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    Re: Tesla Roadster

    since we unfortunatly or fortunatly...don't have starbuck in Italy, if not only 1 in Milano...what are they doing ??? I just know their own places.


    --

    993 c2


    Re: Tesla Roadster

    xander71:

    since we unfortunatly or fortunatly...don't have starbuck in Italy, if not only 1 in Milano...what are they doing ??? I just know their own places.


    They are trying to sell coffee. Not a good idea in Italy, if you ask me. Smiley


    --

    We're at the point where you can be the fastest or just sound like you're the fastest.



    The secret of life is to admire without desiring.


    Re: Tesla Roadster

    Rossi:
    xander71:

    since we unfortunatly or fortunatly...don't have starbuck in Italy, if not only 1 in Milano...what are they doing ??? I just know their own places.


    They are trying to sell coffee. Not a good idea in Italy, if you ask me. Smiley

    Agreed. You can get an excellent Espresso around almost every corner in Italy, no chance for Starbucks I'm afraid.

    You can laugh if you want but McDonald's has an excellent coffee right now in Germany, they have new coffee machines with a new coffee quality. They actually advertised this but I didn't believe it until I tried one.


    --

    RC (Germany) - Rennteam Editor Porsche 991.2 Carrera GTS Cabriolet (2018), Porsche Cayenne S Diesel (2017), Audi R8 V10 Plus (2016), Mini JCW (2015)


    Re: Tesla Roadster

    Well I agree with you, coffe here is a tradition and you find it already every where. Also mcdonalds here have espresso coffe machines like the bars..... I guess starbucks will loose a lot of money here, so they are smart not to even try.

     


    --

    993 c2


    Re: Tesla Roadster

    Tesla has filed the 10-Q report with the SEC for the first-quarter ended 31 March 2018...

    1525702803934image.jpeg

    PDF Link: http://files.shareholder.com/downloads/ABEA-4CW8X0/4919435050x0xS1564590%2D18%2D11086/1318605/filing.pdf

    ...includes disclosure that, as of 3 May 2018, the Fremont factory is to be included in the security package for Tesla's senior secured revolving credit facility...

    1525702770647image.jpeg

    Smiley


    Re: Tesla Roadster

    And yet at 299 the stock is higher than before Musk’s last blunder... must be very frustrating for short sellers angry


    Re: Tesla Roadster

    That is strange.  Wonder why an amendment to a credit agreement made on May 3, 2018, is included in first quarter 2018 10Q, when the official 2018 Q1 end date is March 31, 2018.  This is a material event and should have been made through a separate SEC filing.   Combine this news with Musk’s testiness during the analysts’ earnings call on the same day and the investors have relevant questions.  


    Re: Tesla Roadster

    CGX car nut:

    That is strange.  Wonder why an amendment to a credit agreement made on May 3, 2018, is included in first quarter 2018 10Q, when the official 2018 Q1 end date is March 31, 2018.  This is a material event and should have been made through a separate SEC filing.   Combine this news with Musk’s testiness during the analysts’ earnings call on the same day and the investors have relevant questions.  

    Because it's a subsequent event of relatively little importance that can just be thrown into an MD&A. They added two groups of assets that are available to borrow against and I doubt have any material effect on the total lending base. 


    --

    Past-President, Porsche Club of America - Upper Canada Region


    Re: Tesla Roadster

    I mean, who really cares what they do or don't borrow against? 


    Re: Tesla Roadster

    Mithras:
    CGX car nut:

    That is strange.  Wonder why an amendment to a credit agreement made on May 3, 2018, is included in first quarter 2018 10Q, when the official 2018 Q1 end date is March 31, 2018.  This is a material event and should have been made through a separate SEC filing.   Combine this news with Musk’s testiness during the analysts’ earnings call on the same day and the investors have relevant questions.  

    Because it's a subsequent event of relatively little importance that can just be thrown into an MD&A. They added two groups of assets that are available to borrow against and I doubt have any material effect on the total lending base. 

    Given the history of "tech" companies and accounting standards, one would rather error on the side of caution in disclosing the changes made to the credit facility.   http://markets.businessinsider.com/news/stocks/tesla-stock-price-reveals-accounting-change-was-behind-its-first-quarter-revenue-...

     


    Re: Tesla Roadster

    How short are you on this? I mean, you're literally investing time into reading through financial documents for some random company...


