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    Re: Tesla Roadster

    https://insideevs.com/news/441765/video-tesla-model-3-vs-porsche-taycan-nurburgring/


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    Tesla Model S P100d. 2018 991.2 GT3. 2019 BMW M850i Convertible. 2020 Tesla Model 3 Performance. 2020 Aston Martin Vantage. 2020 Mclaren 720S coupe. 🥳


    Re: Tesla Roadster

    Thanks for sharing.  "All car manufacturers/engineers/CEO, you should really, really, really move your ass soooo quickly for staying in the game into the next futur…." If I remember correctly Sebastian usually drives a GT2 RS around the ring


    Re: Tesla Roadster

    "Model 3 ended with 53% charge and the Taycan with 56% after 2 laps"

    That, tells the true story. THE ONLY STORY.

    handling wise, the Model 3 was a big improvement from the Model S, we already know as much since the Model 3's release and owners been doing some tracking with it.

    Model 3 was supposed to have the 'superior' range......................Maybe that's only on paper...................


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    Re: Tesla Roadster

    Put them side by side down a highway at cruising speed and you will have your answer. 


    Re: Tesla Roadster

    https://insideevs.com/news/441793/videos-tesla-model-3-top-two-pikes-peak/


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    Tesla Model S P100d. 2018 991.2 GT3. 2019 BMW M850i Convertible. 2020 Tesla Model 3 Performance. 2020 Aston Martin Vantage. 2020 Mclaren 720S coupe. 🥳


    Re: Tesla Roadster

    Leawood911:

    Put them side by side down a highway at cruising speed and you will have your answer. 

     

    And the Taycan will do 100+% of the EPA rating while the Tesla struggled to even get to 100%.


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    Re: Tesla Roadster

    EnglishManInNY:

    https://insideevs.com/news/441793/videos-tesla-model-3-top-two-pikes-peak/

     

    Just a slight problem, there is no 'winners' in exhibition class. Which is why it is called EXHIBITION in the first place.

    But who cares about the details when an eye catching headline is there. 🤷🏻‍♂️

     


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    Re: Tesla Roadster

    Whoopsy:
    Leawood911:

    Put them side by side down a highway at cruising speed and you will have your answer. 

     

    And the Taycan will do 100+% of the EPA rating while the Tesla struggled to even get to 100%.

    And the range of each is?

    or miles per kWh 

    or miles per $. Take your pick. And do let me know what your point is because it looks like the Taycan is not ahead in the category you selected. Maybe we should talk fit and finish?  


    Re: Tesla Roadster

    Whoopsy:
    EnglishManInNY:

    https://insideevs.com/news/441793/videos-tesla-model-3-top-two-pikes-peak/

     

    Just a slight problem, there is no 'winners' in exhibition class. Which is why it is called EXHIBITION in the first place.

    But who cares about the details when an eye catching headline is there. 🤷🏻‍♂️

     

    You are being too picky Nick and ruining the headlines in all the Tesla sites, all that matters is that they were faster than all the other 5 cars competing in the class, including and F100 truck, a Beetle and a Datdun 240Z indecision


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    ⇒ Carlos - Porsche 991 Carrera GTS

     


    Re: Tesla Roadster

    Leawood911:
    Whoopsy:
    Leawood911:

    Put them side by side down a highway at cruising speed and you will have your answer. 

     

    And the Taycan will do 100+% of the EPA rating while the Tesla struggled to even get to 100%.

    And the range of each is?

    or miles per kWh 

    or miles per $. Take your pick. And do let me know what your point is because it looks like the Taycan is not ahead in the category you selected. Maybe we should talk fit and finish?  

     

    So we can find a sub category that the Tesla can shine?Smiley

    Miles per kWh, cool, that's like comparing mpg right? Do people compare Camry's mpg vs say an S-Class? Pretty sure a Camry goes farther on a tank of gas too than an S-Class if you want to talk about range.

    My statement is pretty self-explanatory. Government rates these things to a number, the Tesla struggle to even match that number but the Porsche literally beats it no matter who is driving the damn thing. Kind of like whatever performance number Porsche published, Average Joe over here can just take his Porsche and match if not beat that number. 

     


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    Re: Tesla Roadster

    https://blog.cheapism.com/coronavirus-pandemic-hurt-car-sales/#slide=2

     

    Tesla occupied #1 and #5 on this dubious list.

    Tesla fans should be happy, they really topped one list this time.smiley


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    Re: Tesla Roadster

     

    The full chronicle of Randy Probst's Model 3 Pikes Peak experience. EuroCars is a fantastic facility, dare I say they would be one of the best bodyshop in the world to repair a car extremely quickly. Especially just before Pikes Peak Sunday Experienced first hand when I was there. 


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    Re: Tesla Roadster

    Whoopsy:
    Leawood911:
    Whoopsy:
    Leawood911:

    Put them side by side down a highway at cruising speed and you will have your answer. 

     

    And the Taycan will do 100+% of the EPA rating while the Tesla struggled to even get to 100%.

    And the range of each is?

    or miles per kWh 

    or miles per $. Take your pick. And do let me know what your point is because it looks like the Taycan is not ahead in the category you selected. Maybe we should talk fit and finish?  

