Crown

Board: Motor Sports Language: English Region: Worldwide Share/Save/Bookmark Close

Forum - Thread


    Re: 2011 Spanish F1 Grand Prix in Barcelona

    Ferdie knows


    --

    "Form follows function"


    Re: 2011 Spanish F1 Grand Prix in Barcelona

    Thanks guys... but you are too kind.


    Re: 2011 Spanish F1 Grand Prix in Barcelona

    Ferdie Smiley


    --

    There is no try. Just do.


    Re: 2011 Spanish F1 Grand Prix in Barcelona

    LdiM has already started the clean up at SF.

    He must be reading our recommendations at Rennteam regularly

    http://www.autosport.com/news/report.php/id/91694


    --

    "Form follows function"


    Re: 2011 Spanish F1 Grand Prix in Barcelona

    Ferdie:

    I cannot agree on that comparison. Schumacher was well-known for his driving style, positioning the car via throttle input and a loose rear axle. His driving style and suspension setup was awkward for competitors such as Berger who tried the championship-winning car with Schumacher´s original setup first.

    Alsonso does a similiar thing, constantly adjusting the car at the verge of oversteer. I am not sure if he does so via throttle input only but achieves a similiar effect as Schumacher. I am convinced that a driver needs to "feel" the car properly to drive that way, therefore Alonso might have needed some time to adjust to a new car as it happened at Renault against Trulli and at McLaren against Hamilton initially. Alonso gave an interview during his McLaren season and commented that the technical developments should improve his performance in the second half of the season [which eventually happend to be correct]. I do remember that you found Alonso´s mediocre performance as described above to be proof of his inferiority against his teammates and dependability on the correct settings and surroundings within the team. I happen to believe that he needs a setup that encourages his driving style to make him exceptionally quick but even with a mediocre setup he is considerably fast. The comments of his former teammates and rivals about his performance and support within the team paint a different picture than some sources may suggest.

    Hamilton drives the car over the edge and tries to handle any reaction the car gives back. Unfortunately as a consequence he is not able to cover all reactions, such as the training incident in Japan last year or the crash in qualifying in Monaco two years ago. Wait, there is also the crash in the last lap of Monza two years ago. How many times have you seen Alonso do such things? If Hamilton succeeds, he is a hero. If he fails, he does so in a spectacular way.

    I would not place Button within the above driving styles as his gentle way of handling the car is one of the most extreme on the grid. One does remember his difficulties to heat up the tires in qualifying in recent years but do believe that it can help him this year with the rapidly degrading Pirelli tires. Of course, one has to ask whether such a driving style can be successfull in the long run as it is directly opposing Hamilton´s. Seeing these two drive the same car and to finish very close to each other so far makes it very interesting in my opinion.

    In general I dislike generalisations as purported in the yellow press as it does not do justice to the performance and skills of these drivers. All of the above mentioned top-rated drivers make the sport so interesting once you look behind the obvious that I would not want to miss any of them. Just like Easy, I can affiliate with one´s character more than with the other´s but that should not be subject of discussion if we debate about their skills.

    Smiley

     

    Even I would say good post :)

    But there is one point I tends to disagree with, over the years it doesn't seems to me that Alonso is in any danger of losing control of his car, he is very smooth in and out of corners, so I would think he drives a tighter car than Shummy and Hamilton. Alonso reminds me of Prost in that respect. He has the speed but just doesn't seems to pushes the car to the edge which results in my opinions.


    Re: 2011 Spanish F1 Grand Prix in Barcelona

    Smooth does not mean slow, and that depends mostly on the car, next GP take a close look at the onboard camera's and compare Vettel's car to the rest, especially the Ferrari, you will notice that Vettel barely has to make any corrections on the RB while negotiating the turns, its just planted with all the downforce and its effortless to drive, while the Ferrari needs a lot more input and corrections constantly  to drive it at the max. While the RB looks the smoothest, it doesn't mean that its being driven slowly as we can see from the lap times.

