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    Cayenne Vibration

    Has anyone else noticed a vibration problem?
    I didn't see anyone mention this from a search query so maybe it's just my vehicle.
    My S is brand new, only about 400 miles w/ the standard 18" M & S Conti's. Today, for the first time, my wife drove me to try the vehicle out for herself (she has a X5). To be honest, I had noticed that the vehicle vibrated every now and then but I didn't think much of it. Maybe I was just trying to convince myself it wasn't there. However, tonight when my wife drove me, I was stunned by the amount of vibration there was on the highway while in the passenger seat. I can only conclude that since I wasn't concentrating on driving the vibration just became more apparent. When I questioned my wife, she too said that she felt the vibration every now and then. Anyhow, I'd say we going about 75mph and the road was fairly smooth. What's more, the vibration is inconsistent. Meaning, it comes and goes without any real reason. Sometimes it's there and sometimes it's not. Looking back, I know that I've experienced it while driving as low as 50-mph +/-.
    One other thing, at lower speeds like about 40-45 mph or so, I occasionally get a very loud low frequency hum in the cabin. Any thoughts? BTW, I'm use to a loud cabin too. I've owned a Range Rover, two Discovery's and a D-90 so I know road/tire noise and that's not what I'm talking about.

    Re: Cayenne Vibration

    I have heard of a vibration caused by the cardan shaft. That sounds like it could be the cause of the low frequency hum at lower speeds you describe. For the higher speed vibration, I have read of others experiencing this condition but do not know of any specific solution. Have you taken it to the dealer? I would take it there and have them fix it and then report to us what they did. I would suspect suspension components and/or tire balancing. Certainly not all Cayennes have this condition.

    Re: Cayenne Vibration

    Are you with Holberts ? email me, mudditt@comcast.net

    Re: Cayenne Vibration

    Quote:
    rdc111 said:
    Has anyone else noticed a vibration problem?




    As Gary said before, there seems to be a cardan shaft problem on some Cayenne. To my knowledge all Cayenne after the christmas holiday break (starting beginning of january 2004) get an overworked cardan shaft.
    It doesn't seem to be a very common problem but it seems to appear on certain cars. A new cardan shaft version seems already available through parts department.
    But let your dealer first check the tires/rims but because it comes and goes, I suspect the cardan shaft.

    Re: Cayenne Vibration

    I reported the problems to the dealer today. The service manager then told me that he has never heard these problems described before, and that since they're intermittent, there won't be any work done if the symptoms can not be reproduced. Secondly, I had mentioned the cardan shaft as a possible culprit and was told that he (the service advisor) has never heard that term or part before.
    Also, I complained (politely) about the condensation in the headlamp covers and the lurching problem. Again, problems the service advisor never heard of before!
    I'm not holding out much hope here. Sigh......

    Re: Cayenne Vibration

    Maybe you were too polite?
    But I understand you very well, I had my problems with service people too in the past. Thanks god, my Porsche mechanic is a pretty open minded guy and he's always open to suggestions and calling Porsche directly to ask.

    My advise (maybe some people have better ones): go back to your dealer after a few days and tell him that the vibrations are intolerable on such an expensive car. Be upset, show it.
    Then tell them that if they don't do something about it (including the lurching if you really have this problem), you'll contact PCNA by yourself. And this is exactly what you should do. My experience has been always that talking to dealers is OK but if they don't want to help (or aren't capable of helping ), you should go one step up.
    If PCNA is involved, things might move a little bit faster.
    We're talking about a Porsche and not a Yugo.

    Re: Cayenne Vibration

    I have the same problem and am battling Porsche over the noise. I even took the service rep for a ride in another Cayenne off the lot and it had the same vibration. Mine starts at 43 mph and stops at about 54 mph. I am currently waiting to here back from the regional Porsche rep on Jan 5.
    Porsche knows about the problem and they "claim" that my Vin number has the "fix". We'll obviously its not fixed. Roll up all the windows and drive on a chip sealed asphalt road and you'll really notice it.

    Re: Cayenne Vibration

    I have had hints from other message boards that this is a problem with all. As you might have noted in my comment above, they are aware of the problem on previous Vin numbers and have "fixed" the problem on newer Vin #'s. I will provide more info after the Porsche Service Manager gets back to me on the 5th. By the way, I put on new snow tires recommended by Porsche and still the noise exists. The dealer and my tire dealer "ground force" balanced the tires and still the noise and vibration exists.