    Re: Tesla Roadster

    noone1:

    How short are you on this? I mean, you're literally investing time into reading through financial documents for some random company...

    Addressed and answered many times, one holds no economic interest for or against TSLA.  However, as an individual in the investment community, one is obligated to keep current of a number of company filings.  Reviewing a 10Q isn't that time consuming nor does one need to provide a rationalization of how one spends one's time.


    Re: Tesla Roadster

    A quick reminder of the potential sources of financing for Tesla looking forward...

    1. EQUITY: Elon Musk has stated that Tesla will NOT issue equity, as they expect (hope) that the company will be profitable and cashflow generative in Q3 and Q4 2018.
    2. HIGH YIELD BONDS: Tesla existing 5.3% notes due 2025 have traded down to around 87% of par following the rating downgrade by Moody's on 27 March 2018 and the Q1 results call. The bonds are rated B- by S&P and Caa1 by Moody's. From bond investors' perspective, a potential near-term downgrade by S&P could see the bonds marked down lower into stressed territory. Hence, it would not be a good time for Tesla to issue additional high yield bonds. The market may provide liquidity at a price, but the yield required would likely be usurious.
    3. BANK DEBT: As a result of points (1) and (2) above, Tesla is increasingly relying upon liquidity under senior secured credit facilities. This is why pledging the Fremont factory to secure bank lending is material enough to require disclose in the Q1 report. It is also notable that the amendment was signed after the Q1 results call.
    4. CASH FLOW: Tesla operations generated $1.1 billion of negative cashflow during Q1 2018. At the end of Q1, the company had $2.665bn of cash and cash equivalents remaining on the balance sheet.

    ...so Elon Musk is relying on bank lenders to maintain liquidity at Tesla, until the company either (i) generates positive free cash flow; or (ii) it misses the management forecast to generate positive profitability and cashflow in Q3 and Q4, at which point decisions may (e.g. in the case of a covenant breach) be dictated by the senior secured lenders.

    In this context, it is not surprising that all significant expenditures (over $1m) and capital expenditure require sign off from Elon Musk -- which may help to provide a little comfort to bank lenders that cash is being watched very closely.

    It also implies that commitments to significant future capex projects (e.g. Model Y) may be delayed until the company has become profitable and cashflow positive.

    Given the importance of credit and liquidity at this point, the next updates from the credit rating agencies may provide a further insight into the expected direction of travel. For those unfamiliar with rating agencies, in assigning credit ratings they can have the benefit of detailed non-public information, including the company's own financial projections. To the extent that a company's financial results are below those projected in the rating analysis, the credit rating may be downgraded further.

    This will be an excellent case study for future MBA students! Smiley


    Re: Tesla Roadster

    Boxster Coupe GTS:

    A quick reminder of the potential sources of financing for Tesla looking forward...

    1. EQUITY: Elon Musk has stated that Tesla will NOT issue equity, as they expect (hope) that the company will be profitable and cashflow generative in Q3 and Q4 2018.
    2. HIGH YIELD BONDS: Tesla existing 5.3% notes due 2025 have traded down to around 87% of par following the rating downgrade by Moody's on 27 March 2018 and the Q1 results call. The bonds are rated B- by S&P and Caa1 by Moody's. From bond investors' perspective, a potential near-term downgrade by S&P could see the bonds marked down lower into stressed territory. Hence, it would not be a good time for Tesla to issue additional high yield bonds. The market may provide liquidity at a price, but the yield required would likely be usurious.
    3. BANK DEBT: As a result of points (1) and (2) above, Tesla is increasingly relying upon liquidity under senior secured credit facilities. This is why pledging the Fremont factory to secure bank lending is material enough to require disclose in the Q1 report. It is also notable that the amendment was signed after the Q1 results call.
    4. CASH FLOW: Tesla operations generated $1.1 billion of negative cashflow during Q1 2018. At the end of Q1, the company had $2.665bn of cash and cash equivalents remaining on the balance sheet.

    ...so Elon Musk is relying on bank lenders to maintain liquidity at Tesla, until the company either (i) generates positive free cash flow; or (ii) it misses the management forecast to generate positive profitability and cashflow in Q3 and Q4, at which point decisions may (e.g. in the case of a covenant breach) be dictated by the senior secured lenders.

