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    Re: NISSAN GT-R vs REAL LIFE?!?!

    rhino:
    Yes Crash the Rennteamers were worried. Welcome back!      Smiley
    Hi Rhino! Thanks for the welcome!Smiley

    Re: NISSAN GT-R vs REAL LIFE?!?!

    Crash: Welcome too.

    But I do wonder how you made it to 98% Activity if you were gone ;-)


    Re: NISSAN GT-R vs REAL LIFE?!?!

    Eunice:

    Crash: Welcome too.

    But I do wonder how you made it to 98% Activity if you were gone ;-)

    Magic, EuniceSmiley. In any case, good job on the new Rennteam interfaceSmiley.

    Re: NISSAN GT-R vs REAL LIFE?!?!

    Notwithstanding DRs excellent comparison, the debate about the exact GTR Ring time looks set to continue. It's snowing in the Eifel and we can't race so talking is good. Smiley

    One problem for Porsche with the DR comparison is that the GTR is not being compared to its natural competitor the Turbo but to the mighty GT2. Another problem for Porsche is that to beat the GTR the facelift Turbo would have to get too close to the GT2. Porsche marketing would not be happy with this.

    In the meantime Nissan is upgrading the GTR suspension and tires in preparation for faster Ring times in 2009 (hopefully Nissan will invite an independent authority to monitor their next NBR time attack so we don't have to spend another year discussing the next factory claim).

    While all this may not be good news for Porsche it is great for consumers. All sports car enthusiasts should be grateful to Nissan for shaking up the status quo and spurring more competition.

     

    And Porsche fans can take some comfort in knowing that while the GTR may get close the GT2 lap times, Nissan will never be the brand of choice for discerning international men of mystery. Smiley





    Re: NISSAN GT-R vs REAL LIFE?!?!

    to my knowledge no. Lot of conjecture on the GTR forums about the Dunlops being superior, but no supporting lap times. I would be surprised if there will be any tangible differences shown
    --

    track vid

    0-300kph

    chasing a 997GT2




    Re: NISSAN GT-R vs REAL LIFE?!?!

    MKSGR:
    eclou:
    Crash:
    How do The N0-rated MPSC tyres on the GT2 compare against the Bidgestones, worn by the GT-R, when it comes to the damp test conditions? Would the GT-R in fact be quicker with the Dunlops or not?
    Crash, a few folks in the US have tested the softness of the Bridgestone RE70R on a new GTR with a durometer. The results showed it to be about as soft as a Nitto NT01 or Toyo R888, which are not quite as soft as a Michelin Cup. The N spec Michelin Cups or "Cup+" tires are not quite as soft as a non-N spec Cup, which would suggest that the Cup+ and Bridgestone are about on par. The quick wear rate of the Bridgestones (<5k mile lifespan) also suggests the RE70R is essentially an R-compound tire.

    --

    track vid

    0-300kph

    chasing a 997GT2



    Do you know by chance whether any independant comparison of the Bridgestone and the Dunlop tires were done so far?

    I don't think so. We just have this from Nissan:

     

    Cornered at the Paris Auto Show, Nissan’s European spokesman Neil Reeve said “Quite simply we’re not going to get into a war of words with Porsche.” And then did exactly that. “The final word from us is that it was done on absolutely standard tyres which are available to customers in the showroom. They’re not trick tyres – absolutely standard tyres, normal road tyres. The GT-R comes with Bridgestone and Goodyear (Dunlop). One tyre gives slightly better times around the ‘Ring. We did it on Dunlop. They’re available with the car.” When car.com.au’s Andrew Heasley pushed him for an explanation, well, read between the lines. “We absolutely maintain (that) Tochio Suzuki - the chief test driver on the GT-R program pounded thousands of laps - he got to know every inch of Nurburgring (circuit) and how the car performs on the Nurburgring and hence set that fabulous lap. More than that, I can’t speculate. I can’t explain why they couldn’t match the time.” 


    --


    Re: NISSAN GT-R vs REAL LIFE?!?!