    Re: Cayenne Vibration

    I'm with you 100% on this one Kramer. I've narrowed down the noise to just about your referenced area too. It's particularly loud around 50 to 55mph if I'm light on the gas and then lightly add pressure to the gas pedal.
    I took the service manager for a ride yesterday to illustrate the problem. To my surprise he acknowledge the problem too. He told me that he would first check the wheels and tires. If that fails (which we both know it will) he will then call Porsche for help.
    I have an open appointment sometime next week to resolve other issues but since we're waiting on parts that may be pushed back. Let me know how things go with you.
    BTW, my auto is one-week-old w/ 700 miles and the "Service due in 3000 miles" warning came on this morning. Go figure.
    I've owned a lot of cars/trucks in my time (20 +/-) and I'm so disappointed with this vehicle that this will probably be my last Porsche.

    Re: Cayenne Vibration

    Quote:
    RDC111 said:
    I've owned a lot of cars/trucks in my time (20 +/-) and I'm so disappointed with this vehicle that this will probably be my last Porsche.




    Give them a chance to fix the problems. The main problem with Porsche is...their dealers! You can't sell a truck for almost 100000 bucks and then expect the customer to come several times to the dealership to get a problem fixed. This is no way how to treat customers of a Porsche.

    I really don't get it: for more than 4 years now I make complaints about dealers and their handling of problems. Isn't Porsche capable of training the dealers to treat customers as VIPs? C'mon, we're talking about a Porsche and not a Saturn.
    Maybe Porsche should start putting pressure on dealers, maybe they should send "control" customers (Porsche officials who test dealers and mechanics), maybe they should send independent questionaires to customers (not through dealers!). I also never liked the fact that Porsche called my dealer when I made complaints about him. Porsche should be aware that the customer sometimes depends on the dealer and if they tell the dealer that the customer called and made complaints, I'm sure the dealer won't be very pleased, resulting in a pretty bad dealer-customer relationship in the future.
    Dealers and their mechanics are (still) the main problem in my eyes. As long as Porsche doesn't take care of a high quality standard at dealerships, the customer won't be satisfied.

    That said, you should start talking to Porsche (PCNA) directly and tell them exactly what you said here: that it'll be probably your last Porsche. I'm pretty sure they'll do anything to satisfy you.

    Re: Cayenne Vibration

    I hear you RC, but I'm not certain this is a Dealer issue with me at this point. I'm beginning to believe that my problems are design issues with Porsche itself. I also believe that most, if not all, Cayenne's exhibit the same issues that I have but not everyone is as sensitive to them. I have about 750,000 miles under my belt so rightly or wrongly I'm pretty quick to judge. Personally, I believe these were inadequately tested and/or designed.
    With everyone's claim that VW footed the lion share of the development bill, Porsches' only boost over the Touareg is its drive train, suspension and brakes. The brakes are without doubt superior to any SUV on any level, period. Score one for Porsche. The suspension is not bad at all but I'll need to take it off road and go though snow before I judge it fully. I've always found that off-road worthiness is directly equated to snow worthiness. However, my initial impression is that it is designed more for the highway. Which is fine for some and not so fine for others. Last, the drive train. The engine is nice (even if it might be mostly Audi ). I haven't had the chance to put the transfer case to the task so I can't judge that. There is however a problem somewhere in getting the power to the wheels in a smooth quiet fashion. Whether it's the transmission, drive shafts or other components, I don't know. But, I do know it's a problem and that is unexcitable from a design point particularly when Porsche is suppose to be the best in the business at doing this.
    It would be hard for me to believe that Porsche is unaware of the problems. If that's true, Porsche is clearly betting that most people won't complain. That being said, it would also appear that Porsche is no better that Ford, GM or Chrysler in putting out a product that it knows has faults. I see no reason to reward Porsche with future purchases with this current effort.
    Sometimes I don't know why I'm being so hard on it? Well, yes I do. Admittedly, I'm "type A", anal retentive and a little on the excessive compulsive side. You know, a guy who doesn't understand why things aren't right. Maybe my next session with the shrink we'll delve into it.

    Re: Cayenne Vibration

    Mine does not vibrate at all. Not on the summer tires, nor on the snow tires.

    Re: Cayenne Vibration

    RC,

    You are absolutely right about their dealerships!!!! I also own a 993 C4S and I took it in for an alignment. They told me they couldn't align the car due to a nut that was frozen on the suspension part. I said "okay" but save the part so I can inspect it. When I went to pick up the car, the Service Manager who had been their since at least my first Porsche in '72, handed me the rusted suspension part, (excuse me I don't know my suspension parts very well). The part was rusty and DRY with no sign of any penetrating oil. He said they did try the oil, as he looked me in the eye??!! I told him I would take it back to my shop (I have a fleet of over 35 trucks and tons of equipment) and try for myself. Sure enough, after three minutes the nut came loose! Needless to say I recieved credit. I have owned Porsches for 24 years and I usually use an independent mechanic for those reasons. I have also owned several Acura and Infiniti automobiles and I can say with out any doubt there service is the best although I only used the warranty once while owning three of there cars!

