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    Re: Aventador crashes into parked BMW

    "Yield to right" when no sign says otherwise is the same in all of europe and probably the rest of the world, but in this case the Mazda has a yield sign painted on the road (and there should be a vertical sign as well but the video angle doesn't catch it). Since speed of the Aventador cannot be determined post accident, its a cased closed for the insurance companies, Aventador =1, Mazda = 0.


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    Re: Aventador crashes into parked BMW

    Carlos from Spain:

    "Yield to right" when no sign says otherwise is the same in all of europe and probably the rest of the world, but in this case the Mazda has a yield sign painted on the road (and there should be a vertical sign as well but the video angle doesn't catch it). Since speed of the Aventador cannot be determined post accident, its a cased closed for the insurance companies, Aventador =1, Mazda = 0.

    As a rider I'm sure that scenario is familair to you. Those are the exact same scenarios that kill motorcyclists. The car doesn't see the bike or underestimates its speed and pulls out and bam.


    Re: Aventador crashes into parked BMW

    JoeRockhead:
    Carlos from Spain:

    "Yield to right" when no sign says otherwise is the same in all of europe and probably the rest of the world, but in this case the Mazda has a yield sign painted on the road (and there should be a vertical sign as well but the video angle doesn't catch it). Since speed of the Aventador cannot be determined post accident, its a cased closed for the insurance companies, Aventador =1, Mazda = 0.

    As a rider I'm sure that scenario is familair to you. Those are the exact same scenarios that kill motorcyclists. The car doesn't see the bike or underestimates its speed and pulls out and bam.

    A very comon scenario for a bike indeed, and its easier to not see a bike than an Aventador, that is one of the reasons that daytime runnig lights for all cars and not a welcomed thing for bike riders since they make the bikes (that always use daytime runnig lights for visibility) stand out less amongst the cars then.

    In my experience something that when on a bike helps you to be "seen" better by other cars in such scenarios is having an aftermarket exhaust, its saved me more than once.

    The best thing that riding since very young has taught me is to be very aware constantly of the potential mistakes of other drivers around you and drive pre-empively by nature (never be on the other vehicle's mirrors blind spot, adapt speed to crossings to brake in case of a pull out, etc)


    --


    Re: Aventador crashes into parked BMW

    There's no point in guessing at the intentions of the driver of the Mazda or using traffic laws from other countries.  The language from the U.K. motoring laws is quite precise on the subject:

    Turning right

    179

    Well before you turn right you should

    • use your mirrors to make sure you know the position and movement of traffic behind you
    • give a right-turn signal
    • take up a position just left of the middle of the road or in the space marked for traffic turning right
    • leave room for other vehicles to pass on the left, if possible.

    180

    Wait until there is a safe gap between you and any oncoming vehicle. Watch out for cyclists, motorcyclists, pedestrians and other road users. Check your mirrors and blind spot again to make sure you are not being overtaken, then make the turn. Do not cut the corner. Take great care when turning into a main road; you will need to watch for traffic in both directions and wait for a safe gap.

    https://www.gov.uk/using-the-road-159-to-203/road-junctions-170-to-183


    Re: Aventador crashes into parked BMW

    RC:

    I also wonder what is more pathetic: The drivers of these cars (revving) or the people chasing them with their smartphones, taking videos. Oh boy...

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nfM9ZPOFegQ

    It is very bad around that area. When I'm driving through I have photographers running in front of my car on the road to take pictures of "super" cars. Luckily my Boxster isn't super enough for them :)

    Still the Lambo driver did not appear to care less about his "girlfriend" after the accident...!


    --

    RS60 Spyder, 991 GT3 RS pending... :(


    Re: Aventador crashes into parked BMW

    The Lambo driver knew that she was not hurt, and he was not hurt, and the car was not seriously damaged. However, he just encountered a collision where someone making a "right" turn into his lane (which is the same as a "left" turn in any right hand drive country) screwed him while he had the right of way. His control of temperment is admirable!


    Re: Aventador crashes into parked BMW

    Unless the Aventador was going way too fast, I guess it's the other person's fault.

    While you can't judge speed by sound, I find it hard to believe that the Aventador couldn't have braked had he been going the speed limit. Like someone else said, it can go 60-0 in 100 ft and probably 30 - 0 in way less than 50 ft, not to mention that the other car would still be accelerating as you decelerate, giving more time/distance.

    It's entirely possible to just not see a car the one split second we look -- happens to all of us at some point -- or if the Aventador was going too fast and the person possibly didn't judge their speed accurately.

