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    Re: 992 GT3

    The fake tip trend all started with Lexus way back then. I believe the 4th gen LS460 was the first one. The exhaust 'tip' was built into the rear bumper as a chrome accent, the actual exhaust tip is inside and not even touching the 'tip'.

     


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    Re: 992 GT3

    I remember Audi welding an additional tip that was not connected to anything, to make what looked like a dual tip exhaust. That was decades ago, probably on an A4. Single exhaust outlet on one side, predating the trend to symmetric dual exhausts. I can't find a picture now, but I remember the Auto Motor & Sport article showing a picture from underneath and pointing out the fakery. Circa 1990's?


    Re: 992 GT3

    Its in german but if you can find someone to translate it its quite an interesting video with a manual example, informal interior walk around with AP and a timed lap with Jorge which compares with the prior 991.2 RS MR hot lap time....

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ejm5-xiYQbM


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    2017 991.2 GT3 Manual, 2017 Alfa Romeo Giulia QV, 2017 Macan S (Petrol)


    Re: 992 GT3

    Thanks, Mark! 

    What was the final laptime delta between GT3RS MR and 992 GT3?


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    18 GT3 Manual, 73 Carrera RS 2.7 Carbon Fiber replica (1,890 lbs), 06 EVO9 with track mods. Former: 16 Cayman GT4, 73 911S, Two 951S's, 996 C2, 993 C2, 98 Ferrari 550, 79 635CSi

     


    Re: 992 GT3

    992 GT3 1:43.4

    I believe the MR did 1:43.1


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    2018 White 911 GT3


    Re: 992 GT3

    Yes. Three tenths. But Jorg was driving without any safety gear or helmet and on his second lap out. The car was just a press car so entirely factory. I believe it was wearing only the standard Cup2 (but I could be wrong as my wife stopped translating by then!). The author of the youtube clip was sure he could have hit it with some better preparation.

    More encouraging than that the fact that the 992 GT3 was as fast as the 991.2 GT3 MR on this track is the simple matter of the track itself. Its far more similar to the tracks I (and Grant) drive our GT3 at than the Nordschleife.

    This would indicate that the new front suspension, wider track and larger tyre patch along with the recalibrated RWS (now 2.0 degree) and the changes that have made to the rear geo will produce improved results on real world tracks with slower tighter corners than the Ring (where the aero finally really comes into play)

     


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    2017 991.2 GT3 Manual, 2017 Alfa Romeo Giulia QV, 2017 Macan S (Petrol)


    Re: 992 GT3

    This is encouraging wink


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    18 GT3 Manual, 73 Carrera RS 2.7 Carbon Fiber replica (1,890 lbs), 06 EVO9 with track mods. Former: 16 Cayman GT4, 73 911S, Two 951S's, 996 C2, 993 C2, 98 Ferrari 550, 79 635CSi

     


    Re: 992 GT3

    Tyres on the red one was CUP2 R.


    Re: 992 GT3

    Right. Makes sense. I gathered they were commenting on how soft they were after the lap. They also look like they probably dont last that long. I assume the 991.2 GT3 MR was probably running Cup2R so I guess like for like?


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    2017 991.2 GT3 Manual, 2017 Alfa Romeo Giulia QV, 2017 Macan S (Petrol)


    Re: 992 GT3

    macca993:

    Right. Makes sense. I gathered they were commenting on how soft they were after the lap. They also look like they probably dont last that long. I assume the 991.2 GT3 MR was probably running Cup2R so I guess like for like?

    Yes, but the GT3 has 10 mm less width on each tire.


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    18 GT3 Manual, 73 Carrera RS 2.7 Carbon Fiber replica (1,890 lbs), 06 EVO9 with track mods. Former: 16 Cayman GT4, 73 911S, Two 951S's, 996 C2, 993 C2, 98 Ferrari 550, 79 635CSi


    Re: 992 GT3

    Correct Grant. Im not sure how that affects tyre patch (maybe -5%?). Obviously now the 992 GT3 has a 21" rear wheel and wider front and rear tyres its type patch has grown significantly over the 991.2 GT3 (15%?). It really seems they have worked some voodoo on this chassis to give the results we are rearing and reading about...


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    2017 991.2 GT3 Manual, 2017 Alfa Romeo Giulia QV, 2017 Macan S (Petrol)


    Re: 992 GT3

    Grant:
    BiTurbo:
    This ones' real Smiley

    Nearly all of the vents in the Porsches are real too - that's why it's disappointing that they throw a couple fake ones in there too...

