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    Re: C6Z vs. 997TT post from 6speeonline

    Quote:
    Dock (Atlanta) said:
    Quote:
    355Spider said:ACtually I think they are going to be very close in most instances. I've said all along i think the 997TT will be faster off the line and the Z will be faster from a roll which is what real world experience is starting to show.



    And if magazine tests show the two cars being essentially equal from a roll, where does thet leave you with your horsepower/weight argument?


    Well the poster of this thread and most magazines have already proven my theory so where does that leave you?

    Re: C6Z vs. 997TT post from 6speeonline

    quem sabe vcs nao param de discutir com os invejosos de plantao.. e a apreciem o novo turbo q esta deixando a concorrencia de cabelo em pe!

    Re: C6Z vs. 997TT post from 6speeonline

    Quote:
    355Spider said:
    Quote:
    Dock (Atlanta) said:
    Quote:
    355Spider said:ACtually I think they are going to be very close in most instances. I've said all along i think the 997TT will be faster off the line and the Z will be faster from a roll which is what real world experience is starting to show.



    And if magazine tests show the two cars being essentially equal from a roll, where does thet leave you with your horsepower/weight argument?


    Well the poster of this thread and most magazines have already proven my theory so where does that leave you?



    355,

    as the poster of this thread, I have to inform you that the suject 997TT hadn't been properly run in at the time of testing, while the C6Z had. I'd give it another several thousand miles to get fully broken in and then compare it to the Z again (Porsche engines are notorious for 'waking up' after about 5000-6500 miles). There is a reason Porsche had a C6Z in their testing center and I believe they made the Turbo just as fast as the Z (but only just).

    Re: C6Z vs. 997TT post from 6speeonline

    Quote:
    Crash said:
    Quote:
    355Spider said:
    Quote:
    Dock (Atlanta) said:
    Quote:
    355Spider said:ACtually I think they are going to be very close in most instances. I've said all along i think the 997TT will be faster off the line and the Z will be faster from a roll which is what real world experience is starting to show.



    And if magazine tests show the two cars being essentially equal from a roll, where does thet leave you with your horsepower/weight argument?


    Well the poster of this thread and most magazines have already proven my theory so where does that leave you?



    355,

    as the poster of this thread, I have to inform you that the suject 997TT hadn't been properly run in at the time of testing, while the C6Z had. I'd give it another several thousand miles to get fully broken in and then compare it to the Z again (Porsche engines are notorious for 'waking up' after about 5000-6500 miles). There is a reason Porsche had a C6Z in their testing center and I believe they made the Turbo just as fast as the Z (but only just).


    I don't buy that. The TT had 1200 miles on it and the Z had 2000. How is that make the Z more properly run in? ANd most guys are finding the same thing in their Zs. After about 5K they are getting another 15-20hp so I would say it's still even with the engines.

    Re: C6Z vs. 997TT post from 6speeonline

    Quote:
    355Spider said:Well the poster of this thread and most magazines have already proven my theory so where does that leave you?



    I don't know of any magazines that have tested, head-to-head, the C6Z and the 997 Turbo with SC.

    And it leaves me at the same place I've always been...wait and see.

    Re: C6Z vs. 997TT post from 6speeonline

    Quote:
    RC said:
    Quote:
    JimFlat6 said:
    Obviously Porsche builds the car for their audience. Its also obvious its slower as a sports car when used as a sports car on a track than a Corvette is.



    After the day today, journalists can write any crap they want but the 997 Turbo is fast as hell. Especially in twists and turns. Not to forget one point I always had and I repeat myself again: in the hands of a PRO, the Z06 may be frigging fast, even as fast as a 997 Turbo (they're still reviews, where the Z06 is a tiny tick slowlier but anyway, so be it). But take the average "Joe" driver of a Z06 and the same average "Joe" driver of a 997 Turbo and I promise to you, the 997 Turbo will be faster, simply because it's handling is more refined (easier to drive if you like... ).
    So are we all pros? Apparently. I consider myself a slightly above average high power sportscar driver and so are the guys who joined us today. And I highly doubt that one of them would have been faster in a Z06, sorry.
    Regarding our driving today: Walter Röhrl would have been proud of us.