    I'm kind of inclined to think the Aventador was going to fast judging by the sound and the location where retards driving exotics is very, very common.


    Re: Aventador crashes into parked BMW

    Or he is expecting the Mazda driver to obey the law and stop and yield to his right of way. And when the Mazda had no intention to stop and forcefully taken the space from him, it was too late to do anything. 

    The Mazda is making the turn very slowly, there are ample opportunity for him to stop and yield without causing an accident, but he was determine to be the asshole. That Aventador bumper already cost more than the Mazda.

    There are some really weird people in this world, even here where I lived. I have had incidents where people driving cheap cars being very aggressive towards nice cars, in the end I value my car more than right-of-way and let some of these assholes get away with not yielding. Traffic turns like the video, or merging alternately, etc. 


    --

     


    Re: Aventador crashes into parked BMW

    Well, we'll never know. I, like you whoopsy, drive defensively. I don't beep my horn, I evade. I don't hope someone else is paying attention if I already am. Mistakes happen, and I prefer to avoid issues myself if possible rather than hoping someone else realizes what's going on.

    I know I too have been guilty of not seeing someone at first, but fortunately realize it sooner rather than later. It happens to me, and it happens to others. The best thing people can do is take safety into their own hands. Works out best for everyone that way. One person paying attention is usually enough to prevent any accident outside of the most serious.


    Re: Aventador crashes into parked BMW

    noone1:

    Unless the Aventador was going way too fast, I guess it's the other person's fault.

     

    ummhh BINGO, considering all of the stats about how fast the Lambo could have stopped, plus the obvious legal implications; I completely agree it was not the Aventador's fault at all!  Completely the other person.


    Re: Aventador crashes into parked BMW

    Fault is entirely with the Mazda. Had he (she?) managed to actually pull out and get rear-ended by the Lambo - it'd be a different story. I suspect this footage will play a part in settling the claim.


    --

    991 (what a car!) XC90 - 120 Cab - 2 kids, 1 dog


    Re: Aventador crashes into parked BMW

    It's entirely the fault of the Lamborghini driver, all power to the proletariat!

    smiley


    --

    The secret of life is to admire without desiring.


    Re: Aventador crashes into parked BMW

    noone1:

    Well, we'll never know. I, like you whoopsy, drive defensively. I don't beep my horn, I evade. I don't hope someone else is paying attention if I already am. Mistakes happen, and I prefer to avoid issues myself if possible rather than hoping someone else realizes what's going on.

    I know I too have been guilty of not seeing someone at first, but fortunately realize it sooner rather than later. It happens to me, and it happens to others. The best thing people can do is take safety into their own hands. Works out best for everyone that way. One person paying attention is usually enough to prevent any accident outside of the most serious.

     

    At least it's safer up here, in the USA they use guns to settle disputes haha Smiley


    --

     


    Re: Aventador crashes into parked BMW

    noone1:

    Unless the Aventador was going way too fast, I guess it's the other person's fault.

    While you can't judge speed by sound, I find it hard to believe that the Aventador couldn't have braked had he been going the speed limit. Like someone else said, it can go 60-0 in 100 ft and probably 30 - 0 in way less than 50 ft, not to mention that the other car would still be accelerating as you decelerate, giving more time/distance.

    It's entirely possible to just not see a car the one split second we look -- happens to all of us at some point -- or if the Aventador was going too fast and the person possibly didn't judge their speed accurately.

    I'm kind of inclined to think the Aventador was going to fast judging by the sound and the location where retards driving exotics is very, very common.

    I don't think it is fair to use the word 'retards' in this context - because retards are far more intelligent than this :)


    --

    RS60 Spyder, 991 GT3 RS pending... :(


    Re: Aventador crashes into parked BMW

    Carlos from Spain:

    "Yield to right" when no sign says otherwise is the same in all of europe and probably the rest of the world, but in this case the Mazda has a yield sign painted on the road (and there should be a vertical sign as well but the video angle doesn't catch it). Since speed of the Aventador cannot be determined post accident, its a cased closed for the insurance companies, Aventador =1, Mazda = 0.