     

    So we can find a sub category that the Tesla can shine?Smiley

    I think there are plenty -  you made the range argument. I don’t think you won it either  

    Miles per kWh, cool, that's like comparing mpg right? Do people compare Camry's mpg vs say an S-Class? Pretty sure a Camry goes farther on a tank of gas too than an S-Class if you want to talk about range.

    They would if the Camry was a second behind the S- class. Silly much?

    My statement is pretty self-explanatory. Government rates these things to a number, the Tesla struggle to even match that number but the Porsche literally beats it no matter who is driving the damn thing. Kind of like whatever performance number Porsche published, Average Joe over here can just take his Porsche and match if not beat that number. 

    Your statements sure explain your thinking, not much else.  There is a nice Car and Driver article which explains EPA testing for EVs and why Tesla is so good at hitting those numbers.  Legally .  It’s cute that you want to make Porsche underestimating their performance their shining star.  You found their outstanding category.  Perfect reason to spend twice as much. 
    BTW the numbers they post for their PDK cars are not as forgiving as they used to be for the manual cars.  
    Lastly- your number for Tesla was <$200 at best last year.  I’m pleased to let you know it’s over $2500 and thereby easily exceeding your expectations.  How has Porsche stock or VW done in the last 12 months?  Is there any point when you give in or do you just live to amuse me?  

     


    Re: Tesla Roadster

    I am not the only one saying Tesla can't hit their rated number, there are numerous owners posting they can't, YouTube videos that proof they can't and magazine articles published that they can't. On the other side of the coin, there are plenty of videos, articles and messages that proof Taycan will exceed their government rated range. This part is not even subjective, it's an objective observation. Nor sure why you want to argue with that.

    As for the stock price number, even to this day I still value the company at no more than $200 a share. It is trading at > 12 times that much. Go ask any traders, considering EVERYTHING, how can one justify the P/E? There is zero logical support for that price level other than emotional support, and it's always a bad bet trading against emotions. 

     


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    Re: Tesla Roadster

    1) when they get fined billions for not hitting their number let me know. It may have more to do with owners having fun and driving fast. In that case no one makes their numbers - gas or other wise.  Are we really discussing this? 
    2) short the stock.   Not sure why you feel the current price makes me more wrong and you more correct but okay. We can either look at the price online or look at your prediction.  I said it was A $1000 stock a long time ago. Seems it went the direction I predicted. Are we to wait until your prediction comes true?  It might eventually but ...  my guess it will spend far more time over $200 than below going forward.  I’m okay with just being right until then.  I will immediately admit you are right when it hits $199!!  And just to be clear $200 is now $40 after the split. Is there any point at which I’m right? Lol. Just being funny, 


    Re: Tesla Roadster

    My 2 cents:
    At the moment Tesla is the only competitive EV on the market. They basically out-class all direct competitors in terms of speed and range. In addition they have the super-charger network - so it’s the only EV that can be used on long-distance trips with some sort of ease of mind. Fortunately for legacy OEMs fit and finish is still not up to par with competition in its price range and their product line up is beginning to look a bit stale. Especially Model S/X need to be replaced soon IMO. The Model 3 I find quite attractive as an overall package, but it just doesn’t look like a €60k car to me. So at the end of the day I would still get an ICE model from one of the established premium manufacturers. 
     


    Re: Tesla Roadster

    Tim:

    My 2 cents:
    At the moment Tesla is the only competitive EV on the market. They basically out-class all direct competitors in terms of speed and range. In addition they have the super-charger network - so it’s the only EV that can be used on long-distance trips with some sort of ease of mind. Fortunately for legacy OEMs fit and finish is still not up to par with competition in its price range and their product line up is beginning to look a bit stale. Especially Model S/X need to be replaced soon IMO. The Model 3 I find quite attractive as an overall package, but it just doesn’t look like a €60k car to me. So at the end of the day I would still get an ICE model from one of the established premium manufacturers.

    Revealed today:

    Skoda Enyaq iV

    (VW ID.4 platform)

    302HP / 82kWh battery / 510Km WLTP  / 125 kW charging speed

    Model Y LR: 505Km WLTP

    Competition is getting fierce in 2020/21. In 5 years noone will remember Tesla cars (in Europe at least).

     

     


    Re: Tesla Roadster

    The Skoda Enyaq iV 80 seems to be a good deal. Big battery and high range for a reasonable price.


    Re: Tesla Roadster

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hWNL6o8_xXs

    .................Lucid Air: 9.91s @ 144Mph
    .....Taycan Turbo S: 10.5s @ 131Mph (Motortrend)
    Model S P100 Perf: 10.5s @ 125Mph (Motortrend)


    Re: Tesla Roadster

    Awesome. Clearly electric performance will dominate very shortly. That is 720s type speed. 
    The previous post is interesting. Which of those cars are currently for sale? I don’t think the Mustang is. 
     


    Re: Tesla Roadster

    Ford said it would be for sale in late 2020.


