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Re: CGT cut in half...
Quote:
amazon said:
http://www.flat-6.net/forum/showthread.php?t=17750
Just reading those few posts on that forum made me realize once again just how relatively civilized and mature rennteam is.
Re: CGT cut in half...
Thank goodness there was no fatalities but the driver is just as equally responsible for ensuring the safety of his passenger which he clearly didn't. To go have a crash at that kind of speed to rip a car in half like that is madness (can't imagine how fast) - to use a car like that to it's full potential he should have did it on a track. If he did it again on a public road, he might not be so lucky next time...
but then again track driving does present other risks.
but then again track driving does present other risks.
Re: CGT cut in half...
http://www.nydailynews.com/front/story/382993p-325042c.html
speed on the streets is getting bad and with many car now being sold with 600+HP to people who have no idea how to drive them I am afraid the stage is being set for more accidents like this in the future . Car companies should encourage people who are buying their super cars( 500HP and up ) to get into driving schools and even offer programs for their customers . My neighbor just bought a new 430 coupe and when he is out of town I see his 19 year old girlfriend and her friend taking his car out to go clubbing here in Southbeach .
I can see some guy buying a new 520HP Cayenne and his wife out running errands in it ....a 520HP SUV with some housewife on the cell phone putting makeup on as she swats the kids she is yelling at in traffic .
speed on the streets is getting bad and with many car now being sold with 600+HP to people who have no idea how to drive them I am afraid the stage is being set for more accidents like this in the future . Car companies should encourage people who are buying their super cars( 500HP and up ) to get into driving schools and even offer programs for their customers . My neighbor just bought a new 430 coupe and when he is out of town I see his 19 year old girlfriend and her friend taking his car out to go clubbing here in Southbeach .
I can see some guy buying a new 520HP Cayenne and his wife out running errands in it ....a 520HP SUV with some housewife on the cell phone putting makeup on as she swats the kids she is yelling at in traffic .
Jan 16, 2006 4:57:03 PM
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Alex18_996CC
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Re: CGT cut in half...
Quote:
OCEAN said:
http://www.nydailynews.com/front/story/382993p-325042c.html
My neighbor just bought a new 430 coupe and when he is out of town I see his 19 year old girlfriend and her friend taking his car out to go clubbing here in Southbeach .
My only opinion is that people get these type of cars, and dont have respect, they press the accelerator without knowing the consequences...untill one day it happens.....
I have also done the same as your son neighbour.....but the difference is that I truly respect the performace....and know the responsibility I have....very very rare times I have driven over speed limits (I would lie if I didnt accept it)......But each time I drive a car, no matter what (like my mini cooper S for example
) I dont forget about respect and try to be always at 100% concentration...In my opinion is a matter of respect and knowing the consequences........instead of showing off and speeding with any car without knowing what could happen to you or the people that surround you at that time.....With this i dont want to say nothing ,but, it doesnt depends 100% in the age of the driver, it depends in the brain of him/her
Jan 16, 2006 5:03:22 PM
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Alex18_996CC
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Re: CGT cut in half...
She drove it less than a mile and lost it. Clearly, based on the damage she had reached a relatively high speed. Fortunately, it appears she richocheted of the obstruction which caused the car to break into two pieces. Otherwise, they both would be dead.
I would be interested in her and the passenger explanation as to what happened that caused the loss of control.
FWIW it is being reported on a another site that another CGT was totalled in the CA over the weekend. Thankfully the occupants received only minor injuries.
Bottom line is the CGT is just too much car for the non-professional.
I would be interested in her and the passenger explanation as to what happened that caused the loss of control.
FWIW it is being reported on a another site that another CGT was totalled in the CA over the weekend. Thankfully the occupants received only minor injuries.
Bottom line is the CGT is just too much car for the non-professional.
Re: CGT cut in half...
Quote:
nberry said:Quote:
dedam said:
I read in the newspaper in Holland
In Belgium a Porsche CGT halfed when the owner lend the car to his friend.
That make it 3 CGT,s in one weekend
I read of another CGT in CA being totaled this weekend. Where was the third?
Belgium !!!!! Near Holland Nick
Jan 17, 2006 12:04:55 AM
- Ryan in SD
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Re: CGT cut in half...
Quote:
dedam said:
I read in the newspaper in Holland
In Belgium a Porsche CGT halfed when the owner lend the car to his friend.
I assumed you were referring to this crash. This car and the one in Belgium broke in half and both were loaned to friends?
I know another was totaled this weekend in CA just outside of LA.
Re: CGT cut in half...
I think the multitude of accidents really reaffirms the point that the CGT needs to come with a driver training program...
Even though it is directly applicable to this accident (seeing that the car was lent to someone), by making the purchaser realize the severity and danger of the car, he/she would most likely be less prone to lending it out to friends.
