Rennteam 2.0 - EN - Forum - Future of Porsche (In my opinion) - Page4

Mar 6, 2006 5:21:55 PM

nberry: Rennteam VIP; Loc: La Jolla, USA , United States; Posts: 13693, Gallery; Registered on: Apr 11, 2002; Reply to: W8MM

Re: Future of Porsche (In my opinion)

Quote:
W8MM said:
Quote:
RC said:
I'm 41 now, I had my share of excitement in my life. The old saying "no risk, no fun" isn't really valid for me anymore. I learned from mistakes and I started to set priorities. And what I want is actually to be extremely fast at the lowest possible risk. Some people want something else of course and it is understandable.

Maybe we should have two classifications of posters to make it easier to understand points of view:

A) Hormones in control of brain

B) Brain in control of hormones

I started off firmly in group "A". I have, in my old age (56), tried move to group "B". I dare not call it wisdom, more like learning from experience.

I find myself agreeing with your description of driving aims and goals. I have driven thousands of laps at various race tracks and cherish the experience. I no longer feel compelled to explore the uncharted reaches of risk/reward in order to have fun going really fast.

Make no mistake; I like going really fast. It's great fun for which I have a lot of enthusiasm. But, I have learned to appreciate the difference between aggressive slip angles with lots of tire smoke and getting to point "B" before the other guy.

I like getting there first much more than being able to tell hair-raising stories about getting there second.

Great post.

I guess we can agree on the important matters.

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Mar 6, 2006 5:28:07 PM

RC: Rennteam Administrator; Loc: Rennteam HQ , Germany; Posts: 59344, Gallery; Registered on: Mar 26, 2002; Reply to: nberry

Re: Future of Porsche (In my opinion)

Quote:
nberry said:
I like getting there first much more than being able to tell hair-raising stories about getting there second.

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Mar 6, 2006 5:54:40 PM

Crash: Rennteam VIP; Loc: Never been to , Antarctica; Posts: 8287, Gallery; Registered on: Oct 17, 2002; Reply to: rhino

Re: Future of Porsche (In my opinion)

Quote:
rhino said:
I also think it will be more versatile since I can use the phone or be in traffic without having to worry about gear shifts.

Please, tell me you're kidding

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Mar 6, 2006 5:56:47 PM

rhino: Rennteam Pro; Loc: Island , Saint Lucia; Posts: 2866, Gallery; Registered on: Jan 26, 2006; Reply to: Crash

Re: Future of Porsche (In my opinion)

What? You never use your phone while driving, please tell me you're not a joke!

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Mar 6, 2006 6:07:28 PM

Crash: Rennteam VIP; Loc: Never been to , Antarctica; Posts: 8287, Gallery; Registered on: Oct 17, 2002; Reply to: rhino

Re: Future of Porsche (In my opinion)

Quote:
rhino said:
What? You never use your phone while driving, please tell me you're not a joke!

As a matter of fact, I don't use the phone. I just don't feel comfortable operating a 4000-lb hunk of steel without giving it my undivided attention.
Cell phone usage is dangerous and has the same effect as an excessive blood alcohol level.
It's a different matter when you're using a hands-free set, but I still prefer driving without any unnecessary distractions.

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Mar 6, 2006 6:13:06 PM

JimFlat6: Rennteam VIP; Loc: Cave , United States; Posts: 8631, Gallery; Registered on: Jul 25, 2004; Reply to: Crash

Re: Future of Porsche (In my opinion)

No doubt the Tiptronic 997 Turbo will prove itself to be a masterpiece of technology and performance. A very serious machine with no flaws or vices with instant massive thrust, perfect brakes, shifts gears on its own, and all with speed feel of a higher order than anything before it. A great leap forward for sports cars and with no real competitor.

It might be so fantastically competent that it could just become boring. And there lays the basic question about it.

Will it have any heart? Or will it be Porsches version of a Stepford Wife?

Let me invoke the logic of the great philosopher Yogi Berra .."it might be so good that no one wants it!"

