Rennteam 2.0 - EN - Forum - I have always wondered about P21S products. - Page1

Jul 15, 2006 11:34:44 PM

nberry: Rennteam VIP; Loc: La Jolla, USA , United States; Posts: 13473, Gallery; Registered on: Apr 11, 2002

I have always wondered about P21S products.

Usually I use One Grand terrific stuff. So the other day I bought P21S cleaner wax and P21s Canuba wax paste. The wax paste cost $35 for a very small jar.

Today, I first applied the cleaner to set up for the paste wax. I then followed with the paste wax. The entire job took about 1 1/2 hours.

Guy's I must tell you, the results were magnificent. I took the 430 out for a spin and I have never seen so many heads turn. I am accustomed to attention but the brillance of the car drew even more. One woman folowed me and asked what kind of car is that and when I told all her response was "all I can say is WOW".

I highly recommend the P21S products.

However, one caveat. The wax/paste does not last long. Usually about a month or two.

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Jul 16, 2006 12:48:32 AM

Justin: Veteran; Loc: San Diego, CA, USA; Posts: 979, Gallery; Registered on: Jan 12, 2003; Reply to: nberry

Re: I have always wondered about P21S products.

P21S's greatest feature is ease of use IMO. If you have just applied it today, tomororow it will look even better, as surface settles and the solvents will evaporate. The surface hardens a bit it seems. I assume the other product you purchased is P21S Gloss Enhancing Paint Cleanser, which is a glaze and polish in one.

I used to use P21S paste wax on my black Mercedes a few years ago, but San Diego summers were not kind to it at all. Slickness and beading would deteriorate very quickly. It is much better suited for a weekend car such as your 430. It seems to also look better on lighter colors, as it is more reflective than some other carnauba paste waxes.

In any case, how good the paint looks is a function of how well it has been burnished and prepped. Wax is just icing on the cake.

I have so many different boutique products on my shelf, let me know if you want to try something else if you get bored of P21S. Though I suspect you have found your new winner for a while.

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Jul 16, 2006 12:55:34 AM

JP66: Rennteam Pro; Loc: Seattle , United States; Posts: 2217, Gallery; Registered on: Jul 10, 2003; Reply to: nberry

Re: I have always wondered about P21S products.

Quote:
nberry said:
I took the 430 out for a spin and I have never seen so many heads turn. I am accustomed to attention....

How many times did you circle the Starbucks???

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Jul 16, 2006 2:43:10 AM

nberry: Rennteam VIP; Loc: La Jolla, USA , United States; Posts: 13473, Gallery; Registered on: Apr 11, 2002; Reply to: JP66

Re: I have always wondered about P21S products.

Quote:
JP66 said:
Quote:
nberry said:
I took the 430 out for a spin and I have never seen so many heads turn. I am accustomed to attention....

How many times did you circle the Starbucks???

Damn you know too well!

I have experimented with several tire dressings and honestly I have not found one to my liking. The McQuiers (sp?) seems to be the best with 3M a close second.

The P21S car shampoo is without a doubt the very best.

BTW are P21S Porsche products?

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Jul 16, 2006 4:03:23 AM

JP66: Rennteam Pro; Loc: Seattle , United States; Posts: 2217, Gallery; Registered on: Jul 10, 2003; Reply to: nberry

Re: I have always wondered about P21S products.

Quote:
nberry said:
I have experimented with several tire dressings and honestly I have not found one to my liking.

Are you looking for "shine" or a nice clean black look that's not "shiny"? I have some Meguiars Hot Shine, but found that to be a little too shiny. I then started using Griots, Vinyl and Rubber Dressing. It works great a has a nice clean look. If your after shine, which you probably are

, the Hot Shine will do the trick. Since I have a full bottle of Hot Shine, I spray it onto the plastic surroundings in the wheel wells after washing. It makes them look really clean.

PS...let's see some pics of your freshly polished/waxed car

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Jul 16, 2006 4:44:19 PM

nberry: Rennteam VIP; Loc: La Jolla, USA , United States; Posts: 13473, Gallery; Registered on: Apr 11, 2002; Reply to: JP66

Re: I have always wondered about P21S products.

Quote:
JP66 said:
Quote:
nberry said:
I have experimented with several tire dressings and honestly I have not found one to my liking.

