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    Re: McLaren Artura - coming 17 February 2021

    RC:
    Whoopsy:

    I see it in a completely different way.

    Hybrids is a NECESSARY addition to cars if fans still wants a combustion engine enjoyment. Without the electric help, car manufacturers won't be able to meet arbitrary and unnecessary strict emission standards designed for political reasons. 

    Electric HP help is almost like a freebie too, on top of whatever output the combustion engine is already producing.

    Performance hybrids are the 'current' future, before EVs completely takes over dude to government regulations. 

    Bravo to McLaren to follow Porsche's footsteps in making performance hybrids. Would have been better if they paired the hybrid system with a V8, but at least a strong V6 is good enough and they didn't went cheap and go for 4 cylinders.

    Smiley McLaren did the right thing, even if they had to. Others will follow. 

    I just hope the tech is reliable. Smiley

    Once electric cars proved they could run without gas hybrids became totally unacceptable complications in my opinion.  Like keeping a diaper on a child once potty trained. Sure an adult with a diaper can poop anywhere but is it necessary once you learn to hold it?  
    This is my all time best weird analogy to match Whoopsy’s analogy winners!   Lol. 


    Re: McLaren Artura - coming 17 February 2021

    Leawood I think you’re right. If I had to buy a car for commuting right now, and needed to drive an unpredictable amount day to day, I’d get a hybrid. But the simplicity of an EV I could charge at home would be far better. I think the ranges available now are close to what most consumers need to feel comfortable. 


    Re: McLaren Artura - coming 17 February 2021

    Leawood911:
    RC:
    Whoopsy:

    I see it in a completely different way.

    Hybrids is a NECESSARY addition to cars if fans still wants a combustion engine enjoyment. Without the electric help, car manufacturers won't be able to meet arbitrary and unnecessary strict emission standards designed for political reasons. 

    Electric HP help is almost like a freebie too, on top of whatever output the combustion engine is already producing.

    Performance hybrids are the 'current' future, before EVs completely takes over dude to government regulations. 

    Bravo to McLaren to follow Porsche's footsteps in making performance hybrids. Would have been better if they paired the hybrid system with a V8, but at least a strong V6 is good enough and they didn't went cheap and go for 4 cylinders.

    Smiley McLaren did the right thing, even if they had to. Others will follow. 

    I just hope the tech is reliable. Smiley

    Once electric cars proved they could run without gas hybrids became totally unacceptable complications in my opinion.  Like keeping a diaper on a child once potty trained. Sure an adult with a diaper can poop anywhere but is it necessary once you learn to hold it?  
    This is my all time best weird analogy to match Whoopsy’s analogy winners!   Lol. 

     

    Yes bud, WHEN electric cars get there hybrids will be a thing of the past. But we are not there yet. Hence why hybrids are the best solutions available right now.

    It's close though. Like I said, modern EVs all have good enough range for people's daily use already, it's the infrastructure that's still behind.

    Give it 10 years or so, and there won't be anymore hybrids. 


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    Re: McLaren Artura - coming 17 February 2021

    Simply put, hybrids will be a thing of the past when EVs can do what hybrids do.


    --

    ⇒ Carlos - Porsche 991 Carrera GTS


    Re: McLaren Artura - coming 17 February 2021

    wantone:

    What is proper e-Diff?

    This means it is the first modern McLaren with a mechanical LSD that has its locking rate electronically adjusted (like the PDK version of a GT3).  Previously, McLaren had virtual LSD by a computer applying the left or right rear brake only.


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    18 GT3 Manual, 73 Carrera RS 2.7 Carbon Fiber replica (1,890 lbs), 06 EVO9 with track mods. Former: 16 Cayman GT4, 73 911S, Two 951S's, 996 C2, 993 C2, 98 Ferrari 550, 79 635CSi

     


    Re: McLaren Artura - coming 17 February 2021

    10 years? With all the new EV coming on the market and regulations of governments. It will not take 10 years. Not beacuse the technology of the EV is moving fast but the acceptance of the byers is moving faster. A lot of users/buyers find the present range of EV’s sufficient and accept the cars. Personally, I see the hybrids just a last resort to keep ICE a live with present regulations. As much as I like my Taycan Turbo,  I just hope I can still enjoy my ICE cars for a long time and will not be forced to stop driving them because regulations or public opinions.