Please dont call me cynical!

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Mar 6, 2006 6:42:38 PM

Crash: Rennteam VIP; Loc: Never been to , Antarctica; Posts: 8287, Gallery; Registered on: Oct 17, 2002; Reply to: JimFlat6

Re: Future of Porsche (In my opinion)

Quote:
JimFlat6 said:
No doubt the Tiptronic 997 Turbo will prove itself to be a masterpiece of technology and performance. A very serious machine with no flaws or vices with instant massive thrust, perfect brakes, shifts gears on its own, and all with speed feel of a higher order than anything before it. A great leap forward for sports cars and with no real competitor.

It might be so fantastically competent that it could just become boring. And there lays the basic question about it.

Will it have any heart? Or will it be Porsches version of a Stepford Wife?

Let me invoke the logic of the great philosopher Yogi Berra .."it might be so good that no one wants it!"

Please dont call me cynical!

Not taking away from the Tip in any way, but perfection is boring. If I did mainly Autobahn driving, I'd be all over it (with 6 or 7 gears, the car would be a monster), but I like twisty roads and I like to feel involved with the car. I also don't feel the urge to use a cell phone while driving

.

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Mar 6, 2006 6:50:28 PM

SoCalHoosier: Veteran; Loc: California , United States; Posts: 896, Gallery; Registered on: Jun 13, 2003; Reply to: Crash

Re: Future of Porsche (In my opinion)

Quote:
Crash said:

Not taking away from the Tip in any way, but perfection is boring.

The last thing I'd call Tip is "perfection". Definitely boring but not perfect in any way, shape or form.

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Mar 6, 2006 7:03:25 PM

Crash: Rennteam VIP; Loc: Never been to , Antarctica; Posts: 8287, Gallery; Registered on: Oct 17, 2002; Reply to: SoCalHoosier

Re: Future of Porsche (In my opinion)

Quote:
SoCalHoosier said:
Quote:
Crash said:

Not taking away from the Tip in any way, but perfection is boring.

The last thing I'd call Tip is "perfection". Definitely boring but not perfect in any way, shape or form.

What I meant was the fact that the car accelerates so effortlessly, regardless of what the driver does and is integrated with a bazillion computers, all in perfect sync to provide the best performance. That's what I meant with perfection.

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Mar 6, 2006 7:38:38 PM

Hurst: Veteran; Loc: Potomac, MD; Posts: 1255, Gallery; Registered on: Apr 15, 2005; Reply to: JimFlat6

Re: Future of Porsche (In my opinion)

Quote:
JimFlat6 said:
No doubt the Tiptronic 997 Turbo will prove itself to be a masterpiece of technology and performance. A very serious machine with no flaws or vices with instant massive thrust, perfect brakes, shifts gears on its own, and all with speed feel of a higher order than anything before it. A great leap forward for sports cars and with no real competitor.

It might be so fantastically competent that it could just become boring. And there lays the basic question about it.

Will it have any heart? Or will it be Porsches version of a Stepford Wife?

Let me invoke the logic of the great philosopher Yogi Berra .."it might be so good that no one wants it!"

Please dont call me cynical!

Thank you

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Mar 6, 2006 8:33:30 PM

rhino: Rennteam Pro; Loc: Island , Saint Lucia; Posts: 2866, Gallery; Registered on: Jan 26, 2006; Reply to: Crash

Re: Future of Porsche (In my opinion)

I Don't use my phone because I have the urge. I do business whether I am in my office or in my vehicle. When an important client or bank calls me I can't simply tell them call me back I am enjoying the "twisties". Now I don't know what you do for a living Crash but I would imaging occasional forum reading and allot of porn hence you desire to hold the "STICK" through out your drive. So I recommend you get off the stick and suck it !

and i give you the thumbs up sign because there is not one with the middle finger

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Mar 6, 2006 9:07:23 PM

Carlos from Spain: Rennteam Moderator; Loc: Spain. , Spain; Posts: 20993, Gallery; Registered on: Feb 9, 2003; Reply to: rhino

Re: Future of Porsche (In my opinion)

Quote:
rhino said:
What? You never use your phone while driving, please tell me you're not a joke!

