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    2012 Belgian F1 Grand Prix at Spa-Francorchamps

    It feels like the summer break has been going on forever ... perhaps it's also the fact that, with the Olympics dominating the past few weeks, the last race in Hungary really feels like a very long time ago ...

    Anyway, Spa should be fantastic as usual ...

    BTW here is an interesting article on F1 driver ratings ...

    http://www.jamesallenonf1.com/2012/08/are-the-f1-drivers-today-at-a-higher-level-than-in-senna-prost-era/


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    997.1 C2S
     GT Silver/Cocoa, -20mm/LSD, PSE, short shifter, SportDesign rims, Zuffenhausen pickup, BMW Z4 2.5i Roadster Sterling Grey/Red


    Re: 2012 Belgian F1 Grand Prix at Spa-Francorchamps

    Very good article (including the typo!) and some interesting comments from the public..kiss

    However, it's my take that comparing drivers from differing eras is just a case of apples vs oranges..!

    Regarding the current season, there's no doubt that Alonso stands head & shoulders above the rest for consistently outperforming his car.  Can't wait to see if he can continue in this vein for the second half..

     


    --

    "Things turn out best for people who make the best of the way things turn out."


    Re: 2012 Belgian F1 Grand Prix at Spa-Francorchamps

    Thanks for the article! very interesting on the different ratings:

    Auto Motor und Sport's... just a tee bit biased with some drivers 1325269639981rolleyes.gif

     

    Fernando Alonso: 9.09
    Sebastian Vettel: 7.64
    Lewis Hamilton: 7.55
    Kimi Räikkönen: 7.27
    Mark Webber: 7.00
    Michael Schumacher: 6.73
    Nico Hülkenberg: 6.73
    Sergio Perez: 6.64
    Nico Rosberg: 6.27
    Paul di Resta: 6.09
    Kamui Kobayashi: 5.91
    Jenson Button: 5.73
    Romain Grosjean: 5.64
    Heikki Kovalainen: 5.55
    Vitaly Petrov: 5.27
    Daniel Ricciardo: 5.18
    Felipe Massa: 5.18
    Bruno Senna: 5.18
    Timo Glock: 5.00
    Pedro de la Rosa: 5.00
    Jean-Eric Vergne: 4.91
    Charles Pic: 4.55
    Pastor Maldonado: 4.45
    Narain Karthikeyan: 3.00

     

    Here is Gazzeta dello Sport's... with no love for Massa Smiley

    10 – Alonso
    8.5 – Hamilton
    8 – Raikkonen
    7 – Webber, Vettel, Rosberg, Grosjean
    6.5 – Di Resta, Maldonado
    6 – Schumacher, Perez, Kobayashi, Hulkenberg, Kovalainen, Glock, De la Rosa, Pic, Petrov,
    5.5 – Senna
    5 – Button, Vergne, Ricciardo, Karthikeyan 

    4.5 Massa

     

    And IMO the most accurate is J. Allen's and not too far off Gazzetas:

    9.5: Alonso
    8.5: Hamilton
    8: Raikkonen
    7.5: Vettel, Webber
    7: Grosjean
    6.5 Rosberg
    6: Perez, Schumacher,
    5.5: Kobayashi, Button, Di Resta, Hulkenberg,
    5: Maldonado, Senna, Kovalainen, Petrov, Ricciardo, Glock, Pic, de la Rosa
    4.5: Massa, Vergne
    4: Karthikeyan

     


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    Re: 2012 Belgian F1 Grand Prix at Spa-Francorchamps

    Is it just me or does the build up to the resumption of racing (after the summer break) feel especially quiet this year?

    Qualification is in less than 3 days time ... and there's been hardly any talk of F1 in all the usual places on the net ....


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    997.1 C2S
     GT Silver/Cocoa, -20mm/LSD, PSE, short shifter, SportDesign rims, Zuffenhausen pickup, BMW Z4 2.5i Roadster Sterling Grey/Red


    Re: 2012 Belgian F1 Grand Prix at Spa-Francorchamps

    easy_rider911:

    Is it just me or does the build up to the resumption of racing (after the summer break) feel especially quiet this year?