Even though it is directly applicable to this accident (seeing that the car was lent to someone), by making the purchaser realize the severity and danger of the car, he/she would most likely be less prone to lending it out to friends.
Re: CGT cut in half...
Quote:
Hurst said:
I think the multitude of accidents really reaffirms the point that the CGT needs to come with a driver training program...
Even though it is directly applicable to this accident (seeing that the car was lent to someone), by making the purchaser realize the severity and danger of the car, he/she would most likely be less prone to lending it out to friends.
Plenty of rusty 150hp-200hp cars killing people @65MPH w/drunk/inattentive drivers every day in US.....
Don't have pesky/wealthy personal injury lawyers in EU, so lim personal liab risk to lending a supercar to your favorite bimbo....
In US, any smart owner of a supercar knows where/when to exploit its potential....if he doesn't, Darwinian selection and/or lawyers/prosecutors will make sure penalties are severe for poor risk/reward judgement....
Re: CGT cut in half...
Quote:
VKSF said:Quote:
Hurst said:
I think the multitude of accidents really reaffirms the point that the CGT needs to come with a driver training program...
Even though it is directly applicable to this accident (seeing that the car was lent to someone), by making the purchaser realize the severity and danger of the car, he/she would most likely be less prone to lending it out to friends.
Plenty of rusty 150hp-200hp cars killing people @65MPH w/drunk/inattentive drivers every day in US.....
Don't have pesky/wealthy personal injury lawyers in EU, so lim personal liab risk to lending a supercar to your favorite bimbo....
In US, any smart owner of a supercar knows where/when to exploit its potential....if he doesn't, Darwinian selection and/or lawyers/prosecutors will make sure penalties are severe for poor risk/reward judgement....
I disagree with your comments. Porsche put into the stream of commerce a car that has more power than any other production car they produced and failed to provide it with automatic stability controls. Porsche is well aware that the buyers of this car can include people with no experience to handle a car of this power and that the car would be driven by inexperienced drivers.
Consider that the propective buyers were brainwashed with factory professional drivers showing them what the car was capable of. At no time were they allowed to drive the car during the demonstration. It is certainly foresseable and not unreasonable for Porsche to conclude buyers would try to immulate the factory drivers and allow others to drive this car.
Finally, do you realize that but for W. Rohrl's insistence, there would not be any traction control on this monster?
This car is not a car I would want to ride in.
Jan 17, 2006 3:43:26 AM
- CarreraGtRacer
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Re: CGT cut in half...
Quote:So about 7-8 Carrera GTs have been completely totalled and another 4-5 have been badly damaged out of 1,000 + total Carrera GTs and this makes you not want to ride in the Carrera GT right?
nberry said:
I disagree with your comments. Porsche put into the stream of commerce a car that has more power than any other production car they produced and failed to provide it with automatic stability controls. Porsche is well aware that the buyers of this car can include people with no experience to handle a car of this power and that the car would be driven by inexperienced drivers.
Consider that the propective buyers were brainwashed with factory professional drivers showing them what the car was capable of. At no time were they allowed to drive the car during the demonstration. It is certainly foresseable and not unreasonable for Porsche to conclude buyers would try to immulate the factory drivers and allow others to drive this car. Or wait you would ride in the Enzo since it has automatic stability controls right?
Finally, do you realize that but for W. Rohrl's insistence, there would not be any traction control on this monster?
This car is not a car I would want to ride in.
Out of the 400 total Enzos made how many have been crashed/totalled (7-8)? I would be willing to bet the Crash rate ratio is higher in the Enzo compared to the Carrera GT...
7 wrecked out of 400 compared to 8 wrecked out of 1000+
By this logic you wouldn't want to ride in the Enzo too right? Or wait maybe you would because it has automatic stability controls
Re: CGT cut in half...
Quote:
nberry said:Quote:
VKSF said:Quote:
Hurst said:
I think the multitude of accidents really reaffirms the point that the CGT needs to come with a driver training program...
Even though it is directly applicable to this accident (seeing that the car was lent to someone), by making the purchaser realize the severity and danger of the car, he/she would most likely be less prone to lending it out to friends.
Plenty of rusty 150hp-200hp cars killing people @65MPH w/drunk/inattentive drivers every day in US.....
Don't have pesky/wealthy personal injury lawyers in EU, so lim personal liab risk to lending a supercar to your favorite bimbo....
In US, any smart owner of a supercar knows where/when to exploit its potential....if he doesn't, Darwinian selection and/or lawyers/prosecutors will make sure penalties are severe for poor risk/reward judgement....
I disagree with your comments. Porsche put into the stream of commerce a car that has more power than any other production car they produced and failed to provide it with automatic stability controls. Porsche is well aware that the buyers of this car can include people with no experience to handle a car of this power and that the car would be driven by inexperienced drivers.
