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    Re: GT-R 0-60 in 3.3 S

    Quote:
    trip said:
    That cgt lap time is either from a day where the circuit was wet or the driver can't handle the car. Look at the lap times for the F40 and F50, 2:25.26 and 2:26.52. Do you really believe those cars are faster than a CGT? Do you really believe the GTR could lap the 'ring or any other circuit as fast as a CGT?



    Pretty much, yeah.

    Re: GT-R 0-60 in 3.3 S

    Quote:
    Crash said:
    Quote:
    trip said:
    That cgt lap time is either from a day where the circuit was wet or the driver can't handle the car. Look at the lap times for the F40 and F50, 2:25.26 and 2:26.52. Do you really believe those cars are faster than a CGT? Do you really believe the GTR could lap the 'ring or any other circuit as fast as a CGT?



    Pretty much, yeah.


    My above post was in response to Vinnie's, but are you saying you do think the F40, F50, and GTR are faster than the CGT? I'm confused.

    Re: GT-R 0-60 in 3.3 S

    Quote:
    KresoF1 said:
    Sorry Nick but, you did not drive new GT-R and your claim that car is amazing is pure speculation influenced by car press(specially USA car press).

    What if I told you that GT-R will not achive 7.38min on the Ring as Nissan claimed in press release?

    Do you really belive that car with 480hp and weight of 1750kg is faster on any track(and in straight line acceleration) then Porsche 997 GT2 or Ferrari F430 Scuderia?

    If you do then buy GT-R when it becomes available in USA.

    Car press hysteria over GT-R is little bit too loud for my taste...



    I am inclined to agree with you that the Ring time of 7.39 is far fetched. Also, I have difficulty grasping how it is that a car weighing 500 more pds with the same hp can have better times than the 997TT and the 430.

    But when I think about the time of the 997GT2 at the Ring and its acceleration times with 85hp less and weights more than the CGT by 200pds is able to have similar performance parameters it is not inconceivable. Technology has really accelerated in improving performance with less or more whatever the case may be.

    Would I buy a GT-R? I honestly don't know. But I have to ask myself. If I am a performance maven why would I choose the 997TT over the GT-R. It really surpasses the TT in every category and this is stated by just about everyone who has driven and compared the two cars.

    BTW, I assume the V Sauma will bring the GT-R at the Ring around 7.49. Not much better.

    Also, I believed Top Gear raved about the GT-R and confirmed its superiority over the 911TT.

    Re: GT-R 0-60 in 3.3 S

    Quote:
    trip said:
    Quote:
    Crash said:
    Quote:
    trip said:
    That cgt lap time is either from a day where the circuit was wet or the driver can't handle the car. Look at the lap times for the F40 and F50, 2:25.26 and 2:26.52. Do you really believe those cars are faster than a CGT? Do you really believe the GTR could lap the 'ring or any other circuit as fast as a CGT?



    Pretty much, yeah.


    My above post was in response to Vinnie's, but are you saying you do think the F40, F50, and GTR are faster than the CGT? I'm confused.



    No, I'm agreeign with you. Also, what were the conditions at the track? Has it recently been repaved? Was there rain? Those are all important factors.

    Re: GT-R 0-60 in 3.3 S

    Quote:
    nberry said:
    Quote:
    thuggy said:
    There are a couple threads around with dyno runs showing early GT-Rs producing way more horse power than advertised. This was a Japanese tradition due to laws preventing high horsepower cars or something like Germany's 155 mph agreement I believe. I just hope that this is actually a normal practice that will continue and not just hopped up press cars.



    What difference does it make? As long as the price is the same, the customer benefits.

    This car is amazing regardless of how you define it. I wrote about a year ago that once the Japanese enter the market of high performance cars, the landscape will change for Europeans car manufacturers. Either they step up or they will pay the price.

    Automobile magazine has a good write up on the car and its specifications. Apparently it is equipped witha tamper proof black box which will give a lot of information regarding speed, mods and other stuff many car enthusiast would not want manufacturers or police to know.



    Nick, the difference would be if customer cars were not running hot like the press cars. If the customer gets the same performance great! It wouldn't be the first time a manufacturer provided a modified car to test that different than what a customer would get.

    Re: GT-R 0-60 in 3.3 S

    Quote:
    vinnie said:
    I am very impressed with the Suzuka laptime.

    Porsche GT 612 hp, curb weight 1380. Laptime: 2:28.42

    Nissan GT-R 480 hp, curb weight 1780. Laptime: 2:22.8!

    That is over 5.5 seconds faster than the fastest ever Porsche.