    Re: Tesla Roadster

    Leawood911:

    Awesome. Clearly electric performance will dominate very shortly. That is 720s type speed. 
    The previous post is interesting. Which of those cars are currently for sale? I don’t think the Mustang is. 
     

    No chance - even the Taycan turbo s feels slower than a 992 turbo s (if driven fast). The future in EV will be focused on better range - not more power. EV is too heavy and inefficient for high performance Smiley


    Re: Tesla Roadster

    Just a counter point.

    I actually think modern EV's range are all good enough. The key is faster charging and denser charging network.

    V12 Ferraris do maybe 200km a tank when driven sportily, that's well short of any EV can do, but no one complaints about the short range. There will always be gas stations within 100km if not closer. And it takes 5 mins to fill up.

    People CAN live with much shorter range for EVs, as long as the charging rate can be close to gas fill up rate and the charging stations are as dense as gas stations. 

    Once fast charging is at that point, onboard battery size can be reduced, less weight over all.


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    Re: Tesla Roadster

    Whoopsy:

    Just a counter point.

    I actually think modern EV's range are all good enough. The key is faster charging and denser charging network.

    Once fast charging is at that point, onboard battery size can be reduced, less weight over all.

    That sounds convincing. The idea regarding trade-off between charging convenience/speed and vehicle weight is very good Smiley


    Re: Tesla Roadster

    Good to see more alternatives coming for those that don't want a Tesla interior or build quality

    https://www.bloomberg.com/news/articles/2020-09-01/polestar-2-review-don-t-buy-a-tesla-model-3-without-driving-this-first


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    ⇒ Carlos - Porsche 991 Carrera GTS


    Re: Tesla Roadster

    MKSGR:
    Leawood911:

    Awesome. Clearly electric performance will dominate very shortly. That is 720s type speed. 
    The previous post is interesting. Which of those cars are currently for sale? I don’t think the Mustang is. 
     

    No chance - even the Taycan turbo s feels slower than a 992 turbo s (if driven fast). The future in EV will be focused on better range - not more power. EV is too heavy and inefficient for high performance Smiley

    Does Porsche ever handicap it’s cars to keep the prices and order in line?  Hmmm

    The point is that the cars like the next gen Tesla roadster or the eventual 911 EV will obliterate our understanding of what is fast. 
     

    For most of us charging speed is fine and the tech will only improve in short time. 


    Re: Tesla Roadster

    Leawood911:
    MKSGR:
    Leawood911:

    Awesome. Clearly electric performance will dominate very shortly. That is 720s type speed. 
    The previous post is interesting. Which of those cars are currently for sale? I don’t think the Mustang is. 
     

    No chance - even the Taycan turbo s feels slower than a 992 turbo s (if driven fast). The future in EV will be focused on better range - not more power. EV is too heavy and inefficient for high performance Smiley

    Does Porsche ever handicap it’s cars to keep the prices and order in line?  Hmmm

    The point is that the cars like the next gen Tesla roadster or the eventual 911 EV will obliterate our understanding of what is fast. 
     

    For most of us charging speed is fine and the tech will only improve in short time. 

     

    Bud, I think so too, but that's not what the general public sees. We are the minority. They will always compare the experience to a normal car, and their tolerance for waiting to 're-fuel' is ~7 mins. That's the average time people stop at a gas station to get gas and stuff.

    Take off the EV googles first and look again. We have been doing home charging and stuff and it's easy, but they have not experience that and all they see is oh, charging a EV takes at least 25mins if not an hour, and there aren't many EV chargers either. 

    infrastructure is the key to EV adoption. Make charging fast and easy and more people will buy them. Plus, battery size in cars can be reduced and less weight carried around, that makes for a more efficient car also. Win-WIn-Win. 


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    Re: Tesla Roadster

    Fully ack from my side. I expect things to change quickly, once the big car makers must sell EVs and because of that must move marketing budget into their promotion, instead of the opposite

     

     


    Re: Tesla Roadster

    There are far more people able to charge like you and me than there are cars and batteries. The ability to charge will magically appear long before we have enough cars to satisfy demand once people catch on.  
    Do check out the benefits of VPP. It actually solves many of the current load problems. Pardon the pun. The point is the more cars with batteries the more likely they will be used to even out peak demand. 
    Charge time are the holy grail.  Chances that charging will take much less time than gas filling is 100%. Just decide how much faster you want it to be. I predict 1000 mile range in 3 minutes in the next 20 years. 
    Anyway, I’m shorting oil. 


    Re: Tesla Roadster

    It's the mentality of the public, not the reality. 

    EVs already showed they can pretty much match a normal car's range most of the time, that's not a problem anymore.

    The infrastructure will always be the bottleneck. Even for charging at home.

    Say you and I are neighbours, we both have 40A chargers at home. You have one and I have say 2 for charging multiple cars together. Our power company is being cheap and those 120A extra on top of both our houses normal consumption exceed our local line limit. What to do? Maybe intelligent chargers that communicate with each other would do the traffic control and alternate usage priority for sharing. 

    What's stopping me from hacking the system and prioritized my chargers over yours? So when you wake up in the morning both my cars are full while yours is stuck at 20%? Or you hacking the system to even ignore my chargers' request for power?

     


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