Are you looking for "shine" or a nice clean black look that's not "shiny"? I have some Meguiars Hot Shine, but found that to be a little too shiny. I then started using Griots, Vinyl and Rubber Dressing. It works great a has a nice clean look. If your after shine, which you probably are , the Hot Shine will do the trick. Since I have a full bottle of Hot Shine, I spray it onto the plastic surroundings in the wheel wells after washing. It makes them look really clean.

PS...let's see some pics of your freshly polished/waxed car

I don't want it too shiny. What is important is low gloss that does not splatter. I will look into Griot.

I would post a picture but honestly unless you are actually looking at it, pictures do not do it justice.

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Jul 16, 2006 6:48:47 PM

Justin: Veteran; Loc: San Diego, CA, USA; Posts: 979, Gallery; Registered on: Jan 12, 2003; Reply to: nberry

Re: I have always wondered about P21S products.

303 or Raggtop (same company that makes the factory protectant for canvas tops) Vinyl protectant. They are not the longest lasting products, but they leave an acceptable amount of shine. Just enough so that you notice they have been dressed. If you want more shine, two coats really "bling" the tires.

For a long lasting dressing, try Zaino Z-16. It seems to have a bit more shine though.

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Jul 17, 2006 5:09:50 AM

Guibo: Newbie; Loc: CA; Posts: 4, Gallery; Registered on: Nov 10, 2004; Reply to: Justin

Re: I have always wondered about P21S products.

For longevity, you might want to put down a coat of sealant before your next coat of P21S. Sealant can last anywhere from 5-12 months. Using a spray wax or quick detailer between washings can help too.

BTW, S100 wax is basically the same thing as the P21S carnauba wax (aside from small differences in color and smell), but can be had for about $16 online or from a local Harley store.

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Jul 17, 2006 3:23:20 PM

MAVERICK: Veteran; Loc: Cincinnati, OH (USA) , United States; Posts: 1145, Gallery; Registered on: May 31, 2004; Reply to: Guibo

Re: I have always wondered about P21S products.

Quote:
Guibo said:
For longevity, you might want to put down a coat of sealant before your next coat of P21S. Sealant can last anywhere from 5-12 months. Using a spray wax or quick detailer between washings can help too.

BTW, S100 wax is basically the same thing as the P21S carnauba wax (aside from small differences in color and smell), but can be had for about $16 online or from a local Harley store.

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Jul 17, 2006 3:50:10 PM

nberry: Rennteam VIP; Loc: La Jolla, USA , United States; Posts: 13473, Gallery; Registered on: Apr 11, 2002; Reply to: Guibo

Re: I have always wondered about P21S products.

Quote:
Guibo said:
For longevity, you might want to put down a coat of sealant before your next coat of P21S. Sealant can last anywhere from 5-12 months. Using a spray wax or quick detailer between washings can help too.

BTW, S100 wax is basically the same thing as the P21S carnauba wax (aside from small differences in color and smell), but can be had for about $16 online or from a local Harley store.

Good information.

What type of sealant and where would I get it?

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Jul 18, 2006 3:41:11 AM

Guibo: Newbie; Loc: CA; Posts: 4, Gallery; Registered on: Nov 10, 2004; Reply to: nberry

Re: I have always wondered about P21S products.

If you're inclined to try Griot's, then they have a sealant too which they estimate to last (under most cases) for about 1 year. It does have a mild polishing agent, so unless you have swirl marks, you might want to bypass this altogether as polish does remove a small bit of clearcoat with each use.
Here's their sealant:
http://www.griotsgarage.com/catalog.jsp?L1=L1_1000&L2=L2_1005&SKU=11075

Mothers and Meguiars also have similar sealants with a mild polishing agent and can be found locally (Kragens, Pep Boys, etc). You can also order them at this link below, where it seems that at least two of the products are pure sealants w/o polishing agents (Klasse High Gloss Sealant and Wolfgang Deep Gloss Sealant):
http://www.autogeek.net/was.html

Best of luck!

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Jul 18, 2006 4:55:24 AM

Justin: Veteran; Loc: San Diego, CA, USA; Posts: 979, Gallery; Registered on: Jan 12, 2003; Reply to: Guibo

Re: I have always wondered about P21S products.