Of course not! that is hazardous and has been linked time and time again with increased risk of accidents. It is completely ilegal here in Europe and for a very good reason.

I can't even count the drivers you encounter on the road not paying attention to driving because they are fumbling with the mobile

... you can even tell sometimes before you even see them by the way they are driving

And whats even worse is that there is a very simple solution... hands-free kit!!

If someone crashes their car becuase they haven't figured out to use a hands-free kit then thats what is called as Darwin's law

but the problem is that they are a pain in the asss on the road to other drivers on the road, and can take out a family on another car iy they crash.

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Mar 6, 2006 9:14:07 PM

rhino: Rennteam Pro; Loc: Island , Saint Lucia; Posts: 2866, Gallery; Registered on: Jan 26, 2006; Reply to: Carlos from Spain

Re: Future of Porsche (In my opinion)

It's illegal to speed yet I am sure most of you do it. I have a blue tooth phone but sometimes I have to write something down on a pad while in traffic. Now if you are going to tell me what's morally right or wrong I suggest you look in the mirror.

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Mar 6, 2006 9:18:23 PM

SoCalHoosier: Veteran; Loc: California , United States; Posts: 896, Gallery; Registered on: Jun 13, 2003; Reply to: rhino

Re: Future of Porsche (In my opinion)

con.sid.er.a.tion P Pronunciation Key (kn-sd-rshn)
n.
Careful thought; deliberation: We will give your proposal consideration.
A result of considering; an opinion or a judgment: Is it your consideration that I should apply?
A factor to be considered in forming a judgment or decision: Safety is the most important consideration in choosing a car.
A treatment or account: The essay begins with a brief consideration of the history of the problem.
Thoughtful concern for others; solicitude.
High regard; esteem.
Payment given in exchange for a service rendered; recompense: agreed to do it for a small consideration.
Law. Something promised, given, or done that has the effect of making an agreement a legally enforceable contract.

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Mar 6, 2006 10:44:09 PM

RC: Rennteam Administrator; Loc: Rennteam HQ , Germany; Posts: 59344, Gallery; Registered on: Mar 26, 2002; Reply to: rhino

Re: Future of Porsche (In my opinion)

Quote:
rhino said:
I Don't use my phone because I have the urge. I do business whether I am in my office or in my vehicle. When an important client or bank calls me I can't simply tell them call me back I am enjoying the "twisties". Now I don't know what you do for a living Crash but I would imaging occasional forum reading and allot of porn hence you desire to hold the "STICK" through out your drive. So I recommend you get off the stick and suck it ! and i give you the thumbs up sign because there is not one with the middle finger

A. you just learned the reason why Porsche offers a handsfree installation
B. you just made us learn why there are so many sad accidents due to people speaking on the phone, taking notes, eating burgers, etc. while driving
C. I can show you where to stick your registration if you don't watch your language

Sorry to ask a stupid question but why would a Honda owner post to and read a Porsche 997 Turbo forum???!

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Mar 7, 2006 12:02:59 AM

Crash: Rennteam VIP; Loc: Never been to , Antarctica; Posts: 8287, Gallery; Registered on: Oct 17, 2002; Reply to: RC

Re: Future of Porsche (In my opinion)

Quote:
RC said:
Quote:
rhino said:
I Don't use my phone because I have the urge. I do business whether I am in my office or in my vehicle. When an important client or bank calls me I can't simply tell them call me back I am enjoying the "twisties". Now I don't know what you do for a living Crash but I would imaging occasional forum reading and allot of porn hence you desire to hold the "STICK" through out your drive. So I recommend you get off the stick and suck it ! and i give you the thumbs up sign because there is not one with the middle finger

A. you just learned the reason why Porsche offers a handsfree installation
B. you just made us learn why there are so many sad accidents due to people speaking on the phone, taking notes, eating burgers, etc. while driving
C. I can show you where to stick your registration if you don't watch your language

Sorry to ask a stupid question but why would a Honda owner post to and read a Porsche 997 Turbo forum???!

