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    Re: New family SUV orderd...

    mp:

    Christian - congrats on your new SUV. Sounds like a fantastic deal. Much, much cheaper than here in the USA!

    Welcome to my preferred - large, naturally aspirated world. Hope you enjoy it in good health.

    cheers

    Cheaper than in the US? Are you sure (see advertisement)?

    2014-02-20_09-31-40.jpg

     

    Btw: I read yesterday the SUV sales statistics in Germany. To my big surprise, the Jeep Grand Cherokee (all models, incl. Diesels) sells better than the Range Rover, Range Rover Sport, the Mercedes GL, the Mercedes G class and the Audi Q7 in Germany. Surprising.


    --

    RC (Germany) - Rennteam Editor Porsche 991 Turbo S, Porsche Boxster S (981), Jeep Grand Cherokee SRT (2014), BMW X3 35d (2013)


    Re: New family SUV orderd...

    RC:
    Lars997:

    Yep - consumption sucks.

    I checked the fuel by re-filling now couple of times. With an overweight on local/city driving it always have been 18 liters and if going long distance with "normal Autobahn flow around 160-180 km/h" its around 14 liters. Never had the chance going Autobahn on higher speed for longer distance but whenever I was quickly up on 260 km/h it was showing around 30 liters on the display. But for our daily use you have the 18 liters.

    18 liters is "acceptable"...my Cayenne GTS had around 19 l / 100 km. Never seen 30 liters though, at top speed, the fuel consumption was around 22-23 liters (Cayenne GTS).

    Just did 700km mainly German autobahn with my Cayenne S. Last part was quiet and i could drive 200+ km/h consumption 15l /100km. Keep in mind that I had two sleeping kids in the back so I drove smoothly. It's great car for long distances.

     


    --

    2012 Cayenne S White/Espresso 

    Ex: 993 Targa, 986S, 986 and 964 C2


    Re: New family SUV orderd...

    Wow, never got below 18 liters in my GTS and my kids sleep the better, the faster/louder I go. yes My wife always wonders how this is possible. indecision


    --

    RC (Germany) - Rennteam Editor Porsche 991 Turbo S, Porsche Boxster S (981), Jeep Grand Cherokee SRT (2014), BMW X3 35d (2013)


    Re: New family SUV orderd...

    RC:
    mp:

    Christian - congrats on your new SUV. Sounds like a fantastic deal. Much, much cheaper than here in the USA!

    Welcome to my preferred - large, naturally aspirated world. Hope you enjoy it in good health.

    cheers

    Cheaper than in the US? Are you sure (see advertisement)?

    2014-02-20_09-31-40.jpg

     

    Btw: I read yesterday the SUV sales statistics in Germany. To my big surprise, the Jeep Grand Cherokee (all models, incl. Diesels) sells better than the Range Rover, Range Rover Sport, the Mercedes GL, the Mercedes G class and the Audi Q7 in Germany. Surprising.

    Christian - the retail price may be  the same but the lease is probably well over $1,000/mnth with taxes and some required options.  While you mentioned 450 euro, all inclusive. Unless I'm missing something, it looks like you got a good deal. Congrats.

    By the way, how does it compare to your "old" Cayenne GTS?


    Re: New family SUV orderd...

    Compared to the Cayenne GTS? Well...I haven't picked up the car yet (Saturday) but I've test-driven a dealer car.

    The steering feel is very close to the Cayenne Turbo, not as good as the GTS steering feel though. There is a little bit of indirect feel when driving straight(!), the GTS steering felt firmer (and I like it). Steering-in is quite similar to the Cayenne GTS but the GTS had the PDCC, the SRT has an active damper system which seems to "simulate" the PDDC system by stiffening the dampers in curves. Not the same, not as good but there is very little side roll on the SRT. Ride comfort is similar to the GTS but I would call the GTS sportier in curves, the steering just feels a tiny bit more direct. Still, surprisingly sporty for a US SUV.

    The OEM exhaust sound is better than on the Cayenne GTS but not by much. Actually, the sound is very similar but the SRT is a tiny bit louder. Not much difference though. This changes however with the flap exhaust I have on my car, oh boy is this thing loud, amazing.Take the GTS sound, make it a little bit deeper and twice as loud and you have the exhaust sound. Amazing. 