    Just look at the consistantly huge difference in race pace and qualifying laps between Massa and Alonso, and you can see how much Alonso is making do with the Ferrari's ill performance. If it weren't for Alonso, Ferrari would be fighting in between the the Renaults and Williams, and they know that too well at Ferrari, hence they extending his contract just recently.


    --


    Re: 2011 Spanish F1 Grand Prix in Barcelona

    Whoopsy:

    Even I would say good post :)

    But there is one point I tends to disagree with, over the years it doesn't seems to me that Alonso is in any danger of losing control of his car, he is very smooth in and out of corners, so I would think he drives a tighter car than Shummy and Hamilton. Alonso reminds me of Prost in that respect. He has the speed but just doesn't seems to pushes the car to the edge which results in my opinions.


    To be honest, I initially thought the same. Check the below video though and watch his corrections on the sliding car. I personally believe that he drives aggressively whenever it is necessary. Watch the below video as an example, if you can tolerate a few minutes of Alonso.

    Cheers, mate! Smiley


    Re: 2011 Spanish F1 Grand Prix in Barcelona

    Wow, those are some MAJOR corrections..............wait, he was on his warm up lap.............

     

    I actually don't mind watching Alonso drives, he is very fast and smooth in a front runner and he drives safe, doesn't take a lot of risks. He may be driving aggressively but it just doesn't show on TV and thus not many think he is even when he post fast times. I am not a fan but I don't hate the guy, I only think he whines too much and he is overrated a little as he still needs to prove he has the raw talent to bring a so so car into the winning circle a la Senna in a Lotus. If this year's Ferrari is as slow as people think they are, it's actually a perfect opportunity for Alonso to shed that label and prove the doubters like me wrong by winning with the car.

     


    Re: 2011 Spanish F1 Grand Prix in Barcelona

    Wow, in that video the Ferrari looks like a real handful, to be fair....


    --

    throt

    "I didn't do it"


    Re: 2011 Spanish F1 Grand Prix in Barcelona

    Whoopsy:

    Wow, those are some MAJOR corrections..............wait, he was on his warm up lap............. 


    I thought it goes without saying that you watch the part starting at 3:00 min. Now show me a video of Prost in comparison.  Smiley

    As Throt, I find the Ferrari to be a handful. The fastest drivers do not have to drive aggressively if it is unnecessary. Alonso, in my opinion, can adjust his level of commitment to the situation. The fact that he is not stunningly fast in a mediocre car, and I agree with you on that one, might be due to his specific driving style as I mentioned above. The funny thing is that in motor racing, just as in soccer [football], there are so many variables that we could debate for weeks which one is the better driver. I personally rather sit back and relax.


    Re: 2011 Spanish F1 Grand Prix in Barcelona

    lol I was just making fun of the posted video as the first part was just the warm up lap with him twisting the wheel left and right. I do see what you mentioned, guess you didn't get the joke :(

     

     


    Re: 2011 Spanish F1 Grand Prix in Barcelona

    Well, well... wasn´t sure if you make it through an entire video of Alonso.


    Re: 2011 Spanish F1 Grand Prix in Barcelona

    Oh come on, I wasn't THAT bad was I? :)

    When you mention Alonso with his corrections on car control, then you follow it with a video that includes the warm up lap with him sawing the steering wheel, it WAS bloody funny.


    Re: 2011 Spanish F1 Grand Prix in Barcelona

    hahaha, the Ferrari sure is a handful and Alonso is doing a pretty decent job of pulling the max out of it. A total package champion can tell the engineers how to improve and better the car. And that is a big variable not discussed in F1...

     


    --

    indeed shifting is ancient technology - so is a fuel burning engine..  I happen to like both :) 


    Re: 2011 Spanish F1 Grand Prix in Barcelona

    Ferrari has a known to them aerodynamic problem, nothing to do with the driver. They have changed their aero-tunnel scale model from 50% to 60%, in an effort to solve this problem. So far without success.