     


    Re: McLaren Artura - coming 17 February 2021

    What about Hydrogen? Or synthetic fuels? Isn't supposed that these two solutions (or at least the H one) are greener than EV cars? Is there any other objective upside such recycle the current petrol stations infraestructure, less weight or better dynamic behaviour due the lightness? What's not to like here?

    As far as I know Glickenhaus is pushing for H-powered cars, P is exploring the synthetic fuels. There might be hope for the car industry all in all if these manufacturers do what they have to do: lobby hard, extremely good PR and press the right keys here -car industry- and there -politics-.


    Re: McLaren Artura - coming 17 February 2021

    JR-550:

    10 years? With all the new EV coming on the market and regulations of governments. It will not take 10 years. Not beacuse the technology of the EV is moving fast but the acceptance of the byers is moving faster. A lot of users/buyers find the present range of EV’s sufficient and accept the cars. Personally, I see the hybrids just a last resort to keep ICE a live with present regulations. As much as I like my Taycan Turbo,  I just hope I can still enjoy my ICE cars for a long time and will not be forced to stop driving them because regulations or public opinions.

    Biggest issue is still infrastructure in my opinion, at least in Europe.


    --

    RC (Germany) - Rennteam Editor Lamborghini Huracan Performante (2019), Mercedes GLC63 S AMG (2020), Mercedes C63 S AMG Cab (2019), Jeep Grand Cherokee Trackhawk (2019 EU)


    Re: McLaren Artura - coming 17 February 2021

    JR-550:

    10 years? With all the new EV coming on the market and regulations of governments. It will not take 10 years. Not beacuse the technology of the EV is moving fast but the acceptance of the byers is moving faster. A lot of users/buyers find the present range of EV’s sufficient and accept the cars. Personally, I see the hybrids just a last resort to keep ICE a live with present regulations. As much as I like my Taycan Turbo,  I just hope I can still enjoy my ICE cars for a long time and will not be forced to stop driving them because regulations or public opinions.

     

     

    10 years is a short time.

    Lots of governments around the world have already declared they want to get rid of normal cars by 2030-2035. And they also have the same 10 years to upgrade their infrastructure to support what they say they want.


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    Re: McLaren Artura - coming 17 February 2021

    Whoopsy:
    JR-550:

    10 years? With all the new EV coming on the market and regulations of governments. It will not take 10 years. Not beacuse the technology of the EV is moving fast but the acceptance of the byers is moving faster. A lot of users/buyers find the present range of EV’s sufficient and accept the cars. Personally, I see the hybrids just a last resort to keep ICE a live with present regulations. As much as I like my Taycan Turbo,  I just hope I can still enjoy my ICE cars for a long time and will not be forced to stop driving them because regulations or public opinions.

     

     

    10 years is a short time.

    Lots of governments around the world have already declared they want to get rid of normal cars by 2030-2035. And they also have the same 10 years to upgrade their infrastructure to support what they say they want.

    The Corona pandemic could delay (or accelerate) the move to EVs but no matter what happens, EVs are the future. Unless something revolutionary happens in the ICE or whatever domain.


    --

    RC (Germany) - Rennteam Editor Lamborghini Huracan Performante (2019), Mercedes GLC63 S AMG (2020), Mercedes C63 S AMG Cab (2019), Jeep Grand Cherokee Trackhawk (2019 EU)


    Re: McLaren Artura - coming 17 February 2021

     


    Re: McLaren Artura - coming 17 February 2021

    What happens to your electric grid when you plug-in, for example, 100 million EV's every night, your infrastructure better be ready!


    Re: McLaren Artura - coming 17 February 2021

    964C2:

    What happens to your electric grid when you plug-in, for example, 100 million EV's every night, your infrastructure better be ready!

    Still one of the biggest mysteries of all... Smiley Smiley


    --

    RC (Germany) - Rennteam Editor Lamborghini Huracan Performante (2019), Mercedes GLC63 S AMG (2020), Mercedes C63 S AMG Cab (2019), Jeep Grand Cherokee Trackhawk (2019 EU)


    Re: McLaren Artura - coming 17 February 2021

    964C2:

    What happens to your electric grid when you plug-in, for example, 100 million EV's every night, your infrastructure better be ready!

     

    To some pipedream believers, we already have more than enough off peak capacity to charge all of them many times over.

    The math is extremely simple and basic, but for some they claim the calculation is wrong.