Consider that the propective buyers were brainwashed with factory professional drivers showing them what the car was capable of. At no time were they allowed to drive the car during the demonstration. It is certainly foresseable and not unreasonable for Porsche to conclude buyers would try to immulate the factory drivers and allow others to drive this car.
Finally, do you realize that but for W. Rohrl's insistence, there would not be any traction control on this monster?
This car is not a car I would want to ride in.
Let's look at the key comparable sportscar: well, F's have no side/head airbags (even in the 4250lb 612s)
....and F's seem to detonate more often in crashes than P's....perhaps something w/fuel tank placement vs hot engine components???..... ...and I'd bet most engineers would advise any consumer that a more mass produc car like P has more units over which to spread R&D dollars for crash testing and safety refinement....the downside of "exclusivity".... 
And I'm not sure how capable F's stab ctrl sys is vs PSM
...do you have any hard comparo data???....Net, net, I'd argue smart guys who can afford $100K+ sportscars should make their own risk/reward choices in life and/or sportscar safety...and live w/the consequences if their bets are incorrect....Darwinian selection is a very "natural" process w/which even the Prius-loving Berkeley crowd should be comfortable....
Re: CGT cut in half...
Quote:
Hurst said:
I think the multitude of accidents really reaffirms the point that the CGT needs to come with a driver training program...
Even though it is directly applicable to this accident (seeing that the car was lent to someone), by making the purchaser realize the severity and danger of the car, he/she would most likely be less prone to lending it out to friends.
Great- I agree, couldn't hurt!
This seems to be happening much too often with the CGT. Even Leno had a spin out- and he's pretty experienced with super cars/ the CGT. Perhaps it's more than just driver error?
Re: CGT cut in half...
If you watch this video you will see that even Jeremy rates this is not an easy car to control, the clutch is brutal, power is savage and the handling is on a knife edge.
He says that if you make a small mistake in that car it bites your head off, even the "Stig" spun the car several times. A great, exciting, fast car but at the same time a dangerous car.
http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=5956630212110957109&q=Porsche+GT
He says that if you make a small mistake in that car it bites your head off, even the "Stig" spun the car several times. A great, exciting, fast car but at the same time a dangerous car.
http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=5956630212110957109&q=Porsche+GT
Jan 17, 2006 6:54:17 AM
- CarreraGtRacer
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Jan 17, 2006 12:08:42 PM
- elysium
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Re: CGT cut in half...
Quote:
CarreraGtRacer said:
Tiff Needell would say
"I'm sorry this is not a Honda Civic, this is a German supercar and if it scares you, you should go buy something else"
Exctly!
Why anyone would want to be babysat by Porsche or any other corporation is beyond me. If you can afford a 450k car, you should also be able to making your own decisions on how to drive it, and if you are cabable of handling it. Michael Schumacher crashes his F1 car from time to time, Ralph Schumacher managed to crash his Toyota family car and so on. It's not possible to live without risk-taking, but we are all free to choose what risk we take when bying and driving a car. So don't blame Porsche for making a car wich many of us would have a difficult time controlling, they are only a supplier. If it scares you too much (a tad fear is part of the fun), then DO buy something else.
Re: CGT cut in half...
Unless there has been a mechanical problem with the car, I believe, the driver is 100% responsible for what happened whether it's a 100hp or 500hp car.
Some people with twisted minds are trying to make Porsche liable for what happened ...
Unfortunately, I believe more and more people are not able to assume the risk they take and are trying to make others liable for what may happen.
It's not because you have a 500hp car that you must drive like a maniac, I'm sure you can drive it safely at 40-50 mph .... so it's a poor excuse to say the car is dangerous or can get out of control easily. The driver had poor judgment or has poor driving capabilites (or a bit of both may be).
Re: CGT cut in half...
If we follow the logic being espoused by many of you that it is the individual driver responsibility then why bother with other safety features like ABS, PSM, airbags, shatter proof windshields, seat belts and on and on?
The difference here is there is technology which will make this car safer. Porsche knew this car was going to be purchased by the average or below average driver. They also knew the dangerous power of this car given their own test driver crashed a couple and auto reviews journalist crashed a couple as well.
Thereafter, in marketing the car they only allowed test driving on an abandoned airfield. That speaks volumes of Porsche's knowledge of the car propensities.
The difference here is there is technology which will make this car safer. Porsche knew this car was going to be purchased by the average or below average driver. They also knew the dangerous power of this car given their own test driver crashed a couple and auto reviews journalist crashed a couple as well.
Thereafter, in marketing the car they only allowed test driving on an abandoned airfield. That speaks volumes of Porsche's knowledge of the car propensities.
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