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    Re: Porsche Mission E...the future of Porsche?

    noone1:

    Guess that's where we differ. A Cayenne/Macan is just a very average car IMO.

    Shocker 


    Re: Porsche Mission E...the future of Porsche?

    SciFrog:
    noone1:

    Maybe it's different in Europe. I don't think a shopping mall in Miami has anything that a shopping mall in Ohio doesn't.

    You clearly have not been shopping in Miami then. Everything you ever need is in two malls, Aventura and Bal Harbor. And there are other cool places too like Winwood, City Center, Merrrick Park, Lincoln Rd. Europe? Everything is spread out in major cities, you have to go everywhere. Smaller cities simply don’t have the shops. 

    Well that's kinda the appeal of city life -- exploring the city on foot to get places that aren't all in one giant mall and single location. I don't consider Miami to be big city life though. 


    Re: Porsche Mission E...the future of Porsche?


    Re: Porsche Mission E...the future of Porsche?

    The subject of exhaust sound is all about nostalgia.

    Every Walter Mitty (me included) wants to drive a race car while driving around town.  Race cars are the epitome of cool and daring.  What's not to like?

    Historically, race cars were very loud because of displacement categories coupled with the requirement for very little back pressure.   If one wanted maximum engine power, a loud exhaust was an engineering requirement.

    Time has moved on.  With EV's, only a faint whine from the e-machine is the tell-tale of monster torque and racing advantage.  As electric racing comes to the fore, NOBODY will fantasize about raucous exhaust as the signature of potency ... it'll be from a pre-historic era.

    After driving my wife's Tesla Model S (and before, her Tesla Roadster) for many years, I'm completely ready for a faint whine to indicate just how quickly we accelerate down the track.  


    --

    Mike

    918 Spyder + 991 GT3 RS +Tesla Roadster 1.5 & Model S + Panamera Turbo +  BMW Z8 + BMW 3.0 CSi + Bentley Arnage T


    Re: Porsche Mission E...the future of Porsche?

    That is true, time can change many tastes and preferences, but on the other hand, it's been many decades since we have digital watches, they are even Smartwatches now, the cheapest digital watch is far superior in every way to old automatic watch technology in regards to the functions of a watch yet there are plenty of people willing to pay tens or hundreds of times the cost of a digital watch for or automatic watch. 

    I think that the reason the beaitiful engine-exhaust sound is going to slowly disappear from cars will be more from legislation weaning them out from our lives forcibly, which ironically will probably increase even more the appeal of them towards their end.


    --

    ⇒ Carlos - Porsche 991 Carrera GTS


    Re: Porsche Mission E...the future of Porsche?

    Carlos from Spain:

    That is true, time can change many tastes and preferences, but on the other hand, it's been many decades since we have digital watches, they are even Smartwatches now, the cheapest digital watch is far superior in every way to old automatic watch technology in regards to the functions of a watch yet there are plenty of people willing to pay tens or hundreds of times the cost of a digital watch for or automatic watch. 

    I think that the reason the beaitiful engine-exhaust sound is going to slowly disappear from cars will be more from legislation weaning them out from our lives forcibly, which ironically will probably increase even more the appeal of them towards their end.

    Most of the premium comes down to brand name though, not because it's mechanical.


    Re: Porsche Mission E...the future of Porsche?

    Wonderbar:

    Thought you folks might enjoy this piece I wrote for a U.S. Porsche magazine.  Remember it is supposed to be  light hearted and tailored for Porsche enthusiasts.  

    Thanks very much for sharing! I really enjoyed reading this! Very well written Smiley


    Re: Porsche Mission E...the future of Porsche?

    bluelines:
    SciFrog:

    ...a nicer place to get the stuffs you need that you cannot get on the internet...

    What can you not get on the Internet these days? SmileySmiley

    Love... Smiley Smiley Smiley


    --

    RC (Germany) - Rennteam Editor Porsche 991.2 Carrera GTS Cabriolet (2018), Porsche Cayenne S Diesel (2017), Audi R8 V10 Plus (2016), Mini JCW (2015)


    Re: Porsche Mission E...the future of Porsche?

    For pedestrians and cyclists, there is real danger for them with electric cars, they are too silent and they can't hear them.

    I think it should be mandatory for every government in the world to require a EV car to make some sort of sound. 

    I am thinking, the sound of ice-cream truck would be perfect.

     


    --

     

     


    Re: Porsche Mission E...the future of Porsche?

