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    Re: Lamborghini Huracan and variants

    AMRB-001 has little relevance to standard road cars.  In order to create the underbody aerodynamics, the driver cockpit is seriously compromised for normal driving (i.e. it has more of an F1 style seating position).  What Ferrari is doing is probably a more appropriate example of how to create downforce without wings, but considerations for road-worthiness like ground clearance, etc. will always compromise downforce. 

     


    Re: Lamborghini Huracan and variants

    New info on the name "Performante", why they chose it over "Superleggera", and the aero, from lambo talk this time: 

    Name: To make it "short", there is a company called "Carrozzeria Touring Superleggera srl" in Milano. The original company "Carrozzeria Touring" was founded in 1928. All about them can be read in wikipedia.

    In 2008 they started many files against companies in the automotive industry who used the name "Superleggera", of course Lamborghini was one of them. I just found them today (in German) and it was only one of the investors who started them. This year Lambo (or it's mother Audi) decided not to go further and will not use Superleggera anymore. I could not find anything if they have to pay back for using Superleggeraon the Gallardo

    The lawyers from Labo/Audi then immediately trademarked "Performante" what has already been posted here. If they also trademark "Edizione Technica" is not yet clear. So the next version will for sure be called Performante regardless if it is a Coupé or Spyder.

    Features:
    Many pictures are around and the latest ones show some additional openings and different angles of the new wing. Behind this is the new active system that changes the angle to have less drag on high speeds but best possible downforce in turns. The system also includes variable active openings in the front. It seems that all this works very well on the Huracan Performante what resulted in very low lap times on the Ring. But they keep the secret well.

    Together with 640PS, more lightweight exhaust, many CF parts the Performante seems to become an expensive animal


    Re: Lamborghini Huracan and variants

    kingjr9000:

    New info on the name "Performante", why they chose it over "Superleggera", and the aero, from lambo talk this time: 

    Name: To make it "short", there is a company called "Carrozzeria Touring Superleggera srl" in Milano. The original company "Carrozzeria Touring" was founded in 1928. All about them can be read in wikipedia.

    In 2008 they started many files against companies in the automotive industry who used the name "Superleggera", of course Lamborghini was one of them. I just found them today (in German) and it was only one of the investors who started them. This year Lambo (or it's mother Audi) decided not to go further and will not use Superleggera anymore. I could not find anything if they have to pay back for using Superleggeraon the Gallardo

    The lawyers from Labo/Audi then immediately trademarked "Performante" what has already been posted here. If they also trademark "Edizione Technica" is not yet clear. So the next version will for sure be called Performante regardless if it is a Coupé or Spyder.

    Features:
    Many pictures are around and the latest ones show some additional openings and different angles of the new wing. Behind this is the new active system that changes the angle to have less drag on high speeds but best possible downforce in turns. The system also includes variable active openings in the front. It seems that all this works very well on the Huracan Performante what resulted in very low lap times on the Ring. But they keep the secret well.

    Together with 640PS, more lightweight exhaust, many CF parts the Performante seems to become an expensive animal

    Thanks for the verification of the rear wing and its adaptability according to conditions.  Ferrari has for many years led the aerodynamic efforts when compared with Lamborghini.  One has always found that puzzling given Lamborghini's parent, Audi, and its expertise in aerodynamics.  


    Re: Lamborghini Huracan and variants

    Active aerodynamics, AWS...logical consequences, especially since Porsche already uses them for the 911 Turbo S and  now even for the Panamera (AWS).

    The Huracan Performante will be a beast but I am pretty sure that the tech will find it's way, in a way or another, to the facelift. I'd say 630 hp for the facelift and AWS optional.


    --

    RC (Germany) - Rennteam Editor Porsche 991 Carrera 4 GTS Cabriolet, Porsche Macan Turbo, Audi R8 V10 Plus (2017), Mini JCW (2015), Jeep Grand Cherokee SRT (2014)



    Re: Lamborghini Huracan and variants

    Seriously, I do not get Lamborghini's marketing philosophy at all. Not even sure how well the LP580 models sell because every single review I read actually put the LP610 with AWD ahead of the LP580. yes


    --

    RC (Germany) - Rennteam Editor Porsche 991 Carrera 4 GTS Cabriolet, Porsche Macan Turbo, Audi R8 V10 Plus (2017), Mini JCW (2015), Jeep Grand Cherokee SRT (2014)


    Re: Lamborghini Huracan and variants

    I think the RWD models are included in the range primarily to appease the press who have consistently been less than positive about the benefits of AWD in a modern exotic ever since the Gallardo was launched in 2004 and secondly to provide an entry price point in the model range. It is a relatively easy win for Lamborghini to decontent the car and pull in additional buyers who may otherwise have gone elsewhere.