    In this context, it is not surprising that all significant expenditures (over $1m) and capital expenditure require sign off from Elon Musk -- which may help to provide a little comfort to bank lenders that cash is being watched very closely.

    It also implies that commitments to significant future capex projects (e.g. Model Y) may be delayed until the company has become profitable and cashflow positive.

    Given the importance of credit and liquidity at this point, the next updates from the credit rating agencies may provide a further insight into the expected direction of travel. For those unfamiliar with rating agencies, in assigning credit ratings they can have the benefit of detailed non-public information, including the company's own financial projections. To the extent that a company's financial results are below those projected in the rating analysis, the credit rating may be downgraded further.

    This will be an excellent case study for future MBA students! Smiley

    Excellent!  Another question to consider is what Tesla told their lenders about Model 3 conversion rates and why Musk refused to address that question during the analysts earnings call.  On the other hand the Tesla universe is going crazy over the 25 y/o YouTuber who took 23 minutes of wind out of the call last week.  


    Re: Tesla Roadster

    Musk bought $9mio of Tesla shares on Monday... He is either insane or a genius... or both?


    Re: Tesla Roadster

    A rather small purchase in the scope of his wealth/ownership, but that said, Jamie Dimon put in the bottom on JPM (and the entire market really) in 2016 when he bought 20M of JPM.

    I really don't know why Musk bought $9M instead of $19M or $40M or whatever. It's not a lot, and it's not a little. It's all relative I guess.


    Re: Tesla Roadster

    noone1:

    A rather small purchase in the scope of his wealth/ownership, but that said, Jamie Dimon put in the bottom on JPM (and the entire market really) in 2016 when he bought 20M of JPM.

    I really don't know why Musk bought $9M instead of $19M or $40M or whatever. It's not a lot, and it's not a little. It's all relative I guess.

    When you get stock in that kind of size it's not bought on the open market it's a block trade. A single seller would have been looking to offload those shares in one go and found a buyer in Munk. He has a family office that runs his investments for him, whoever had the block for sale would have have called an bank or broker/dealer they have a relationship with and had their sales & trading desk look for a buyer. The largest shareholder is always a good call to make...


    --

    Past-President, Porsche Club of America - Upper Canada Region


    Re: Tesla Roadster

    I don't think $9M is too big to sell/buy on the open market given the volume and size of the company. Whether he did or not, I have no idea. Maybe someone sold $100M to several different buyers. Or maybe they did buy it on the open market.

    Just saw a report that said he purchased them over the course of two days, so that makes it even more likely it was an open market buy.


    Re: Tesla Roadster

    I think it is a bigger deal than you imply. Most of his wealth is already tied in Tesla stock and he had to come up with some cash to buy these shares...


    Re: Tesla Roadster

    I'm sure he has $10M in liquid cash/assets. The guy isn't living entirely on loans against is Tesla shares. Doesn't he have like a couple $20M homes?


    Re: Tesla Roadster

    Most likely his homes have mortgages. Many wealthy people locked in large mortgages when rates were very low... I am not that wealthy but still did that too following advice from people I usually largely ignore. Worked out very well smiley


    Re: Tesla Roadster

    I'm just going to make a wild guess that Musk has $10M+ in a savings account at any given time.

    And he's still gotta make down payments and make the payments. $30M in mortgages at 3.5% is still $150K/month in payments. And that's just on housing.

    I'm guess Musk has plenty of cash.


    Re: Tesla Roadster

    SciFrog:

    Musk bought $9mio of Tesla shares on Monday... He is either insane or a genius... or both?

     

    Not insane, it's clean ever actually.

    He needs to prop up the stock prices, what better way than to announce he bought extra shares? To investors, that's one of the best thing Elon could have done, more so than announcing vapourware.He is the biggest shareholder after all.

    Spending 9 mil on shares and everyone else jumped in to and sent the stock price a few dollars higher, and his net worth went up multiple of that 9 mil.

    Stock price is safely on the other side of $300 now, so his financial deals that hinges on stock prices are safe again.

     

     


    --

     

     


    Re: Tesla Roadster

    Whoopsy:
    SciFrog:

    Musk bought $9mio of Tesla shares on Monday... He is either insane or a genius... or both?

     

    Not insane, it's clean ever actually.

    He needs to prop up the stock prices, what better way than to announce he bought extra shares? To investors, that's one of the best thing Elon could have done, more so than announcing vapourware.He is the biggest shareholder after all.