    Carlos from Spain:

    That is true, time can change many tastes and preferences, but on the other hand, it's been many decades since we have digital watches, they are even Smartwatches now, the cheapest digital watch is far superior in every way to old automatic watch technology in regards to the functions of a watch yet there are plenty of people willing to pay tens or hundreds of times the cost of a digital watch for or automatic watch. 

    I think that the reason the beaitiful engine-exhaust sound is going to slowly disappear from cars will be more from legislation weaning them out from our lives forcibly, which ironically will probably increase even more the appeal of them towards their end.

    Smiley It is funny: In the past, even maybe five years ago, I was a sucker for pure performance. Exhaust sound? Emotions? Just a by-product. I liked it of course but performance was the most important thing for me. So if you'd asked me five years ago what car I would choose, an EV doing 0-200 kph in 7 seconds or a normal but nice sounding sports car in 10 seconds, I would have chosen the EV. No doubt. Add some track performance and curve fun and definitely the EV. Now? Never ever. I view EVs as some sort of high tech gadgets, nice to drive but the enjoyment lies in using the tech, not in the driving itself. I drove the  Tesla S P100D and yes, if I had the money for several cars, the Tesla would probably be in my garage as well. As a replacement for my R8 or my upcoming E63S? NEVER EVER. BORING. 

    Maybe I am getting older and maybe I will change my opinion again but right now, the more the media and society talks about exhaust sounds and "noise", the more I seem to enjoy the "noise". The appeal will increase sooner or later but I have one worry only: Once EVs are a thing (mass transportation), it is very likely going to raise fuel prices. Once fuel prices hit record highs, petrol cars will be a thing of the past, a luxury item for a few collectors maybe. Luckily, when this time comes (in my opinion not in the next 20-30 years), I will be dead. So I'm good. Smiley Smiley 


    --

    RC (Germany) - Rennteam Editor Porsche 991.2 Carrera GTS Cabriolet (2018), Porsche Cayenne S Diesel (2017), Audi R8 V10 Plus (2016), Mini JCW (2015)


    Re: Porsche Mission E...the future of Porsche?

    Whoopsy:

    For pedestrians and cyclists, there is real danger for them with electric cars, they are too silent and they can't hear them.

    I think it should be mandatory for every government in the world to require a EV car to make some sort of sound. 

    I am thinking, the sound of ice-cream truck would be perfect.

     

    Smiley Smiley We should start a petition... Smiley


    --

    RC (Germany) - Rennteam Editor Porsche 991.2 Carrera GTS Cabriolet (2018), Porsche Cayenne S Diesel (2017), Audi R8 V10 Plus (2016), Mini JCW (2015)


    Re: Porsche Mission E...the future of Porsche?

    Whoopsy:

    For pedestrians and cyclists, there is real danger for them with electric cars, they are too silent and they can't hear them.

    I think it should be mandatory for every government in the world to require a EV car to make some sort of sound. 

    I am thinking, the sound of ice-cream truck would be perfect.

     

    Smiley

    Wy wife was already hit by a Prius in Paris. Car going backwards, wife walking on the street, car coming from behind, bang! Luckily she wasn't hurt.


    Re: Porsche Mission E...the future of Porsche?

    Porsche just needs to install an internal generator that makes a nice sound to re-charge the EV batteries... maybe a naturally aspirated flat-six would do the trick! Smiley

    Porsche Sounds Link: https://youtu.be/ltMXvyA8LIU


    Re: Porsche Mission E...the future of Porsche?

    RC:
    Whoopsy:

    For pedestrians and cyclists, there is real danger for them with electric cars, they are too silent and they can't hear them.

    I think it should be mandatory for every government in the world to require a EV car to make some sort of sound. 

    I am thinking, the sound of ice-cream truck would be perfect.

     

    Smiley Smiley We should start a petition... Smiley

    SmileySmileySmileySmileySmileySmileySmileySmileySmileySmiley


    --

    2016 Porsche 991 Carrera GTS  Black with AeroKit Cup Package,  2017 Porsche Cayenne Platinum  Purpurite Metallic, New York


    Re: Porsche Mission E...the future of Porsche?

    RC:
    Carlos from Spain:

    That is true, time can change many tastes and preferences, but on the other hand, it's been many decades since we have digital watches, they are even Smartwatches now, the cheapest digital watch is far superior in every way to old automatic watch technology in regards to the functions of a watch yet there are plenty of people willing to pay tens or hundreds of times the cost of a digital watch for or automatic watch. 