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    Re: McLaren Artura - coming 17 February 2021

    100 Mio Batteriepacks from Elon at home on the wall smiley


    Re: McLaren Artura - coming 17 February 2021

    BjoernB:

    100 Mio Batteriepacks from Elon at home on the wall smiley

    Smiley Could work, right? Smiley


    --

    RC (Germany) - Rennteam Editor Lamborghini Huracan Performante (2019), Mercedes GLC63 S AMG (2020), Mercedes C63 S AMG Cab (2019), Jeep Grand Cherokee Trackhawk (2019 EU)


    Re: McLaren Artura - coming 17 February 2021

    RC:
    BjoernB:

    100 Mio Batteriepacks from Elon at home on the wall smiley

    Smiley Could work, right? Smiley

    well a owner of a big house here with Solar Panels is unhappy that he feeds back his overflow for little money into the Net during the day (not like previously more subsidized/kwh) and rather heats his pool now in Winter - so storage of energy surely will become big one day.


    Re: McLaren Artura - coming 17 February 2021

    BjoernB:

    well a owner of a big house here with Solar Panels is unhappy that he feeds back his overflow for little money into the Net during the day (not like previously more subsidized/kwh) and rather heats his pool now in Winter - so storage of energy surely will become big one day.

    I fully agree, people will have tehir solar panels on the roof, a battery instead of an oil tank in the cellar and an electric car in the garage. They will live self-sufficiently in terms of electricity. I do not see any other solution, at least currently.


    Re: McLaren Artura - coming 17 February 2021

    Whoopsy:
    964C2:

    What happens to your electric grid when you plug-in, for example, 100 million EV's every night, your infrastructure better be ready!

     

    To some pipedream believers, we already have more than enough off peak capacity to charge all of them many times over.

    The math is extremely simple and basic, but for some they claim the calculation is wrong.

    Back to the fact that people don’t drive enough and cars don’t charge fast enough at home in order to make a dent during off peak hours.  You have this vision of everyone DC charging at home in 60 minutes after a 300 mile day. The reality is that perhaps %5 of your total monthly bill might be car charging.  It would not even matter if you did this off peak but if you did I doubt, compared to peak use during the day, it would be anywhere near the grid challenge you think it would be.  But - as eyes open to the vast battery on wheels which will outlast the wheels by a factor of 10 - the ability for that battery to serve as home energy storage and grid hardening is obvious.  In fact it is key to solar and other renewable energy. Homes can power up when power is cheap and use it when most needed.  This is so obvious I hate to keep pointing it out. 


    Re: McLaren Artura - coming 17 February 2021

    Leawood911:
    Whoopsy:
    964C2:

    What happens to your electric grid when you plug-in, for example, 100 million EV's every night, your infrastructure better be ready!

     

    To some pipedream believers, we already have more than enough off peak capacity to charge all of them many times over.

    The math is extremely simple and basic, but for some they claim the calculation is wrong.

    Back to the fact that people don’t drive enough and cars don’t charge fast enough at home in order to make a dent during off peak hours.  You have this vision of everyone DC charging at home in 60 minutes after a 300 mile day. The reality is that perhaps %5 of your total monthly bill might be car charging.  It would not even matter if you did this off peak but if you did I doubt, compared to peak use during the day, it would be anywhere near the grid challenge you think it would be.  But - as eyes open to the vast battery on wheels which will outlast the wheels by a factor of 10 - the ability for that battery to serve as home energy storage and grid hardening is obvious.  In fact it is key to solar and other renewable energy. Homes can power up when power is cheap and use it when most needed.  This is so obvious I hate to keep pointing it out. 

     

    Again, it's simple math buddy. Right now, EVs are still a tiny fraction of the overall car market. The drain on the grid is still negligible. 

    Just in the USA alone, about 100 million cars are driven every day. Every year, the world's car production is just under 100 million.

    Using that 100 million number. Each car gets plugged in at home to a home charger after work, that's 100 million times 7-9kW/hr per car. Works out to be 800,000,000,000,000W/hr, that's 800 GW, Giga-Watt. That's the output of 800 nuclear power stations. 

    So not all of them needs a full 8-10hr charge, but all chargers works the same and negotiate the fastest charge rate first then ramp down depending on state of charge, so the instantaneous load right after work would still be roughly the same but the load would ramp down the later the night goes as chargers are ramping down their charge rate based on SoC. Some cars might only need a 30 min charge, others might need a couple hours, others could be a 4-6 hour charge. 

    To ease the strain, government could mandate smart chargers and control their charge rate to not overload the grid, but who gets to decide which charge has charging privilege for faster rate? If I am your neighbor, why are you getting the full 9kW and I am throttled to only 3kW even if we plugged in at the same time?

