer involved in WRC (World Rally Champoinship) has the guts to make its car available for public use. The current Polo WRC featurs around 300hp, AWD, and a good gravel suspension. 

    I am convinced if you civilise a WRC in the way a GT3 is civilised, with the appropriate badge to ask for the necessary price, it would be a match, i.e. A WRC Polo with Porsche badge for 90 K-Euro.

    https://encrypted-tbn3.gstatic.com/images?q=tbn:ANd9GcQv33dLnMq11TuxJo3Qtus43j5_4JZYlH1Vt1r1A9TtfePtiRMemA

    The current Polo WRC would have been a great product with AWD, 300 hp and maybe let's say 1200 kg weight. Unfortunately VW decided to offer 220 hp without AWD only. Lame.

    It appears you cannot sell 300hp, "lightwihgt" AWD cars as volume car. But you can sell them as sports-cars. Everybody of us is looking for an agile winter and gravel car, but we are not served by the industry. Even WRX and Evos are too big and too heavy. Weissach should go for it, as Winter and Gravel-GT3.


    Re: Next Porsche Product Line

    I simply want Porsche to build a 928 successor. Put the Panameras engines in, especially the magnificent GTS V8 powertrain. Make it optional a convertible, with 4-wheel drive. Give that thing the look that it deserves, and I'll buy it in a heartbeat.


    --

    Note to self: I DO NOT need a Turbo. 


    Re: Next Porsche Product Line

    TomSilver:

    I simply want Porsche to build a 928 successor. Put the Panameras engines in, especially the magnificent GTS V8 powertrain. Make it optional a convertible, with 4-wheel drive. Give that thing the look that it deserves, and I'll buy it in a heartbeat.

    Smiley I like the M6 Cab but I'm a Porsche guy. The 911 doesn't offer the back seat room or the luggage room.

    Let me see: A 928 successor, weight below 2000 kg (all model variants), same engines as Panamera, Coupe and Cab. Wonderful idea. Still not sure why Porsche isn't offering one yet.

    It should be a different design than the Panamera though.

    So far I like this concept most but with a more refined front and rear look.

    091029-porsche-928.jpg


    --

    RC (Germany) - Rennteam Editor Porsche 991 Turbo S, Cayenne GTS (958), BMW X3 35d (2013)


     
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