    No other SUV beats the Cayenne regarding the interior look and feel. Not even the SRT. However, the SRT has a very nice interior and quality look & feel is at least at par with the current Mercedes ML and GL. The TFT display speedo is quite unique (I love it) and I actually prefer it over the Cayenne speedo cluster and I cannot even begin to compare the amazing 8.4'' display of the Uconnect system to the Cayenne's PCM system. The Uconnect is feature overkill, the future in car entertainment. The sound system is close to the Burmester in sound quality, much better than the BOSE, 19 speakers and a 12 channel amp, I'm not surprised.

    Overall, I think that Chrysler really put some development work into the 2014 Grand Cherokee but of course only the Diesel sells pretty well over here in Germany. Since Chrysler only officially imports 70 cars or so per model year, not really a problem. You won't see many SRTs driving around in Germany, which is actually a plus for me. 

    As to the lease rate: I forgot to mention the 20k EUR initial payment, without initial payment, the lease rate is around 900 EUR per month. As a comparison: The Cayenne Turbo S I had eyed last week was 2900 EUR per month. Ouch. The lease rate I pay also includes the sport flap exhaust and some other goodies , the monthly lease price is actually 350 EUR (incl. 19% VAT).

    Still thinking about that 7.3 l engine (stroker) upgrade to 557 hp but this means I would need to buy the car after the lease ends. Not sure about it, especially since my dealer expects Chrysler to offer the Hellcat engine in the GC SRT by the MY 2016 (next year around summer). This engine is rumored to produce 620-640 hp. angel

    If my SRT proves to be reliable (this is my only concern), then I might actually switch to the next gen SRT with that monster engine and not go for a Cayenne anymore. For a family car, the price difference is just too much. I realized it when discussing the Cayenne Turbo S last week, I really wanted that car (fully loaded, incl. PCCB) and the lease period was only 29 months, car was immediately available and very fast  but 2900 EUR per month lease rate? I'm not nuts.


    --

    RC (Germany) - Rennteam Editor Porsche 991 Turbo S, Porsche Boxster S (981), Jeep Grand Cherokee SRT (2014), BMW X3 35d (2013)


    Re: New family SUV orderd...

    RC:

    As to the lease rate: I forgot to mention the 20k EUR initial payment, without initial payment, the lease rate is around 900 EUR per month. 


    that is a very important fact!


    Re: New family SUV orderd...

    RC - that was quite a detailed report - thanks.

    As for more power - you sound a bit like me. Never enough HP. I'm so spoiled by motorcycles that it takes a lot for a car to impress me now. I really need to slow down….

    Perhaps adding a supercharger is the easiest/safest way to go?  Edelbrook made one for previous models of the Hemi. Not sure what they offer for the 6.4L?

    Once you break it in, let us know how it runs? Speaking of break-ins, you must be getting tired of the process, with your frequent purchases? 

    Cheers


    Re: New family SUV orderd...

    Superchargers and turbo chargers put too much stress on the drivetrain and engine. The 7.3 l stroker tuning (classic tuning) is the best method to maintain reliability. My dealer has a lot of experience with modded cars, he has done tons of them without any major reliability issues, including cars for off-road racing. Unfortunately this tuning is quite expensive, something around 20k EUR but the performance gain is substantial (0-100 kph in 4.1 seconds, 0-200 kph in 16 seconds). Unfortunately fuel consumption goes up too, so... surprise

    I think I am going to wait for the supercharged version with over 600 hp which is supposed to be available in two or three years. Only if the current car proves to be reliable though.


    --

    RC (Germany) - Rennteam Editor Porsche 991 Turbo S, Porsche Boxster S (981), Jeep Grand Cherokee SRT (2014), BMW X3 35d (2013)


    Re: New family SUV orderd...

    sfo:
    RC:

    As to the lease rate: I forgot to mention the 20k EUR initial payment, without initial payment, the lease rate is around 900 EUR per month. 

     

    that is a very important fact!

    Sorry, I thought I mentioned it. Smiley

    20k EUR initial payment, 350 EUR per month for 36 months and 10k km per year. VAT is included. With the sport exhaust (4200 EUR), the lease rate is 450 EUR per month incl. VAT.