    Rest easy folks! RC to the rescue of his beloved Turbo Porsche again!!!

    Re: C6Z vs. 997TT post from 6speeonline

    I have no doubt that the new Turbo is faster than schnell. Well put together, a technical tour de force, has a luxury aura, a fabulous paint job and comes with owners manuals as
    thick as the archives of the European Coal Commission.

    Fabulous street car, yes! But it might not make a wonderful sports car for doing 20 plus hard laps 8 weekends a year.

    Best to have both!

    Re: C6Z vs. 997TT post from 6speeonline

    Quote:
    devo said:
    Take a hard look at the Z06. I don't care how fast it is...sorry, but it's built very cheaply. Besides it not realistic comparison. The Z is built for cheap speed, nothing more. Every creature comfort is secondary. Christ, I had a 2000cc, highly tuned Harley (ported heads, high-lift cam-yes one, big carb and a lot of cubes) that smoked most rice burners in any roll on contest. It didn't make it a better bike.
    And, it's not like the (us) Americans haven't done it before. The Viper is just as fast, has been for years. it just has much taller gears. (and is just as cheap) Swap the gears and...presto.
    Z06: cheap orange peel paint, cheap skimpy leather, Chevy Chevette style interior, loud and unrefined. Who cares, except Nick, who wants to stir things up.
    Anyway, Nick, if the Z beats the tt like reported, what do you think that that does to your 430. Can we say third place. Does that make your F car that much less of an achievement. Oh no it doesn't because your car SOUNDS fast.



    Nice cop out, but you and most on the forum DO care how fast the Z is compared to the Turbo. You care so damn much that is just eats away at you that the Z is just flat ass out faster. And you can come up with all of the other BS about cheap leather, plastic, orange peel paint and so on, but at the end of the day, the Z will outrun the 997TT.
    If all you care about in a sports car is nice leather, then go out and spend 123K + on a 997TT. Give me the awesome feeling of the power and torque of the Z. The 997, with all of its nice leather is, at the end of the day, boring. The Z is anything but that!

    Re: C6Z vs. 997TT post from 6speeonline

    Quote:
    RC said:
    Quote:
    nberry said:
    Terrific post! Sometime we tend to forget we are very fortunate to sit here and argue with personal experience about these great cars. Your post really nailed the respective positions.



    I don't find anything terrific about it, still doesn't explain the psychological reasons for YOU posting on a Porsche forum and a Z06 owner doing the same.
    Do you have children, Nick? I think you have way too much free time on your hands.



    RC....get a clue! The Porsche owners on this forum bring up the Z06 and Ferrari ALL OF THE TIME!!! So why are you so surprised that Z owners and Ferrari owners chime in?
    If you can't handle the heat, get out of the kitchen.

    Re: C6Z vs. 997TT post from 6speeonline

    Quote:
    Crash said:
    RC,

    I guess I should apologize, as I am the thread starter. I didn't mean for this to turn into a bash fest, with Corvette owners telling us how great their cars are. I think it's really time to curb membership, since it seems that a simple thread, displaying the results of a friendly shootout can't seem to remain civilized.



    This has to be the only car forum on the planet where its members suggest curbing membership and are concerned about rules such as "car bashing". It's laughable. I agree about being civilized, but I do not see one post on this thread that is not civilized.

    Re: C6Z vs. 997TT post from 6speeonline

    Quote:
    JimFlat6 said: But it might not make a wonderful sports car for doing 20 plus hard laps 8 weekends a year.





    The Turbo is not sold for that purpose. As a matter of fact, using it for that purpose can void the warranty.

    Re: C6Z vs. 997TT post from 6speeonline

    Ronnie - Has it occurred to you that many Turbos owners (me included) don't give a flip that the C6Z is faster than either the 996 or 997 Turbo. There's just way more to car ownership than that. Do you understand that concept?