    Regards,
    Mark

    Re: Cayenne Vibration

    Quote:
    With everyone's claim that VW footed the lion share of the development bill, Porsches' only boost over the Touareg is its drive train, suspension and brakes.



    VW footed the bill, yes. Porsche did most of the development of the platform. The only part VW developed was the transmission which may shed some light on the downshifting/lurching problem. Hmmm ... I wonder if the transmission development included the driveshaft?

    Re: Cayenne Vibration

    Quote:
    GM Austin said:
    Porsche did most of the development of the platform



    Gary, you read too much "official" Porsche literature.
    You still believe that story that VW paid Porsche to develop the Touareg? Almost 50(!) VW engineers worked at Weissach during development, I bet they only "learned" from Porsche.

    Re: Cayenne Vibration

    Out of 187

    Re: Cayenne Vibration

    Quote:
    Mick said:
    Out of 187



    I think you didn't get the point, Mick.

    Re: Cayenne Vibration

    I think this thread contains multiple issues, for clarity, if you FEEL a vibration it may be but mostly likely WILL NOT BE the Cardan Shaft, which presents itself as a low frequency "sound" between 40mph and 60 mph from the first day you had your car due to a soft bearing. It impacts most 03's and a small number of early 04's both S and TT.

    Dealers cannot rely on VIN to identify your vehicle, they have to look at the stamped part number in each case as remaining 03 parts were used to keep production running.

    If the vibration is over 60mph then it is most likely a tire/suspension/tracking issue, remember that some peppers left the factory with tracking issues.

    I think we need to make sure these do not get lumped together ( apart from those who only wish to vent about Porsche rather than be constructive about getting solutions to these problems).

    I for one would like solutions not BS. Mine goes in Wednesday.

    Re: Cayenne Vibration

    Also for clarity, my 04 S was an April build, I took delivery in June and posted my first question on the issue in June.

    Apart from that I have experienced no vibration over its 9800 miles all the way up to 135mph.

    Re: Cayenne Vibration

    The main Cayenne/Touareg development took place at Hemmingen.

    Re: Cayenne Vibration

    Quote:
    Mick said:
    ...apart from those who only wish to vent about Porsche rather than be constructive about getting solutions to these problems



    I can't help but I somehow get the feeling that you have some problems with the fact that you bought a re-badged Volkswagen? Just wondering...
    C'mon, Mick...I owned 4 Porsche sports cars(!) before my first Porsche truck, so please spare me with your exaggerated enthusiasm. I just can't wait to get my Cayenne Turbo but I also keep my eyes and ears open and try to see through marketing talk and advertisement.
    I for myself couldn't care less if the Cayenne is developped by Porsche, VW, Mercedes or ACME but we're here to discuss the Cayenne and for people who like to show off their trucks and praise them at the best on this planet (which they just aren't...just look at the lurching and cardan shaft issues), there are other forums on the internet.
    I'm 180 km away from Zuffenhausen and maybe you should grant me the right that I (sometimes ) know what I'm talking about.
    Porsche makes great cars, no doubt about it but we shouldn't be blind.

    Re: Cayenne Vibration

    RC.

    I did not buy a "Porsche" I bought the best truck available after looking around to replace my ML430.

    This is my first experience with Porsche, I carry no baggage all I care about is getting the best out of my truck.

    The problems discussed still only account for about 3% of my enjoyment, 97% I am well pleased.

    It could be that your opinion will change when you get your TT.

    I am dealing with the problems on a day to day basis, which is why my frustration may appear with debate about who does what to whom in the international car business.

    Believe me had the T-Reg been the better vehicle I would have had no hesitation buying it, sames goes for the X5, FX45, Ford Explorer etc.

    Based on my experience with the Cayenne, I like what Porsche is doing, its a great entry into the more general market and its already having an impact i.e making the comptetition get better so that we, the consumer, wins.
    BMW and MB have already altered their product plans to compete.

    So we come from different angles, nothing wrong with that.

    Re: Cayenne Vibration

    Just heard from the Porsche service manager who talked to the Porsche district rep. They are going to order a new shaft and "a special centering tool". He also said "if that doesn't fix the problem they can't do anything more". I will advise as this soap opera continues.

    Mk

    Re: Cayenne Vibration

    Quote:
    Mick said:
    It could be that your opinion will change when you get your TT.