    For comparison: The Cayenne Turbo S is 2900 EUR per month incl. VAT but without initial payment. SRT would be 900 EUR per month without initial payment. Huge difference.

    SRT also has full factory warranty during the whole lease period of three years and an additional year afterwards (good if I want to buy out the car or for the next buyer).

    I could have negotiated a better deal if I wasn't in a hurry but I'm really happy with the dealer, he also updated the car with the latest software and fixes (there have been a couple of service actions this year alone), incl. the latest Uconnect software. They have their own software programmer since they do a lot of conversions and mods, they even asked me if I need a few enhancements like more aggressive shifting or even better throttle response but I want to drive the car like it is for now and if I don't like it, the dealer is open for (almost) everything. This is very unusual for official dealers, this is why I love him. Smiley


    --

    RC (Germany) - Rennteam Editor Porsche 991 Turbo S, Porsche Boxster S (981), Jeep Grand Cherokee SRT (2014), BMW X3 35d (2013)


    Re: New family SUV orderd...

    Congratulations! in Italy the SRT is more expensive around 80k€

    Very nice car


    --

    Mini Clubman  S



    Uploaded with ImageShack.us


    Re: New family SUV orderd...

    mikigta:

    Congratulations! in Italy the SRT is more expensive around 80k€

    Very nice car

    In Germany, the price is similar. However...there is a special offer from Chrysler right now for businesses only and it is basically a 15k(!) EUR price deduction right from the start, without any negotiation. Wonderful. I can imagine they have the same offer in other countries too. This is for an official German 2014 SRT, no grey import or EU import.


    --

    RC (Germany) - Rennteam Editor Porsche 991 Turbo S, Porsche Boxster S (981), Jeep Grand Cherokee SRT (2014), BMW X3 35d (2013)


    Re: New family SUV orderd...

    Looks like a great car and nice deal. Based on that lease arrangement, why would anyone make the initial payment unfront though??


    --
    Off enjoying my car...

    Re: New family SUV orderd...

    TEE:

    Looks like a great car and nice deal. Based on that lease arrangement, why would anyone make the initial payment unfront though??

    I want to keep the monthly rates low, this is a psychological thing. Smiley I don't like it to move through life with high fixed monthly expenses and/or debt. Call me a pussy. Smiley  Smiley

    Car has been leased privately (well, officially for the business to get the deal but I cannot put another car on the business), so it doesn't really matter.


    --

    RC (Germany) - Rennteam Editor Porsche 991 Turbo S, Porsche Boxster S (981), Jeep Grand Cherokee SRT (2014), BMW X3 35d (2013)


    Re: New family SUV orderd...

    With that inital payment my three year leases on my, my wifes and my daughters new Hyundais would be free with enough to cover insurance and taxes for three years and some left for gas - lol - That's two Sonatas and one Elantra - all with XM, Bluetooth, heated seats and Navigation - Yeah, that 20K is a big deal to factor in.

     


    Re: New family SUV orderd...

    kissCongrats RC, the SRT is a great choice!!  

    Porsche and their crazy pricings really are over the top. Great cars but a SUV is a SUV no matter what badg it carries. As thr saying goes, Andere Mütter haben auch schöne Töchter! so i am lookimg forward to your experience with it over time. 

    I would also be curious to know the fuel consumption when cruising round 130 on the highway, cause that' s what we are forced to do here in Switzerland most of the times...


    --

    turbolite


    Re: New family SUV orderd...

    Hi Turbolite. Just had it the other day in Switzerland and was driving from Schaffhausen to Chiasso - long cruise! Consumption went down to 11.5 ltr. But this was then in Eco Mode and cruise control on! On the way back I had 13.5 with a bit traffic jam around Luzern and Zurich. Realistic is 14 on long distance I would say. As we tent to drive  a lot city we always refill on around 18 average.

     


    Re: New family SUV orderd...

    turbolite:

    kissCongrats RC, the SRT is a great choice!!  

    Porsche and their crazy pricings really are over the top. Great cars but a SUV is a SUV no matter what badg it carries. As thr saying goes, Andere Mütter haben auch schöne Töchter! so i am lookimg forward to your experience with it over time. 