    Anybody with an IQ of above 50 will believe these numbers Please use your brains

    Re: GT-R 0-60 in 3.3 S

    The fastest car on the Tsukuba as well (February 2008 Best motoring ?) :

    1- Nissan GT-R MCR---------1:01.93 Keiichi Tsuchiya
    2- Ferrari 360 CS----------1:02.44 Best Motoring
    3- Nissan GT-R Mines-------1:03 Takayuki Kinoshita
    4- Lamborghini Gallardo----1:03.6 Best Motoring
    5- Ferrari F40-------------1:03.73 best motoring
    6- Porsche 993 GT2---------1:04.25 "Best Motoring"
    7- Chevrolet Corvette Z06--1:04.551
    8- McLaren F1--------------1:04.62 Best Motoring
    9- Porsche 997 Turbo-------1:04.73 Best Motoring
    10- Lamborghini Murcielago--1:04.76 Best Motoring
    11. Porsche 997 GT3---------1:04.84

    Re: GT-R 0-60 in 3.3 S

    Best Motoring provides the fundamentally worst and biased results of performance I've ever seen by any automobile magazine. Inevitably the NSX-R will beat anything ever made in their videos.

    Re: GT-R 0-60 in 3.3 S

    Quote:
    KresoF1 said:
    Sorry Nick but, you did not drive new GT-R and your claim that car is amazing is pure speculation influenced by car press(specially USA car press).

    What if I told you that GT-R will not achive 7.38min on the Ring as Nissan claimed in press release?

    Do you really belive that car with 480hp and weight of 1750kg is faster on any track(and in straight line acceleration) then Porsche 997 GT2 or Ferrari F430 Scuderia?

    If you do then buy GT-R when it becomes available in USA.

    Car press hysteria over GT-R is little bit too loud for my taste...



    No, I do not believe that it will achieve 7:38, but I believe it will be faster than a 997TT at the Ring. But I do believe that a professional driver who knows the Ring like Walter may be able to do it in 7:38! So tell us, what is the time achieved?

    Re: GT-R 0-60 in 3.3 S

    Quote:
    Grant said:
    Quote:
    edz61 said:
    This thing moves. Because of the low price many rich parents will buy this car for their kids. As it is you have know idea how many kids in their highly modified hondas and acuras chase my 997tt and try to challenge me. Can you imagine what they will do in the GTR?


    Yeah, and just think about the aftermarket upgrades for this car. I bet they'll sell bigger turbos and ECU flashes for over 800hp...



    I will dock in TT and act like they don't exist when they drive by me

    Re: GT-R 0-60 in 3.3 S

    I guess that this is going to be another Z06 VS. 997tt kind of a thing. Gents they are all gr8 cars who cares one is a little faster. Honesty and IMHO if three normal people (not race car drivers) race these cars (TT, Z06, GTR) on the streets they will be very very close and the better driver will win it all

    Re: GT-R 0-60 in 3.3 S

    Quote:
    thuggy said:
    Quote:
    nberry said:
    Quote:
    thuggy said:
    There are a couple threads around with dyno runs showing early GT-Rs producing way more horse power than advertised. This was a Japanese tradition due to laws preventing high horsepower cars or something like Germany's 155 mph agreement I believe. I just hope that this is actually a normal practice that will continue and not just hopped up press cars.



    What difference does it make? As long as the price is the same, the customer benefits.

    This car is amazing regardless of how you define it. I wrote about a year ago that once the Japanese enter the market of high performance cars, the landscape will change for Europeans car manufacturers. Either they step up or they will pay the price.

    Automobile magazine has a good write up on the car and its specifications. Apparently it is equipped witha tamper proof black box which will give a lot of information regarding speed, mods and other stuff many car enthusiast would not want manufacturers or police to know.



    Nick, the difference would be if customer cars were not running hot like the press cars. If the customer gets the same performance great! It wouldn't be the first time a manufacturer provided a modified car to test that different than what a customer would get.



    Thuggy, Edmonds BORROWED a car from an owner and came up with the terrific numbers which I believe are better than the official numbers of Nissan. Additionally, with Corp fraud on the front page daily, I doubt very much the performance parameters would be substantially altered.

    Look, you just have to accept the fact that our beloved high priced European cars have been spanked pretty badly by a Japanese low priced car. The question is whether Porsche owners will continue to buy Porsche (if they do it is because of the Marque and nothing else) or will they give this car a serious look.

    Ferrari owners are not interested in the GT-R. Though most of us like performance. it is not the driver (pun) when it comes to purchasing a car. For me you know what they are. None of which exist in either the Porsche or the Nissan.