There are tons and tons of sealants/waxes on the market, and at some point it becomes like Porsche vs. Ferrari vs. Lambo, etc.

Wolfgang, Platinum, and Menzerna brand sealants are similar.
Pros: Among the best looking IMO, very wet, extremely slick surface, very easy to use.
Cons: Mediocre durability for a sealant, probably due to the oils that make the product slick.

Klasse Sealant Glaze
Pros: Readily available at MB/BMW dealers, very reflective, like adding a skin of plastic over the car. After it has cured, many like to add a layer of P21S or other paste wax on top.
Cons: Can be difficult to remove if appied too thicky. Product may have changed due to VOC compliance issues, and doesn't seem to have the same durability as older versions (could be my imagination).

Zaino Z5 and Z2
Pros: One of the longest lasting products available, looks great once you have a few layers on. Fairly easy to use once you have the process down
Cons: Instructions can make the process seem too complex. Longer cure time before slickness and shine really comes out, compared to Wolgang, Menzerna, etc.

Zaino fans tend to be a bit fanatical online, but I haven't found a sealant that is as well rounded. I tend to rotate the product I use, otherwise I'd have all these products on the shelf going to waste.

- Justin

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Jul 18, 2006 4:58:44 AM

Justin: Veteran; Loc: San Diego, CA, USA; Posts: 979, Gallery; Registered on: Jan 12, 2003; Reply to: Guibo

Re: I have always wondered about P21S products.

BTW, Griot's Paint Sealant seems a little gimmicky in that they also ask you to use the Spray Wax after each wash to maintain the Paint Sealant. This is not atypical, but I wonder if their 1-year durability claim includes this spray wax. If so, it probably doesn't last very long without using the spray wax to replenish the product. Still, that's not very different form how you'd use other sealants...

Most importantly, drive more, and polish less.

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Jul 18, 2006 8:07:22 PM

vtrader: Veteran; Loc: Los Angeles; Posts: 1085, Gallery; Registered on: Jun 6, 2004; Reply to: nberry

Re: I have always wondered about P21S products.

Quote:
nberry said:
...I have experimented with several tire dressings and honestly I have not found one to my liking. The McQuiers (sp?) seems to be the best with 3M a close second.

The P21S car shampoo is without a doubt the very best.

BTW are P21S Porsche products?

Nick,

Meguiar's has a class for the Ferrari Owners Club coming up. Its a freebie and they give you products afterwards. They are located in Irvine and it may be worth the drive. Plus, you can try different products on your car afterwards.

Here is the link:
http://www.meguiarsonline.com/forums/showthread.php?s=&threadid=11362

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Jul 18, 2006 11:23:29 PM

nberry: Rennteam VIP; Loc: La Jolla, USA , United States; Posts: 13473, Gallery; Registered on: Apr 11, 2002; Reply to: vtrader

Re: I have always wondered about P21S products.

Quote:
vtrader said:
Quote:
nberry said:
...I have experimented with several tire dressings and honestly I have not found one to my liking. The McQuiers (sp?) seems to be the best with 3M a close second.

The P21S car shampoo is without a doubt the very best.

BTW are P21S Porsche products?

Nick,

Meguiar's has a class for the Ferrari Owners Club coming up. Its a freebie and they give you products afterwards. They are located in Irvine and it may be worth the drive. Plus, you can try different products on your car afterwards.

Here is the link:
http://www.meguiarsonline.com/forums/showthread.php?s=&threadid=11362

Thanks for the information.

What i don't understand is if the wax goes over the sealant why would that tend to add to the durability of the wax? Wouldn't the exposure reduce wax durability regardless of what is under it?

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Jul 18, 2006 11:38:35 PM

Justin: Veteran; Loc: San Diego, CA, USA; Posts: 979, Gallery; Registered on: Jan 12, 2003; Reply to: nberry

Re: I have always wondered about P21S products.

Quote:
nberry said:
What i don't understand is if the wax goes over the sealant why would that tend to add to the durability of the wax? Wouldn't the exposure reduce wax durability regardless of what is under it?

I've never heard of the durability of wax being increased because it was layered over a synthetic.

You are correct. Carnauba paste waxes merely adhere to the surface, as opposed to sealants, which need to bond to it. So unless the sealant is providing a better base for the wax to adhere to, durability of the wax should be the same.