    Qualification is in less than 3 days time ... and there's been hardly any talk of F1 in all the usual places on the net ....

    Probably the whole uncertainty of the 1st half has turned people off. Many people in the know (Brawn, Schumacher, Webber, Alonso) have said that this results roulette is damaging the sport. There has to be a pecking order.


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    FERRARI RULES!!!

    Re: 2012 Belgian F1 Grand Prix at Spa-Francorchamps

    REALZEUS:
    easy_rider911:

    Is it just me or does the build up to the resumption of racing (after the summer break) feel especially quiet this year?

    Qualification is in less than 3 days time ... and there's been hardly any talk of F1 in all the usual places on the net ....

    Probably the whole uncertainty of the 1st half has turned people off. Many people in the know (Brawn, Schumacher, Webber, Alonso) have said that this results roulette is damaging the sport. There has to be a pecking order.

    Yeah, I agree. It's a bit too much of a too much.... And this break made me lose all the feel and the anticipation of the next race for it...


    Re: 2012 Belgian F1 Grand Prix at Spa-Francorchamps

    REALZEUS:
    easy_rider911:

    Is it just me or does the build up to the resumption of racing (after the summer break) feel especially quiet this year?

    Qualification is in less than 3 days time ... and there's been hardly any talk of F1 in all the usual places on the net ....

    Probably the whole uncertainty of the 1st half has turned people off. Many people in the know (Brawn, Schumacher, Webber, Alonso) have said that this results roulette is damaging the sport. There has to be a pecking order.

    I think quite the opposite, this year has been the most interesting in a long time, because while the drivers to take home the GP cups on the first half have been more varied and even than ever, they have done so because of their own merit, which makes it exiting, and not because of meterological conditions, engine failures, etc.

    Furthermore the previous years there were drivers with a clear advantage on the championship points table by the end of the first half, but it had little to do with their own merits but rather the merits of the car they were driving, which was boring.

    So I'd take this uncertainty any day! Smiley and even is Alonso is ahead right now, it doesn't seem like he will have it easy at keeping that advantage on the second half as the Ferrari doesn't seem to be able to improve the car, really lagging behind in the dry, and will likely have a hemorrhage of points throughout the rest of the season against its faster rivals. So its completely open.

    Questiion is... will any of its rivals get its act together and start to stand out from others to be able to consistently score top points and close the gap over Alonso (who is able to always score points consistently, so you need to win consistently to take points from him), or will they average each other out and divide the points between themselves alternating podiums, allowing Alonso to maintain the lead?


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    Re: 2012 Belgian F1 Grand Prix at Spa-Francorchamps

    Nah, it has been about figuring the Pirelli tyres and being lucky with the car set up and the driving style. Also, the weather has played a major role. Unless Ferrari improves, they will lose both championships, even though the constructors seems already lost.


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    FERRARI RULES!!!

    Re: 2012 Belgian F1 Grand Prix at Spa-Francorchamps

    Very interesting results from qualifying. I think Carlos is right in that the uncertainty only adds to the excitement.

    The varying results could allow Alonso to hang on to the lead, but it is all up for grabs.


    Re: 2012 Belgian F1 Grand Prix at Spa-Francorchamps

    Fantastic race weekend for Button ... his first pole position for McLaren and then leading from start to finish. Superb!

    Maldonado is a cheat. I looked at the replay of the start multiple times and he did jump the lights. Not only did he jump the lights but he planned it since he tried to get past through the middle when the other cars were still stationary.

    Grosjean is all bravado and balls and no brains. He drove right pushing Hamilton wide and the touching wheels were inevitable. The carnage that resulted was shocking. Alonso was lucky today. Grosjean's car went over Alonso and it could have caused a very serious injury. It wrecked Perez's and Hamilton's races.