    These loads are on top of whatever household is using without EVs. 

    Now for your other pipe dream about 'battery wall' energy storage, how many homes have it and how many don't yet? We are still decades away from widespread adoption.

     

     

     

     


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    Re: McLaren Artura - coming 17 February 2021

    You are not listening. Your math is wrong. The math to get to the number of nuclear power plants is amazing though. Congrats. 
    Regarding your understanding of virtual power plants - 
    The car takes the place of the power wall. It will balance the load and make even the current grid much better. Good news is there are not enough batteries for all the cars which could easily charge at home now.  So as the number of batteries to satisfy demand is produced and more cars go into service the grid gets more redundant and less tied to spikes. 
    And - it is not like we have any choice. It will happen. 
    As of now Tesla does not have or allow bi directional charging.  This will soon change as Lucid will offer this feature early on.  They need to work out what warranty implication are for the batteries. 

    Btw home charging is not level 3 DC fast charging. The power going into the battery at those rates is very constant from any point on to almost 98%.  Which no one does. 
    Im kinda surprised that as an EV owner you are so far from understanding the impact using batteries as a grid storage device would have. You literally ignore the possibility (referring to power walls instead - almost comically - as though you don’t get that a Tesla has three Powerwalls in it. ). I.e. everyone with an EV will have multiple power walls for free.  Solar anyone?

    Back to my EV costing me around $10-$20 per month to charge.  800 nuclear powers stations lol. Buy a few led lights and turn your TV off now and then. 


    Re: McLaren Artura - coming 17 February 2021

    LOL buddy you are the one not reading properly. Go read read what I wrote first.

    There is 2 different things in question. One is the 'power wall' you are talking about, using the batteries in the EV as a storage for home use. But that's the secondary item.

    The primary question was and is, how are you going to charge up 100 million empty or partially empty EVs at the same time.

    No one is talking about 250kW DC fast chargers here. We are talking about plain 240V level 2 home chargers that pumps out 7-9kW/hr. You times that drain by 100 mil EVs and you will get 800 GW/hr load on the grid. People come back from work in the evening and everyone plugs their cars in for the cheap overnight charging at home. You can split that time by time zones, so 6pm EST is only 3pm PST. But majority of US population lives on the East Coast, so say half the load then, that puts it at 400 GW/hr. Less people lives in the middle section of USA, The total load increased to say 550 GW. But then not every car needs a full charge, some could be done charging after an hour or two, so we drop that down to 450 GW. By the time 6pm hits the West Coast, another 250GW of power is needed for those West Coast EVs, but another hour have passed and more cars goes offline with a full charge, say the load will get to 600GW instead of 700GW. 

    Throughout the night, as cars getting fully charged the load will keep going down. But even at 600GW peak load, that's still 600 nuclear power plants worth of electricity is needed, just for common level 2 home charging, for 100 million EVs. 

    Some places with good sunshine can utilize solar power and storage batteries to charge up their EVs, but those locations aren't common, but lets be generous and say there is enough of those to provide say 100GW of power. The net load needed still sits at 500GW. That's every day. If somewhere in those lucky place with reliable solar power got a rain storm or something that prevent collection of solar energy, the demand goes back  to the grid instead of their panels.

    That's how the math works in simple terms for charging up EVs. And we haven't even touch on infrastructure improvements for transmitting that kind of power to subdivisions. 

    IF one has a fully charged up EV, yes the battery in it can be used as a energy storage device for household use. But that battery in the car still need somewhere somehow someway to get charged in the first place. Surprised you didn't realize that simple idea. 


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    Re: McLaren Artura - coming 17 February 2021

    On top of being charged, it also stays on floating mode when it is fully charged. A battery never stay at 100% on its own.