    Yes, actually the driver is lucky he didn't brake but on the other hand, maybe this accident could have been avoided completely if he would have braked in time and braked properly (many drivers don't seem to understand the purpose of a brake Smiley). On the other hand, without this accident happening, we wouldn't be entertained by this thread. Smiley


    --

    RC (Germany) - Rennteam Editor Porsche 991 Turbo S, Porsche Boxster S (981), Jeep Grand Cherokee SRT (2014), BMW X3 35d (2013)


    Re: Aventador crashes into parked BMW

    Rossi:

    It's entirely the fault of the Lamborghini driver, all power to the proletariat!

    smiley

    Don't make fun of this: A friend of mine, in his Porsche Cayenne, crashed into a car in a smaller village in Bavaria. The other car was at fault (he passed a red light) but it was a small Toyota Aygo and the female driver was blocked inside the car after the impact. After people managed to get her out of the car, they started shouting at my friend, blaming him and his "road monster" Cayenne for hurting that woman. Luckily, an older woman was sitting at her window when the accident happened and she saw that the Cayenne had a green light. It took her some time to get down to the street, even the police which arrived earlier at the accident spot started to talk in a very derogatory way to my friend and everybody around them, maybe two dozens of people, was furious at the "Porsche driver", shouting insulting words. After that older woman who saw the accident cleared up the situation, the police did an alcohol test on that woman and it came on positive. Do you think someone apologized to my friend? At some point, he even feared for his well being because one older guy in the group of bystanders was waving with his walking stick while he was shouting.

    I cannot imagine what would happen if that Lambo driver would have hurt a pedestrian or another car driver, no matter if it was his fault or not. When it comes to expensive cars, people easily take sides (look at the comments on YouTube under the video).


    --

    RC (Germany) - Rennteam Editor Porsche 991 Turbo S, Porsche Boxster S (981), Jeep Grand Cherokee SRT (2014), BMW X3 35d (2013)


    Re: Aventador crashes into parked BMW

    RC:
    Rossi:

    It's entirely the fault of the Lamborghini driver, all power to the proletariat!

    smiley

    Don't make fun of this: ...


    Christian, it was meant only half funny. When I wrote this I was well aware, that today often the driver of the expensive car is to blame, no matter if it's correct or not, especially in our country. Smiley


    --

    The secret of life is to admire without desiring.


    Re: Aventador crashes into parked BMW

    I once had a lady turn left infront of me while I had the right-of-way.  She received four tickets - which she plead guilty to!  My OWN insurance company (rhymes with WallState) screwed me over by not follwing up on the tickets she received and declared me 50% at fault (for purposes of raising my rates and writing off the loss) simply because I had a Porsche and money and she did not.  When I complained to the Kansas State Insurance commissioner in Topeka with evidence of the other persons tickets AND guilty plea the Insurance commissioners office chose to accept instead a simple letter from 'WallState' that she received no tickets and that I was at least 50% at fault - with NO actual evidence presented to dispute my facts. 

    When confronted with my FACTS (court documents from her case delivered by a court approved courier) and their simple letter containing a complete lie the Commissioner sided with the LIE and ignored the proof I presented.  (I first visited them with photo copies of her guilty plea and the Commissioner accused me of forgery so I had the court deliver them without me touching the papers).  It was a complete fraud - the commssioner and the insurance company were thick as thieves.  It was my first look into the reality of business and politics.  It is why it I am not surprised at all that we have a 100% forgery supporting Obama's claim to Natural Born citizenship. 

    I digress.  Ahem - how is that guy working for us?

    It cost me a $1000 deductible and increased rates (rated out of a California Office on purpose to get max increase!) for years - had I not found another carrier.  I can't stand (W)Allstate commercials on TV - good hands people my A$$.

    To say the insurance business is crooked is an understatement - don't get me started.  After that meeting with the insurance commissioners lawyers I told my friends that if I 'disappeared' to start looking at them first for clues. 

    Yes - owing an expensive car can make you a target.  Thanks to our 'class-baiting' pretender in chief it is only getting worse.  Especially when government agencies get in on the act.

    PS  the name of the KS Insurance commissioner at the time - Kathleen Sebelius.  No surprise that our Health Care system is riddled with fraud now.