    It was great to watch Raikkonen overtake Schumi round the outside through Eau Rouge. Thrilling!

    Funniest moment of the race for me was when Raikkonen was told not to use full KERS and then his race engineer told him to push. Kimi instantly responded 'Give me full power then' :)


    --


    997.1 C2S
     GT Silver/Cocoa, -20mm/LSD, PSE, short shifter, SportDesign rims, Zuffenhausen pickup, BMW Z4 2.5i Roadster Sterling Grey/Red


    Re: 2012 Belgian F1 Grand Prix at Spa-Francorchamps

    Before the race, Ecclestone seemed to give away the fact that he knows that Schumi will retire at the end of this season ... he lamented the fact that Schumi will retire having not won in his comeback ... rather than as the winner that he has been ...

    And WTF? Why did Hamilton tweet his and Button's confidential telemetry data? Is he mad?

    Hamilton has been driving consistently all season saying he has been in a good mental place ... but he seems unsettled again after the summer break ...


    --


    997.1 C2S
     GT Silver/Cocoa, -20mm/LSD, PSE, short shifter, SportDesign rims, Zuffenhausen pickup, BMW Z4 2.5i Roadster Sterling Grey/Red


    Re: 2012 Belgian F1 Grand Prix at Spa-Francorchamps

    Fantastic drive by SV. He ones again proved that he is another level to MW, who could not get his head around even how to pass people. He is just too concerned about not flipping over another car and has got no balls for real racing.


    Re: 2012 Belgian F1 Grand Prix at Spa-Francorchamps

    easy_rider911:

    Fantastic race weekend for Button ... his first pole position for McLaren and then leading from start to finish. Superb!

    Maldonado is a cheat. I looked at the replay of the start multiple times and he did jump the lights. Not only did he jump the lights but he planned it since he tried to get past through the middle when the other cars were still stationary.

    Grosjean is all bravado and balls and no brains. He drove right pushing Hamilton wide and the touching wheels were inevitable. The carnage that resulted was shocking. Alonso was lucky today. Grosjean's car went over Alonso and it could have caused a very serious injury. It wrecked Perez's and Hamilton's races.

    It was great to watch Raikkonen overtake Schumi round the outside through Eau Rouge. Thrilling!

    Funniest moment of the race for me was when Raikkonen was told not to use full KERS and then his race engineer told him to push. Kimi instantly responded 'Give me full power then' :)

    Maldonado needs to be kicked out of F1 for a couple of years.

    That comment by Kimi was hilarious Smiley and that pass on MS was amazing, but if MS would not of seen him and closed the door, the accident could have had been the one with most serious consecuences of the season.

    Grosjean may have ruined the champioship for Alonso right there, we will see on the end on the season, but with Ferrari having such a slow car on the dry, that gap Alonso still has is going to go away soon, no matter how much of a better driver he is. But thats racing so...

    Thank goodness the accident wasn't worse, Alonso in particular was very lucky, his season could have been over on that first corner, the OBC view on his car of the accident was shocking...

    What was very insulting is that after Grosjean causes such an accident on the freaking straight, he was questioned on the accident and he replied that he doesn't know anything about it, that he will have to look at the footage to see what happened Smiley like if he was just a bystandard. Hope he gets a penalty.

    Very happy for Button, to bad he is so far down in the championship, hopefully this GP signifies his return to form and will keep this up and start to climb places.

    Don't know what Hamilton is thinking, McLaren need to set him straight.


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    Re: 2012 Belgian F1 Grand Prix at Spa-Francorchamps

    It did not look to me that Maldonado jumped the start. It looked to me like he got lucky and anticipated the lights perfectly. Ironically, he stated that his hand slipped off the clutch button (so he thinks he jumped the start...) And the race marshal in the starting booth was shown shaking his head; so he probably felt Maldonado jumped the start. I assume they have telemetry that will show exactly what he did when.

    Hamilton was and remains a jerk, in my opinion.