RC,

thanks for responding, I didn't really plan on dignifying his over-the-line and totally offensive post with a reply.
Well put with the three points, though.

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Mar 7, 2006 12:15:12 AM

rhino: Rennteam Pro; Loc: Island , Saint Lucia; Posts: 2866, Gallery; Registered on: Jan 26, 2006; Reply to: RC

Re: Future of Porsche (In my opinion)

After reading my post I guess it was out of line and disrespectful. Even though I felt I was being attacked, I had no right to react in that manner. I must apologize to Crash first, to everyone on Rennteam and to you RC. I will definitely refrain from those kinds of posts in the future. I realize being able to participate on Rennteam is a privilege and not a right, so I thank you guys for letting me be a part of this community. I also have witnessed people driving very badly while talking on there cell phones, but I would be lying if I told you I never use it while driving. I think of myself as a safe driver and keep my speed down when doing so, but you guys opposed to this type of behavior might think otherwise. I know a friend of mine who was hit while riding his motorcycle by a lady. She was on the cell phone and she ran through a stop sign. Luckily he survived and is still riding today. Believe me I am not twenty one anymore and I truly try to be safe while operating my vehicle, and I will think twice about driving habits. In regards to your question RC I do drive a Honda Accord, a Honda 450TRX, a 1972 mercury cougar convertible, and I just sold my Honda 900rr (for the same reason you stopped driving motorcycles). I have looked forward to buying a Porsche since 1993 but for some reason or other I decided to go with a less expensive car so I can put my money in a better investment. Now some twelve years later I find myself needing to buy a new car because my Hondas lease is do in July and I can afford the car I always wanted. God willing I will buy the 997TT, but if driving a Honda Accord makes me any less and not welcome amongst you guys who already own Porsches, ask me to leave and I will do as you wish.

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Mar 7, 2006 12:30:54 AM

Crash: Rennteam VIP; Loc: Never been to , Antarctica; Posts: 8287, Gallery; Registered on: Oct 17, 2002; Reply to: rhino

Re: Future of Porsche (In my opinion)

Quote:
rhino said:
After reading my post I guess it was out of line and disrespectful. Even though I felt I was being attacked, I had no right to react in that manner. I must apologize to Crash first, to everyone on Rennteam and to you RC. I will definitely refrain from those kinds of posts in the future. I realize being able to participate on Rennteam is a privilege and not a right, so I thank you guys for letting me be a part of this community. I also have witnessed people driving very badly while talking on there cell phones, but I would be lying if I told you I never use it while driving. I think of myself as a safe driver and keep my speed down when doing so, but you guys opposed to this type of behavior might think otherwise. I know a friend of mine who was hit while riding his motorcycle by a lady. She was on the cell phone and she ran through a stop sign. Luckily he survived and is still riding today. Believe me I am not twenty one anymore and I truly try to be safe while operating my vehicle, and I will think twice about driving habits. In regards to your question RC I do drive a Honda Accord, a Honda 450TRX, a 1972 mercury cougar convertible, and I just sold my Honda 900rr (for the same reason you stopped driving motorcycles). I have looked forward to buying a Porsche since 1993 but for some reason or other I decided to go with a less expensive car so I can put my money in a better investment. Now some twelve years later I find myself needing to buy a new car because my Hondas lease is do in July and I can afford the car I always wanted. God willing I will buy the 997TT, but if driving a Honda Accord makes me any less and not welcome amongst you guys who already own Porsches, ask me to leave and I will do as you wish.

You can buy a Yugo for all anyone here cares, it doesn't make you any less welcome. I accept your apology and I want to emphasize that I wasn't attacking you, but was simply pointing out what I thought about a habit such as this.