    I would also be curious to know the fuel consumption when cruising round 130 on the highway, cause that' s what we are forced to do here in Switzerland most of the times...

    Don't get me wrong: I would have loved to get that Cayenne Turbo S I've been offered and yes, this car plays in a completely different performance league than the SRT, no doubt about it. However, 2000 EUR more per month(!) just for a family car I barely use? No problem with a car like the 991 Turbo S (which is surprisingly cheaper but thats a different story) but for a family truck? I really hesitated but this time, I did NOT ask my wife for advice because last time I did (with the Panamera), I ended up with a car I returned to the lease company after only one year. Smiley

    The SRT is an experiment and Lars is to blame for it (hear it? If something goes wrong...I know where to find you... Smiley). I really like how the car looks and I always wanted a US car with such an engine. I also have to admit that the dealer kind of was the final decision point, I never met such a friendly, flexible, straight-forward and service oriented dealer like this one. Also had checked on him if this is only show to get the car sold but everything he promised, he kept the promise and asking around about him revealed the same good service with other people, so I decided to take the deal. Just one example: The exhaust is hand made and the two guys who manufacture/install it were doing overtime to get it installed in time. Yes, I checked...I was there (was in the neighborhood and just wanted to see if somebody is still there) at 7.30 pm (they usually close the repair shop at 6 pm) and there were still there, my car was up on a lift and they were installing the exhaust. Amazing.

    To make it short: The Cayenne is an amazing product but the Jeep is surprisingly close in my opinion and if Chrysler decides to put a 600+ hp supercharged engine into the next generation, it will be the hell of a competitor. Similar to what the Corvette is to the 911. Only thing is: I can drive a Jeep here, nobody calls me a pimp, they rather would say I didn't have enough money for a Cayenne Smiley but with the Corvette, this is unfortunately a different story.

    Bottom line is: Porsche isn't alone anymore in the performance SUV category and while the ML63, GL63, G63 and X5/X6M came only close to Cayenne performance and fun factor, the SRT already gives the Cayenne S/GTS and maybe even the Turbo a run for it's money and I don't want to know how much the next gen supercharged SRT will change that.

    Exciting times for SUV owners.

    Btw: The Macan is really a nice SUV but luggage room is too small. Compared to the Cayenne, the price tag is highly attractive (especially when comparing the Macan Turbo to the Cayenne GTS/Turbo models) but Porsche needs to be careful here. They are already on the expensive side and if Chrysler and GM are clever, they do not leave this performance SUV segment to Porsche. They would be fools. Chrysler seems to have understood this, not so sure about GM though.

    If Chrysler succeeds in reducing the SRT weight by 150 kg, at the same time adding that supercharged Hellcat engine to it and maybe working on the fuel consumption in the higher speed range, they would have the hell of a competitor. They could even offer some sort of hybrid, which wold make the whole deal even more attractive to buyers. Add a three year warranty (right now they have two years plus two years special offer), make this car under 100k EUR (current SRT has 79k EUR official price tag), offer good lease offers and this car will sell like crazy over here. Once they make a reputation for themselves, it will be a piece of cake.


    --

    RC (Germany) - Rennteam Editor Porsche 991 Turbo S, Porsche Boxster S (981), Jeep Grand Cherokee SRT (2014), BMW X3 35d (2013)


    Re: New family SUV orderd...

    RC, you just want a thumpin V8. indecision First that Mercedes Mustang and now this Jeep SRT. If this Dealers is really smart they will loan you a Factory Five Cobra with a 427 for on a sunny weekend. Then you will justify buying that with the money you saved from getting a Jeep and not a Cayenne Turbo S.   I think the sub plot here is that even for your abilities and passion for Porsche products that Porsche just wants too much money for a fast truck.


    Re: New family SUV orderd...

    RC:

    Guys, say hello to my new ride...Jeep Grand Cherokee SRT8 (German version, 2014).