     


    Re: 2012 Belgian F1 Grand Prix at Spa-Francorchamps

    Williams’ Pastor Maldonado will drop ten places on the grid at next weekend’s Italian round in Monza after being handed two separate penalties by the Belgian race stewards.

    Maldonado was punished for jumping the start of the Spa-Francorchamps race and for causing a collision with the Marussia of Timo Glock on Lap Five. He received a five-place penalty for his premature...»

    and

    Lotus’s Romain Grosjean has been given a one-race ban after the stewards at Spa-Francorchamps judged him to be responsible for causing the first-corner accident at the start of Sunday’s 2012 Formula 1 Shell Belgian Grand Prix.

    http://www.formula1.com/news/

    --

    - "I see dead pixels..."
    - “When the only tool you have is a hammer, everything looks like a nail.”


    Re: 2012 Belgian F1 Grand Prix at Spa-Francorchamps

    Good! hopefully that will throw some cold water on those two hot heads, they are not even competing for the title and have no regard for the other drivers who actually have championship posibilities...


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    Re: 2012 Belgian F1 Grand Prix at Spa-Francorchamps

    Just look at the OBC of Alonso towards the end of this video angelheart it could have been so much worse...

     

     

     

     

     

     

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    Re: 2012 Belgian F1 Grand Prix at Spa-Francorchamps

    Grosjean is a huge wanker! mail Button was immaculate. Kudos to him and to McLaren. Things are not looking good for Ferrari though. enlightened


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    FERRARI RULES!!!

    Re: 2012 Belgian F1 Grand Prix at Spa-Francorchamps

    Hurricane Grosjean. SMH


    Re: 2012 Belgian F1 Grand Prix at Spa-Francorchamps

    I am glad that Alonso is safe. And glad for Button too. It was a nice race.


    --

    There is no try. Just do.


    Re: 2012 Belgian F1 Grand Prix at Spa-Francorchamps

    I am invited by the Lotus Team next week-end - hope I don't see RG.....sad smiley


    Re: 2012 Belgian F1 Grand Prix at Spa-Francorchamps

    Andrew Benson: http://www.bbc.co.uk/blogs/andrewbenson/2012/09/smooth_button_masters_f1_great.html

    James Allen on Grosjean: http://www.jamesallenonf1.com/2012/09/grosjean-penalty-was-coming-say-drivers/

    James Allen on Hamilton's tweet: http://www.jamesallenonf1.com/2012/09/hamilton-in-a-twist-over-twitter/
     


    --


    997.1 C2S
     GT Silver/Cocoa, -20mm/LSD, PSE, short shifter, SportDesign rims, Zuffenhausen pickup, BMW Z4 2.5i Roadster Sterling Grey/Red


    Re: 2012 Belgian F1 Grand Prix at Spa-Francorchamps

     

    Closed cockpits in F1 heart

    http://www.autosport.com/news/report.php/id/102213

     

     


    --

    "Form follows function"


    Re: 2012 Belgian F1 Grand Prix at Spa-Francorchamps

    I don't see how a closed cockpit would have protected Alonso from serious injury if Grosjean's car had landed right on top of him (instead of on the front suspension where it actually landed) ...

    I think this is a knee-jerk idea ...

    The solution is to 'coach' new (and nearly new) drivers to use more judgement and show more respect for the safety of others before embarking on an overtaking manoeuvre.

    Jackie Stewart offered to give Grosjean some coaching advice (as a former Lotus driver) but Grosjean was foolish enough to decline coaching from a 3 time world champion.

    As Alonso pointed out, Grosjean has been involved in 7 crashes in 12 starts ... he needs to put this right ...

    As for Maldonado, IMO he drives like a thug ... I've said it before and the race at Spa merely added more evidence to back that view ...