    Re: GT-R 0-60 in 3.3 S

    Here are some more numbers for you:

    According to a 1/4 mile calculator, if the Nissan weighs 1780kg, plus I'm assuming a 160lb driver, and did the quarter mile at 11.6 @ 120.9 mph as Edmunds claims, the car would need 666hp.

    If the car has 473hp as stated in Edmunds, using the same weight, the car has the power to do a 1/4 mile in 12.6 seconds, within 95% accuracy. The car would have to weigh 1600kg, or 500lbs less than the stated weight to achieve the 11.6 seconds stated in the article.

    Further, with a vehicle weight of 4050lbs, curb weight plus driver, and a claimed 473hp with AWD, the car is capable of 4.0088 second 0 - 60 times. This assumes the car hooks up and doesn't include any turbo lag, (full 473hp at launch).

    No amount of 'new technology' can overcome the laws of physics. So in other words, someone is lying.

    Re: GT-R 0-60 in 3.3 S

    Question: can the GTR AWD system make such a BIG difference?

    I noticed that many (not all) of the other cars are RWD...

    Re: GT-R 0-60 in 3.3 S

    On the "european car manufacturers" issue: I don't agree with people that focus so much on the statement "the GTR is faster than the 997TT and so on".

    That it's not the big issue. Focus people! Even if the GTR is slower (which I believe is the case on a race track), on real world situations the GTR will be at worst glued to the back of a TT or a similar car BUT (and that is a very big BUT ) it's costing just 70K!!!!! Let's say in Europe it will cost as much as a standard Carrera... the TT is what, 50% more!!! For what? For half a second or a second or two less? Not worth it. Don't even get me started on comparing the GTR with the 430scud price or Lamborghini G-SL and so on...

    I believe this is the real issue. I am waiting for a 430scud and yes, I believe a F430 or a Lambo G-SL or a GT3/GT3RS/GT2 or similar cars will make me grin much more than a GTR BUT I will still be pissed big time to see a 20 year old kid staying on my tale thinking that it's a much better driver becaus he is driving a 70K GTR that has auto susp, auto gear box, AWD so basically is just steering, accelerating and hopefully braking from time to time

    Yes, maybe I am still imature but even so 70K compared with 170K, 200K+ makes me shake my head... too big of a difference...

    Re: GT-R 0-60 in 3.3 S

    Quote:
    Pentium said:
    On the "european car manufacturers" issue: I don't agree with people that focus so much on the statement "the GTR is faster than the 997TT and so on".

    That it's not the big issue. Focus people! Even if the GTR is slower (which I believe is the case on a race track), on real world situations the GTR will be at worst glued to the back of a TT or a similar car BUT (and that is a very big BUT ) it's costing just 70K!!!!! Let's say in Europe it will cost as much as a standard Carrera... the TT is what, 50% more!!! For what? For half a second or a second or two less? Not worth it. Don't even get me started on comparing the GTR with the 430scud price or Lamborghini G-SL and so on...

    I believe this is the real issue. I am waiting for a 430scud and yes, I believe a F430 or a Lambo G-SL or a GT3/GT3RS/GT2 or similar cars will make me grin much more than a GTR BUT I will still be pissed big time to see a 20 year old kid staying on my tale thinking that it's a much better driver becaus he is driving a 70K GTR that has auto susp, auto gear box, AWD so basically is just steering, accelerating and hopefully braking from time to time

    Yes, maybe I am still imature but even so 70K compared with 170K, 200K+ makes me shake my head... too big of a difference...



    Great post! I will be cruising in my 430 Spider and sleek hair kid in Prada glasses will pull alongside and want to give me a go. I will of course snort with "how dare you" and summarily waive him off (which I always do) as though he was fodder not to be even acknowledge. All the while knowing he would kick my butt.

    Joe ,I am not a physicist and not able to dispute the numbers you post. However, if performance was as clear cut as you state i.e. know the weight of the car and its hp will give you its acceleration numbers why do they bother to test these cars? There must be other variables that will affect the performance.

    Re: GT-R 0-60 in 3.3 S

    Quote:
    nberry said:
    Quote:
    Pentium said:
    On the "european car manufacturers" issue: I don't agree with people that focus so much on the statement "the GTR is faster than the 997TT and so on".

    That it's not the big issue. Focus people! Even if the GTR is slower (which I believe is the case on a race track), on real world situations the GTR will be at worst glued to the back of a TT or a similar car BUT (and that is a very big BUT ) it's costing just 70K!!!!! Let's say in Europe it will cost as much as a standard Carrera... the TT is what, 50% more!!! For what? For half a second or a second or two less? Not worth it. Don't even get me started on comparing the GTR with the 430scud price or Lamborghini G-SL and so on...

