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    The more I drive it the more impressed I am, BUT

    I have encountered an issue unique to the F1. Ben experienced it when he drove the car.

    Because the car has tremendous torque, it reaches the rev limiter very quickly and when that happens it automatically upshifts to the higher gear. The problem is, if I am also upshifting then it upshifts twice thereby compromising the best gear for speed and performance.

    This feature also existed on the 360 but the 360 does not have the torque like the 430. I could time the upshift and never had a situation where it automatically did it for me.

    I guess the fix is to be more mindful of the accelerating rpm's and time the upshift better.

    Other than that, this car is unbelieveable.

    Re: The more I drive it the more impressed I am, BUT

    I'm sure its just a matter of getting used to the torque and the rev limt.
    Its like when people jump from a N/A 991 to a TT and tend to hit the rev limiter in first gear when shifting to sencond.

    Re: The more I drive it the more impressed I am, BUT

    Quote:
    Carlos from Spain said:
    I'm sure its just a matter of getting used to the torque and the rev limt.
    Its like when people jump from a N/A 991 to a TT and tend to hit the rev limiter in first gear when shifting to sencond.



    OUCH!

    My concern is I do not want to be driving an automatic. The timing of my upshifts is important. I am going to se what happens when the car is set to disable all stability management systems.

    Re: The more I drive it the more impressed I am, BUT

    hi nberry, could you maybe post a short video of your car? love listening to the sounds emitting from the exhaust and engine?

    Re: The more I drive it the more impressed I am, BUT

    Quote:
    Carlos from Spain said:
    I'm sure its just a matter of getting used to the torque and the rev limt.
    Its like when people jump from a N/A 991 to a TT and tend to hit the rev limiter in first gear when shifting to sencond.



    there probably isn't a faster reving car on the market today than the CGT, and i'd be pissed if the tranny shifted for me. like nick said, if both you and the computer are making the decision to shift at virtually the same time (as was the case when i drove it), you end up upshifting 2 gears instead of one which completely screws up the torque (and balance if in a track setting). my stradale never did this and would sit at the redline (rev limiter) all day long if i wanted it to. (this was in race in the 430 but i wonder if this is "feature" is defeated when the CST is off). as well, there are certain curves at certain tracks in certain cars which require a few hundred more RPM for just a very brief moment and as a result upshifting, then downshifting for that couple extra seconds is just a PIA. in the 430, it is not possible to leave it in that gear a bit longer at or near redline before you begin your pre corner business. the bottomline is that as nick said, i wouldn't want an automatic which only allowed me to downshift when i wanted to but did the upshifting at redline for me.

    Re: The more I drive it the more impressed I am, BUT

    If you can't find a work around for the tranny issue, consider a DB9 will hold any gear up or down at any rpm
    until the tax code is thrown out.

    or just flip the car and rejoin the jurassic era

    Re: The more I drive it the more impressed I am, BUT

    I see the your point now, I though all F1 trannies did that and nick was just complaining of missing the shift before the computer did it. But having this auto shift at redline sort of defeats the point of the paddles and manual gear selection not even torque converters auto slush trannies that I have driven do this when in mnaula selection

    Re: The more I drive it the more impressed I am, BUT

    Quote:
    ben, lj said:
    my stradale never did this and would sit at the redline (rev limiter) all day long if i wanted it to.



    Surprised "standard" Ferraris exhibit this behavior. The behavior of your stradale is preferred. Was at an autox today and would be pissed off if the tranny automatically upshifted at redline. Sometimes it's faster to ride the redline for a moment instead of shifting up, and then back down.

    Anyway, Nick, you seem to be finding that just a minor quibble of an otherwise great car.

    - J

    Re: The more I drive it the more impressed I am, BUT

    I am surprised Ferrari programs in this shifting feature, rather than the non- shifting mode, like the CS. In fact, I wonder if the European 430's and 360's have the same feature. Any rational for this in the owners manual?
    Does this intervention happen in all gears, or just 1st to 2nd? Does it happen when the "little switch" is all the way to the right?
    At any rate, I bet you get it down, Nick, just like in the 360.


    Quote:
    nberry said:
    I have encountered an issue unique to the F1. Ben experienced it when he drove the car.

    Because the car has tremendous torque, it reaches the rev limiter very quickly and when that happens it automatically upshifts to the higher gear. The problem is, if I am also upshifting then it upshifts twice thereby compromising the best gear for speed and performance.

    This feature also existed on the 360 but the 360 does not have the torque like the 430. I could time the upshift and never had a situation where it automatically did it for me.

    I guess the fix is to be more mindful of the accelerating rpm's and time the upshift better.

    Other than that, this car is unbelieveable.


    Re: The more I drive it the more impressed I am, BUT

    Quote:
    Justin said:
    Quote:
    ben, lj said:
    my stradale never did this and would sit at the redline (rev limiter) all day long if i wanted it to.



    Surprised "standard" Ferraris exhibit this behavior. The behavior of your stradale is preferred. Was at an autox today and would be pissed off if the tranny automatically upshifted at redline. Sometimes it's faster to ride the redline for a moment instead of shifting up, and then back down.

