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    I must confess

     I miss the sensuous sound of a sport car. The Turbo is as good as it gets in many categories but if I am going to pay $160,000 for a sport car at least provide me with an exhaust sound that makes heart skip a beat, my ears tingle with delight, my face break into a smile as wide as the distance between my ears  and my mind sending erotic signals throughout my body.

    Today, in the turbo I stop at a light next to a 430 coupe. Now I am well aware I could trounce him in acceleration and as is my wont I had no intention of initiating a drag race. Frankly, I don't believe he wanted any part of me.Smiley Yet, I must tell you listening to him acceleration at less than full throttle sent chills up my spine. What a beautiful melodious sound!

    Recently a car critic for I believe CAR magazine in comparing a Ferrari to a Porsche wrote the sound alone is worth the $100,000 you pay more for the Ferrari. I would not go that far but I gladly would pay 10 to $20,000 more for a Porsche that provided a similar sound.

    Will we ever see the day?Smiley I know there are noise restrictions in most jurisdictions but Ferrari, Lambo, AM, Audi and many others seems to comply. Why can't Porsche? They need to understand that high end performance is difficult to accomplish on public roads and therefore they must provide the driver with other sensory delights to enjoy as he/she drive on public streets.


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    Re: I must confess

    You could always replace the Turbo with a 458

    you seems to be in your 'wife's' Porsche a lot

     

    Seriously, I don't think Porsche can do much with the Turbo's exhaust sound, it's just simple physics, the turbo acts as mufflers for sound waves and a turbo car will never ever sound as good as a NA car, and the ones that sounds good to you are all NA cars.

    But I know what you mean by exhaust sounds, my car has aftermarket exhaust, sounds much better than stock but it's still no match for others, especially Aston Martins, those Vantage V8 keep calling me to buy one just for the sound every time I see one on the road.


    Re: I must confess

     Nick, have you though of fitting a high-end aftermarket exhuast system for the Turbo (though being turbocharged its never going to sound like an NA), I haven't heard any for the Turbo in particular but surely there must be some that improve the sound without being tiresome like maybe a set titanium Akrapovic 


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    Re: I must confess

     I haven't considered after market. Does the GT2 sound the same as the turbo or NA 911? I heard the GT3 and it sounded pretty good.

    If things don't change with Porsche, I will look elsewhere. It really does make a difference in riding enjoyment. Hell the Camero's, Dodge STS's and Corvettes have much better exhausts. My wife hasn't objected too much about the sound but she is becoming aware of the passivity of the exhaust. Ultimately, it will be her decision.

    I am still debating what to get for myself.

     


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    Re: I must confess

    I love the sound effect of a good exhaust and the smiles it brings...

    My only ever "poor" ricer choice was a 2.5" stainless steel exhaust on my Focus. I loved every second of it.

    n122504729_32156632_237.jpg


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    indeed shifting is ancient technology - so is a fuel burning engine..  I happen to like both :) 


    Re: I must confess

    Whoopsy:

    you seems to be in your 'wife's' Porsche a lot


    Smiley
     


    Re: I must confess

    Ferdie:
    Whoopsy:

    you seems to be in your 'wife's' Porsche a lot


    Smiley
     

     I like the car but would like a whole lot better if it sounded like a sport car.SmileySmiley

     Porsche owners do not know what they are missing.SmileySmiley


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    Re: I must confess

    nberry:
    Ferdie:
    Whoopsy:

    you seems to be in your 'wife's' Porsche a lot


    Smiley
     

     I like the car but would like a whole lot better if it sounded like a sport car.SmileySmiley

     Porsche owners do not know what they are missing.SmileySmiley

     

    That is a bit too generalized. Get into a GT3 or a Carrera with PSE and you will not be missing anything Smiley


    --

    997.2 Carrera S in Carrara White. PASM-Sport Suspension (-20 mm), PSE.

    987.1 Boxster S in Arctic Silver. OZ Racing Ultraleggera HLT Wheels, H&R Monotube Coil-Over Suspension, H&R Anti-Roll Bars, Sachs Racing Clutch, Single-Mass Flywheel, Recaro Pole Position Seats, PSE.


    Re: I must confess

    Nick, im sorry Porsche doesn't make a bright yellow Boxster with shitty welds and straight pipes


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    indeed shifting is ancient technology - so is a fuel burning engine..  I happen to like both :) 


    Re: I must confess

     Nick , seriously drive a GT3 RS if you haven't yet....just yesterday had a blast in it again. As to the exhaust note in sport mode the valve opens from 3k rpm in normal mode from 4k onwards - I like the flat six shreeek very much it produces - it's there but not as dominant as in a Ferrari. I also looked at a 430 Scuderia - but if people turn their heads already before you pass them - I found it very embarrassing....very cool for 10 mins - thereafter to much for the roads over here at least....

    Guess you have to decide for a "cruiser" or something more raw - like in my case -that you might drive less but with 100% enjoyment. 

    Alternative : best mix was the SLS for me....


    Re: I must confess

    nberry:

     I haven't considered after market. Does the GT2 sound the same as the turbo or NA 911? I heard the GT3 and it sounded pretty good.