Once the wax wears off, you will still have the sealant there to protect the finish. You can then rewax when you feel like and not worry about the paint being bare (assuming the sealant has also not worn off). The combination also looks stellar. Carnauba paste waxes have a lot of carrier solvent, so I'm not sure how much this affects the durability of the sealant you are layering over.

Due to the bonding nature of most sealants, after applying paste wax, you will not be able to reapply the sealant before the paste wax completely wears off, or before chemically cleaning the paint.

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Jul 19, 2006 4:28:09 PM

AJVIP: Expert; Loc:; Posts: 1862, Gallery; Registered on: May 30, 2005; Reply to: Justin

Re: I have always wondered about P21S products.

I can vouch for the Klasse sealant / p21s Caranuba Wax combo. P21s is by far the best wax I have used - in terms of the whole package - shine, ease of application/removal and even durability. Then again, I only use it for the weekend car so I haven't experienced yet with a daily driver. I find that P21s beads MORE than Rejex but of course does not last as long. I apply an extra layer of P21s almost every two weeks, and the results are excellent.

Nick, I believe you had a thread on here several weeks ago about tire shine. I still find my favorite to be Mother's Reflections Tire Shine to be the best and closest to the matte look that you are looking for. It's important that you clean off the tire well and scrub it clean before applying it. After putting the Reflections on and wiping off any excess, it leaves a beautiful matte finish. I would leave it for two hours before driving it though as I have noticed splattering with the tire shine when waiting only an hour or so.

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Jul 19, 2006 7:50:51 PM

nberry: Rennteam VIP; Loc: La Jolla, USA , United States; Posts: 13473, Gallery; Registered on: Apr 11, 2002; Reply to: AJVIP

Re: I have always wondered about P21S products.

Quote:
ajcastaneda said:
I can vouch for the Klasse sealant / p21s Caranuba Wax combo. P21s is by far the best wax I have used - in terms of the whole package - shine, ease of application/removal and even durability. Then again, I only use it for the weekend car so I haven't experienced yet with a daily driver. I find that P21s beads MORE than Rejex but of course does not last as long. I apply an extra layer of P21s almost every two weeks, and the results are excellent.

Nick, I believe you had a thread on here several weeks ago about tire shine. I still find my favorite to be Mother's Reflections Tire Shine to be the best and closest to the matte look that you are looking for. It's important that you clean off the tire well and scrub it clean before applying it. After putting the Reflections on and wiping off any excess, it leaves a beautiful matte finish. I would leave it for two hours before driving it though as I have noticed splattering with the tire shine when waiting only an hour or so.

Good Information.

Do you apply the sealant before or after the P21S? I will trying Mothers and applying P21S every couple of weeks. It really isn't difficult to apply.

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Jul 19, 2006 10:59:59 PM

Justin: Veteran; Loc: San Diego, CA, USA; Posts: 979, Gallery; Registered on: Jan 12, 2003; Reply to: nberry

Re: I have always wondered about P21S products.

Klasse SG requires a surface it can bond to, so the sealant first, then P21S paste wax.

Bare minimum steps:
1. Prep surface for sealant by removing foreign oils and waxes. This can be accomplished by a strong car wash solution, alcohol (or something like PrepSol), or using Klasse All-in-One cleaner.
2. Apply Klasse Sealant glaze
3. Allow sealant to cure. 24 hours is reasonable if you have the time. Full cure occurs by 48 hours.
4. Apply P21S paste wax.

The Klasse All-in-One product from step one is a chemical cleaner with very mild abrasives, and some acrylic sealant content. It protects the finish somewhat, and leaves a nice slick finish.

- J

PS: Klasse products are made by a German company called Carlack (so it would seem). Carlack also sells their formula under an American brand called Jeffs Werkstatt. Jeffs has a spray version of the Klasse Sealant Glaze, which is very easy to use.

http://www.jeffswerkstatt.com

Though, for instant gratification, local BMW and MB dealers carry the Klasse line.

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Jul 20, 2006 3:48:52 PM

AJVIP: Expert; Loc:; Posts: 1862, Gallery; Registered on: May 30, 2005; Reply to: Justin

Re: I have always wondered about P21S products.

Justin beat me to it.

Nick, you do the above steps you'll be looking excellent in no time (and save money from using a detailer).

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