    The Turbo S seems to have authentic vents, despite not being a proper track focused car Smiley


    Re: 992 GT3

    Porsche 992 GT3 aero illustration...   E0F26BDD-E91B-4EF4-964B-7C4204B9E420.gif

    F448FE71-A970-4BD2-AEAE-8CA43AA38F52.jpeg

    Smiley


    Re: 992 GT3

    macca993:

    Correct Grant. Im not sure how that affects tyre patch (maybe -5%?). Obviously now the 992 GT3 has a 21" rear wheel and wider front and rear tyres its type patch has grown significantly over the 991.2 GT3 (15%?). It really seems they have worked some voodoo on this chassis to give the results we are rearing and reading about...

    Contact patch does not change in size with larger wheels, just shape. The only variables for sq. In. of SIZE is weight of the car and tire pressure. The wider the wheel the more rectangular on one axis the patch will be but it will become "shorter" as well. 


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    Past-President, Porsche Club of America - Upper Canada Region


    Re: 992 GT3

    Boxster Coupe GTS:

    Porsche 992 GT3 aero illustration...   E0F26BDD-E91B-4EF4-964B-7C4204B9E420.gif

    Look at those fake vents by the rear reflectors. No air coming out there.

    Are the exhaust tips real? Did anyone check? indecision

     


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    2016 Porsche 981 GT4 | Racing Yellow
    2018 Audi S6 Avant | Ibis White


    Re: 992 GT3

    Im fairly certain that a 21" wheel using a 315 tyre on a 12" rim (992.1 GT3) will have a larger tyre patch than a 20" wheel using a 305 on an 11.5" rim (991.2 GT3) assuming the weight is not changed?


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    2017 991.2 GT3 Manual, 2017 Alfa Romeo Giulia QV, 2017 Macan S (Petrol)


    Re: 992 GT3

    bluelines:
    Boxster Coupe GTS:

    Porsche 992 GT3 aero illustration...   E0F26BDD-E91B-4EF4-964B-7C4204B9E420.gif

    Look at those fake vents by the rear reflectors. No air coming out there.

    Are the exhaust tips real? Did anyone check? indecision

     

    There's always an easy fix Smiley


    Re: 992 GT3

    macca993:

    Im fairly certain that a 21" wheel using a 315 tyre on a 12" rim (992.1 GT3) will have a larger tyre patch than a 20" wheel using a 305 on an 11.5" rim (991.2 GT3) assuming the weight is not changed?

    Mithras is correct, the contact patch remains at the same area, assuming weight and tire pressure doesn't change.  What changes is the shape of the contact patch when a wider tire is employed instead of a narrower one; area remains the same.  


    Re: 992 GT3

    Boxster Coupe GTS:

    Porsche 992 GT3 aero illustration...   E0F26BDD-E91B-4EF4-964B-7C4204B9E420.gif

    F448FE71-A970-4BD2-AEAE-8CA43AA38F52.jpeg

    Smiley

    Without a full streamline analysis, it's not necessarily indicative that the cutout, while not containing a real vent, does not contribute to air flow management around the rear of the car.  The Turbo S has a rear vent to assist with cooling of the turbocharged engine and the intake air charge.  The demands on a normally aspired motor, of course, are different. 


    Re: 992 GT3

    You may be right but this was what Porsche published as the increase between the 991.1 GT3 and 991.1 GT3RS back in the day. Sure the shape changes but so does the size (coverage). Why is it any differenet between a 991.2 GT3 (same as the GT3 in this chart) with 20" rear on 305 11.5J and a 992 GT3 with 21" rear 315 and 12J? 

    Ok its not going to be a 18% rear increase or a 20% front increase but my calcs show the increase in useable contact area is going to be between 5-10% and likely more effective coverage if you could calculate for the effects of the front double wishbone set up on dynamic camber?

    Im not challenging anyone just curious to the reasons why the contact patch is unchanged with the 992 GT3 vs the 991.2 GT3?

     

     


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    2017 991.2 GT3 Manual, 2017 Alfa Romeo Giulia QV, 2017 Macan S (Petrol)


    Re: 992 GT3

    1619905134520GT3 vs RS tyre contact patch.jpg


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    2017 991.2 GT3 Manual, 2017 Alfa Romeo Giulia QV, 2017 Macan S (Petrol)


    Re: 992 GT3

    If increasing the wheel diameter doesn’t increase contact patch, all other things equal , I wonder what moron at say John Deere, decided to put those large diameter wheels on their tractors.... just saying😎 


    Re: 992 GT3

    Scary to see how little is keeping us in contact with the tarmac ....