    I think that the reason the beaitiful engine-exhaust sound is going to slowly disappear from cars will be more from legislation weaning them out from our lives forcibly, which ironically will probably increase even more the appeal of them towards their end.

    Smiley It is funny: In the past, even maybe five years ago, I was a sucker for pure performance. Exhaust sound? Emotions? Just a by-product. I liked it of course but performance was the most important thing for me. So if you'd asked me five years ago what car I would choose, an EV doing 0-200 kph in 7 seconds or a normal but nice sounding sports car in 10 seconds, I would have chosen the EV. No doubt. Add some track performance and curve fun and definitely the EV. Now? Never ever. I view EVs as some sort of high tech gadgets, nice to drive but the enjoyment lies in using the tech, not in the driving itself. I drove the  Tesla S P100D and yes, if I had the money for several cars, the Tesla would probably be in my garage as well. As a replacement for my R8 or my upcoming E63S? NEVER EVER. BORING. 

    Maybe I am getting older and maybe I will change my opinion again but right now, the more the media and society talks about exhaust sounds and "noise", the more I seem to enjoy the "noise". The appeal will increase sooner or later but I have one worry only: Once EVs are a thing (mass transportation), it is very likely going to raise fuel prices. Once fuel prices hit record highs, petrol cars will be a thing of the past, a luxury item for a few collectors maybe. Luckily, when this time comes (in my opinion not in the next 20-30 years), I will be dead. So I'm good. Smiley Smiley 

    RC you are getting older, as we all are. A E63S as daily driver? If you were younger you would have a 911 turbo as DD or a GT3 if you had no kids, or even the R8... The E63S is neither practical nor a proper sport car. It is a compromise for old farts like us, like a Panamera or a Tesla S would be...


    Re: Porsche Mission E...the future of Porsche?

    noone1:
    SciFrog:
    noone1:

    Maybe it's different in Europe. I don't think a shopping mall in Miami has anything that a shopping mall in Ohio doesn't.

    You clearly have not been shopping in Miami then. Everything you ever need is in two malls, Aventura and Bal Harbor. And there are other cool places too like Winwood, City Center, Merrrick Park, Lincoln Rd. Europe? Everything is spread out in major cities, you have to go everywhere. Smaller cities simply don’t have the shops. 

    Well that's kinda the appeal of city life -- exploring the city on foot to get places that aren't all in one giant mall and single location. I don't consider Miami to be big city life though. 

    Miami is big city life but more like LA. You have many small pedestrian centers but you need to drive to them. It is pretty nice actually, and the weather of course. Can’t wait to finally move there at some point for some sort of retirement. We are so ready for that, we have the perfect house all done, just need to add a yacht at the dock and a fun smaller boat and we all set Smiley We made our decision about Miami 10 years ago and yet to this day still don’t  regret it one bit and haven’t found a more perfect place for our future.

    In the interim, we just have to deal with real big city life with noise, traffic and superb restaurants and schools...


    Re: Porsche Mission E...the future of Porsche?

    SciFrog:

    RC you are getting older, as we all are. A E63S as daily driver? If you were younger you would have a 911 turbo as DD or a GT3 if you had no kids, or even the R8... The E63S is neither practical nor a proper sport car. It is a compromise for old farts like us, like a Panamera or a Tesla S would be...

    The E63 S is the only alternative to a SUV. I wanted a SUV but the G63 was the only one I really liked and my wife hates it. The GLC 63 was a nice choice and performance is amazing (recent review put it at 0-100 kph in 3.8 seconds and 0-200 kph in 13.8 seconds) but in the end, I hated the interior (probably really the main reason I switched my order from the GLC to the E class), it just didn't look like the interior of a 135k car.

    Without a R8 in my garage, I would have chosen a different daily driver, no doubt about it. Not sure which car though because there isn't much I like on the market. The M5? I live in Bavaria, the 5 series is basically our "Volkswagen", can't look at it anymore and I hate the interior, also the sound. RS6 was disappointing (could have gotten one for a very very low lease rate, didn't want it), so what else? Would have loved a S 63 AMG Coupe but this thing is built for comfort, not for sportiness (funny, the E63 is sportier). Panamera Turbo? Too expensive and sounds like crap. Smiley

    The E63 S will be my daily driver and my wife will use it for her ski trips with friends. It wasn't difficult to convince her not to get the GLC (SUV) because the rear seats were not great for adults.