    Spending 9 mil on shares and everyone else jumped in to and sent the stock price a few dollars higher, and his net worth went up multiple of that 9 mil.

    Stock price is safely on the other side of $300 now, so his financial deals that hinges on stock prices are safe again.

     

     

    Your logic is flawed because a couple percent doesn't make or break the story, and he doesn't stand to gain anything since he can't just go sell it.

    He is either truly crazy or just simply thinks he's right and the shorts are wrong. Maybe he does in fact know something the analysts don't. I mean, he is CEO after all...


    Re: Tesla Roadster

    No idea where this will end up but that’s fascinating.

    On another note has anyone toyed with the idea of the solar roof tiles? We priced it but it was expensive and would not be available on time to put on our extension...


    Re: Tesla Roadster

    Haven't, but I'm not a fan unless the cost is parity. To me, solar roofs are a way to contributing to the movement of renewable energy because it's the right/smart thing to do. That said, I'd rather just invest in giant infrastructure projects where dollars go furthest.

    Then again, maybe there are no such projects that individuals can contribute to with any sort of return/savings.

    And if there aren't such projects, my next business idea is to create one. Seems like common sense to let customers buy "managed" panels off-site at a giant solar farm, and then give them a discount on their bill equivalent to the amount of power their panels generated.


    Re: Tesla Roadster

    noone1:
    Whoopsy:
    SciFrog:

    Musk bought $9mio of Tesla shares on Monday... He is either insane or a genius... or both?

     

    Not insane, it's clean ever actually.

    He needs to prop up the stock prices, what better way than to announce he bought extra shares? To investors, that's one of the best thing Elon could have done, more so than announcing vapourware.He is the biggest shareholder after all.

    Spending 9 mil on shares and everyone else jumped in to and sent the stock price a few dollars higher, and his net worth went up multiple of that 9 mil.

    Stock price is safely on the other side of $300 now, so his financial deals that hinges on stock prices are safe again.

     

     

    Your logic is flawed because a couple percent doesn't make or break the story, and he doesn't stand to gain anything since he can't just go sell it.

    He is either truly crazy or just simply thinks he's right and the shorts are wrong. Maybe he does in fact know something the analysts don't. I mean, he is CEO after all...

     

    This is where you are wrong.

    Tesla, and Elon, have tons of stocks of Tesla as collaterals. There is minimum stock price written in somewhere where the collateral is worth what was borrowed. If the price falls below that threshold they will have to pledge more stocks to cover.

    The last thing they want right now is a call back of loans or pledging more shares. Tesla currently has a liquidity problem, they thinks they can get though it once the Model 3 is in mass production an the cash flow coming in will be enough. 

    Did you see the amendment earlier? By pledging in the factory, the creditors have something more solid to hold on to and can let Tesla borrow more against it. 

    Tesla is hoping this cash flow problem is a short term thing. Propping up stock prices to reinforce the value of collaterals is the cheapest thing Elon can do. It's almost like free money. 


    --

     

     


    Re: Tesla Roadster

    Except there is no indication $280 was the magic number or anything of the sort. The stock has been trading around these levels for like a year now. It's not like TSLA was crashing. It was down modestly.


    Re: Tesla Roadster

    noone1:

    Except there is no indication $280 was the magic number or anything of the sort. The stock has been trading around these levels for like a year now. It's not like TSLA was crashing. It was down modestly.

     

    And we wouldn't know what price Elon had agreed to, it could very well be around there.

     


    --

     

     


    Re: Tesla Roadster

    It's also worth keeping in mind that Tesla's debt maturities include convertible bonds... another reason for a CEO to watch the stock price! Smiley

    For example, Tesla has a $230 million bond inherited from SolarCity due in November with a strike price of nearly $561 per share; a $920 million convertible in March 2019 with a strike price of about $360; another $566 million SolarCity convertible bond due in November 2019 with a strike of about $760 per share... Smiley

    While $230 million in November 2018 and $566 million due in November 2019 are a significant distance from converting into equity, Elon may be hoping that Tesla stock recovers to trade above $360 by March 2019 which would avoid another $920 million of debt maturing... Smiley

    For reference, an extract from the 2018 Q1 filing in the Risk Factors...

    1525813797665image.jpeg


     
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