    Pickup will be next Saturday.

    srt1.jpg

    srt2.jpg


    Let's be blunt: I always liked US SUVs but never really considered getting one in Germany, simply because they lacked in build quality and especially in sportiness.
    When I started to look into the SRT8, based on Lars' recommendation, I stumbled over a used 2012 car at a dealer. That car was nice and build quality was much better than on the luxury Cadillac Escalade (what a crappy build quality this car has) and quite close to the build quality of my wife's X3 35d or even my former X5M.

    When I saw the 2014 car today, I had a shock. I didn't have high expectations but the surprise was huge: This car is at the build quality level of a Mercedes ML or GL. What a surprise. Much better than the 2012 car and better than my wife's X3.

    The dealer had his own SRT8 for a testdrive, so I took it for a spin. Not as direct and sporty as a Cayenne GTS but at least at the same level of a Cayenne Turbo for example. A pretty firm ride, the car feels stiff and sporty but could use a bit more steering feel when driving straight. Otherwise, a wonderful ride.

    I tried the launch control twice and reached a time of 4.6 and 4.7 seconds (from 0-100 kph). This is Cayenne Turbo territory. The 2012 model does 0-100 kph in 5.4 seconds. The new 8 speed automatic really seems to have an impact.

    The whole car is very nice, the front is very aggressive looking with those blacked out front lights and despite the many photos I saw on the internet, even the rear lights are smoke grey, very nice.

    The entertainment system is, in my opinion, the best available in a SUV. Amazing features and the sound of the 19 speaker system is divine (very Burmester-like and worlds ahead of the BOSE I had in the Cayenne GTS).

    I won't even start to mention the many standard features, the black met. paint was the only option, everything else, including seat ventilation or adaptive cruise control, is standard. Also many USB ports available all over the car, the kids love it (iPads, iPhone charging).

    The sound of the V8 is very nice and close to the Cayenne GTS but I decided to go for a special sport exhaust system with flap control. Not cheap but this system gets TÜV (something I don't understand because this thing is super loud but...who cares) and I have a button for the flap control next to the shifter.

    Overall, this car costs me, over a 36 months lease period, a ridiculously low amount of money (Lars, you were right...amazing offer) because Jeep Germany has right now a special discount offer for businesses and another special lease offer. For this kind of money, you cannot even get a naked Cayenne Diesel.

    If the quality is as good as the whole look and feel, this will be a wonderful addition to my car family.

    Driving report with more photos next weekend.

    Holy moly, Christian,

    You don't eff about do you. Congrats, enjoy it..


    --

    throt

    "I Have Done It!".

    GT3 pick up?, when P find a fix..


    Re: New family SUV ordered...

    Lars997:

    My wifes 2010 Range Rover Sport is up for replacement. So we test drove the GL350, X5 3.0d/5.0d, Range Rover Sport 3.0d 292HP, Cayenne Diesel, Jeep SRT).

    How did we rate:

    • GL – to big but driving was really fun. We love the optic (with AMG package) and really had great emotions driving the car. Almost bought it but the dealer was not able to make the right offer. He came back after the weekend but then we had the doubs regarding the size.... bad for him!
    • new X5 – to boring, dont misunderstand, from the technology and feel a perfect car, but also just another BMW – nothing special about and you will see it on every corner sooner or later
    • RRS – great exterior but  inside zero emotions on test drive. The interior is boring and lots of things just been reduced to cost efficiency instead driver experience. I would have been ok with it but my wife just hated it (and she was the one which must had the last RRS - because she loves RR!).
    • Cayenne –  great from emotions. Good looking interieur/exterieur. Normal Diesel would have been all we needed (the S was not available for testing). But - 5 months after delivery there will be a huge facelift (Autumn 2014) which is a killer arguement for me.  
    • Jeep SRT – The SRT got our attention during a vacation in the US. The neighbor of our friends had one and we instantly like the design of the car. After returning home we made an test drive and loved the ride - it sits and feels on the streat like a sports car and not like an SUV. The seats have been the best of all contestants and the stereo just want to let you stay in the car forever. I dont have to say anything about the engine - the car kicks insane - but that was not what we have been looking for... but sure - adds a lot of emotions. 