    I don't know why you would say the E63 isn't practical, I actually think this is the most practical car I had for a very long time. 

    Oh, I even considered the Tesla X (after looking at it live again, this desire was gone in a second Smiley), believe it or not.

    Old farts? Speak for yourself. Smiley  Smiley


    --

     

    RC (Germany) - Rennteam Editor Porsche 991.2 Carrera GTS Cabriolet (2018), Porsche Cayenne S Diesel (2017), Audi R8 V10 Plus (2016), Mini JCW (2015)

     


    Re: Porsche Mission E...the future of Porsche?

    “Old farts” was just a joke... I truely hope you will be happy with the E. For us at the end of the day, nothing replaces a SUV or a crossover for daily driver because of safety, practicality and higher driving position...


    Re: Porsche Mission E...the future of Porsche?

    SciFrog:

    “Old farts” was just a joke... I truely hope you will be happy with the E. For us at the end of the day, nothing replaces a SUV or a crossover for daily driver because of safety, practicality and higher driving position...

    I was joking as well...smiley...wink. Smiley

    I really wanted a SUV but the E63 is really nice and you can even set the chassis a bit higher (at slower speeds) in snow (air suspension). Smiley Not my dream car, neither is my wife's upcoming C63 S convertible facelift but a compromise for the family. So glad I have my R8. Smiley Smiley I could have gotten the first Cayenne Turbo S (once available) but even the Cayenne Turbo is too expensive (lease) compared to the E63, the Turbo S would be out of my league (financially).


    --

     

    RC (Germany) - Rennteam Editor Porsche 991.2 Carrera GTS Cabriolet (2018), Porsche Cayenne S Diesel (2017), Audi R8 V10 Plus (2016), Mini JCW (2015)

     


    Re: Porsche Mission E...the future of Porsche?

    Before i have a hearh condition!!!

    Seen the Missioon E!!! Like it!!!!????


    --

    This is the way this post ends, not with a bang but with a wisper, WOSHHHHHHHHHHHHH


    Re: Porsche Mission E...the future of Porsche?

    SciFrog:
    noone1:
    SciFrog:
    noone1:

    Maybe it's different in Europe. I don't think a shopping mall in Miami has anything that a shopping mall in Ohio doesn't.

    You clearly have not been shopping in Miami then. Everything you ever need is in two malls, Aventura and Bal Harbor. And there are other cool places too like Winwood, City Center, Merrrick Park, Lincoln Rd. Europe? Everything is spread out in major cities, you have to go everywhere. Smaller cities simply don’t have the shops. 

    Well that's kinda the appeal of city life -- exploring the city on foot to get places that aren't all in one giant mall and single location. I don't consider Miami to be big city life though. 

    Miami is big city life but more like LA. You have many small pedestrian centers but you need to drive to them. It is pretty nice actually, and the weather of course. Can’t wait to finally move there at some point for some sort of retirement. We are so ready for that, we have the perfect house all done, just need to add a yacht at the dock and a fun smaller boat and we all set Smiley We made our decision about Miami 10 years ago and yet to this day still don’t  regret it one bit and haven’t found a more perfect place for our future.

    In the interim, we just have to deal with real big city life with noise, traffic and superb restaurants and schools...

    Sounds perfect Scifrog; I like how you thinkSmiley


    Re: Porsche Mission E...the future of Porsche?

    Mission E Cross Turismo Concept press literature describes a driveway charging pad that charges the car's battery when the car is parked over it...


    Re: Porsche Mission E...the future of Porsche?

    Paulo_Rangel_Melo:

    Before i have a hearh condition!!!

    Seen the Missioon E!!! Like it!!!!????

    I like how the concept looked... Smiley


    --

    RC (Germany) - Rennteam Editor Porsche 991.2 Carrera GTS Cabriolet (2018), Porsche Cayenne S Diesel (2017), Audi R8 V10 Plus (2016), Mini JCW (2015)


    Re: Porsche Mission E...the future of Porsche?

    SciFrog:
    noone1:
    SciFrog:
    noone1:

    Maybe it's different in Europe. I don't think a shopping mall in Miami has anything that a shopping mall in Ohio doesn't.

    You clearly have not been shopping in Miami then. Everything you ever need is in two malls, Aventura and Bal Harbor. And there are other cool places too like Winwood, City Center, Merrrick Park, Lincoln Rd. Europe? Everything is spread out in major cities, you have to go everywhere. Smaller cities simply don’t have the shops. 