    Re: Aventador crashes into parked BMW

    RC:
    Rossi:

    It's entirely the fault of the Lamborghini driver, all power to the proletariat!

    smiley

    Don't make fun of this: A friend of mine, in his Porsche Cayenne, crashed into a car in a smaller village in Bavaria. The other car was at fault (he passed a red light) but it was a small Toyota Aygo and the female driver was blocked inside the car after the impact. After people managed to get her out of the car, they started shouting at my friend, blaming him and his "road monster" Cayenne for hurting that woman. Luckily, an older woman was sitting at her window when the accident happened and she saw that the Cayenne had a green light. It took her some time to get down to the street, even the police which arrived earlier at the accident spot started to talk in a very derogatory way to my friend and everybody around them, maybe two dozens of people, was furious at the "Porsche driver", shouting insulting words. After that older woman who saw the accident cleared up the situation, the police did an alcohol test on that woman and it came on positive. Do you think someone apologized to my friend? At some point, he even feared for his well being because one older guy in the group of bystanders was waving with his walking stick while he was shouting.

    I cannot imagine what would happen if that Lambo driver would have hurt a pedestrian or another car driver, no matter if it was his fault or not. When it comes to expensive cars, people easily take sides (look at the comments on YouTube under the video).

              The attitude of the police and the crowd to that Cayenne driver borders on the medieval. What a nasty situation for the innocent Cayenne driver to deal with. The incident makes Bavarians look small minded and very ugly, do they have a state "sharpen your pitchforks" holiday?


    Re: Aventador crashes into parked BMW

    JoeRockhead:

    The Lambo can brake from 60-0 in 30 metres, so if he was going 30 mph he should have been able to stop in less than half of that. Either he wasn't paying attention or speed was a factor in the crash. My guess is that the Mazda driver saw him and under-estimated his speed and pulled out. Dual fault probably.

     

     

    That Lambo is left hand drive, so probably made it very hard to see the mazda.


    Re: Aventador crashes into parked BMW

    LHD or RHD - makes no difference - he shouldn't have to be concerned about someone pulling out of a side road into his path. (although I'm sure we all do to some extent!)


    --

    991 (what a car!) XC90 - 120 Cab - 2 kids, 1 dog


    Re: Aventador crashes into parked BMW

    JimFlat6:
              The attitude of the police and the crowd to that Cayenne driver borders on the medieval. What a nasty situation for the innocent Cayenne driver to deal with. The incident makes Bavarians look small minded and very ugly, do they have a state "sharpen your pitchforks" holiday?

    Saturday at Schloss Nymphenburg in Munich:

    I was there with my wife and we sat next (maybe two meters away) to my 991 Turbo S to enjoy the sun before leaving.

    Many many people passed by and many looked at the car or inside the car. Some people made comments. Kids were usually using quite friendly attributes and loved the car. Even one older woman took a stroll around the car and said "what a beauty". Unfortunately, not only positive comments were heard.

    One guy said to his wife or girlfriend, she looked inside the car, "Angeberauto" (swanky car). Another guy walked buy, not even looking at the car and his little son stopped looking at it and this guy said "komm, lass die Scheisskarre" (c'mon, leave that crappy car). Another woman mentioned "schau mal, wo unsere Steuergelder hingehen" (look where our taxes are going to"), something I actually didn't understand because I don't remember the government having paid for my car. Smiley Then an older man came and he said "gut um junge Mädels anzumachen" (good to attract younger women) but he kind of meant it as a joke, he was smiling. The worst comment came from a woman, in her mid 50s or so, she stopped and looked at the car for a minute or two and then she turned around, telling her husband(?) "so eine sinnlose Geldverschwendung, das Ding sollte man beschlagnahmen und das Geld den Armen geben" (such a waste of money, this car should be confiscated and the money given to the poor).

    Also more comments (as far as I remember, I was sitting there with my wife for half an hour or so):

    "Ferrari ist schöner" (Ferrari looks more beautiful)...not that I never heard this Smiley

    "Ego Prothese" (ego prosthesis)...never heard this one, actually interesting. Smiley

    More of a harmless comment: "Was kostet der denn?" "200 Tausend oder so." "Euro?" "Ja klar." "Das ist krank". (how much does this car cost? 200 thousand or so. Euro? Yes, sure. This is just sick.)

    Funniest comment (from a kid), addressed to his dad: "Papa, ist das Auto schnell?" "Ja, ganz schnell." "Schneller als unser Auto?" "Natürlich nicht." (Dad, is this car fast? Yes, very fast. Faster than our car? Of course not.) Smiley

    Overall, around 60% negative comments and 40% positive comments but it never seizes to impress me how many people actually have an opinion when they see this car.