    Re: Lamborghini Huracan and variants

    RC:

    Seriously, I do not get Lamborghini's marketing philosophy at all. Not even sure how well the LP580 models sell because every single review I read actually put the LP610 with AWD ahead of the LP580. yes

    As an intranet fanboy, i can probably answer that.  Take the famous Chris harris piece on ferrari, for starters.  Now, every time ferrari does a test, it always openly mocked and criticized as a ringer and non representative of customers.  Sometime later after the Huracan came out, he does a lamborghini piece on how they are posers' cars because of how they handle.  He claimed they are the perfect cars for people who can't drive, as opposed to ferrari, who he also claimed are layers and cheaters; and the internet swallowed it all, digested it all, and became one with it.  So when the Huracan came out and all the testers claimed it was good, but understeered and they couldn't drift, so therefore it was bad.  And then the intranet fanboys swallowed it all and became one with those reviews.  Now lamborghini didn't like those statements, so it probably came out with the 580-2--made specifically for those who want to have fun and drift.  Even though the 610-4 has been shown to drift marvelously.  Or it could simply be a continuation of the 550-2.

     


    Re: Lamborghini Huracan and variants

    RC:

    Seriously, I do not get Lamborghini's marketing philosophy at all. Not even sure how well the LP580 models sell because every single review I read actually put the LP610 with AWD ahead of the LP580. yes

    They sell fine from what I can tell. Lower entry price and they honestly look better and aren't much slower. I'd probably buy a 580 and just save money.


    Re: Lamborghini Huracan and variants

    Three different posters from LP; not sure what they mean thoughyes: I thought my sales guy told me the wing was fixed but vented air from through the body. I assume the front aero opens and closes to move around the CoP.

    Regrets. If I tell, I won't be able to get more info. on any future models anymore. Let's just say it's a synchronization of several parts fore & aft.

    Nothing new here. Its well known that the active aero is controlled by gyroscopes in the car. The gyro's determine how to distribute power as well as control the active aero to provide ideal conditions (downforce, power distribution to each wheel etc) for any situation. So "pro-active" aero rather than simple "triggered" aero 

     

     


    Re: Lamborghini Huracan and variants

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=r4psQ1wLa9c

     


    Re: Lamborghini Huracan and variants

    Sweet looking track, though I definitely wouldn't want to run off on it!


    Re: Lamborghini Huracan and variants

    Topspeed:

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=r4psQ1wLa9c

     

    This review is another reminder of that those car magazines are only good for entertainment and absolutely pointless for purchase decisions. My 2 days with the LP580 in Tuscany, driven back to with a 458 reveal a completely different picture - a fantastic driver's car inspiring as much confidence as a Turbo S in fast turns, never loosing traction unless provoked. After that V10 the GT3 RS'es engine feels like nothing special. The only complain - unsatisfying steering feel.

    For real world driving I would get the LP580 over GT3 RS any day, even though it lacks the precision of the RS at the edge, it's that good. 

     


    Re: Lamborghini Huracan and variants

    That V10 engine is just...how to put it...sent straight down to earth from the car gods (if you believe in mystic characters indecision). I still prefer the AWD version though, especially now in winter time, it is amazing how useful AWD is, even if it doesn't snow. Cold surface temps already challenge the AWD, can't imagine how traction must be without AWD.


    --

    RC (Germany) - Rennteam Editor Porsche 991 Carrera 4 GTS Cabriolet (2015), Porsche Cayenne S Diesel (2017), Audi R8 V10 Plus (2016), Mini JCW (2015)


    Re: Lamborghini Huracan and variants

    Prototype Drive: Lamborghini Huracán Performante

    In the Slipstream of Perfection: Latest Huracán variant is a Supertrofeo for the road

    By: Georg Kacher January 16, 2017

    IMOLA, Italy — It’s 8 a.m. on a chilly December morning, and although the Imola F1 circuit in northern Italy should already be in hibernation, the place is bustling with activity.