    If things don't change with Porsche, I will look elsewhere. It really does make a difference in riding enjoyment. Hell the Camero's, Dodge STS's and Corvettes have much better exhausts. My wife hasn't objected too much about the sound but she is becoming aware of the passivity of the exhaust. Ultimately, it will be her decision.

    I am still debating what to get for myself.

     

     The GT2 has a mute sound up to about 3000/min. After that, with the throttle pressed, the noise gets pretty loud/impressive (depending on definition Smiley). This setup works fine for me as you can travel in "stealth" mode most of the time and still have a more aggressive sound available in certain situations Smiley


    Re: I must confess

    nberry:

     

    If things don't change with Porsche, I will look elsewhere. It really does make a difference in riding enjoyment. Hell the Camero's, Dodge STS's and Corvettes have much better exhausts. My wife hasn't objected too much about the sound but she is becoming aware of the passivity of the exhaust. Ultimately, it will be her decision.

     

     Sound is one thing. Precision of steering, suspension feed-back, brakes, turbo effect etc. the other... In terms of car response a Porsche does feel very different from a Ferrari. If you like Porsche's setup you will never be satisfied with a Ferrari. Just my personal experience Smiley


    Re: I must confess

    The sound of the N/A 911 is just fine with the sport exhaust. Very sporty and loud enough at 3500-4000rpm and fantastic above 5000rpm. However, because of the position of the engine bystanders enjoy the sound more than occupants, especially in the coupe with windows closed. The GT cars are louder from the inside too, because of different engine and also the absence of rear seats, less soundproofing, thinner rear glass etc.

    I don't like the sound of the Turbo myself. It's not commensurate with the performance and status of this model. There are aftermarket exhausts with louder sound but not necessarily better sound, but I doubt if they are street legal. I'm sure Porsche will rectify this area when the 991 Turbo comes.

    The Ferrari OTOH is an extrovert's car. It sounds as if it is at full throttle even when crawling in traffic queues at 30km/h. Too loud at anytime is something that many people despise, even enthusiasts and often reflects badly, although often unfairly,  on the personality of owners.

    The best sounds, in terms of quality and volume, for me come  from some AMG cars and the BMW V10

     


    --

    "Form follows function"


    Re: I must confess

    the gt2 screams at higher revs. i am not sure it sounds good actually. its more of an aggressive sound.

    porsche have realised that they need to work on the sound of the turbo. so i guess with the 991 it will be fixed.


    --
    Speed has never killed anyone, suddenly becoming stationary... That's what gets you.

    Re: I must confess

    try the GTS cab Smiley


    Re: I must confess

    ARMD009:

    try the GTS cab Smiley

    I agree the factory sport exhaust of 997.2 sounds great.

    The right balance between sound volume and quality.And at the right revs too, as you don't really want to create lots of noise at tickover and annoy everyone  Smiley 

    Especially, in the cab where there is less material between the engine and the driver you enjoy the sound more.

    Of course a flat 6 cannot sound like a V8, V10 or a V12.


    --

    "Form follows function"


    Re: I must confess

    Nberry, buy an aftermarket exhaust for your car.... I have had 2 Turbos now, a 997.1 and 997.2 , the first thing I did was change the exhaust to a Cargraphic exhaust.  They have 3 types, OEM, Loud, and Export I think....I took the middle one of those 3 and I can't tell you what a difference it makes.  The dealer here always asks to borrow my car for client test drives who use the excuse that the Turbo has no exhaust sound.  For about 5k US that should help you feel a little better about your car:):) I'll try to get a video of the sound for you.....

     

     

    Moser


    Re: I must confess

    Moser:

    Nberry, buy an aftermarket exhaust for your car.... I have had 2 Turbos now, a 997.1 and 997.2 , the first thing I did was change the exhaust to a Cargraphic exhaust.  They have 3 types, OEM, Loud, and Export I think....I took the middle one of those 3 and I can't tell you what a difference it makes.  The dealer here always asks to borrow my car for client test drives who use the excuse that the Turbo has no exhaust sound.  For about 5k US that should help you feel a little better about your car:):) I'll try to get a video of the sound for you.....

    In countries where there is regular inspection of cars by the Ministry of Transport including noise measurement, most of these aftermarket exhausts are outside allowed limits.

    In such cases it's best to check beforehand which version is allowed in which country. Unless you want to change the exhaust before each inspection and put it back thereafter. Many people do that on motorbikes but it's more difficult on a car Smiley


    --

    "Form follows function"


    Re: I must confess

    Ya that's true, but mine is legal in the US and Germany, the export version is illegal in Europe, that' why it's called export as they can't install it in Europe.  But ya Nberry check it out before you do anything :) you should be ok in the US though....

     

    Moser

     


    Re: I must confess

    Nick, Cargraphic makes amazing sport exhausts or just look for a US counterpart offering the same quality. Don't go for cheap systems, they can even damage your engine.
    Good systems usually include high flow cats but you should stick with 200 cell cats, not the 100 cell because they can cause trouble with the engine software/OBD system.