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     964 Carrera 4 --  997.2 C2S , -20mm -- 991.2 GT3 RS 


    Re: 992 GT3

    macca993:

    You may be right but this was what Porsche published as the increase between the 991.1 GT3 and 991.1 GT3RS back in the day. Sure the shape changes but so does the size (coverage). Why is it any differenet between a 991.2 GT3 (same as the GT3 in this chart) with 20" rear on 305 11.5J and a 992 GT3 with 21" rear 315 and 12J? 

    Ok its not going to be a 18% rear increase or a 20% front increase but my calcs show the increase in useable contact area is going to be between 5-10% and likely more effective coverage if you could calculate for the effects of the front double wishbone set up on dynamic camber?

    Im not challenging anyone just curious to the reasons why the contact patch is unchanged with the 992 GT3 vs the 991.2 GT3?

     

     


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    2017 991.2 GT3 Manual, 2017 Alfa Romeo Giulia QV, 2017 Macan S (Petrol)

    Apparently afaik while just making the tire wider will not increase the contact patch as some have already said, a larger diameter tire wheel will increase the contract patch, and using a wider rim (not just tire) probably will as well when in motion.

    Also the shape of the contact patch changes with the wider tire and a wider patch, even with the same surface area, will still give you more grip in the corners too.

    As you already mentioned, the new front suspension will also make that contract patch more effective as it will keep it on the ground more efficiently. So it all ads up I guess.

    Are pressures the same in the 992GT3 as in the 991 BTW?

     


    Re: 992 GT3

    macca993:

    1619905134520GT3 vs RS tyre contact patch.jpg

    Hey, this is so f##ked up - thanks for sharing SmileySmileySmiley​​​​​​ so, there is one person driving a car over a plate all day and the other sits there with a ruler ... Smiley ... ok, all computerized and wired ... in DE they always showed us a postcard to picture it ...


    Re: 992 GT3

    996FourEss:

    If increasing the wheel diameter doesn’t increase contact patch, all other things equal , I wonder what moron at say John Deere, decided to put those large diameter wheels on their tractors.... just saying😎 

    Smiley
     

    John Deere, ahead of their time when it came to big rear wheel bling tuning. Top fuel drag racers and Porsche RS cars followed tune Smiley


    --

    2016 Porsche 981 GT4 | Racing Yellow
    2018 Audi S6 Avant | Ibis White


    Re: 992 GT3

    d997h:
    macca993:

    1619905134520GT3 vs RS tyre contact patch.jpg

    Hey, this is so f##ked up - thanks for sharing SmileySmileySmiley​​​​​​ so, there is one person driving a car over a plate all day and the other sits there with a ruler ... Smiley ... ok, all computerized and wired ... in DE they always showed us a postcard to picture it ...

    Just imagine now on a sportbike, it's the size of a cigarette pack with only two tires on the ground, on equilibrium, and a 1:1 power to weight ratio... most fun vehicle... ever Smiley 


    Re: 992 GT3

    I remember reading about how small the contact area of tire actually is in Auto Motor Sport many decades ago. This is why RC is always so concerned about the correct OEM N01 or factory spec tire fitment. I have come around to this thinking now as well and specifically specify N01 tires for my Porsche and R01 tires for my R8. We are speed controlled in Canada but there is something about having best contact area you can get.

     

     


    Re: 992 GT3

    Porsche 992 GT3 Touring looking great (with the ducktail) in a stunning render...  E0F26BDD-E91B-4EF4-964B-7C4204B9E420.gif

    05C6BF31-54D4-41C0-BC17-7821CBC6CDBD.jpeg

    9E824A06-811B-43FA-921E-3A4F025851CB.jpeg

    B30C5EE6-4EAE-4577-BAE1-FB6108321E4E.jpeg

    520CBBC5-29A7-4EE6-AE3D-C06E1A28A71B.jpeg

    Link: https://widebodynews.com/renderings/new-992-porsche-911-gt3-touring-rendering/

    ...with thanks and credit to digital artist Treston Chen!  Smiley

    Smiley


    Re: 992 GT3

    But compared to the 991 Touring, the 992 is just too chubby and now trying too hard

     

     


     
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