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    Why I'm glad I didn't get the S, IMO

    So I have an 05 987 tip and i took it in for repair, and the gave me an 08 Boxster S tip.  I thought I would be amazed at the differences, but nothing of the sort:

    First off, I should say I'm glad I got stone grey instead of the savannah beige, because knowing myself, that interior gets dirty soooo fast, and with me, it would be completely ugly.  

     2nd, I have on my car the standard audio system that comes with it.  This car had the Bose surround sound.  Even when I put the Bass at its highest and the surround was on, I could barely tell a small difference, ok, maybe a little more than small, but not worth the money.  I am so glad I saved the money.

     3rd, the Boxster S has bigger brakes and better suspension, of which I could see a small difference, but not important enough to grant much more money.  This car had only 6000 miles while mine has 24,000 so granted, this car would automatically be a little more stiff.

     4th, the engine.  This engine has 295 hp while mine has 240.  A difference of 55.  I thought this would be huge, but the difference was completely negligible.  I saw that the car did accelerate a little faster but not fast enough to warrant an S badge.

    5th, and finally, the biggest reason: the sound.  The engine sound of this car is much less and not at all as beautiful as the non-S.  I have no clue why but everyone who was with me agreed as well.  This car's sound is toned down it seems and had a low whine, while my non-S has a much louder growl. 

    oh, and those stock S tips are so damn ugly. 

     Maybe it is because both are tips and the manuals will have a significant difference, I dunno.  But I returned that car and got mine back so satisfied I had saved the extra 10,000 dollars.  Smiley


    Re: Why I'm glad I didn't get the S, IMO

    Sounds like there was something very much wrong with the S you drove - even allowing for the horrible, nasty and very unsporting tiptronic transmission. Thank Ferdinand that it's been replaced at last by PDK. I've driven several tips, both 987 and 997 and every time I've driven one it has re-confirmed how prehistoric it is and how it stunts both performance and engine response compared with the manual. It ruins a world class sports car.

    I can assure you there should be a very significant difference in performance between 2.7 and the S - even the difference between the 3.2S and the 3.4S is very noticeable, particularly in response and the more freer revving engine.There is certainly nothing wrong with S engine note, though - but if you do like a more vocal sound then retrofitting PSE is not horrifically expensive unlike some tequipment prices.

    I have to agree with you about the nasty oval exhaust tips, though!


    --
    Boxster S 3.4 06 Cobalt / Ocean Blue BMW 123d M Sport 08 Le Mans Blue / Lemon

    Re: Why I'm glad I didn't get the S, IMO

    yea, i've driven the PDK, i like it better. (I live in Los Angeles deal with traffic every single day), the tip is just easier for me.  And there was a difference in performance, i agree, but to me it wasn't signiicant enough to give over 10,000 dollars.  

     And I guess it's just IMHO, the engine note was nothing compared to the 2.7.  It just wasn't loud enough on residential driving. 

     i dunno.  Maybe it's just me.  from 45,000 to 55,000, I dont see the logic in spending that much more for so little.  but once again guys, this is just my opinion, Im not trying to state what is right or wrong, lol.  



    Re: Why I'm glad I didn't get the S, IMO

    bigantballs:

    So I have an 05 987 tip and i took it in for repair, and the gave me an 08 Boxster S tip.  I thought I would be amazed at the differences, but nothing of the sort:

    First off, I should say I'm glad I got stone grey instead of the savannah beige, because knowing myself, that interior gets dirty soooo fast, and with me, it would be completely ugly.  

     2nd, I have on my car the standard audio system that comes with it.  This car had the Bose surround sound.  Even when I put the Bass at its highest and the surround was on, I could barely tell a small difference, ok, maybe a little more than small, but not worth the money.  I am so glad I saved the money.

     3rd, the Boxster S has bigger brakes and better suspension, of which I could see a small difference, but not important enough to grant much more money.  This car had only 6000 miles while mine has 24,000 so granted, this car would automatically be a little more stiff.

     4th, the engine.  This engine has 295 hp while mine has 240.  A difference of 55.  I thought this would be huge, but the difference was completely negligible.  I saw that the car did accelerate a little faster but not fast enough to warrant an S badge.

    5th, and finally, the biggest reason: the sound.  The engine sound of this car is much less and not at all as beautiful as the non-S.  I have no clue why but everyone who was with me agreed as well.  This car's sound is toned down it seems and had a low whine, while my non-S has a much louder growl. 

    oh, and those stock S tips are so damn ugly. 