    How did we decide - we ordered an SRT. Why - emotions. It just felt so good on the street and you will hardly find any of these cars on the street (only 70 will make it to Germany) Obviously it doesn't fit the contestant group - we should have compared the SRT with an Cayenne Turbo, AMG GL63 or X5-M - but from the total cost level it goes exactly into this group (lease, fuel, inspection and insurance costs). 

    So - that's the first US car we will have. I hope I will not regret but its a toy and more or less my wife's car. The car is due to delivery in beginning of 2014 - will send pictures asap after we having it.

    That's the color she choosen "SRT redline" - interior will be Sepia leather

    You too, Lars. Congrats. Roll on pick up.


    --

    throt

    "I Have Done It!".

    GT3 pick up?, when P find a fix..


    Re: New family SUV orderd...

    Wow!! I had no idea, congrats!!!.  Your Porsche dealer must be pissed off Smiley


    --
    Happy Driving

    Re: New family SUV orderd...

    Ron (Houston):

    Wow!! I had no idea, congrats!!!.  Your Porsche dealer must be pissed off Smiley

    No, he isn't. I have a 991 Turbo S and a 981 S from him, this is more than the average customer. Smiley

    Here are two photos from today's pickup.

    First one shows the surprise the dealer prepared when we picked up the car and the second one is a photo of a friend who we went to lunch with to celebrate the new car (maybe someone recognizes the car Smiley Smiley). I can tell you that my car sounded much better (and louder) than his. Smiley

    srtpu2.jpg

    1393112916272x5m.jpg

     


    --

    RC (Germany) - Rennteam Editor Porsche 991 Turbo S, Porsche Boxster S (981), Jeep Grand Cherokee SRT (2014), BMW X3 35d (2013)


    Re: New family SUV orderd...

    Congrats very nice looking SUV - but sounding better than an M5 isnt a virtue ;)


    Re: New family SUV orderd...

    hunterone:

    Congrats very nice looking SUV - but sounding better than an M5 isnt a virtue ;)

    M5? Smiley


    --

    RC (Germany) - Rennteam Editor Porsche 991 Turbo S, Porsche Boxster S (981), Jeep Grand Cherokee SRT (2014), BMW X3 35d (2013)


    Re: New family SUV orderd...

    X5M Typo ;)


    Re: New family SUV orderd...

    Christian, congratulation - nice car!


    --

    AM
    www.aldo-yachting.de


    Re: New family SUV orderd...

    Very nice. Was looking at a local offer here in Dubai 6 months back. Very good price, but based upon the "old" version with the 5 speed automatic, so not interested. 

    Enjoy it !!!


    Re: New family SUV orderd...

    Lars997:

    Hi Turbolite. Just had it the other day in Switzerland and was driving from Schaffhausen to Chiasso - long cruise! Consumption went down to 11.5 ltr. But this was then in Eco Mode and cruise control on! On the way back I had 13.5 with a bit traffic jam around Luzern and Zurich. Realistic is 14 on long distance I would say. As we tent to drive  a lot city we always refill on around 18 average.

     

    Hi Lars, thanks fot the information!

    in fact it is how i thought and that is that if you tread carefully the consumption of this car is absolutely reasonable for its size. Obviously at higher speeds at which you cruise with in Germany the aerodynamics simply cause an exponential increase of  the consumption, but that will not happen in Switzerland. We have the mountain twisties for fun though..Smiley


    --

    turbolite


    Re: New family SUV orderd...

    @Lars & RC deal: 20k EUR initial payment, 350 EUR per month for 36 months and 10k km per year. VAT is included. With the sport exhaust (4200 EUR), the lease rate is 450 EUR per month incl. VAT.
     
    This deal sounds really excellent! 
    Just checked on the website for deals here in Switzerland and as far as i can see it looks like this: get a demonstrator for chf 86k instead of 99k new price and do the leasing with jeep (fiat finance). With a downpayment of chf 25k (approx 20k eur) , 10000km and 36 months lease period the monthly payment is chf 1000. That's more than double than your lease rate!!  Maybe it would look different if offered directly thru the dealer, but i am sure that it will come nowhere close to your solution, so enjoy it  and congrats again on your SRTs! 

    --

    turbolite


    Re: New family SUV orderd...

    Congrats Christian, very nice choice Smiley

    J.Seven


    --

    J.Seven


     
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