    Re: C6Z vs. 997TT post from 6speeonline

    Quote:
    Dock (Atlanta) said:
    Quote:
    JimFlat6 said: But it might not make a wonderful sports car for doing 20 plus hard laps 8 weekends a year.





    The Turbo is not sold for that purpose. As a matter of fact, using it for that purpose can void the warranty.




    This why I am considering either upgrading my car or buying a track-modified lightweight TT (with a warranty for non-competition track use) that still retains reasonable long-distance comfort.

    I needa dual-purpose track and AB transport Turbo with a warranty. It seems unlikely that any new 911 willfulfil those requirements.

    Re: C6Z vs. 997TT post from 6speeonline

    Quote:
    Dock (Atlanta) said:
    Ronnie - Has it occurred to you that many Turbos owners (me included) don't give a flip that the C6Z is faster than either the 996 or 997 Turbo. There's just way more to car ownership than that. Do you understand that concept?




    The majority of TT owners probably don't care whether their car can be beat in a straight line If they really were concerned about that, they could easily go out and buy the Vette, or any other car that might, in the same price range or lower than the TT. People buy their cars for thier own specific reasons. We all know what the various reasons are. I personally think the Vette is ok looking and is quite fast, but it's not for me. When I think of the Vette's past, it reminds me of several things....often seeing blonde women driving it, "rockers"(Dio, Megadeath, Ratt, etc), guys that are stuck with the 80's look, smokers, mullets....just to name a few...oh, and grown men still named Ronnie , sorry couldn't resist

    Re: C6Z vs. 997TT post from 6speeonline

    Quote:
    Dock (Atlanta) said:
    Ronnie - Has it occurred to you that many Turbos owners (me included) don't give a flip that the C6Z is faster than either the 996 or 997 Turbo. There's just way more to car ownership than that. Do you understand that concept?



    What is the name of this thread and who started it and what is the subject? Duh!

    Re: C6Z vs. 997TT post from 6speeonline

    For ME, it is the whole package which counts. Nobody denies that the Z06 is a very interesting product for a highly competitve price tag. Unfortunately this is not the car I want, I would love it to pay the same amount of money I have to pay for the Z06 for my 997 Turbo.

    Re: C6Z vs. 997TT post from 6speeonline

    Quote:
    RonnieC6Z said:
    Quote:
    Dock (Atlanta) said:
    Ronnie - Has it occurred to you that many Turbos owners (me included) don't give a flip that the C6Z is faster than either the 996 or 997 Turbo. There's just way more to car ownership than that. Do you understand that concept?



    What is the name of this thread and who started it and what is the subject? Duh!



    I may be one of the few potential 997TT buyers here who does care that it at least be faster than the much cheaper Z06. However, if it isn't, I won't be shopping at my local Chevrolet dealership for a Z06. I'll just get the 997TT anyways. Like Dock says, "there's way more to car ownership than that."

    Re: C6Z vs. 997TT post from 6speeonline

    JP66, you have swallowed the whole PC charade hook, line and sinker. You win the prize for stereotyping!

    I dont think its practical to attach much cultural or class significance by the car people buy especially in the Corvette and Porsche worlds.

    As for "smoking" so you are stating irrevocably that you do not support American Indians?

    Hate mullets? Go tell that to some Apaches I know.

    Blondes in Vettes? Mmmm what about Blondes in Astons, Bentleys and Porsches? Como se Century City, Bel Aire? Its the food chain baby

    Ronnie names? Go tell Nancy!

    You cant stereotype car owners and its not too cool to slam people based upon class assumptions and self perceived high ground.

    I watched a farmer in Bib overalls and a straw cowboy
    hat buy a new Ferrari Testarossa at Ron Tonkins in Portland ..as his wife ate donuts and chugged Safeway Cola, so you never know~!

    Z06 or TT is a useless choice. One seats 4, one seats 2,
    one works in the snow, one doesnt! All counts what you need it to do, not what it has done.