    Anyway, Nick, you seem to be finding that just a minor quibble of an otherwise great car.

    - J



    Were you at Qualcomm? I went there today to check it out, but I was at the BMW area. I should have gone over to the Lotus'

    Re: The more I drive it the more impressed I am, BUT

    Quote:
    Ryan in SD said:
    Were you at Qualcomm? I went there today to check it out, but I was at the BMW area. I should have gone over to the Lotus'



    Yep, that was us. Come on over next time! Love the Lotus club because you can get over 40 runs and by the end of the day they are nearly back to back. You can push the limits a bit more than you can on a race track.

    - J

    Re: The more I drive it the more impressed I am, BUT

    Quote:
    yavapai said:
    Does this intervention happen in all gears, or just 1st to 2nd? Does it happen when the "little switch" is all the way to the right?

    Quote:
    nberry said:
    I have encountered an issue unique to the F1. Ben experienced it when he drove the car.

    Because the car has tremendous torque, it reaches the rev limiter very quickly and when that happens it automatically upshifts to the higher gear. The problem is, if I am also upshifting then it upshifts twice thereby compromising the best gear for speed and performance.

    This feature also existed on the 360 but the 360 does not have the torque like the 430. I could time the upshift and never had a situation where it automatically did it for me.

    I guess the fix is to be more mindful of the accelerating rpm's and time the upshift better.

    Other than that, this car is unbelieveable.





    it happens in all gears and the 430 doesn't have the shift lights on the steering wheel. even if it didn't, that's not the problem. a driver will hit the correct shift point at the same time the computer does - hence the double shift.

    Re: The more I drive it the more impressed I am, BUT

    "This feature also existed on the 360 but the 360 does not have the torque like the 430"

    Don't know why but it hasn't happened to me in my CS.

    Re: The more I drive it the more impressed I am, BUT

    Quote:
    STRADALE said:
    "This feature also existed on the 360 but the 360 does not have the torque like the 430"

    Don't know why but it hasn't happened to me in my CS.



    it is not a "feature" present in the CS as my crapload of time at redline in it would make clear.

    Re: The more I drive it the more impressed I am, BUT

    Quote:
    ben, lj said:
    Quote:
    STRADALE said:
    "This feature also existed on the 360 but the 360 does not have the torque like the 430"

    Don't know why but it hasn't happened to me in my CS.



    it is not a "feature" present in the CS as my crapload of time at redline in it would make clear.



    If it was present in the 360 but not the CS I would hope it would not be present in a 43O CS.

    Re: The more I drive it the more impressed I am, BUT

    That is a feature that I recall I hated in the Porsche Tiptronics I've driven - they upshifted even in manual mode . Even worse, they did that 2-300 rpm SHORT of redline in the lower gears if I recall. Why is it even in these sports cars, esp since all modern cars come with rev limiters .
    My wife's MBZ slushbox wagon just hit's the rev limiter if in the " manual " shift mode.

    Re: The more I drive it the more impressed I am, BUT

    Quote:
    MKW said:
    That is a feature that I recall I hated in the Porsche Tiptronics I've driven - they upshifted even in manual mode . Even worse, they did that 2-300 rpm SHORT of redline in the lower gears if I recall. Why is it even in these sports cars, esp since all modern cars come with rev limiters .
    My wife's MBZ slushbox wagon just hit's the rev limiter if in the " manual " shift mode.



    yes, i guess "the transformation is (not) complete":

    http://www.rennteam.com/showflat.php?Cat=0&Number=99018&an=0&page=0#99018

    Re: The more I drive it the more impressed I am, BUT

    I think the 360 in "sport" setting didn't have it, only in "normal" mode the F1 did automatic upshifts.

    Re: The more I drive it the more impressed I am, BUT

    nick,

    get your factory rep's cell from your dealer and discuss it with him...

    Re: The more I drive it the more impressed I am, BUT

    Quote:
    Rossi said:
    I think the 360 in "sport" setting didn't have it, only in "normal" mode the F1 did automatic upshifts.



    Waiting on Nick to report back but it appears like the 43O is the same as the 360. In the 43O "race" it doesn't automatically upshift. In the 360 in "sport" it doesn't automatically upshift. 430 in sport it automatically upshifts/360 normal it automatically upshifts.

    43O Race - No upshift
    360 Sport - No upshift

    43O Sport - Auto upshift
    360 Normal - Auto upshift
    Is this right ?

    How about Patriek ? What are his conclusions ?

    Re: The more I drive it the more impressed I am, BUT

    Quote:
    STRADALE said:
    Quote:
    Rossi said:
    I think the 360 in "sport" setting didn't have it, only in "normal" mode the F1 did automatic upshifts.



    Waiting on Nick to report back but it appears like the 43O is the same as the 360. In the 43O "race" it doesn't automatically upshift. In the 360 in "sport" it doesn't automatically upshift. 430 in sport it automatically upshifts/360 normal it automatically upshifts.

    43O Race - No upshift
    360 Sport - No upshift

    43O Sport - Auto upshift
    360 Normal - Auto upshift
    Is this right ?

    How about Patriek ? What are his conclusions ?



    if i'm not mistaken, it was occuring while in race.