    AUM it is a standard on the GTR but don't try to pretend that the RE70R is like a regular street tire. The durometer does not lie. The <5k treadlife does not lie. Looking up the availability of the RE70R shows it to be manufactured only in the sizes for the GTR.  It is not the same as the RE70.
    --

    track vid

    0-300kph

    chasing a 997GT2




    Re: NISSAN GT-R vs REAL LIFE?!?!

    eclou:
    AUM it is a standard on the GTR but don't try to pretend that the RE70R is like a regular street tire. The durometer does not lie. The <5k treadlife does not lie. Looking up the availability of the RE70R shows it to be manufactured only in the sizes for the GTR.  It is not the same as the RE70.
    --

    track vid

    0-300kph

    chasing a 997GT2



    Here is a link to another forum that has many pages on this topic. After reading all that, I have nothing left to add! 

    http://www.pistonheads.com/gassing/topic.asp?h=0&f=48&t=605408&i=100 

    Here is a sample:

    T.Suzuki's capability in the GT-R is unmatched and certainly will never be tested by drivers who have never driven anything as dynamically unique as the GT-R.

    When was the last time W.Rorhl or Wolfgang drove an ATTESSA platformed AWD car with a 600lb engine over the front axle and a 350lb gearbox over the rear axle?

    I'll tell you: Never.

    Nissan understands this situation completely. For the Nurburgring press intro to the GT-R last year they had called in a group of drivers for the purpose of taking the less experienced press for a lap around the nurb. During their time there these drivers produced lap times of 7:44 upwards with most coming in at 7:55 to 7:58 and some as low as 8:13.

    Suzuki, being the primary test driver, is the only one capable of driving the GT-R to it's real limit.
    --


    Re: NISSAN GT-R vs REAL LIFE?!?!

    Crash:
    rhino:
    Yes Crash the Rennteamers were worried. Welcome back!      Smiley
    Hi Rhino! Thanks for the welcome!Smiley

    I was worried... Great to see you back!Smiley

    BTW, you moved to SlovakiaSmiley?


    Re: NISSAN GT-R vs REAL LIFE?!?!

    KresoF1:
    Crash:
    rhino:
    Yes Crash the Rennteamers were worried. Welcome back!      Smiley
    Hi Rhino! Thanks for the welcome!Smiley

    I was worried... Great to see you back!Smiley

    BTW, you moved to SlovakiaSmiley?

     Hey Krešo!

    Good to speak to you as well! No, I didn´t move to Slovakia. It´s more of an inside jokeSmiley. I might change it back, so as not to cause undue confusion.



    Re: NISSAN GT-R vs REAL LIFE?!?!

    AUM,

     any professional driver (like WR) should be able to drive even a Skoda, MC12, and Prius back to back and  extract 99.9% of the performance potential within a few minutes. That's why they are called pros.


    --

    track vid

    0-300kph

    chasing a 997GT2




    Re: NISSAN GT-R vs REAL LIFE?!?!

    eclou:

    AUM,

     any professional driver (like WR) should be able to drive even a Skoda, MC12, and Prius back to back and  extract 99.9% of the performance potential within a few minutes. That's why they are called pros.


    --




    Exactly right!  Smiley

    It's a sure sign that you have run out of real arguments when you are so desperate that you are reduced to quoting posts from another forum which happen to support your own views.  SmileySmiley


    --
    fritz

    Re: NISSAN GT-R vs REAL LIFE?!?!

    fritz:
    eclou:

    AUM,

     any professional driver (like WR) should be able to drive even a Skoda, MC12, and Prius back to back and  extract 99.9% of the performance potential within a few minutes. That's why they are called pros.


    --




    Exactly right!  Smiley

    It's a sure sign that you have run out of real arguments when you are so desperate that you are reduced to quoting posts from another forum which happen to support your own views.  SmileySmiley


    --
    fritz
    My views are agnostic and I have nothing more to add. This topic has been beaten to death.
    --


    Re: NISSAN GT-R vs REAL LIFE?!?!

    fritz:
    eclou:

    AUM,

     any professional driver (like WR) should be able to drive even a Skoda, MC12, and Prius back to back and  extract 99.9% of the performance potential within a few minutes. That's why they are called pros.


    --




    Exactly right!  Smiley

    It's a sure sign that you have run out of real arguments when you are so desperate that you are reduced to quoting posts from another forum which happen to support your own views.  SmileySmiley


    --
    fritz
     My opinion after driving the GTR on a track and considering all the pros and cons is that there is no evidence of Nissan cheating. I would be surprised if anyone else can match Suzuki's time since the GTR was developed around his driving style and it took him thousands of laps to get the perfect lap. And I really have nothing more to add. Smiley
    --


    Re: NISSAN GT-R vs REAL LIFE?!?!