    Well that's kinda the appeal of city life -- exploring the city on foot to get places that aren't all in one giant mall and single location. I don't consider Miami to be big city life though. 

    Miami is big city life but more like LA. You have many small pedestrian centers but you need to drive to them. It is pretty nice actually, and the weather of course. Can’t wait to finally move there at some point for some sort of retirement. We are so ready for that, we have the perfect house all done, just need to add a yacht at the dock and a fun smaller boat and we all set Smiley We made our decision about Miami 10 years ago and yet to this day still don’t  regret it one bit and haven’t found a more perfect place for our future.

    In the interim, we just have to deal with real big city life with noise, traffic and superb restaurants and schools...

    I hear ya, brother. Smiley Smiley Although I do not think we are going to get a house or a yacht (well, maybe a small boat) there, we plan to get a condo and a nice car (convertible). 

    I still need to get the money thing figured out...and maybe a way to actually immigrate (not only live there for 6 months a year, like many of my compatriots) but first, the kids need to finish school and then we'll see. Smiley

    Would love to do something related to cars in Miami, lots of potential customers (I think need to learn Spanish...and maybe Russian first Smiley) but all in due time.


    --

    RC (Germany) - Rennteam Editor Porsche 991.2 Carrera GTS Cabriolet (2018), Porsche Cayenne S Diesel (2017), Audi R8 V10 Plus (2016), Mini JCW (2015)


    Re: Porsche Mission E...the future of Porsche?

    Investor visa works for sure, I know two people who did it... But business in Miami is nothing like business in Germany, it is a latin “country”.


    Re: Porsche Mission E...the future of Porsche?

    SciFrog:

    Investor visa works for sure, I know two people who did it... But business in Miami is nothing like business in Germany, it is a latin “country”.

    This could actually suit me better... Smiley Smiley

    Investor visa? Well, you flatter me, I'm afraid I'm not that wealthy. OK, maybe with selling some stuff, I could qualify but I want to move to the US only if I can really afford it. Right now it looks more like a "6 months a year" adventure after I retire. Smiley Unless of course I find something to do in the US, you never know, life can change fast (a friend of mine never wanted to move to the US and now lives there for a couple of years...an old school friend who immigrated to the US needed him for his business and they partnered up). One thing is for sure though: I will never be able to work in my current profession in the US, so I have to find something new. OK, I could sell drugs (the other kind... Smiley) but I'm afraid I am too honest, too scared and probably too dumb to do that. Smiley Smiley


    --

    RC (Germany) - Rennteam Editor Porsche 991.2 Carrera GTS Cabriolet (2018), Porsche Cayenne S Diesel (2017), Audi R8 V10 Plus (2016), Mini JCW (2015)


    Re: Porsche Mission E...the future of Porsche?


    Re: Porsche Mission E...the future of Porsche?

    So far these mules look nothing like the concept. Really hope it's just camo...


    Re: Porsche Mission E...the future of Porsche?

    noone1:

    So far these mules look nothing like the concept. Really hope it's just camo...

    I'm afraid... Smiley


    --

    RC (Germany) - Rennteam Editor Porsche 991.2 Carrera GTS Cabriolet (2018), Porsche Cayenne S Diesel (2017), Audi R8 V10 Plus (2016), Mini JCW (2015)


    Re: Porsche Mission E...the future of Porsche?

    RC:
    SciFrog:

    Investor visa works for sure, I know two people who did it... But business in Miami is nothing like business in Germany, it is a latin “country”.

    This could actually suit me better... Smiley Smiley

    Investor visa? Well, you flatter me, I'm afraid I'm not that wealthy. OK, maybe with selling some stuff, I could qualify but I want to move to the US only if I can really afford it. Right now it looks more like a "6 months a year" adventure after I retire. Smiley Unless of course I find something to do in the US, you never know, life can change fast (a friend of mine never wanted to move to the US and now lives there for a couple of years...an old school friend who immigrated to the US needed him for his business and they partnered up). One thing is for sure though: I will never be able to work in my current profession in the US, so I have to find something new. OK, I could sell drugs (the other kind... Smiley) but I'm afraid I am too honest, too scared and probably too dumb to do that. Smiley Smiley

    Are we talking about the same investor visa requiring $250k to $500k? If so I have to admit your lifestyle is a real head scratcher Smiley


     
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