    --


    997.1 C2S
     GT Silver/Cocoa, -20mm/LSD, PSE, short shifter, SportDesign rims, Zuffenhausen pickup, BMW Z4 2.5i Roadster Sterling Grey/Red


    Re: 2012 Belgian F1 Grand Prix at Spa-Francorchamps

    easy_rider911:

    Jackie Stewart offered to give Grosjean some coaching advice (as a former Lotus driver) but Grosjean was foolish enough to decline coaching from a 3 time world champion. [...]

    As for Maldonado, IMO he drives like a thug ... I've said it before and the race at Spa merely added more evidence to back that view ...


    Have to say that I gave Maldonado the freedom of the doubt so far but that was obviously for no reason . In virtually every battle his driving was the decisive factor that lead to the crash. 

    Regarding Grosjean, I am a bit surprised that such an experienced driver that has been competing in F1 before can make so many mistakes in one season. Nonetheless, I would be curious what a former champion such as Jackie Stewart would be able to teach him. Without any disrespect, his era has been four decades ago where cars, drivers and attitude were of a different kind. Grosjean should be prepared for any on-track situations over his year-long career.


    Re: 2012 Belgian F1 Grand Prix at Spa-Francorchamps

    easy_rider911:

    I don't see how a closed cockpit would have protected Alonso from serious injury if Grosjean's car had landed right on top of him (instead of on the front suspension where it actually landed) ...

    If they had a fast-jet style bullet proof canopy, it could withstand the force of an incoming car. After all, they are designed to take on birds and other objects at supersonic speeds.


    --
    FERRARI RULES!!!

    Re: 2012 Belgian F1 Grand Prix at Spa-Francorchamps

    A bird may weigh around 1 kg and it hits a plane at a combined speed of around 1000 km/h. A F1 car weighs around 650 kg and could hit another car at a speed of 300 km/h. IMO that's a pretty big difference.


    --


    997.1 C2S
     GT Silver/Cocoa, -20mm/LSD, PSE, short shifter, SportDesign rims, Zuffenhausen pickup, BMW Z4 2.5i Roadster Sterling Grey/Red


    Re: 2012 Belgian F1 Grand Prix at Spa-Francorchamps

    Yellow cards for F1 drivers?

    http://www.jamesallenonf1.com/2012/09/analysis-should-yellow-cards-be-used-to-discipline-f1-drivers/

    Maldonado's record is pretty damning IMO.

    Post-race strategy report from James Allen:

    http://www.jamesallenonf1.com/2012/09/analysis-mclaren-pace-and-strategy-provides-wake-up-call-for-rest-of-field/
     


    --


    997.1 C2S
     GT Silver/Cocoa, -20mm/LSD, PSE, short shifter, SportDesign rims, Zuffenhausen pickup, BMW Z4 2.5i Roadster Sterling Grey/Red


    Re: 2012 Belgian F1 Grand Prix at Spa-Francorchamps

    Just for the record, qualification: http://news.bbc.co.uk/sport1/hi/motorsport/formula_one/results/9713347.stm

    Final result: http://news.bbc.co.uk/sport1/hi/motorsport/formula_one/results/9713343.stm
     


    --


    997.1 C2S
     GT Silver/Cocoa, -20mm/LSD, PSE, short shifter, SportDesign rims, Zuffenhausen pickup, BMW Z4 2.5i Roadster Sterling Grey/Red


    Re: 2012 Belgian F1 Grand Prix at Spa-Francorchamps

    easy_rider911:

    A bird may weigh around 1 kg and it hits a plane at a combined speed of around 1000 km/h. A F1 car weighs around 650 kg and could hit another car at a speed of 300 km/h. IMO that's a pretty big difference.

    Some engineers or physics majors might correct me, but I think that the F1 scenario is over 58 times more powerful than the bird scenario. However, I find the actual closing speeds of the F1 cars a bit extreme and the bird a little small.

    So just for fun, I have reduced the closing speeds of the F1 cars to a mere 100kph and increased the bird to 6 kg.

    The F1 car would still receive a greater impact than the plane!   Smiley


     
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