    Our host for today’s event is Maurizio Reggiani, Lamborghini’s charismatic R&D chief. Reggiani is an utterly charming and knowledgeable top manager whose main mission in life is to reinvent Lamborghini.

    “This is a very special brand that builds very special cars,” Reggiani says. “But in today’s economic climate, we must fight for our goals every step of the way.”

    Although Huracán and Aventador are doing well in the marketplace, money is tight in the small Italo-German enclave north of Bologna. Before Reggiani and his team get the nod to introduce an all-new design or an additional product, they must first milk the existing range by launching at least two highly profitable special-edition models per year throughout the life cycle.

    Kicking off 2017 is the Huracán Performante, which officially bows in March at the 2017 Geneva auto show. This time, the Performante label stands for much more than fancy wheels, loud stripes, and 15 or 20 extra horsepower.

    Lamborghini Huracan Performante Prototype side profile in motion 02

     

    “The new Performante is, in essence, a Super Trofeo for the road,” states senior vehicle development manager Dennis Schmitz. “What makes all the difference is the patented ALA concept, short for Active Lamborghini Aerodynamics. It transforms the car by enhancing cornering grip, handling prowess and high-speed stability. Driving is believing. This really is a Performante worthy of its badge.”

    We don’t get a full look at the Huracán Performante prototype’s sheetmetal, which is wrapped in swirly black-on-white camouflage. A close look reveals a redesigned nose cone, revised air intakes, and an imposing rear wing sitting on two wide mounts. Is this really all it takes to create what is being heralded as a dynamic miracle?

    “There is more to this system than meets the eye,” promises chief aerodynamicist Antonio Torluccio, “like precise torque vectoring by air-flow management.” Seems we are on to something interesting here.

    Imola is a fantastic track. With the possible exception of the chicane, there isn’t a single second-gear corner. Instead, the mind is boggled by plenty of high-speed stuff. It’s a mix of third, fourth, and fifth gear, then up to sixth toward the end of the start-finish straight.

    The Performante effect is immediate. Not because of the 10 percent power boost and the extra 54 lb-ft of torque. It’s the transformed road-holding that makes you shake the head in disbelief, again and again.

    In a way, hard cornering in the Performante feels like slalom skiing. You are constantly in the flow, shifting weight from one side to the other, fighting and eventually conquering g-force with downforce. While the benefit is totally symmetrical under hard braking, aero vectoring automatically shifts the load to the inner rear wheel when cornering at the limit of adhesion. The system not only generates a precious extra 0.2 to 0.4 g within fractions of a second, it also suppresses understeer by permitting smaller steering angles.

    While the fast-acting single electric motor quashes axle lift by closing the front flaps, the rear wing is a much more complex assembly. The hollow wing profile consists of two separate chambers and a pair of narrow, full-width underside slots. The air flow is masterminded (and split, more often than not) by two independent aero shutters attached to the base of the two hollow stanchions supported by the main spoiler. Progressively picking up speed, air enters the wing and is compressed before exiting through one or both concealed slot diffusers, thereby creating substantial downforce.

    During our first pit stop, a brief discussion ensues about the appropriate ESP setting.

    “Sport is dedicated to make the car feel a little loose and tail-happy,” explains Lorenzo Rinaldi, who is in charge of vehicle dynamics. “For the fastest lap times, however, you’re better off in Corsa. It is more focused and sharper overall. Alternatively, you can of course switch off stability control altogether.”

    In Sport, both air flaps open to boost downforce in the critical 45 to 112 mph bracket. Beyond 193 mph, the rear flap opens for maximum drag reduction.

    Lamborghini Huracan Performante Prototype Georg Kacher driving

     

    In Strada, they both open at 45 mph. Above 193 mph, the front air flow control blades close to reduce lift. Only in Corsa is there a constant front-to-rear and left-to-right interplay to optimize the cornering performance. The aerodynamic balance is, in essence, determined by lateral and longitudinal acceleration.

    Other contributing factors to the Huracán Performante’s abilities include an 88-pound weight reduction, bespoke Pirelli P Zero Corsa tires, more aggressively calibrated AWD and ESP systems, a free-breathing exhaust with high-mounted tailpipes, a faster shifting seven-speed dual-clutch transmission, and notably stiffer suspension mounts.