    --

    GT Lover, Porsche fan

    991.2 GT3 manual

    Cayenne GTS 2014


    Re: McLaren Artura - coming 17 February 2021

    Oh boy. 
    Let us begin by how many miles, on average, Americans cover in a day. Not 100 million cars times x number of kWh. 
    Next we need to appreciate the fact that this would be around 5-10% of your total power bill today.  So that represents the additional load - if everyone magically had an EV all at once.  Do you know how much excess percent capacity there is during off peak hours?  It is far more than 10%.  Now, and this is the fun part.  Imagine setting your car charger to start at midnight or whenever your local peak use ends.  During the off peak hours there is plenty of capacity and it is cheaper.  Next, and this is the amazing part - imagine that when three is peak demand or a power outage, you could use your car to power your house with the cheap power you gained off peak?  You could even sell it back to the grid when it cost more.  
    To summarize - the cars batteries can charge off peak with simple scheduling when there is plenty of capacity and electricity is cheaper.  When there is a peak or prices get higher you can run off batteries or sell back power. 
    Batteries are the biggest boon to renewables. This actually needs to happen. 
    In California today they make too much power when the solar and wind systems are running so they pay other states to take the power from them. When they run out of solar and wind they buy the power back from neighboring states.  Smiley   See anything wrong with this picture?  It is not a capacity problem. It is a peak and storage problem. 
    So this secondary item which you so quickly blow off - else your entire argument falls apart - the power wall or in the case of a car battery VPP ( virtual power plant) is the solution and not secondary. 
    As we get better at making electric power, which we will, peaks will still be an issue. Batteries will be plentiful, especially as this tech evolves. 
    In reality EVs will not arrive at once. Bottlenecks will move from lack of batteries to lack of charging to lack of road spaces etc. - this is what fuels our economy, need and demand. In the end though we all have electricity in our homes already. Much handier than the gas station a mile or two away. 
    Of course what is not being mentioned are the savings in power as well. As one industry uses more power other industries will use less or none. How much electricity do refineries use?  Oil rigs and all the effort to produce oil. Pumps, gas stations. It is not a zero sum game but we can do fancy math here. 


    Re: McLaren Artura - coming 17 February 2021

    the-missile:

    On top of being charged, it also stays on floating mode when it is fully charged. A battery never stay at 100% on its own.

    Interesting point. I often have wondered if the trickle charge you mention is cheaper than making a trip to go and get gas vs just plugging in at home. I know that for my turbo I still go past a few budget stations to get the higher quality gas from BP. If it costs me one half gallon ($1.50) to go get fuel I realize I could travel over 100 miles with my EV. And be quicker by a long shot. 
    So my point is - the gas in your car does not magically appear. You spend gas to go get it. It also evaporates. 


    Re: McLaren Artura - coming 17 February 2021

    Leawood911:
    the-missile:

    On top of being charged, it also stays on floating mode when it is fully charged. A battery never stay at 100% on its own.

    Interesting point. I often have wondered if the trickle charge you mention is cheaper than making a trip to go and get gas vs just plugging in at home. I know that for my turbo I still go past a few budget stations to get the higher quality gas from BP. If it costs me one half gallon ($1.50) to go get fuel I realize I could travel over 100 miles with my EV. And be quicker by a long shot. 
    So my point is - the gas in your car does not magically appear. You spend gas to go get it. It also evaporates. 

    You know your arguments are getting pretty desperate when you are factoring in the evaporation of the gas inside the closed tank indecision

    Just as another perspective, the cost of getting the gas into the tank is about the cost of the gas that I spend driving 10m, about a tenth of a cent, which is the distance from the road to the fuel pump. I only stop at Repsol or BP, and the are countless on my way to wherever I'm driving before I need to refuel, can't remember the last time I had to go out of my route to get gas. And that is the case for most people, as the number of gas stations correlates with the numbers of people that need them.


    Re: McLaren Artura - coming 17 February 2021

    Well, maybe he inhaled too many of these fuel fumes at some point... Smiley Smiley


    --

    RC (Germany) - Rennteam Editor Lamborghini Huracan Performante (2019), Mercedes GLC63 S AMG (2020), Mercedes C63 S AMG Cab (2019), Jeep Grand Cherokee Trackhawk (2019 EU)


    Re: McLaren Artura - coming 17 February 2021

    Whoopsy, you're way way over adding, unless you think that 100m cars go through a tank of gas every day as well. The average commute in North America is 16 miles or 25km. Even adding in groceries, running around etc. it's easy to see why most leases are for 15-20,000km a year. 

    Now as EVs mature it's not unrealistic to say that they will have a range of 500km / charge. 

    At 20,000km that's 40 full charges a year. Less than one a week. NOT one EVERY night. Now many will want to have a more full battery but that's still either a nightly top up or 2-3 times a week for a quarter "tank of gas".

    Plugging that into your scenario makes it look a LOT different. 