    There are export versions available, not legal in Germany for example but I guess not a problem in the US, which sound absolutely amazing and very loud.

    Yes, the sound of the Turbo/Turbo S really sucks and this is one of the reasons Porsche may loose customers on this car, not even sure they are aware of it.


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    RC (Germany) - Rennteam Editor Porsche 997 Turbo, BMW X5 M, BMW M3 Cab DKG, Mini Cooper S JCW


    Re: I must confess

    I'd be surprised to see a car on sale to day that sounds better (stock) than a GT3/RS, maybe a 599 GTO but that's it...

    So if you want sound, look at those models, you will not be disappointed.


    Re: I must confess

    Moser:

    Nberry, buy an aftermarket exhaust for your car.... I have had 2 Turbos now, a 997.1 and 997.2 , the first thing I did was change the exhaust to a Cargraphic exhaust.  They have 3 types, OEM, Loud, and Export I think....I took the middle one of those 3 and I can't tell you what a difference it makes.  The dealer here always asks to borrow my car for client test drives who use the excuse that the Turbo has no exhaust sound.  For about 5k US that should help you feel a little better about your car:):) I'll try to get a video of the sound for you.....

      

    Moser

     There you go Nick, this is what I would do ASAP, Cargraphic is very reputable and known for exhaust systems. 


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    Re: I must confess

    Is it true that on certain aftermarket exhausts (not all)  what you gain in sound you lose in PS? I don't know how that works but I'm sure I've heard it many times 


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    "Form follows function"


    Re: I must confess

    Porker:

    I'd be surprised to see a car on sale to day that sounds better (stock) than a GT3/RS, maybe a 599 GTO but that's it...

    So if you want sound, look at those models, you will not be disappointed.

    An Aston Martin DBS sounds far better than a 599GTO especially when you take out the fuse Smiley


    Re: I must confess

     Gentlemen, thank you all for the good advice. That is why Rennteam has no equal.

    I will do some investigating. However, though many don't believe me, the car does belong to my wife. Her input is essential. I am sure she will not accept an exhaust that is too loud and sounds very raw i.e. as though it has no exhaust.

    What I am looking for which I am confident she will accept is something along the lines of the AM and Ferrari. A vroom like sound which is melodious, smooth and pleasant to the ear. Whether that can be done on a Porsche remains to be seen.

    My other option is to wait for the 991 and hope Porsche sees the light though I am not optimistic.


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    Re: I must confess

    check youtube. many clips of the various exhaust setups. i too find the cargraphic euro version to have a nice raspy sound.

    very NA flat six kind of sound.


    --
    Speed has never killed anyone, suddenly becoming stationary... That's what gets you.

    Re: I must confess

    Nick,

    Coming from a 430 spider, I'm surprised you liked the Turbo that much, especially in the beginning. While my 997.1 Turbo Triptronic coupe surely wasn't as satisfying as your cab, especially with the new dual clutch transmission, I got over the ownership excitement after about 6 months.

    Not sure what bothered me most? Lack of sound, turbo lag or its frustrating over boost characteristics?

    Regretted choosing the turbo over the GT3 almost immediately.  IMO, an aftermarket exhaust won't give you what you're after. Only a proper NA engine will suffice.

    In terms of cabliolets, I know you don't like the SLS, but the Roadster version may change your mind. Fantastic overall package IMO. You also seem to dislike another terrific car - Ferrari California. Too bad. Would be my second choice after the SLS Roadster. Wouldn't touch an AM .

    Cheers.


    Re: I must confess

    Good points.

    When I first saw the SLS roadster a couple of years ago I found it to much better looking than the SLS coupe. Also, the exhaust sound was almost as good as a Ferrari. But at the end of the day, it was/is another iteration of MB. Nothing unique or special other than the 565 hp. 

    The California does not strike me as an aggressive looking car. Its rear is hideous and has a Maserati front. It does have a nice exhaust and when I drove it unattended for almost an hour I did not get the Ferrari feeling nor view it as a competent sport car.

    The Turbo has a somewhat dead feeling but it is nevertheless very good in corners and acceleration especially while in Sport or Sport+. The lag isn't noticeable and the power almost instantaneous. What I don't get is the sport car sensation and much of that is attributable to the exhaust and heaviness of the AWD.


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    Re: I must confess

    nberry:

    The Turbo has a somewhat dead feeling but it is nevertheless very good in corners and acceleration especially while in Sport or Sport+. The lag isn't noticeable and the power almost instantaneous. What I don't get is the sport car sensation and much of that is attributable to the exhaust and heaviness of the AWD.

    Nick, it sounds to me as if you need to test-drive a GT2.  


    --

    fritz


    Re: I must confess

     Fritz, I am afraid I would kill myself.

    Also, when driving in Sport or sport+ it can be rather jarring. I can only imagine what it would be like in a GT2.

    What I need is Porsche to develop a mid-engine car to compete with the 458, MP12 and lambo. Unfortunately, it would end up competing with 911 models. Not sure it would be a good business decision.

    One conclusion I have reached is my preference is for Porsche over any other car. The engineering, quality and value is unsurpassed by ANY car manufacturer. 


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