     Maybe it is because both are tips and the manuals will have a significant difference, I dunno.  But I returned that car and got mine back so satisfied I had saved the extra 10,000 dollars.  Smiley


            I completely agree! My feelings were the same when I tested the boxster S 295cv 2 years ago.acceleration 0-80km/h is the same more or less


    --
    Dedi La vita è troppo corta per non guidare italiano.....

    Re: Why I'm glad I didn't get the S, IMO

    Hi bigantballs Smiley

    Thanks for sharing your impressions.

    I think the 2 key points are that (1) 'perceptions' are not always in perfect sync with technical realities. Clearly there is a big difference of 55 bhp 'on paper' between the 05 987 and the 08 987S. Normally, one would expect that to be easily noticeable.

    But the second key issue is that (2) you were judging the cars through the prism of the Tip S transmission. I definitely agree with DC here - it really affects the performance of the car. While you could argue that 'it's the same for both cars', I would say that comparing Tip S versions of both cars just makes the whole comparison into a distorted one. IMHO DC's comment that the Tip S spoils a world class car is no exaggeration or hyperbole. But - I entirely understand your situation - for daily commuting in traffic, avoiding a manual can be preferable to some drivers (such as yourself) - and I fully respect that choice - even though I wouldn't make it myself.

    Ideally, if you compared a manual 08 987S with a manual 05 987, my expectation would be that you would notice a significant difference.

    In the Boxster range, the difference between 987 and 987S was about 55 bhp. In the 911 range, the 997 and 997S difference was 325 bhp vs 355 bhp - only 30 bhp - an even smaller difference on paper that was nonetheless noticeable.

    I think you hit the nail on the head when you focussed on sound. It contributes greatly to your 'perception' of power and performance.

    BTW about the other stuff you mentioned, again, it can be subjective. I have the BOSE system in my 997S and I love it - to my ears, it's a vast improvement over the standard sound system.

    About the exhaust note though - I love PSE. I'm sure if you retrofitted it, you'd love it too. It's very raspy and aggressive. With the top down, you will hear it even better! It's enough to make grown men hunt for tunnels to drive through! ;)

    I love the red brakes on my 997S. The standard 997 brakes (with black calipers) work almost as well but they have a different feel. They felt more 'snatchy' to me. The big reds just 'smother' the brake discs. It's a hard feeling to describe but I know for sure that I prefer the big reds and that I can tell the difference. Still, it's horses for courses! :)

    But overall, whichever choices you made, it's all good - enjoy Smiley


    --

    Rennteam Moderator - 997S GT Silver/Cocoa, -20mm/LSD, PSE, SportDesign rims, Zuffenhausen collection


    Re: Why I'm glad I didn't get the S, IMO

    I agree that the difference between an "S" and non "S" is not as significant as I thought it would be. I have driven both a Boxster and Cayman S and there is no question the "S" is quicker it is hard to see why it costs $10,000 more. Although I always want to buy more and may even buy an "S" next time, it is hard to justify the premium. Anything with the Porsche badge on it is the best vehicle on the road. I have thought about buying an M3 or a C63 to replace my Porsche but nothing compares even though both those vehicles have significantly more power.
    --
    Porsche Crazed - Boxster 987 Speed Yellow/Black

    Re: Why I'm glad I didn't get the S, IMO

    This is sort of like the argument that money won't bring you happiness, but I see lots of people wantingt to be rich but no one who wants to be poor!

    I see "NON S" drivers dismissing any advantages of the S', but I can't remember any "S" owners wishing they had bought the NON S!

    Just like when the ne wmodels arrive, all of the guys who bought the previous model will wax lryically about how inferior the new model is compared to their choice.

    Denial is not a river in Egypt.


    Re: Why I'm glad I didn't get the S, IMO

    yea i totally think the S is definitely an improvement.  And I think with a manual, the differences will be much more noticeable.  Maybe that's where I went wrong in my comparison.  I'll have to try out the manuals.  

    But I guess the other thing is that I don't use my Boxster as a hard-core racing machine, I use it more as a cruiser.  So maybe that's why I didnt like the S.  I mean, for the money, I could have gotten a much more powerful car, but there is just nothing like a Porsche.  

    But I am gonna look into PSE, maybe that will help.  I don't think I've ever heard PSE other than vids on youtube (of which you cant tell anything). 

     But thanks for all the responses. :)

     To each his own. 



    Re: Why I'm glad I didn't get the S, IMO

    My impressions were about manual 987 240hp  vs manual 987 s 295hp
    --
    Dedi La vita è troppo corta per non guidare italiano.....