    I believe this is the real issue. I am waiting for a 430scud and yes, I believe a F430 or a Lambo G-SL or a GT3/GT3RS/GT2 or similar cars will make me grin much more than a GTR BUT I will still be pissed big time to see a 20 year old kid staying on my tale thinking that it's a much better driver becaus he is driving a 70K GTR that has auto susp, auto gear box, AWD so basically is just steering, accelerating and hopefully braking from time to time

    Yes, maybe I am still imature but even so 70K compared with 170K, 200K+ makes me shake my head... too big of a difference...



    Great post! I will be cruising in my 430 Spider and sleek hair kid in Prada glasses will pull alongside and want to give me a go. I will of course snort with "how dare you" and summarily waive him off (which I always do) as though he was fodder not to be even acknowledge. All the while knowing he would kick my butt.

    Joe ,I am not a physicist and not able to dispute the numbers you post. However, if performance was as clear cut as you state i.e. know the weight of the car and its hp will give you its acceleration numbers why do they bother to test these cars? There must be other variables that will affect the performance.



    Nick, we could do the same thing in a 997TT as you could do in an F430. It's not always about who's car is faster. Personally, I don't race on the street with other cars, so this debate doesn't affect me.

    Re: GT-R 0-60 in 3.3 S

    GTR reminds me of when the new z06 came out, cheaply priced car with the proformance of a 120k+ car. some people raved about it, while others tried to discredit the car by saying it was made by chevy and cheap interior.

    I love porsches, I love the lines of the car and the history. I think companies like nissan and chevy challenge porsche and others to make a better car to justify the price difference.

    Re: GT-R 0-60 in 3.3 S

    The tires used on the GT-R are runflats by Bridgestones. I am really curious to see the construction of them because for what they are... I am suprised to see if all of these tests are done using them.

    Re: GT-R 0-60 in 3.3 S

    Quote:
    nberry said:
    Quote:
    thuggy said:
    Quote:
    nberry said:
    Quote:
    thuggy said:
    There are a couple threads around with dyno runs showing early GT-Rs producing way more horse power than advertised. This was a Japanese tradition due to laws preventing high horsepower cars or something like Germany's 155 mph agreement I believe. I just hope that this is actually a normal practice that will continue and not just hopped up press cars.



    What difference does it make? As long as the price is the same, the customer benefits.

    This car is amazing regardless of how you define it. I wrote about a year ago that once the Japanese enter the market of high performance cars, the landscape will change for Europeans car manufacturers. Either they step up or they will pay the price.

    Automobile magazine has a good write up on the car and its specifications. Apparently it is equipped witha tamper proof black box which will give a lot of information regarding speed, mods and other stuff many car enthusiast would not want manufacturers or police to know.



    Nick, the difference would be if customer cars were not running hot like the press cars. If the customer gets the same performance great! It wouldn't be the first time a manufacturer provided a modified car to test that different than what a customer would get.



    Thuggy, Edmonds BORROWED a car from an owner and came up with the terrific numbers which I believe are better than the official numbers of Nissan. Additionally, with Corp fraud on the front page daily, I doubt very much the performance parameters would be substantially altered.

    Look, you just have to accept the fact that our beloved high priced European cars have been spanked pretty badly by a Japanese low priced car. The question is whether Porsche owners will continue to buy Porsche (if they do it is because of the Marque and nothing else) or will they give this car a serious look.

    Ferrari owners are not interested in the GT-R. Though most of us like performance. it is not the driver (pun) when it comes to purchasing a car. For me you know what they are. None of which exist in either the Porsche or the Nissan.



    Nick, I actually said it was good for the customer if they under promised and over delivered. I don't know why you have to take a negative tone with every Porsche owner. Chill out dude.

    And if you believe every advertisement because companies are scared of lawyers... I have a bridge in NYC for you that you can buy... a pill that will make your nether regions larger and make your wife happy... a diet pill that will let you eat whatever you want and still lose weight... and a get rich scheme that will make you millions over night!!!

    Re: GT-R 0-60 in 3.3 S

    Winding Road video here

    Camera work isn't great.

    Re: GT-R 0-60 in 3.3 S

    Quote:


    Joe ,I am not a physicist and not able to dispute the numbers you post. However, if performance was as clear cut as you state i.e. know the weight of the car and its hp will give you its acceleration numbers why do they bother to test these cars? There must be other variables that will affect the performance.