    --

    "Form follows function"


    Re: 2011 Spanish F1 Grand Prix in Barcelona

    Has overtaking become too easy? BBC's Andrew Benson's article:

    http://www.bbc.co.uk/blogs/andrewbenson/2011/05/has_f1_made_overtaking_too_eas.html


    --


    RT Moderator 
    - 997.1 C2S GT Silver/Cocoa, -20mm sports suspension/LSD, PSE, short shifter, SportDesign rims, Zuffenhausen collection


    Re: 2011 Spanish F1 Grand Prix in Barcelona

    Strategy analysis from Barcelona by James Allen

    http://www.jamesallenonf1.com/2011/05/a-deep-dive-into-strategies-from-the-spanish-grand-prix/


    --


    RT Moderator 
    - 997.1 C2S GT Silver/Cocoa, -20mm sports suspension/LSD, PSE, short shifter, SportDesign rims, Zuffenhausen collection


    Re: 2011 Spanish F1 Grand Prix in Barcelona

    Helmut Marko thinks Ferrari is engaging in espionage

    http://www.planetf1.com/driver/18227/6950173/Marko-RBR-suspicious-of-Ferrari-tactics


    --


    RT Moderator 
    - 997.1 C2S GT Silver/Cocoa, -20mm sports suspension/LSD, PSE, short shifter, SportDesign rims, Zuffenhausen collection


    Re: 2011 Spanish F1 Grand Prix in Barcelona

    David Coulthard thinks Hamilton's car needed a longer 7th gear in Barcelona (to enable overtaking on the start/finish straight)

    http://www.planetf1.com/driver/18227/6949734/-Lewis-s-gear-ratios-weren-t-long-enough-


    --


    RT Moderator 
    - 997.1 C2S GT Silver/Cocoa, -20mm sports suspension/LSD, PSE, short shifter, SportDesign rims, Zuffenhausen collection


    Re: 2011 Spanish F1 Grand Prix in Barcelona

    easy_rider911:

    Helmut Marko thinks Ferrari is engaging in espionage

    http://www.planetf1.com/driver/18227/6950173/Marko-RBR-suspicious-of-Ferrari-tactics


    Marko was interviewed by Lauda and the second interviewer by German´s RTL channel and stated that Red Bull had to use tactics to fool Ferrari regarding the pitstop manouvre. They asked him whether Ferrari was spying and Marko could not do anything else than reluctantly confirm.

    I would be actually surprised if any F1 team is not surveying the radio of competing teams to learn something about setup and strategy, what other reason would they have to use encrypted orders everytime the driver has to change a setting on the car?
     


    Re: 2011 Spanish F1 Grand Prix in Barcelona

     Every team monitors all radio transmisions, they have photographers with telescopic lenses distributed around the track to take pictures in detail of all cars, specially if there is an accident and parts are exposed, etc etc, etc... all that is normal.


    --


    Re: 2011 Spanish F1 Grand Prix in Barcelona

    Exactly - teams wouldn't be exploiting all avenues available to them if they weren't doing these things ...

    We, as fans, should feel happy - e.g. the Renault blown-exhaust diffuser design is now used by other teams that has led to closer racing ...


    --


    RT Moderator 
    - 997.1 C2S GT Silver/Cocoa, -20mm sports suspension/LSD, PSE, short shifter, SportDesign rims, Zuffenhausen collection


    Re: 2011 Spanish F1 Grand Prix in Barcelona

    Has a Spanish journalist been stirring up trouble? Apparently he has been claiming that Banco Santander is unhappy with Ferrari's performance. Ferrari's Horse Whisperer has denied this.

    http://www.jamesallenonf1.com/2011/05/ferraris-horse-whisperer-attacks-spanish-journalist/