    Speaking of the 991 Turbo S and people over here: When I picked up my 991 Turbo S at my dealership back in October 2013, a guy was waiting at the dealership to take a look at my car because he was also expecting a 991 Turbo S he had ordered for a late October delivery and he had never seen the car live. Two weeks ago, I met this guy again at my dealership. He almost cried. What had happened? He has parked his car outside in our city (downtown) at night. When he returned to the car, the car was severely damaged. Vandals had left it with a damage of over 30k(!) EUR. Someone had hit his doors, his fenders, there was even a partial imprint of a boot visible in the metal. This is why I never park my Porsches at night somewhere in public.

    Please don't misunderstand me: I am sure similar things happen in other countries too but my personal perception is that people over here care a lot about what you do or drive and the more expensive it is, the more you're in trouble.

     


    --

    RC (Germany) - Rennteam Editor Porsche 991 Turbo S, Porsche Boxster S (981), Jeep Grand Cherokee SRT (2014), BMW X3 35d (2013)


    Re: Aventador crashes into parked BMW

    No wonder you're planning a move to the US. I didn't realize it was quite so bad in Germany at this time. 


    --

    991 (what a car!) XC90 - 120 Cab - 2 kids, 1 dog


    Re: Aventador crashes into parked BMW

    I don't get the popular attitude there to publically or in small social settings denounce "objects".  Like they can't just assume that someone worked his ass off to get ahead and buy something nice. Instead because they don't have one, the "object" must be a sign of evil. Maybe the media has used the "all businessmen are evil" story line too many times and the people are just mentally locked on that theme.


    Re: Aventador crashes into parked BMW

    bridggar:

    LHD or RHD - makes no difference - he shouldn't have to be concerned about someone pulling out of a side road into his path. (although I'm sure we all do to some extent!)

    You guys are way too used to people obeying the laws of trafficSmiley

    Over here I always have to drive on the defensive and assume someone is going to change lane, pull out into a road, run a red light, or crash into me at all times. It's even common knowledge that if you're the first one on a red light you have to be careful when it changes to green because often one or two cars still make it through after it turns. I get honked at and even shouted at every now and then for trying to drive properly. 


    Re: Aventador crashes into parked BMW

    I guess it's about respect for the law? yes The car isn't quite as precious in the UK as the US, but most people are fearful of losing their licence and the freedom it gives so generally obey the highway code. 


    --

    991 (what a car!) XC90 - 120 Cab - 2 kids, 1 dog


    Re: Aventador crashes into parked BMW

    bridggar:

    I guess it's about respect for the law? yes The car isn't quite as precious in the UK as the US, but most people are fearful of losing their licence and the freedom it gives so generally obey the highway code. 

    As it should be. It was a half joke about how things work in different cultures. Traffic is one of the things I hate about living here. 


    Re: Aventador crashes into parked BMW

    bridggar:

    No wonder you're planning a move to the US. I didn't realize it was quite so bad in Germany at this time. 

    It depends. Not everyone with an expensive car pays attention to this stuff, some couldn't care less and others even enjoy it. In the past, when I had no kids, I couldn't care less either but with the kids came awareness of our surroundings and it sucks. The media is to blame: Wealth is always associated with tax cheating or exploiting others. 

    Also interesting: My Jeep SRT actually attracts more attention in public than my 991 Turbo S but surprisingly (or not), I never get dumb comments. It surely has something to do with money and brand reputation.


    --

    RC (Germany) - Rennteam Editor Porsche 991 Turbo S, Porsche Boxster S (981), Jeep Grand Cherokee SRT (2014), BMW X3 35d (2013)


    Re: Aventador crashes into parked BMW

    JimFlat6:

    I don't get the popular attitude there to publically or in small social settings denounce "objects".  Like they can't just assume that someone worked his ass off to get ahead and buy something nice. Instead because they don't have one, the "object" must be a sign of evil. Maybe the media has used the "all businessmen are evil" story line too many times and the people are just mentally locked on that theme.

    This is actually my theory too.


    --

    RC (Germany) - Rennteam Editor Porsche 991 Turbo S, Porsche Boxster S (981), Jeep Grand Cherokee SRT (2014), BMW X3 35d (2013)


    Re: Aventador crashes into parked BMW

    We don't have that attitude in US popular culture. Here even the poorest guy wants a Lambo. People don't throw insults at what other people drive if its something they can't afford themselves.

    Whats scary is that considering its history, Germany still has a kind of anti social vibe towards those who exceed the lifestyle of the proletariat or their neighbors.. No wonder lots people there believed the blame it all on the Jews crap on their pre '45 Volks radios.

    Please don't take this wrong, but I think it was Churchill who said Germans are either at your throat or at your feet.


     
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