    Re: Why I'm glad I didn't get the S, IMO

    The 2.7 you need to rev more, but it's not too shabby.Better flexibility lower down the rev range with the S. Tips are very very annoying!


    Re: Why I'm glad I didn't get the S, IMO

    I love my S. Then again, I like most things that are Porsche.

     Hp is quickly gotten used to -kind of like money. For those who want too much, there is never enough.


    --
    2008 Boxster S

    Re: Why I'm glad I didn't get the S, IMO

    I partly agree with you.

     

    years ago I had my 05' 2.7L manual for service and I got a 3.2L Tip as a loaner.

    to y surpirse there wasnt much difference, well, not AUD 30k difference. 

    plus I HATED the tip. its retarded.

     

    BUT.

    i got a chance to drive a 08 3.4L boxster S manual.  oh my oh my... its night and day difference.  the 3.4L is sweeeet!!  and I bet the 3.4 DFI engine is even sweeter.

     

    thats why i had a hard time deciding wether to upgrade to a Cayman S FL or C63.

    as u all know, i chose the latter.

     

    go try a C63. u will be impressed.  esp coming from a std 2.7 boxster. Smiley

    just dont blame me if u ended up ordering one!


    Re: Why I'm glad I didn't get the S, IMO

    Generally, people prefer what they own, that's why they purchased it in the first place.

    +1 for the S.

    vincesf 

    RearShot1-26-09medium.jpg
     


    Re: Why I'm glad I didn't get the S, IMO

    Very true observation vincesf  Smiley
    --

    Rennteam Moderator - 997S GT Silver/Cocoa, -20mm/LSD, PSE, SportDesign rims, Zuffenhausen collection


    Re: Why I'm glad I didn't get the S, IMO

    easy_rider911:

    Hi bigantballs Smiley

    Thanks for sharing your impressions.

    I think the 2 key points are that (1) 'perceptions' are not always in perfect sync with technical realities. Clearly there is a big difference of 55 bhp 'on paper' between the 05 987 and the 08 987S. Normally, one would expect that to be easily noticeable.

    But the second key issue is that (2) you were judging the cars through the prism of the Tip S transmission. I definitely agree with DC here - it really affects the performance of the car. While you could argue that 'it's the same for both cars', I would say that comparing Tip S versions of both cars just makes the whole comparison into a distorted one. IMHO DC's comment that the Tip S spoils a world class car is no exaggeration or hyperbole. But - I entirely understand your situation - for daily commuting in traffic, avoiding a manual can be preferable to some drivers (such as yourself) - and I fully respect that choice - even though I wouldn't make it myself.

    Ideally, if you compared a manual 08 987S with a manual 05 987, my expectation would be that you would notice a significant difference.

    In the Boxster range, the difference between 987 and 987S was about 55 bhp. In the 911 range, the 997 and 997S difference was 325 bhp vs 355 bhp - only 30 bhp - an even smaller difference on paper that was nonetheless noticeable.

    I think you hit the nail on the head when you focussed on sound. It contributes greatly to your 'perception' of power and performance.

    BTW about the other stuff you mentioned, again, it can be subjective. I have the BOSE system in my 997S and I love it - to my ears, it's a vast improvement over the standard sound system.

    About the exhaust note though - I love PSE. I'm sure if you retrofitted it, you'd love it too. It's very raspy and aggressive. With the top down, you will hear it even better! It's enough to make grown men hunt for tunnels to drive through! ;)

    I love the red brakes on my 997S. The standard 997 brakes (with black calipers) work almost as well but they have a different feel. They felt more 'snatchy' to me. The big reds just 'smother' the brake discs. It's a hard feeling to describe but I know for sure that I prefer the big reds and that I can tell the difference. Still, it's horses for courses! :)

    But overall, whichever choices you made, it's all good - enjoy Smiley

    According to Porsche's web site, there's only a .2 second difference in 0-60 between the 997 and 997S. Considering that, I wonder if 30hp is really noticeable. I suppose if you ask S owners, Yes! And if you ask non-S owners, No! I recall Chris Harris, an S owner, said he bought the wrong car when he drove a friend's non-S with PCCB brakes which he thought had better road feel due to its lighter weight. Excellence magazine has also said the non-S, boxster and 997.1, was a better value than than the S.  Go figure.

     


            


    Re: Why I'm glad I didn't get the S, IMO

    Last fall at the track I noticed a difference between my 07 S and the non-s especially with top end on the long straight.  I quickly moved by the non-s.  Normal daily driving maybe not as great but I really like the 3.4 in the S.

    Re: Why I'm glad I didn't get the S, IMO

    0.2s for 0-60 is a lot...

     
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