    --


    RT Moderator 
    - 997.1 C2S GT Silver/Cocoa, -20mm sports suspension/LSD, PSE, short shifter, SportDesign rims, Zuffenhausen collection


     
    Edit

    Forum

    Board Subject Last post Rating Views Replies
    Porsche Sticky The moment I've been waiting for... 5/18/22 6:36 PM
    Pilot
     
     
     
     
     
    690366 1306
    Porsche Sticky OFFICIAL: New Porsche 911 Turbo S (2020) 1/29/23 2:19 AM
    watt
    322896 1192
    Porsche Sticky SUN'S LAST RUN TO WILSON, WY - 991 C2S CAB LIFE, END OF AN ERA (Part II) 1/26/23 4:09 PM
    W8MM
    221682 1340
    Porsche Sticky Welcome to Rennteam: Cars and Coffee... (photos) 1/28/23 3:45 AM
    Spyderidol
    206325 465
    Porsche Sticky Porsche Taycan Turbo S - Short Review 10/6/22 12:37 AM
    WhoopsyM
    187646 580
    Porsche Sticky OFFICIAL: Cayman GT4 RS (2021) 1/20/23 10:57 PM
    Pilot
    133032 58
    Porsche Sticky OFFICIAL: Porsche 911 (992) GT3 RS - 2022 11/30/22 2:30 PM
    GnilM
    58450 68
    McLaren McLaren on a winning streak 2/1/22 10:14 PM
    SSO.
    524253 3954
    Porsche OFFICIAL: 911 R (2016) 12/25/22 1:02 AM
    CGX car nut
    483815 2663
    Porsche 992 GT3 2/1/23 7:03 AM
    GnilM
    479361 3807
    Porsche Welcome to the new Taycan Forum! 1/21/23 3:51 PM
    CGX car nut
    234221 1491
    Porsche Donor vehicle for Singer Vehicle Design 9/30/22 6:31 PM
    Grant
    232253 774
    AMG AMG GT R 3/13/22 8:52 PM
    spudgun
    202219 834
    Lambo Aventador and SV 5/20/22 5:24 PM
    Topspeed
    198350 710
    Others Tesla 2 the new thread 2/1/23 1:18 AM
    WhoopsyM
    197134 2053
    Porsche GT4RS 12/30/22 1:28 AM
    JAMS
    192574 1194
    Motor Sp. [2021] Formula 1 4/19/22 10:08 PM
    Leawood911
    165141 1590
    Others Bugatti Chiron 8/30/22 4:31 PM
    Josef
    162185 525
    Ferrari Ferrari 812 Superfast 6/12/22 5:09 PM
    watt
    158289 535
    BMW M BMW M2 Rumors 2/28/22 7:42 PM
    Topspeed
    144849 409
    Porsche Red Nipples 991.2 GT3 Touring on tour 2/1/23 6:45 AM
    GnilM
    142014 513
    Lambo Urus (SUV) 6/7/22 1:20 PM
    Topspeed
    139657 593
    Others Corvette C8 7/18/22 12:40 PM
    WhoopsyM
    138692 443
    Porsche Dave and Gnil @ Nürburgring Nordschleife 7/4/22 10:42 PM
    DaveGordon
    137159 722
    Motor Sp. [2022] Formula 1 1/13/23 3:57 PM
    Leawood911
    129536 1572
    Others Toyota Yaris GR 4/13/22 8:33 PM
    Grant
    108513 640
    Lambo Huracán EVO STO 7/21/22 8:37 AM
    RCA
    107354 335
    AMG Mercedes E63 S AMG (2018) - Short Review (updated on a regular basis) 10/24/22 7:42 AM
    RCA
    105139 402
    Ferrari Wandered to the dark side 8/29/22 9:35 AM
    BiTurbo
    80321 418
    Ferrari Ferrari Roma 4/18/22 4:33 PM
    watt
    32653 438
    166 items found, displaying 1 to 30.