    Re: The more I drive it the more impressed I am, BUT

    Quote:
    ben, lj said:
    Quote:
    STRADALE said:
    Quote:
    Rossi said:
    I think the 360 in "sport" setting didn't have it, only in "normal" mode the F1 did automatic upshifts.



    Waiting on Nick to report back but it appears like the 43O is the same as the 360. In the 43O "race" it doesn't automatically upshift. In the 360 in "sport" it doesn't automatically upshift. 430 in sport it automatically upshifts/360 normal it automatically upshifts.

    43O Race - No upshift
    360 Sport - No upshift

    43O Sport - Auto upshift
    360 Normal - Auto upshift
    Is this right ?

    How about Patriek ? What are his conclusions ?



    if i'm not mistaken, it was occuring while in race.



    Did it ? I'm confuused. This is what Nick said on the other thread about the same topic:

    "Today I used Race and CST off and tried to see if the car upshifted when it neared 8500 rpm. It did not. Then I put it into Sport and when it hit 8500 it upshifted."

    Re: The more I drive it the more impressed I am, BUT

    Quote:
    STRADALE said:
    Quote:
    ben, lj said:
    Quote:
    STRADALE said:
    Quote:
    Rossi said:
    I think the 360 in "sport" setting didn't have it, only in "normal" mode the F1 did automatic upshifts.



    Waiting on Nick to report back but it appears like the 43O is the same as the 360. In the 43O "race" it doesn't automatically upshift. In the 360 in "sport" it doesn't automatically upshift. 430 in sport it automatically upshifts/360 normal it automatically upshifts.

    43O Race - No upshift
    360 Sport - No upshift

    43O Sport - Auto upshift
    360 Normal - Auto upshift
    Is this right ?

    How about Patriek ? What are his conclusions ?



    if i'm not mistaken, it was occuring while in race.



    Did it ? I'm confuused. This is what Nick said on the other thread about the same topic:

    "Today I used Race and CST off and tried to see if the car upshifted when it neared 8500 rpm. It did not. Then I put it into Sport and when it hit 8500 it upshifted."



    i'm pretty sure i was in race when it happened. i don't recall what i put it in when we went through a very tight decreasing radius, but nick might remember. we went through there fast enough to get a feel for the car but not so fast as to push things with the new tires and someone elses new car. if memory serves, nick asked me what setting we were in through there and he might remember the answer. however, i'm fairly certain that it was in race shortly after that section when we turned left onto the highway on ramp and experienced auto upshift again.

    btw, good chance i'll be out on the track (again) with a 430 this week.

    Re: The more I drive it the more impressed I am, BUT

    At a track you'll have plenty opportunity to play around redline with all modes. Please report back your findings. If I wanted a 43O spider I could get one relatively soon but my window for a decision wont last for long.

    Re: The more I drive it the more impressed I am, BUT

    I would be rather surprised, if the F430 does automatic upshifts whilst in "race"-modus. In "sport" (what actually is the "normal" setting) yes, but not in race. Would make no sense to me, if CST was the only setting where you have no interference by the F1 tranny.

    Re: The more I drive it the more impressed I am, BUT

    Quote:
    STRADALE said:
    At a track you'll have plenty opportunity to play around redline with all modes. Please report back your findings. If I wanted a 43O spider I could get one relatively soon but my window for a decision wont last for long.



    will do.

    Re: The more I drive it the more impressed I am, BUT

    "Please report back your findings."

    Stradale, you're asking the world's angriest Carrera GT owner for feedback on a Ferrari? I wouldn't wait around for an objective review. As for a 430 spider, if you can get one in the near future at MSRP, what's the downside?

    Re: The more I drive it the more impressed I am, BUT

    Quote:
    WCH said:
    ...you're asking the world's angriest Carrera GT owner for feedback on a Ferrari? I wouldn't wait around for an objective review.



    i call em as i see em. that said, i can't believe my opinions are anymore tainted than those of fcar worshippers. fwiw, i do try pretty hard to be objective. afterall, i'm a potential buyer of any of these cars and what i put the money on is the best reflection of my true opinion, eh?

    Re: The more I drive it the more impressed I am, BUT

    Quote:
    ben, lj said:
    Quote:
    WCH said:
    ...you're asking the world's angriest Carrera GT owner for feedback on a Ferrari? I wouldn't wait around for an objective review.



    i call em as i see em. that said, i can't believe my opinions are anymore tainted than those of fcar worshippers. fwiw, i do try pretty hard to be objective. afterall, i'm a potential buyer of any of these cars and what i put the money on is the best reflection of my true opinion, eh?



    I checked with ferrari service and they told me they would check with Ferrari NA. The service tech did not believe the 360 automatically upshifted. As we all know, the manenitto is new so we are all learning. When I get an answer, I will report.

    BTW, Ben when are you ever out of race mode?

    Re: The more I drive it the more impressed I am, BUT

    Not tryin to annoy you or anyhting, but I'm pretty sure little dial is called the "mannetino".

    And Ben, their's a guy on Flat-6.net that's trying to use your pictures, saying that it's his car. Thought I'd let you know.

     
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