    But perhaps the most significant dynamic alteration is the reprogrammed steering. The effort is now slightly higher in Strada, the ratio quickens in Sport, and there is no longer any variation at all in Corsa — exactly the way Porsche does it.

    The Performante sounds rawer and meaner than the average Huracán, and its turbo-free long-stroke V-10 pushes some 650 horsepower (final figures won’t be available before March). It draws an even prouder torque curve. According to gossip, the power boost will help the car shave roughly three-tenths off the base Huracán’s 0-60 mph acceleration time. Top speed may not matter much anymore these days, but at a rumored 210 mph, this bull would eclipse the R8 V10 plus, which helps when it’s bragging time down at the club.

    Its surround sound intake system, derived from the Super Trofeo race car, clears its throat at 3,000 rpm before raucously and rapidly reeling in the 8,500-rpm redline. Backpressure is an alien term to the lightweight exhaust and completing the package is a transmission that hammers its seven gears like a violent electro-mechanical robot.

    Lamborghini Huracan Performante Prototype rear three quarter in motion 08

     

    Its substantially stiffer chassis is a tangible asset when fighting the paling red, white, and green curbs. But despite this sadomasochistic calibration, the ride quality on public roads barely suffers, claims project leader Antonio Grandi. “Especially in Strada, springs and dampers are sufficiently pliable. Maximum downforce does, of course, have an effect on the compliance.”

    The Huracán Performante is amazingly stable under hard braking, controls its body movements with the composed virtuosity of a Yoga guru, and sticks to the line like a fast-moving magnetic field guided by an invisible induction loop. Confidence at the limit can easily be stretched from an unperturbed 10 tenths to an only slightly more frivolous 11. What lies beyond would require a stab at the ESP button, a move that calls for a better and more courageous driver.

    But the itch to take a little more risk for a potentially bigger reward gains the upper hand. We carry fractionally more speed into the next corners to test the buffer zone between physical and aerodynamic grip. Brake half a foot and then a full foot deeper into bends to sample the demarcation area between turn-in and understeer. Stay in third gear through the chicane with three wheels momentarily on the ground to find out whether the fast-acting torque split and the flippant ESP calibration will straddle the line between drama and disaster.

    Despite being a pain to get into and an embarrassment to get out of, in the end what happens between these two procedures is dazzling, physical, and addictive. And while the Performante may not beat the Ferrari 488 and McLaren 570S in the nominal horsepower, torque, and miles-per-hour sweepstakes, it is bound to keep in close touch with its rivals in real life thanks to the game-changing adaptive aerodynamics. Avete lavorato stupendamente, ragazzi!

    http://www.automobilemag.com/news/lamborghini-huracan-performante-prototype-drive/


    Re: Lamborghini Huracan and variants


    Re: Lamborghini Huracan and variants

    kingjr9000:

    Very interesting and looking forward to learning more. 



    Re: Lamborghini Huracan and variants

    One last thing: The Performante went very quickly around the Nürburgring Nordschleife. How fast? Well, Lamborghini’s own Aventador Superveloce set a time of 6 minutes, 59.73 seconds. The only production car to ever circumnavigate more quickly is the Porsche 918 Spyder, which laid down an ice-cold 6:57.00. The Huracán Performante? Lambo ain’t saying no matter how many times I ask (Reggiani just smiles at me), but I heard mutterings of “six-fifty-two-something-something.” That would shatter the Porsche’s record. We’ll find out for sure when Lamborghini pulls the wraps off the Performante in March at the Geneva International Motor Show.


    Re: Lamborghini Huracan and variants

    Hey Noone1, could you the MT review and its time over at Mclife for me? Thanks if you can.


    Re: Lamborghini Huracan and variants

    I just looked at the old 0-60mph / 0-100kph for the 610-4 by C&D, and it did it in 2.5, and it weights 3423.  So taking .3 seconds off of the best time the Huracan has done, means we're looking at a 0-60 @ 2.2 secs, while the weight is around 3333lbs. angel


    Re: Lamborghini Huracan and variants

    So no word about rear wheel steering?


    --

    We're at the point where you can be the fastest or just sound like you're the fastest.



    The secret of life is to admire without desiring.


    Re: Lamborghini Huracan and variants

    I don't know shit, but my Huracan was very eager to swing the tail out on snow and ice, but it was very 'lazy' and can be caught.