    Mick, I drove a Cayenne TT when most people in the US didn't even know what a Cayenne is.
    I know the Cayenne, I drove the V6, S and TT and I think it is a great SUV, especially compared to my ML55. No doubt about it, Porsche and VW did a great job regarding the technical part of the Cayenne.
    But...this doesn't mean there aren't glitches and question marks...
    I still find the Cayenne to be one of the ugliest SUVs on the market. I heard a rumor that Murkett wanted something more spectacular but Lagaay and some Porsche bosses were afraid of their traditional customers who might not accept a fresh design. So the Cayenne became a technical masterpiece but an exterior design catastrophy. The front of the Cayenne TT is somehow acceptable because it has more accentuated air inlets incl. the power domes which make it look SUV like from the front. The rear of the Cayenne is...it is hard to find the words... I understand the look for the front, it is Porsche-like, even if my wife calls it a 911 caricature. But where does the rear come from, it doesn't have ANYTHING to do with Porsche. The rear lights should have been designed differently.
    Did you ever see a VW Touareg by night with the rear lights on? A beauty. And even if the front looks like a supped up Passat (I'm not sure you guys in the US know the VW Passat, the most "beloved" VW in Germany besides the Golf), it looks nice. And it is funny: I go to my dealer and meet customers intested in buying the Cayenne and nobody really likes how it looks. But people buy it and I bought one too. Are we all crazy or even stupid? Nope. The Cayenne is a great SUV and may I say it might be even the best available SUV on the market, especially if I don't take the VW Touareg V10 Diesel in consideration. But is it enough? Are people willing to make a compromise and go for the technical part instead of the design part? I doubt it. I'm afraid the Cayenne "hype" will slow down because most buyers don't appreciate the technical part but went mostly for a Cayenne because it is a Porsche.

    Did you see the new Mercedes SLK? Especially the new SLK 55 AMG? Not only does it look like a baby SLR but it also has been improved substantially. Now imagine how the new Mercedes ML will be alike when it comes out 2005.
    Mercedes has much more technical resources than Porsche and VW together, they are capable of making a hell of a product. And this is when Porsche starts to be in trouble with the Cayenne. I know that til then, they might have cashed in substantially and made a good profit with the Cayenne. But what comes after? Is Porsche capable of outrunning Mercedes with their new ML? Does Porsche have the resources to keep track with Mercedes, even with VW's help? I'm afraid that Porsche will be sooner or later another VW company because they don't have the resources to keep up with the market. They could have done it with their sports cars but I'm not sure they can compete on different "fronts". A fourth model would make things even more difficult.

    That said, I hope I'm wrong. Unfortunately I predicted Porsche's steps pretty good over the past few years.
    Dr. Wiedeking is trapped in his own success story.

    Re: Cayenne Vibration

    RC

    I am not really sure where your coming from, all I meant was that when you are living and breathing with your TT you will be more about solutions to problems than whether Porsche is right or wrong, because in the great scheme of things nothing we say will impact what they do or what happens to them.

    As far as the looks thing is concerned, who cares ! thats all subjective anyway, I have not had one person say "wow thats an ugly car" but I have had LOTS of people stop me and say "wow what a great looking car" so go figure.

    Looks are only skin deep, right.

    Re: Cayenne Vibration

    Quote:
    Mick said:
    As far as the looks thing is concerned, who cares ! thats all subjective anyway, I have not had one person say "wow thats an ugly car" but I have had LOTS of people stop me and say "wow what a great looking car" so go figure.




    This is because the Cayenne is a Porsche, because people in the US view a Porsche like something very special and because the Cayenne looks like a supped up 911, especially from the front. And you don't seriously expect somebody to come over to you and tell you how "ugly" your car is, don't you? )

    In Germany and even Europe, things are a little bit different.
    We have lots of 911 driving around and especially in Germany, you see a 911 at almost every corner. It became like the Mercedes SL the "Volkswagen" sports car of the wealthy.
    The Cayenne is a different story, people don't seem to like the idea of a Porsche SUV, especially not "traditional" buyers.
    This is why Porsche actually designed the Cayenne especially for the US market. This is what happened with the 928 too, it was supposed to be the 911 successor. A great success in the US, german sales slowed down and 911 sales went surprisingly up (guess why... ). Finally, they had to stop 928 production.
    Don't forget that although the US is the largest market for Porsche, Germany comes on 2nd place. So if the german market doesn't "accept" a model, Porsche is in trouble.

    I'm just afraid that the whole Cayenne "hype" will stop at a moment and I'm afraid it already begun.
    Personally, I don't care much but I'm worried about Porsche's future. They need money to build good sports cars...

    I agree that as soon as I have my Cayenne TT, I'll be able to find out for myself what the glitches are and where to appreciate the TT. I only hope that most of the problems from the first production year are wiped out. I spent almost every week with my first 996 (one of the first cars produced back in 1997) at the dealership and I don't want that to happen again.

    Re: Cayenne Vibration

    Interesting point of view.

    We had better by lots of them then

    Re: Cayenne Vibration

    Got a new Carden Shaft and the noise went away. Just imagine that! The dealer tried their best to convince me it was a "characteristic" of the Cayenne. Much more fun now!
    and a much nicer ride. Thanks for your insights.

    Regards,
    MK



     
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