    Re: C6Z vs. 997TT post from 6speeonline

    Quote:
    RonnieC6Z said:

    What is the name of this thread and who started it and what is the subject? Duh!



    What does that have to do with my statement/question to you?

    Your comments in post #245801 (see below) are open for reply, are they not?

    Quote:
    Nice cop out, but you and most on the forum DO care how fast the Z is compared to the Turbo. You care so damn much that is just eats away at you that the Z is just flat ass out faster.


    Re: C6Z vs. 997TT post from 6speeonline

    Quote:
    JP66 said:
    Quote:
    Dock (Atlanta) said:
    Ronnie - Has it occurred to you that many Turbos owners (me included) don't give a flip that the C6Z is faster than either the 996 or 997 Turbo. There's just way more to car ownership than that. Do you understand that concept?




    The majority of TT owners probably don't care whether their car can be beat in a straight line If they really were concerned about that, they could easily go out and buy the Vette, or any other car that might, in the same price range or lower than the TT. People buy their cars for thier own specific reasons. We all know what the various reasons are. I personally think the Vette is ok looking and is quite fast, but it's not for me. When I think of the Vette's past, it reminds me of several things....often seeing blonde women driving it, "rockers"(Dio, Megadeath, Ratt, etc), guys that are stuck with the 80's look, smokers, mullets....just to name a few...oh, and grown men still named Ronnie , sorry couldn't resist



    I do recall a grown man named Ronnie that was president once. And I can think of many called Johnny rather than John, Tommy rather than Tom, etc. And when I think of Porsches past, I think of guys with gold chains around their necks, sour looks on their face when a Ferrari is near, heads constantly turning to see who is looking at them, and always looking quite constipated: grin:, sorry couldn't resist.

    Re: C6Z vs. 997TT post from 6speeonline

    Quote:
    RonnieC6Z said:
    And when I think of Porsches past, I think of guys with gold chains around their necks, sour looks on their face when a Ferrari is near, heads constantly turning to see who is looking at them, and always looking quite constipated: grin:, sorry couldn't resist.



    Well, all I can tell you is that in Germany's past, Vettes were driven by pimps. And this is not me provoking but the plain truth. The image of the Corvette started to change a decade or so ago, maybe even longer. But in the 70s and 80s, the Vettes were definetely the cars of the pimps over here. And Porsches were driven by VIPs (a lot of german actors, soccer players, etc. had Porsches), doctors, lawyers, etc. Ferraris were also pretty much in the hands of the red district, it changed with the introduction of the F355 and F40 but maybe also because people started to view things differently over here.

    Don't know about the US but over here in the land of Porsches, they weren't driven by guys with gold stuff around their neck.

    Re: C6Z vs. 997TT post from 6speeonline

    Quote:
    JimFlat6 said:
    JP66, you have swallowed the whole PC charade hook, line and sinker. You win the prize for stereotyping!

    I dont think its practical to attach much cultural or class significance by the car people buy especially in the Corvette and Porsche worlds.

    As for "smoking" so you are stating irrevocably that you do not support American Indians?

    Hate mullets? Go tell that to some Apaches I know.

    Blondes in Vettes? Mmmm what about Blondes in Astons, Bentleys and Porsches? Como se Century City, Bel Aire? Its the food chain baby

    Ronnie names? Go tell Nancy!

    You cant stereotype car owners and its not too cool to slam people based upon class assumptions and self perceived high ground.

    I watched a farmer in Bib overalls and a straw cowboy
    hat buy a new Ferrari Testarossa at Ron Tonkins in Portland ..as his wife ate donuts and chugged Safeway Cola, so you never know~!

    Z06 or TT is a useless choice. One seats 4, one seats 2,
    one works in the snow, one doesnt! All counts what you need it to do, not what it has done.