    My 918 wasn't so 'comforting'. It swings when it wants to, sometimes it stays hooked up, sometimes it wants to play. Playing in the casinos have better odds than predicting the tail's behaviour. 

    But the best was actually my Cayenne Turbo S, it will swing willingly, but it also let me control it, it is actually a 'fun' car believe it or not.

    But what do I know, I am not a journalist, I don't have a channel on Youtube with a million subscribers, i just drive my cars.

     


    --

     

     


    Re: Lamborghini Huracan and variants

    Whoopsy:

    I don't know shit, but my Huracan was very eager to swing the tail out on snow and ice, but it was very 'lazy' and can be caught.

    I don't have a clue about the various ESP/AWD/etc. setups of the Huracan but in the R8, you can set Quattro to "Comfort" setting and the car behaves very neutral on snow, wet roads, etc., a very nice and safe setup. With winter tires of course but I know you have winter tires too on your Huracan.

    My 918 wasn't so 'comforting'. It swings when it wants to, sometimes it stays hooked up, sometimes it wants to play. Playing in the casinos have better odds than predicting the tail's behaviour. 

    But the best was actually my Cayenne Turbo S, it will swing willingly, but it also let me control it, it is actually a 'fun' car believe it or not.

    Same here, once you turn off Sport or Sport Plus, it behaves quite neutral on snow, unless you really force it.

    But what do I know, I am not a journalist, I don't have a channel on Youtube with a million subscribers, i just drive my cars.

     

    Smiley Maybe you should have a YouTube channel...maybe Rennteam should but like me and the mods/admins, you probably don't have the time (or desire) to deliver content for the masses, even if it could pay off at some point. Maybe. Smiley


    --

    RC (Germany) - Rennteam Editor Porsche 991 Carrera 4 GTS Cabriolet (2015), Porsche Cayenne S Diesel (2017), Audi R8 V10 Plus (2016), Mini JCW (2015)


    Re: Lamborghini Huracan and variants

    Rossi:

    So no word about rear wheel steering?

    The active aerodynamics was pretty much clear but the RWS is probably the surprise, same as the power figure.

    The article says The Performante effect is immediate. Not because of the 10 percent power boost, so I kind of have the feeling that the mentioned 650 hp is on the lower scale of power. I assume they push the V10 engine to it's limit because there is no future for it, as sad as this may sound. Smiley

    This gives me hope for the R8 V10 facelift or that rumored R8 GT...670 hp would be amazing and exactly the power boost this car needs to be fully competitive (power-wise) with the 488 and others out there. I guess however that if the Huracan Performante gets 670 hp, the standard Huracan facelift and R8 facelift will get "only" 650 hp or so, which is fine to me.

     


    --

    RC (Germany) - Rennteam Editor Porsche 991 Carrera 4 GTS Cabriolet (2015), Porsche Cayenne S Diesel (2017), Audi R8 V10 Plus (2016), Mini JCW (2015)


    Re: Lamborghini Huracan and variants

    Salmon is already talking about it

    https://youtu.be/dV68HIzwce0?t=10m38s


    Re: Lamborghini Huracan and variants


    Re: Lamborghini Huracan and variants

    kingjr9000:


    Game changing technology it may be, the downside is you will always see this huge wing. Smiley

    Yes, I know, this is a Lamborghini and real Lamborghini always feature massive wings, but I never liked them and never will. Smiley


    --

    We're at the point where you can be the fastest or just sound like you're the fastest.



    The secret of life is to admire without desiring.


    Re: Lamborghini Huracan and variants

    I warmed up to my R8 V10 Plus wing as well and trust me, I never liked wings. Never.

    The active aerodynamics on the new Huracan Performante remind me of Porsche's PAA. Assuming that Weissach already assists Lamborghini with development, I think this may be a further development of PAA. I am actually pretty sure about it. 


    --

    RC (Germany) - Rennteam Editor Porsche 991 Carrera 4 GTS Cabriolet (2015), Porsche Cayenne S Diesel (2017), Audi R8 V10 Plus (2016), Mini JCW (2015)


    Re: Lamborghini Huracan and variants

    I would love a green Huracan. Its just so much in your face. Mmmm, that V10, proper man engines..


    --

    throt

    "I Have Done It!".

    991 GT3 pick up in October 2014.


     
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