Like Carlos said, cell phones are banned in Europe for a reason. Lots of accidents occur because of them and if you ask me, 100 USD (only 50 if you pay right away) is way too small a ticket, especially when considering that studies have shown the effect to be similar to a 0.1% (not sure if I got the decimals right) blood alcohol level. Cell phones are definitely a no-no.

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Mar 7, 2006 12:40:09 AM

rhino: Rennteam Pro; Loc: Island , Saint Lucia; Posts: 2866, Gallery; Registered on: Jan 26, 2006; Reply to: Crash

Re: Future of Porsche (In my opinion)

Thank you for accepting, and will order the handsfree installation on my next vehicle.

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Mar 7, 2006 1:47:22 AM

JMShrink: Pilot; Loc: California; Posts: 395, Gallery; Registered on: Oct 12, 2005; Reply to: rhino

Re: Future of Porsche (In my opinion)

Actually, I think I'm gonna step in to clear something up. It's been studied that people using cell phones while driving can be just as dangerous if it is a headset(hands free) instead of a handheld device. I think it was in JAMA, but not positive. Not the result I would have expected, just the facts. Speaking with a passenger even while driving can distract a driver.

Just thought I'd step in to clear this up..

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Mar 7, 2006 2:28:36 AM

ADias: Rennteam Pro; Loc: Southwest USA , United States; Posts: 2495, Gallery; Registered on: Apr 9, 2004; Reply to: JMShrink

Re: Future of Porsche (In my opinion)

Correct. Being involved in a phone conversation (set or hands free), playing w/ NAV/radio/CD/any player or being distracted by a conversation with a passenger have been proven as accident causes.

I see this every day. I often see vehicles swerving out of their lane, and every time, it is either the driver on the phone or fiddling with gadgets on the dash.

Unfortunately, as the number of gadgets increase in modern cars, the more the driver will be isolated from his driving function and busy operating those.

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Mar 7, 2006 5:28:10 AM

WBH: Expert; Loc: CA; Posts: 1963, Gallery; Registered on: Jan 2, 2004; Reply to: ADias

Re: Future of Porsche (In my opinion)

Sure, cell phs while driving are extremely dangerous. But I don't know where to rank that risk vs a few other seemingly obvious (and easily avoidable) risks....

Like convertibles....I'd want a rigid, steel roof structure (in addition to advanced side/head airbags) protecting my head/spine vs an SUV bumper/rollover situation...should personal injury lawyers/NHTSA seek to prevent sales of Cabs to reduce risks and costs assoc'd w/poss head/spinal injuries?
Drivers drinking/eating while driving...should cupholders be banished?
Placing any loose objects in passenger compartment (esp back seat area) of 997....potential lethal missles in any severe deceleration (similarly, don't understand how people are comfortable placing objects in cargo area of SUVs)

...any objects that don't fit in trunk or in a closed/secured compartment of car shouldn't be in the passenger compartment....should there be laws prohibiting loose objects in cars and use of cargo areas of SUVs/station wagons?

IMO people should be relatively free to assume risks w/which they're comfortable...and live/die w/negative consequences when risks are realized.....natural laws of Darwinian selection should prevail....but, realistically, an alarming percentage of drivers will always be sloppy/inept/distracted/inebriated no matter how specific the laws...and, at least in US, the most affluent guy in any accid can expect to be sued for a nuisance settlement, no matter who is at fault....

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Mar 7, 2006 7:08:22 AM

ADias: Rennteam Pro; Loc: Southwest USA , United States; Posts: 2495, Gallery; Registered on: Apr 9, 2004; Reply to: WBH

Re: Future of Porsche (In my opinion)

I agree with you that people should be free to take risks as far as they are concerned... but that should stop when 3rd parties are on the scene.

An unsecured load on a backseat may hurt someone only after some accident has already happened and that someone accepted the risk. That load will very unlikely hurt 3rd parties outside the vehicle.

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