    I simply stated MY opinion on My past experiences when I've seen some Vettes. I didn't say ALL Vettes, nor did I say I didn't support Am.Indians (where did you come up with that?) or that blonde women only drive Vettes. I do however hate mulletts

    As RC has said in the past, what is "written" on these pages, isn't always "understood or percieved" as what the writer intended. You read waaaay into what I wrote and came up with your own "self percieved high ground" notions.

    Thanks for the PC lesson though

    Re: C6Z vs. 997TT post from 6speeonline

    Quote:
    RC said:
    Quote:
    RonnieC6Z said:
    And when I think of Porsches past, I think of guys with gold chains around their necks, sour looks on their face when a Ferrari is near, heads constantly turning to see who is looking at them, and always looking quite constipated: grin:, sorry couldn't resist.



    Well, all I can tell you is that in Germany's past, Vettes were driven by pimps. And this is not me provoking but the plain truth. The image of the Corvette started to change a decade or so ago, maybe even longer. But in the 70s and 80s, the Vettes were definetely the cars of the pimps over here. And Porsches were driven by VIPs (a lot of german actors, soccer players, etc. had Porsches), doctors, lawyers, etc. Ferraris were also pretty much in the hands of the red district, it changed with the introduction of the F355 and F40 but maybe also because people started to view things differently over here.

    Don't know about the US but over here in the land of Porsches, they weren't driven by guys with gold stuff around their neck.



    Here in the US (Porsches #1 target market), generally speaking, Vettes are driven by guys that love speed, performance and balls-to-the-wall thrills, and Porsches are driven by exactly what I stated above.

    Re: C6Z vs. 997TT post from 6speeonline

    Quote:
    RonnieC6Z said:
    Here in the US (Porsches #1 target market), generally speaking, Vettes are driven by guys that love speed, performance and balls-to-the-wall thrills, and Porsches are driven by exactly what I stated above.



    And what data source did you use to come up with that information?

    Re: C6Z vs. 997TT post from 6speeonline

    Quote:
    AMA said:
    pick up a Z06 + Super-Glue(just incase the roof decides to part out)



    pwnage @ first reply. rofl!

    Re: C6Z vs. 997TT post from 6speeonline

    Plenty of post disco "new country" mullets with gold chains and ageing dentists with peroxide blonde asistants running around in 911s in the US. Ahoy, its nooner time at the Hotel Notel.

    Want cars from bad people? Check out DEA auctions, so many black 911's ..you will go blind!

    You cant sterotype owners in the US. There are just too many people. Other countries with different tax rates and
    limited social mobility yes, maybe, but even that doesnt mean you would trust them with your wallet for a few hours.

    Re: C6Z vs. 997TT post from 6speeonline

    lol even more ownage, the subject didn't even spell the damn car's name right "C6 Z06". I'm all for disrespecting the Z06, so I'm not flaming anyone, I'm just laughing in agreement.

    Re: C6Z vs. 997TT post from 6speeonline

    The Z06 will be a rattling heap in 4-5 years. The 997tt will not. The only thing GM builds for longevity is trucks. My 2001 Z71 4x4 is a tank, with 110k+ miles.

    Re: C6Z vs. 997TT post from 6speeonline

    Quote:
    Dock (Atlanta) said:
    Quote:
    RonnieC6Z said:
    Here in the US (Porsches #1 target market), generally speaking, Vettes are driven by guys that love speed, performance and balls-to-the-wall thrills, and Porsches are driven by exactly what I stated above.



    And what data source did you use to come up with that information?



    Funny...you did not ask RC the same question when he said that Pimps drive Vettes in Germany.

    Re: C6Z vs. 997TT post from 6speeonline

    Quote:
    eclou said:
    The Z06 will be a rattling heap in 4-5 years. The 997tt will not. The only thing GM builds for longevity is trucks. My 2001 Z71 4x4 is a tank, with 110k+ miles.



    And your experience with Vettes is??? I have owned 7 of them...drive the hell out of them...20-25K a year. None fell apart..none developed rattles...they are the most trouble free cars that I have ever owned..including 911's that lived in the shop.

     
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