    --

    Past-President, Porsche Club of America - Upper Canada Region


    Re: McLaren Artura - coming 17 February 2021

    Mithras:

    Whoopsy, you're way way over adding, unless you think that 100m cars go through a tank of gas every day as well. The average commute in North America is 16 miles or 25km. Even adding in groceries, running around etc. it's easy to see why most leases are for 15-20,000km a year. 

    Now as EVs mature it's not unrealistic to say that they will have a range of 500km / charge. 

    At 20,000km that's 40 full charges a year. Less than one a week. NOT one EVERY night. Now many will want to have a more full battery but that's still either a nightly top up or 2-3 times a week for a quarter "tank of gas".

    Plugging that into your scenario makes it look a LOT different. 

    Are you sure? Maybe one-way? Smiley

    Let me do a different calculation for you: My daily driver (Trackhawk) has an average range of 400 km. Usually I fuel it up once a week. My way to work is around 15 km daily but I also drive to other places, including on weekends. 

    I barely have the time to fuel up the car, it usually takes 5-7 minutes (I stopped it), depending on how many people are inside the fuel station (in the past, it took less time but with Corona...).

    Now just imagine I want to fuel up on my way home from work (keep in mind that I am tired and want to have dinner): In a Taycan Turbo S, the charging time at a fast charger would be around one hour. One friggin hour. At home, I could probably charge the car over night but would pay 2x or more the price I would pay with a special card at a charging station.

    I see two major problems here: Charging infrastructure and cost of electricity at home. This can only change and improve if governments commit to EVs and start supporting them in a more serious way. Right now, I think most governments are preoccupied with Corona and the pandemic. Smiley 


    --

    RC (Germany) - Rennteam Editor Lamborghini Huracan Performante (2019), Mercedes GLC63 S AMG (2020), Mercedes C63 S AMG Cab (2019), Jeep Grand Cherokee Trackhawk (2019 EU)


    Re: McLaren Artura - coming 17 February 2021

    Mithras:

    Whoopsy, you're way way over adding, unless you think that 100m cars go through a tank of gas every day as well. The average commute in North America is 16 miles or 25km. Even adding in groceries, running around etc. it's easy to see why most leases are for 15-20,000km a year. 

    Now as EVs mature it's not unrealistic to say that they will have a range of 500km / charge. 

    At 20,000km that's 40 full charges a year. Less than one a week. NOT one EVERY night. Now many will want to have a more full battery but that's still either a nightly top up or 2-3 times a week for a quarter "tank of gas".

    Plugging that into your scenario makes it look a LOT different. 

     

    Actually I am not.

    There is some that thinks every EV owner plug in their car at night every day after driving. Just using that scenario. But I am not calculating with all of these EVs as empty and needs a full charge. Hence why I wrote the load goes down as time goes on. Some of the EVs are barely driven and may need a 15 mins charge, others could be just an hour of charging, that's not a lot of electricity, like 8kW. for some EVs that's 40km driven or so. To the grid it makes absolutely no difference, all home chargers starts off with the highest current draw first and ramp down as needed, so the initial peak load is the same for a car with 95% charge left or one with 80% or one with 10% left, and that's 7-9kW/hr.

    But if we re-do the scenario using normal car owner behaviour, i.e. people don't keep topping off their gas tank every night, and they do their 'fill-up' at 1/2 'tank', 1/4 'tank', lights on, etc, then the numbers will be quite different. Some cars could go only charging a couple times a week, or if really lightly driven like how I used my e-Tron, charge it once every 3 weeks. The peak load will be a lot lower as the number of cars plugged in at the same time will be a lot lower. But in this scenario, the infrastructure will need to be improved, a lot. Density of quick chargers will need to approach that of gas stations to ease people's mind. It doesn't matter if 75% of these extra chargers aren't being used like gas stations pumps currently are, it's a peace of mind thing for drivers, mentality problem. 

    So what if someone came home late one night and forgot to plug it in at say 50% charge? Not a problem, he/she could wake up the next morning fully confident that he will come across a quick charge for a top up if needed, which in most cases he/she won't need and can wait till the next day to charge at home at say 35% SoC or something. It's like normal car drivers who never sweat about how much gas they have left in their gas tank, they know they will come across 100s of pumps everywhere. 

    Adoption of EVs will always be infrastructure limited, whatever EVs on sale atm are all good enough and even better ones see pcoming, but people's mentality aren't prepared yet and they won't be until they see parity or almost parity with what they are used to with gasoline. 

    With governments around the world trying to ban normal cars within the next decade, stuff needs to happen fast now to prepare for the inevitable. 


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