    There are variables such as aerodynamics and tire slippage that could effect the numbers by a tenth or two (of a second). The Edmunds article was off by a full second in the quarter mile, which would have to be a substantial HP gain, or weight loss. I'm just a little suspect that this thing won't live up to the hype once it arrives. I'm not arguing that the car can't put up those numbers, but not with the spec's they've provided.

    Re: GT-R 0-60 in 3.3 S

    Quote:
    JoeRockhead said:
    Here are some more numbers for you:

    According to a 1/4 mile calculator, if the Nissan weighs 1780kg, plus I'm assuming a 160lb driver, and did the quarter mile at 11.6 @ 120.9 mph as Edmunds claims, the car would need 666hp.

    If the car has 473hp as stated in Edmunds, using the same weight, the car has the power to do a 1/4 mile in 12.6 seconds, within 95% accuracy. The car would have to weigh 1600kg, or 500lbs less than the stated weight to achieve the 11.6 seconds stated in the article.

    Further, with a vehicle weight of 4050lbs, curb weight plus driver, and a claimed 473hp with AWD, the car is capable of 4.0088 second 0 - 60 times. This assumes the car hooks up and doesn't include any turbo lag, (full 473hp at launch).

    No amount of 'new technology' can overcome the laws of physics. So in other words, someone is lying.



    Nissan is the someone. the car is making 480 hp at all 4 wheels, not at the crank. this explains the acceleration, 1/4 mile and Sportauto Nring time of 7:50. OR Nissan is giving BS press cars to everyone and the car is making 473 hp at the crank. I used to be a none believer, but Im now thinking that the former is whats going on.

    Re: GT-R 0-60 in 3.3 S

    One of the things we have to all factor is that the fuel is Japan is of higher octane (100 octane). I don't believe that is readily available elsewhere.

    Re: GT-R 0-60 in 3.3 S

    Quote:
    KresoF1 said:
    If that data is accurate I am wondering how long will gearbox and drivetrain last in GT-R? With that kind of mechanical tension not too long IMHO...


    The same can be said about the GT2, huh? To me, such a launch control system doesn't make any sense on a road car anyway. What is it for? Traffic-light racing?... Plain stupid.

    About the lap times at the Ring: many people are saying that a heavier car than the 997TT can't be quicker. Well, the same people have no problem accepting that the 997 GT2 is almost as quick around the Ring as the CGT, which is both more powerful and lighter. So? If Porsche does wonders, why couldn't Nissan do some too?

    Re: GT-R 0-60 in 3.3 S

    Excellent point Pierre!

    Re: GT-R 0-60 in 3.3 S

    Yes, very good point Pierre.

    GT2 is 100kg heavier and 75hp less than Carrera GT and laps the ring just as fast.

    Re: GT-R 0-60 in 3.3 S

    Quote:
    vinnie said:
    Yes, very good point Pierre.

    GT2 is 100kg heavier and 75hp less than Carrera GT and laps the ring just as fast.


    GT2 isn't faster than the CGT and nobody from Porsche has claimed that! You forgot, that the GT2 uses new semi-slick tyres, which are the only reason for this "so closed" to the CGT time around N-ring...

    Re: GT-R 0-60 in 3.3 S

    ...anyone else heard the rumour that the GT-R's 7.38min lap-time was on slicks?


    Re: GT-R 0-60 in 3.3 S

    Quote:
    pierre said:
    Quote:
    KresoF1 said:
    If that data is accurate I am wondering how long will gearbox and drivetrain last in GT-R? With that kind of mechanical tension not too long IMHO...


    The same can be said about the GT2, huh? To me, such a launch control system doesn't make any sense on a road car anyway. What is it for? Traffic-light racing?... Plain stupid.

    About the lap times at the Ring: many people are saying that a heavier car than the 997TT can't be quicker. Well, the same people have no problem accepting that the 997 GT2 is almost as quick around the Ring as the CGT, which is both more powerful and lighter. So? If Porsche does wonders, why couldn't Nissan do some too?



    Pierre,

    Regarding LC I fully agree with you.

    My point regarding Ring time is Doettinger Hoehe top speed spot... I know that GT-R is few kms slower here then 997 Turbo. So, that is telling us something-either car that von Saurma drove is with stock specs(481ps) or other GT-Rs(as the one used in Japan by Edmmunds) are little bit tuned...

    Other thing read drive impressions in EVO and Top Gear. They both claim that 997 Turbo is still(true, marginally) faster then GT-R on the autbahn...

    And when GT-R become available in Europe(current info is early 2009!) there will be a lot of new models on sportscars market...

     
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