    AUM:

     

    It's a sure sign that you have run out of real arguments when you are so desperate that you are reduced to quoting posts from another forum which happen to support your own views.  SmileySmiley


    --
    fritz
     My opinion after driving the GTR on a track and considering all the pros and cons is that there is no evidence of Nissan cheating. I would be surprised if anyone else can match Suzuki's time since the GTR was developed around his driving style and it took him thousands of laps to get the perfect lap. And I really have nothing more to add. Smiley
    --


    I thought agnostics were supposed to be people who didn't have such incisive opinions?   Smiley Smiley

    So if the GT-R has been exclusively tailored to Tochio Suzuki's driving style and still took him thousands of laps to get its ultimate performance out of it, why should anyone else ever want to buy it? Smiley

     

    PS: I agree that this topic has been flogged to death. Maybe now we won't hear anymore about it until the Auto Sport Supertest report is published in the spring. Smiley

    But I doubt it somehow. Smiley


    --
    fritz

    Re: NISSAN GT-R vs REAL LIFE?!?!

    5 seconds on the Ring is about 1% of a 7.30 lap. 20 seconds is just a 4% margin. We see bigger margins between the identical cars in A1GP.

    Any average tracker can drive the GTR very fast. Any pro can drive the GTR near its limit (within 5%). But to drive at the absolute limit is something else. 

     


    --


    Re: NISSAN GT-R vs REAL LIFE?!?!

    AUM:

    Suzuki, being the primary test driver, is the only one capable of driving the GT-R to it's real limit.
    --


    Now that is simply nonesense in my view Smiley 


    --
    Off enjoying my car...

    Re: NISSAN GT-R vs REAL LIFE?!?!

    TEE1:
    AUM:

    Suzuki, being the primary test driver, is the only one capable of driving the GT-R to it's real limit.
    --


    Now that is simply nonesense in my view Smiley


    --
    Off enjoying my car...

    We all need a driving lesson when it comes to the GTR because of its sophisticated DSG box + 4wd system


    --
    Oh Scheiße!

    Re: NISSAN GT-R vs REAL LIFE?!?!

    And WR  seems to be the only driver capable of extracting the full potential of the 997 Turbo. 7.38 WR vs 7.54 for HvS
    --


    Re: NISSAN GT-R vs REAL LIFE?!?!

    AUM:
    And WR  seems to be the only driver capable of extracting the full potential of the 997 Turbo. 7.38 WR vs 7.54 for HvS
    --


    Just to correct you HvS did 7.52min with second sample of 997 Turbo(little bit different PASM setup). Current 997 Turbo with little bit revised PTM and Bucket seats(weight overall at 1560kg level) is capable of 7.48min in HvS hands. Trust me on this...

    Re: NISSAN GT-R vs REAL LIFE?!?!

    We have now produced a video combining the two (video-in-video) together with Chris talking us around the lap.  It provides a little more insight beyond that provided thus far.

    http://www.drivers-republic.com/dr_tv/index.cfm?videoid=61a64bd813c44161b345e9f706147ad9&area=features


    --
    ____________________________________ Steve

    Re: NISSAN GT-R vs REAL LIFE?!?!

    We have now produced a video combining the two (video-in-video) together with Chris talking us around the lap.  It provides a little more insight beyond that provided thus far.

    http://www.drivers-republic.com/dr_tv/index.cfm?videoid=61a64bd813c44161b345e9f706147ad9&area=features


    --
    ____________________________________ Steve

    Re: NISSAN GT-R vs REAL LIFE?!?!

    Many thanks Steve and Chris. That is a very illuminating video that sums up these two magnificent cars perfectly.

    Well done DR!  


    --


    Re: NISSAN GT-R vs REAL LIFE?!?!

    Not sure if this is a repost, but some of DR's staff's ex-employer EVO has crowned GT-R the eCOTY.  That is no mean feat considering GT2, 560/4, Gran Tourismo S, 4.7 V8 Vantage, Alfa V8 are all in the final.  But no doubt, price would have been a consideration. 

     
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